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Amazon income drops as Kindle Fire burns margins

post #1 of 69
Thread Starter 
Online retailer Amazon announced on Tuesday lower than expected third quarter earnings and guided for potential losses in the fourth quarter, as its low-margin strategy with the Kindle Fire could pose a threat to future profits.

The company revealed sales for the recent September quarter grew 44 percent year over year to $10.88 billion, but it was unable to convert the growth into earnings. Operating income shrank from $268 million in third quarter 2010 to just $79 million. According to Investor's Business Daily, Amazon's 14 cents a share earnings missed average analyst estimates by 10 cents.

Guidance for the fourth quarter predicted a broad range for operating income -- a lower limit of a loss of $200 million and an upper limit of $250 million in profits. Such a loss would represent a 142 percent decline year over year for the retailer. Net sales for next quarter are expected to be between $16.45 billion and $18.65 billion, with growth between 27 percent and 44 percent

The earnings miss shook investors' faith in the company last Tuesday. Shares of the company slid $10.46, or 4.4 percent, in the day's trading and plummeted $28.26 to $198.89 during after-hours trading.

Founder and CEO Jeff Bezos also announced in the earnings press release that pre-orders for the Kindle Fire tablet have been better than expected, with the company "increasing capacity and building millions more" units than initially planned.

Though Amazon CFO Thomas Szkutak dodged analyst questions of whether the Kindle is affecting margins, he did hint at a low-margin strategy during a Q&A session with analysts to discuss the results, as covered by Seeking Alpha.

"We think about the economics of the Kindle business, we think about the totality," he said. "We think of the lifetime value of those devices. So we're not just thinking about the economics of the device and the accessories. We think about the content.

"We are selling quite a bit of Special Offers devices which includes ads. We're thinking about the advertisement and those Special Offers and those lifetime value. So those are the things certainly that are impacting, as well as investments in other areas impacting our Q4 guidance. So we feel very good about where we are right now and the opportunities that we have in front of us."

Amazon unveiled the first ad-based Kindle with Special Offers in April, then made the subsidized versions the default for new Kindle and Kindle Touch models.



Amazon announced the aggressively-priced $199 Kindle Fire in late September. The 7-inch multitouch tablet goes on sale on Nov. 15.

J.P. Morgan analyst Douglas Anmuth said Kindle Fire production has risen sharply as of late. He expects Amazon to sell 5 million Kindle Fire units in the fourth quarter.

But, some analysts have questioned whether Amazon's strategy will pay off in the long-term. Piper Jaffray's Gene Munster estimates that the company will lose $50 per Kindle Fire sale. J.P. Morgan's Mark Moskowitz said he's "not impressed" with the device, adding that the Fire's low price could actually deter customers.

For his part, Apple CEO Tim Cook responded to the notion that the Kindle Fire represents a threat to iPad sales during the company's most recent quarterly earnings conference call.

"We've seen several competitors come to market to try to compete with the iPad over time. Some had different form factors, different price points. I think it's reasonable to say that none of these have gained any traction thus far."

According to recent projections from Gartner, Apple will hold on to a dominant 73.4 percent of the tablet market in 2011. The company sold a record 11.12 million iPads in the September quarter, up 166 percent from a year ago.
post #2 of 69
"Fire burns margins" -- pun intended?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #3 of 69
Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more. If you want a $25 netbook, then you can live in poverty in India. Part of bettering yourself is to strive for something better. If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.
post #4 of 69
First of all, I love my iPad2. Coupled with MobileMe and now iCloud, it allows me to manage appointments, enter contacts, take notes, etc. Sync them with the iPhone and iMac. and besides that Filemaker Go allows me to work with my FM11 database resident on my iMac. I'm in business.

Allow me to gloat, second. When the Kindle Fire had the center of attention pre-iPhone 4s for all about 2 seconds, we had to hear from all of the press and all of the Kindle Fire fanatics that the Kindle Fire would DESTROY the iPad, that the Kindle Fire set the price point for tablets in the future, that Jeff Bezos would be the next Steve Jobs, blah, blah, blah.

Now, gee, no shit, Amazon is following the same failed strategy as the netbook. Flood the market with OK quality product at a low price. Watch your margins shrink.

Oh wait, though, they would make it back on content sales. But yet again, you have another dumbfuck company looking at the wrong target. IT'S NOT CONTENT THAT MAKES APPLE RICH, IT'S THE HARDWARE, DUMMIES!!! When will these companies learn.

Steve (RIP) said it best, "They just don't get it."
post #5 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more.

Not "good", but "better". i.e. If you want a better house, you pay more. If you want better technology, you pay more... etc.

Just because I don't like in a mansion and drive a Ferrari doesn't mean my house and car aren't any good.

There are already going to be people in society that have the means and the will to pay for "better" or even "the best", but everyone else is going to settle for "good enough".



Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.

I would hope when I die my children would know of love, kindness, generosity and humility and that the people they meet in life cannot be simply defined by the color of their skin, the number of 0's on their bank balance or where they decide to do their bloody shopping.

Each to their own though.
post #6 of 69
Developing a new tablet like this was a necessary evil for amazon. With electronic books being the next big thing, amazon is fighting for its life. By altering android they also help create their own ecosystem somewhat isolated from google. Only problem here is they need to keep developing and innovating with their core software instead of the frills around the edges.

Only time will tell if it was worth it.
post #7 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more. If you want a $25 netbook, then you can live in poverty in India. Part of bettering yourself is to strive for something better. If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.

So when Samsung release their next tablet that will be more expensive than Apples, you will be ditching your iPad. Good to see.
post #8 of 69
Ok so this fire device, it doesn't have a cell unit built in and from what it looks like to me it is a bit small for books. I mean the color screen and the size of that screen isn't as nice to read a book on compared to the standard liquid paper model. I wonder if they think they have a cheaper version of the iPad that in my opinion "you get what you pay for". I have seen other people in this posting say the same thing. I guess we will have to wait and see. Oh and one more thing. I went to amazon and looked at this device. The specs are vague. Really they don't explain the specs very well.
An Apple man since 1977
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An Apple man since 1977
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post #9 of 69
Everyone had a bad 3rd quarter, even Apple. Wait till after the Holidays, and then we'll see what's what with whom.
post #10 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psych_guy View Post

...Oh wait, though, they would make it back on content sales. But yet again, you have another dumbfuck company looking at the wrong target. IT'S NOT CONTENT THAT MAKES APPLE RICH, IT'S THE HARDWARE, DUMMIES!!! When will these companies learn.

Steve (RIP) said it best, "They just don't get it."

Hardware without the content is USELESS. Apple created the ecosystem to tie Mac, iPhone, and iPad together. Likewise, the reverse is also true. You can have the best content but subpar hardware won't get you anywhere. Amazon is ALMOST right. It has the contents, but it needs to improve on the hardware to compete.
post #11 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

...I mean the color screen and the size of that screen isn't as nice to read a book on compared to the standard liquid paper model...

I guess it's mostly meant for video and games; Amazon still has the e-ink Kindles that are better suited for reading.
post #12 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nairb View Post

Developing a new tablet like this was a necessary evil for amazon. With electronic books being the next big thing, amazon is fighting for its life. By altering android they also help create their own ecosystem somewhat isolated from google. Only problem here is they need to keep developing and innovating with their core software instead of the frills around the edges.

Only time will tell if it was worth it.

Yup...Amazon is going scorched earth with this.

Lets see whether it pays off.
post #13 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

Everyone had a bad 3rd quarter, even Apple. Wait till after the Holidays, and then we'll see what's what with whom.

Ummm....there is a huge difference between Apple's more than 100% growth in profit year over year, and a record quarter, and Amazon's 73% DROP in profit.

I don't think the word bad means what you think it means.
post #14 of 69
I am worried that Amazon is trying to repeat its initial success strategy with the Kindle Fire. Amazon burnt through millions of dollars in the beginning, not making any profits for the first many years of their existence. This paid off for them because their competitors were largely Web Startups created in the boom, who went bust after the dot-com crash. Amazon was essentially the only remaining e-retailer.

However, that strategy won't work against deep pocketed rivals like Apple, Samsung, and heck even RIM. I am just not seeing the payoff for Amazon here, unless they think that content purchases will be strong enough to lock users in. Maybe Amazon intends on eliminating their Android and iOS Kindle apps in the future, to convince users to move to the Fire...
post #15 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

Everyone had a bad 3rd quarter, even Apple. Wait till after the Holidays, and then we'll see what's what with whom.

Apple had an incredible Quarter. Record Mac sales. Record iPad sales. The 'disappointment' was that they 'only sold' 17 million of a soon to be replaced phone in a single quarter. Think about that for a second. Only a few years ago, selling 4 million iPods in a whole YEAR was considered a tremendous success. The standard by which Apple is judged at is in a completely different universe than every other company. Because they didn't match the numbers conjured from analysts' asses means nothing in regards to their performance in the real world.

As for Amazon? Their margins are already razor thin. They'll be selling this tablet at cost, or at a loss. Extremely risky business model. We'll see.
post #16 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

Ok so this fire device, it doesn't have a cell unit built in and from what it looks like to me it is a bit small for books. I mean the color screen and the size of that screen isn't as nice to read a book on compared to the standard liquid paper model. I wonder if they think they have a cheaper version of the iPad that in my opinion "you get what you pay for". I have seen other people in this posting say the same thing. I guess we will have to wait and see. Oh and one more thing. I went to amazon and looked at this device. The specs are vague. Really they don't explain the specs very well.

Amazon are really the only competitor to Apple in the tablet space. Not because of the HW, anyone can do that, but because of the vertically integrated system of content and delivery to back it up. Apple have it with iTunes and Amazon have it through their webstore and Kindle eBooks.

As for the HW specs, I was walking through another mall the other days and saw the ads for the 4S. "Dual Core A5 CPU, 8Mpix camera, iOS5". HW specs, but what does that mean to the public? This surprised me. Stating HW specs isn't the way Apple works, they are more about the total experience than the overall speed of the device. This is why, for example, they don't list the sub-GHz clock speed of their CPU. Nearly all modern Android devices have faster CPUs but it is pretty much a moot point as the user experience is down to a combination fo the applications, OS and HW.
post #17 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by addicted44 View Post

I am worried that Amazon is trying to repeat its initial success strategy with the Kindle Fire. Amazon burnt through millions of dollars in the beginning, not making any profits for the first many years of their existence. This paid off for them because their competitors were largely Web Startups created in the boom, who went bust after the dot-com crash. Amazon was essentially the only remaining e-retailer.

However, that strategy won't work against deep pocketed rivals like Apple, Samsung, and heck even RIM. I am just not seeing the payoff for Amazon here, unless they think that content purchases will be strong enough to lock users in. Maybe Amazon intends on eliminating their Android and iOS Kindle apps in the future, to convince users to move to the Fire...

Exactly.

The difference between Apple and Amazon is... Apple has always sold its own stuff at high margins... while Amazon has always sold other people's stuff at low margins.

Although Amazon entered the hardware game with the original Kindle... Amazon's main strategy is still being an online retailer of goods.

Apple's #1 is selling you hardware... while content (iTunes, App Store, etc) is a distant #2

It sounds like Amazon is doing the opposite: losing money on selling you the Kindle Fire and hopes to make it up with you buying content.

It sounds risky... but I think Amazon is also counting on people getting hooked on buying everything through Amazon from now on. Those pennies they get when you buy toilet paper add up over time.

And that's been Amazon's strategy all along... they are the Wal-Mart of the web selling other people's stuff. I can't imagine they're making a lot of money on the $79 Kindle either.
post #18 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaptainK View Post

Amazon are really the only competitor to Apple in the tablet space. Not because of the HW, anyone can do that, but because of the vertically integrated system of content and delivery to back it up. Apple have it with iTunes and Amazon have it through their webstore and Kindle eBooks.

Don't forget... Apple makes billion of dollars on hardware... but only a fraction of that from iTunes and the App Store.

Apple is and will always be a hardware company. iTunes and the App Store do make some money... but it pales in comparison to their hardware sales.

Now imagine if Apple didn't make any money on hardware... and only relied on iTunes and the App Store for profit. That would be suicide.

Well that sounds like what Amazon is doing.
post #19 of 69
Eh. I'll wait and see before passing judgement
post #20 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more. If you want a $25 netbook, then you can live in poverty in India. Part of bettering yourself is to strive for something better. If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.

As another poster pointed out with more words and less directly...you are what's wrong with the world.

Good should be the standard. Better should cost more.
post #21 of 69
The funny thing about the kindle fire is.... I have no idea what I would use it for.... if I didn't have an iPad I still find it too small and crippled to even browse the web.

If, and that's a big IF, M$ and it's partners come up with a decent competitor to the iPad maybe there will be some real competition, but android based tablets are a waste of time.
post #22 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

Everyone had a bad 3rd quarter, even Apple. Wait till after the Holidays, and then we'll see what's what with whom.

IIRC earnings were up 54%. Really BAD quarter.
Keeping things in perspective: Amazon made 3.5% (0.035) of the profit Apple made. And that was BEFORE shipping millions ob Kindle Fires with a loss.
I really hope Jim B. makes it to orbit with Blue Origin. But he might have a real problem soon with Amazon.
post #23 of 69
No doubt Amazon is taking a big gamble on Kindle Fire but I think they are one of the few that can make such an attempt and have better chance at success than anyone else. Amazon offers a similar close buying/shopping-ecosystem as Apple, the only thing I think could hold them back is they might not have the same vision as Jobs for post-PC devices. Amazon is specialized in internet-shopping, Jobs-Apple is into making better products and user experience with these devices on a daily basis...two very different approach to success.
post #24 of 69
I have said it to many "analytics" who love Amazon and their crazy P/E over 100.

The Kindle fire looses money on each one sold. Its not good for a company to loose money. Amazon believes that they will make back the lost money by locking the customers into Amazon store and buy all their stuff there.

The fun thing will be when you can jailbreak the fires and put Android on them. It will happen within days. Then maybe even I will buy one just to have an Android device to play around with.

BTW. Apple is "evil" for its 30-70 with Apps.
In music Apple have 7-11% and the artist/music company gets the rest.
Books 30-70.

Amazon kindle had 70-30. Amazon took 70% of the book sales. No one is angry at them since its not evil Apple.
post #25 of 69
Amazon is worried Apple's ecosystem will suck up a bunch of their customers and leave them frozen out of affluent markets (i.e. consumers who actually have money to spend). That could have drastic consequences for Amazon's bottom line. They're probably also worried that Google will start funneling customers to its own content services (like YouTube) via Android.

The Fire actually poses more of a threat to Google and its Android partners than it does to Apple, because of the price point. Android appeals to folks who don't have any money. It's a cheap but serviceable knockoff with a 2nd-rate ecosystem. The Fire is a cheap but serviceable iPad knockoff with - once Amazon gets done building it out - a decent ecosystem. It'll also be an ecosystem separate from the rest of the Android ecosystem, which currently is largely under Google's control. For Amazon, this represents a win / win. They'll successfully fragment the Android market, depriving Google of its control of that platform. They'll also hoover up a large percentage of low-value customers in the market, possibly enough to justify their enormous investment in the Fire. At the very least they'll keep Google and its other partners from successfully launching Android-based tablets to compete with the iPad. The Fire will suck all of the oxygen out of the Android tablet marketplace.

In a way, Amazon is borrowing a page from Microsoft's old playbook. Embrace and extend. They're doing to Google what Microsoft did to IBM.

The only problem is, Apple is way, way ahead of them in the enterprise space, which is where the software ecosystem matters the most. If they can't get established there, quickly, my guess is that the iPad will become the defacto tablet standard, and will become almost impossible to compete with anywhere outside of the low-margin, low-end of the space. Amazon still stands to make billions off of a commanding percentage of the overall tablet market, but the lion's share of all profits will flow to Apple, which will easily maintain a 25% market share.

The real losers in all of this will be Google and Microsoft, who will never make the transition to the post-PC marketplace.
post #26 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more. If you want a $25 netbook, then you can live in poverty in India. Part of bettering yourself is to strive for something better. If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.

These statements make no sense. The iPhone 4S is not any more expensive than any other smarthphone. You don't have to look hard to find a phone on contract for 199. With everything the iPhone does its actually inexpensive. The perception of having to pay more to have perceivebly better things is NOT true.
post #27 of 69
Wowee ....

Talk about your double-edged sword ....
"Technology Alone Is Not Enough -- Married With The Liberal Arts & The Humanities,
It Yields Us The Results That Make Our Hearts Sing." - Steven P. Jobs
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"Technology Alone Is Not Enough -- Married With The Liberal Arts & The Humanities,
It Yields Us The Results That Make Our Hearts Sing." - Steven P. Jobs
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post #28 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cash907 View Post

Everyone had a bad 3rd quarter, even Apple. Wait till after the Holidays, and then we'll see what's what with whom.

Except they didn't have a bad third quarter, they had low iPhone sales due to the offset demand for the new iPhone. Apple beat their own guidance for the quarter. It wasn't Apple's fault that the street set lofty goals on the basis that the new iPhone might be released in the quarter.

The Kindle Fire is a low end tablet running phone apps that do not scale well. It will be a me too product with a crappy experience. This device is no better than an original 7" Samsung Galaxy Tab, only a year late.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #29 of 69
This sounds just like the eMachines model: sell hardware at a loss to make it back on future sales.

It was a colossal failure then, and it won't work now. It gets to a point where the more units you ship, the more money you lose. Kindle Fire at fire-sale prices isn't going to be around long.
post #30 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunspot42 View Post

The Fire actually poses more of a threat to Google and its Android partners than it does to Apple, because of the price point. Android appeals to folks who don't have any money. It's a cheap but serviceable knockoff with a 2nd-rate ecosystem. The Fire is a cheap but serviceable iPad knockoff with - once Amazon gets done building it out - a decent ecosystem...

The biggest problem Amazon is going to face is the fact that they're selling a device aimed towards people that don't want to spend a lot of money. How exactly does that translate into content sales!?

What Apple has going for it, that no one else has been able to duplicate for the last decade, is a user base willing to spend money, not only for the devices themselves, but also for the content. This is why the iTunes Music Store was a huge success from the start; anyone willing to spend $399 dollars for an MP3 player, would surely have absolutely no problem paying 0.99 for content to play on that device. Likewise for iOS devices and apps.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #31 of 69
Amazons margins will get even worse when Microsoft comes calling to get their cut because they are using an Android fork. The only reason why they probably haven't done so is that it isn't for sale yet. I expect another $5 - $10 loss per machine.
post #32 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psych_guy View Post

Oh wait, though, they would make it back on content sales. But yet again, you have another dumbfuck company looking at the wrong target. IT'S NOT CONTENT THAT MAKES APPLE RICH, IT'S THE HARDWARE, DUMMIES!!! When will these companies learn.

Steve (RIP) said it best, "They just don't get it."

It's the software, stupid.

just thought i'd throw that out there. everyone is going nuts over the Fire, but it's all based on price. they see the hardware as the PlayBook, which had pretty solid specs. but they focus so much on the price that they don't take a good look at the software.

the interface is pretty terrible for a tablet. how many of us use coverflow on our iOS device when browsing our music/movie collection? i sure don't. in fact, i don't even know if that is still an option with the new Music/Videos app...
now imagine if all the apps you had on your iPad were in one long coverflow style list? that is insane.

in reality, its both hardware & software. If you cut corners on one, doesn't matter how good the other is.

It's the experience.
post #33 of 69
Wait, so selling things for less than what it costs you to make it is bad? What is this world coming to? Who is running Amazon now, Micheal Scott paper?
post #34 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

Wait, so selling things for less than what it costs you to make it is bad? What is this world coming to? Who is running Amazon now, Micheal Scott paper?

Hey now! Michael Scott Paper Company managed to swindle a pretty successful buyout out of their situation. Although, admittedly, Dunder Mifflin probably wasn't run any better.
post #35 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Don't forget... Apple makes billion of dollars on hardware... but only a fraction of that from iTunes and the App Store.

Apple is and will always be a hardware company. iTunes and the App Store do make some money... but it pales in comparison to their hardware sales.

Now imagine if Apple didn't make any money on hardware... and only relied on iTunes and the App Store for profit. That would be suicide.

Well that sounds like what Amazon is doing.

No, it's not what Amazon is doing and you don't understand Apple's strategy.

It's true that Apple sells hardware and makes most of its money selling hardware. But one of the main selling points for their hardware sales is the ecosystem - all the software and media and other stuff that is available. Without the ecosystem, Apple would have a MUCH harder time selling most of its products (Most of the Macintosh computers wouldn't be that badly affected, but everything else would be).

Amazon is at least attempting to do the same thing. Amazon has the ecosystem -eBooks, media, apps, etc. The difference is that they are selling the hardware at a loss in order to get the profitable ecosystem sales. Apple sells the ecosystem sales at roughly break-even in order to get the profitable hardware sales.

It looks like Apple's strategy is going to be more successful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

As another poster pointed out with more words and less directly...you are what's wrong with the world.

Good should be the standard. Better should cost more.

Not at all. Acceptable should be the standard. Some people will always want the bare minimum functionality and there's nothing wrong with that.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #36 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Granmastak View Post

The funny thing about the kindle fire is.... I have no idea what I would use it for.... if I didn't have an iPad I still find it too small and crippled to even browse the web.

If, and that's a big IF, M$ and it's partners come up with a decent competitor to the iPad maybe there will be some real competition, but android based tablets are a waste of time.

I know exactly what I would use it for. But I'm not holding my breath in hopes of ever using it for what I want to use it for. That is a network remote to control my lossless iTunes library into an Airport Express into a DAC that is connected to my stereo system. (And the iTunes library is in a Mac Cube.) I find that my iPad is a little too big (and heavy) and my Touch a little too small for this. But a 7" tablet that is light and can withstand a drop to the floor from sofa height every now and then would be perfect. And this is all I would use it for. And maybe as a paper weight while it's sitting on the coffee table.
post #37 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinN206 View Post

Hardware without the content is USELESS. Apple created the ecosystem to tie Mac, iPhone, and iPad together. Likewise, the reverse is also true. You can have the best content but subpar hardware won't get you anywhere. Amazon is ALMOST right. It has the contents, but it needs to improve on the hardware to compete.

As you probably already know, ALMOST is never good enough to compete with Apple.
post #38 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Consumers are not stupid. You get what you pay for. If you want good food, you pay more. If you want a good education, you pay more. If you want a nice house, you pay more. If you want good technology, you pay more. If you want a $25 netbook, then you can live in poverty in India. Part of bettering yourself is to strive for something better. If you shop at Walmart your whole life, then you will have nothing better to offer your children when you die than Walmart items.

Your life and your self worth have little to do with the consumer electronics items that you select for purchase.


post #39 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

I guess it's mostly meant for video and games; Amazon still has the e-ink Kindles that are better suited for reading.

Web surfing too. It has a well-reviewed new browser.

Dunno about email, etc.

To me, not having access to the Android App Store is the biggest drawback, but I'll be curious if it will be possible to install plain vanilla Android onto it. I also wonder how durable it will be.
post #40 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidW View Post

I know exactly what I would use it for. But I'm not holding my breath in hopes of ever using it for what I want to use it for. That is a network remote to control my lossless iTunes library into an Airport Express into a DAC that is connected to my stereo system. (And the iTunes library is in a Mac Cube.) I find that my iPad is a little too big (and heavy) and my Touch a little too small for this. But a 7" tablet that is light and can withstand a drop to the floor from sofa height every now and then would be perfect. And this is all I would use it for. And maybe as a paper weight while it's sitting on the coffee table.

What type of DAC do you use? Does the Mac Cube work well as a server? Do you use it for any other media, or just audio?
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