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Another Nail in the AGW Coffin - Page 5

post #161 of 244

Does it shock anyone that a British tabloid writes an incredibly misleading article with several downright lies?  Doesn't shock me at all.

 

Does it shock anyone that Jazz & SDW immediately jump on said misleading article, one minutes after it's published?  Nope, still doesn't shock me.

 

Here's the response from the Met Office:

http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/

 

And here's some other coverage of the tabloid's terrible reporting:

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/updraft/archive/2012/10/british_met_office_refutes_mis.shtml

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/10/15/climate-data-feeling-the-heat

http://summitcountyvoice.com/2012/10/15/climate-september-2012-ties-2005-as-warmest-ever/

 

Since several nitwits on this board will probably not even bother to read these articles, I'm not going to waste my time discussing this in further detail, either.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #162 of 244

I was hoping BR would surprise me. Disappointed again.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #163 of 244

How about you stop knee-jerking on every poorly written tabloid article?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #164 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Does it shock anyone that a British tabloid writes an incredibly misleading article with several downright lies?  Doesn't shock me at all.

 

Does it shock anyone that Jazz & SDW immediately jump on said misleading article, one minutes after it's published?  Nope, still doesn't shock me.

 

Here's the response from the Met Office:

http://metofficenews.wordpress.com/2012/10/14/met-office-in-the-media-14-october-2012/

 

And here's some other coverage of the tabloid's terrible reporting:

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/collections/special/columns/updraft/archive/2012/10/british_met_office_refutes_mis.shtml

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/10/15/climate-data-feeling-the-heat

http://summitcountyvoice.com/2012/10/15/climate-september-2012-ties-2005-as-warmest-ever/

 

Since several nitwits on this board will probably not even bother to read these articles, I'm not going to waste my time discussing this in further detail, either.

 

Actually, if you look at the charts that the minnesota.publicradio.org site has which include cooling periods it looks like we are overdue for a cooling period anyway.  It seems that the cooling periods last about 20 years, so woohoo.

 

I'm really not sure where the tabloid got anything just dramatically wrong here.  Yeah, I'll give you that it appears they overstated the nature of the released report and made it sound like some kind of coverup conspiracy but that's what tabloids are all about.  They did of course sensationalize and spin the data, but the data does actually support their presented conclusions.

post #165 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

How about you stop knee-jerking on every poorly written tabloid article?

 

I posted a link. How is that a knee-jerk, BR?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #166 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

I posted a link. How is that a knee-jerk, BR?

Your lack of comment with the links you post leads one to believe that you agree with everything in said link.  Since you clearly didn't wait to see if your linked article was accurate in the least before posting it and implicitly agreeing with everything inside, you knee-jerked.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #167 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Your lack of comment with the links you post leads one to believe that you agree with everything in said link.  Since you clearly didn't wait to see if your linked article was accurate in the least before posting it and implicitly agreeing with everything inside, you knee-jerked.

 

Maybe you just inferred all that.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #168 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Your lack of comment with the links you post leads one to believe that you agree with everything in said link.  Since you clearly didn't wait to see if your linked article was accurate in the least before posting it and implicitly agreeing with everything inside, you knee-jerked.

 

My lack of comment does not imply anything. It does not expressly condone or support anything. I posted a link. You read the information at said link and inferred all this about my motive, intentions, and position? It appears you are the one who knee-jerked.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #169 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

My lack of comment does not imply anything. It does not expressly condone or support anything. I posted a link. You read the information at said link and inferred all this about my motive, intentions, and position? It appears you are the one who knee-jerked.

Well, posting links without commentary is against posting guidelines.  If you post links alone, I'm going to assume you agree with the contents as you deem no further comment to be necessary.  If you'd prefer, I could just report those posts instead.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #170 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Well, posting links without commentary is against posting guidelines.  If you post links alone, I'm going to assume you agree with the contents as you deem no further comment to be necessary.  If you'd prefer, I could just report those posts instead.

 

I always post links relevant to the conversation. You can assume whatever you want about what I believe, of course. Your assumptions, however, can be (and often are) very different from reality.

 

Those posting guidelines are intended to prevent spamming. But if you want to try to get an infraction against me over a technicality to try to silence me, then report away, BR. It's a rather petty tactic on your part, though.


Edited by jazzguru - 10/16/12 at 1:50pm

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #171 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

I always post links relevant to the conversation. You can assume whatever you want about what I believe, of course. Your assumptions, however, can be (and often are) very different from reality.

 

Those posting guidelines are intended to prevent spamming. But if you want to try to get an infraction against me over a technicality to try to silence me, then report away, BR. It's a rather petty tactic on your part, though.

Either stand by the links you post or provide commentary about them.  You don't get to have it both ways, jazzy.  I am not trying to silence you.  I'm encouraging you to speak up and stop being so goddamn weaselly about your positions.  If you think a bullshit tabloid story is relevant to the conversation, you have a pretty crazy idea of what relevant means, anyway.

 

So speak up, or stop spamming.  Pick one.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #172 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Either stand by the links you post or provide commentary about them.  You don't get to have it both ways, jazzy.  I am not trying to silence you.  I'm encouraging you to speak up and stop being so goddamn weaselly about your positions.  If you think a bullshit tabloid story is relevant to the conversation, you have a pretty crazy idea of what relevant means, anyway.

 

So speak up, or stop spamming.  Pick one.

 

Ignoratio elenchi

 

Stop derailing the thread, please.


Edited by jazzguru - 10/16/12 at 4:50pm

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #173 of 244
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

Ignoratio elenchi

 

Stop derailing the thread, please.

 

I'd settle for an answer to this:  Is the Met Office the definitive authority on "global warming?"  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #174 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

Ignoratio elenchi

 

Stop derailing the thread, please.

Stop spamming the thread, please.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #175 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Stop spamming the thread, please.

 

I posted a link that is relevant to the conversation. That is not spamming. We've been over this. Stay on topic, please.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #176 of 244

You violated posting guidelines and spammed a thread with a random link to a bullshit tabloid story.  We've been over this.  How about you comment on that link if you want to get us back on topic?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #177 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You violated posting guidelines and spammed a thread with a random link to a bullshit tabloid story.  We've been over this.  How about you comment on that link if you want to get us back on topic?

 

Report me if I violated the posting guidelines. You do not need to continue to derail the thread with these petty antics.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #178 of 244

So, please give us your thoughts about that link.  I'm interested to hear what specific parts of it prompted you to post it here--I want to know what you think it added to this thread.  Of course, if you won't do that, I'll assume you were just spamming us.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #179 of 244

Your assumptions are noted. Again.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #180 of 244

Why did you post the link?  What part of the misleading tabloid article prompted you to post it?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #181 of 244
 
Quote:
Global warming hasn't been a point of contention in the presidential campaign. This is as it should be, because it's not a real issue. Earth's temperature is about the same now was it was in 1997.
In fact, we don't believe it's ever been a real issue. Global warming has always been an idea, a guess. We've never been satisfied that man's small contributions to the carbon dioxide level in our atmosphere were causing the planet to overheat.
 
The global warming alarmists always liked to point to the "hockey stick" graph that supposedly showed temperatures flatlining for about 900 years before shooting sharply upward starting around 1900. Now that chart has been discredited.
 
With that in mind, we invite the alarmists to take a look at a graph produced by the Met Office, the official weather forecaster of the United Kingdom.
 
It shows that global temperatures have been up and down since 1997 but are at the same place they were at the beginning of that year.
 
"This means that the 'plateau' or 'pause' in global warming has now lasted for about the same time as the previous period when temperatures rose, 1980 to 1996," writes Daily Mail reporter David Rose.
 
"Before that," Rose continued, "temperatures had been stable or declining for about 40 years."
 
The global temperature data set was compiled by the Met Office and the University of East Anglia's Climate Research Unit, the band of alarmist scientists whose work has been called into question by the Climate-gate scandal. The data showing no temperature change, Rose noted, were issued with little fanfare.
 
The Met Office tried to marginalize Rose's report, saying that "choosing a starting or end point on short-term scales can be very misleading."
 
"Climate change," said the British weathermen, "can only be detected from multidecadal timescales."
 
Right. Like that "multidecadal timescale" of 1980-96, a warm period that allegedly confirmed man-made global warming was indeed happening.
 
It isn't dead yet, but the global warming game is winding down. Fraud always has an expiration date.

 

Why hasn't climate change been a major issue this election cycle? Why are we not hearing about it in the debates? Certainly, if there is a "scientific consensus" that by merely exhaling we are destroying the planet - if the "science is sound" and we really are hastening a worldwide calamity by using incandescent light bulbs instead of CFLs - at least one of our presidential candidates should be talking about it, right?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #182 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

 

Why hasn't climate change been a major issue this election cycle? Why are we not hearing about it in the debates?

Blame the myopia of the swing-state voter when the unemployment rate is decreasing but not yet returned to acceptable levels.  In tougher economic times, long-term issues, no matter how important, tend to get put on the back-burner.  However, while global climate change has not specifically been named, President Obama has been addressing the issue by pushing for a wider dedication to green energy.

 

Certainly, if there is a "scientific consensus" that by merely exhaling we are destroying the planet

 

 

This is a wholly ignorant statement, demonstrating either your complete lack of understanding with regard to the science or an intentional misrepresentation of said science.  Either way, this sort of statement has no place whatsoever in intellectual discourse about this topic.  In other words, this statement was bad and you should feel bad.

 

 

Quote:

 - if the "science is sound" and we really are hastening a worldwide calamity by using incandescent light bulbs instead of CFLs - at least one of our presidential candidates should be talking about it, right?

 

 

If talking about it sours the electorate in tougher economic times, it is better for the candidate who actually wants to do something about it to speak indirectly by talking about the focus on green energy than opening himself up to ridiculous soundbites (you know, like your terrible statement above) that speak to an ignorant segment of the population, increasing the chances of a candidate who really doesn't seem to give two shits about the environment (well, anymore anyway since he has now embraced coal after calling coal plants killers while governor).

 

So, in short, pragmatism.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #183 of 244

Also, Jazz, why did you post the previous link?  What part of the misleading tabloid article prompted you to post it?

 

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #184 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Also, Jazz, why did you post the previous link?  What part of the misleading tabloid article prompted you to post it?

 

I explained why I posted it.

 

The wording of your second question indicates you are not interested in my opinion, therefore I won't waste my time on you.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #185 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

This is a wholly ignorant statement, demonstrating either your complete lack of understanding with regard to the science or an intentional misrepresentation of said science.  Either way, this sort of statement has no place whatsoever in intellectual discourse about this topic.  In other words, this statement was bad and you should feel bad.

 

Your opinion is noted.

 

You want to use government to forcibly regulate a gas that is naturally emitted by plants and animals under the assumption that it is causing catastrophic global warming. My comment absolutely has a place in the discussion because the policies you support have brought it into the discussion.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #186 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

Your opinion is noted.

 

You want to use government to forcibly regulate a gas that is naturally emitted by plants and animals under the assumption that it is causing catastrophic global warming. My comment absolutely has a place in the discussion because the policies you support have brought it into the discussion.

 

Your statement here is again either intentionally deceptive or you completely don't understand the science of global climate change.  It is the excess carbon dioxide that was sequestered in hydrocarbons deep below the Earth's surface that is now being released at a ridiculous pace through the burning of fossil fuels that causes the problem--it's what goes beyond the natural equilibrium.  So, now that you are informed, any further repetitions of these kinds of statements you just made again will be interpreted as willful ignorance or willful deception.  

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #187 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

 

Your statement here is again either intentionally deceptive or you completely don't understand the science of global climate change.  It is the excess carbon dioxide that was sequestered in hydrocarbons deep below the Earth's surface that is now being released at a ridiculous pace through the burning of fossil fuels that causes the problem--it's what goes beyond the natural equilibrium.  So, now that you are informed, any further repetitions of these kinds of statements you just made again will be interpreted as willful ignorance or willful deception.  

 

My original statement still stands. Alarmists believe "excess" CO2 emissions will result in "catastrophic climate change". Yes, CO2 is a byproduct of fossil fuel production and use. It is also a gas emitted by living organisms, our oceans, and other sources.

 

Alarmists want governments to control how much CO2 gas is emitted to prevent "catastrophic climate change". They've already gone as far as mandating what kinds of gas mileage cars should be allowed to have, what kinds of lights retailers can sell. There's talk of other initiatives like government-controlled thermostats in homes.

 

But I digress. Why is it ignorant or deceptive to conclude that alarmists want to use governments to regulate a gas that humans exhale when that is exactly the case?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #188 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

My original statement still stands. Alarmists believe "excess" CO2 emissions will result in "catastrophic climate change". Yes, CO2 is a byproduct of fossil fuel production and use. It is also a gas emitted by living organisms, our oceans, and other sources.

 

Alarmists want governments to control how much CO2 gas is emitted to prevent "catastrophic climate change". They've already gone as far as mandating what kinds of gas mileage cars should be allowed to have, what kinds of lights retailers can sell. There's talk of other initiatives like government-controlled thermostats in homes.

 

But I digress. Why is it ignorant or deceptive to conclude that alarmists want to use governments to regulate a gas that humans exhale when that is exactly the case?

No, your original statement doesn't stand.  Tacking on the phrase "that humans exhale" may be done intentionally to deceive others into thinking that the problem of excess CO2 from the burning of ever-increasing amounts of fossil fuels is a trivial one because, hey, humans exhale it.  It also may be done because one literally believes that humans breathing is the cause of global climate change--in that case, it is ignorance of monumental proportions speaking.  

 

So, deception or stupidity--your choice.  Which is it?

 

I suppose you wouldn't mind a different gas that humans emit from  filling your home, because hey, humans emit it.  In fact, no need to evacuate a school that is leaking a kind of gas that humans emit.  All you alarmists who think we shouldn't light matches or cause sparks when our homes and schools fill with methane need to CHILL THE **** OUT because it's JUST A GAS THAT HUMANS EMIT.  It's not a problem, because I'm super clever and say humans emit it as if attempting to lessen how significant it sounds will literally lessen the danger.  I'M A MAGICAL THINKING SUPERMAN!  GO ME!  IT'S EXACTLY THE CASE!  BOLD, UNDERLINE, AND ITALICS!

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #189 of 244

Superman? SUPERMAN?! If you're going to insult me, at least pick a superhero that is less cool. Aquaman, maybe?

 

I mean, who wouldn't want to be Superman?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #190 of 244

A superman of magical thinking.  That person doesn't get all the other abilities.  That person only has superhuman powers to deny reality.

 

But anyway, now will you explain the real reason you keep tacking on the phrase "that humans exhale" over and over again?  Or did I have it covered?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #191 of 244
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

A superman of magical thinking.  That person doesn't get all the other abilities.  That person only has superhuman powers to deny reality.

 

But anyway, now will you explain the real reason you keep tacking on the phrase "that humans exhale" over and over again?  Or did I have it covered?

 

I'm sure he will.  In the meantime, perhaps you'd like to explain why you are assigning motives to his statements?  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #192 of 244

"That humans exhale" is an irrelevant fact with regard to the topic of global climate change.  He is committing a logical fallacy by including that phrase with his argument, as it serves as a distractor.  Jazz's motives are obvious when he takes bullshit tabloid "news" and posts it minutes after it is released because it supports his preconceived notions.  He doesn't check the veracity of the article first.  He just blindly posts without explanation.  I'm still waiting for an explanation on that one.  

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #193 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

A superman of magical thinking.  That person doesn't get all the other abilities.  That person only has superhuman powers to deny reality.

 

But anyway, now will you explain the real reason you keep tacking on the phrase "that humans exhale" over and over again?  Or did I have it covered?

 

I guess an Aquaman of magical thinking doesn't sound quite as cool.

 

Perhaps Batman of magical thinking.

 

Ooh wait! Can I be an Iron Man of magical thinking? That would be sweet.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #194 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

"That humans exhale" is an irrelevant fact with regard to the topic of global climate change.  He is committing a logical fallacy by including that phrase with his argument, as it serves as a distractor.  Jazz's motives are obvious when he takes bullshit tabloid "news" and posts it minutes after it is released because it supports his preconceived notions.  He doesn't check the veracity of the article first.  He just blindly posts without explanation.  I'm still waiting for an explanation on that one.  

 

Humans exhale CO2. That is a fact.

 

You want governments to regulate CO2. That is a fact.

 

You want governments to regulate a gas that humans exhale. That is a fact.

 

Or am I wrong?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #195 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

"That humans exhale" is an irrelevant fact with regard to the topic of global climate change.  He is committing a logical fallacy by including that phrase with his argument, as it serves as a distractor.  Jazz's motives are obvious when he takes bullshit tabloid "news" and posts it minutes after it is released because it supports his preconceived notions.  He doesn't check the veracity of the article first.  He just blindly posts without explanation.  I'm still waiting for an explanation on that one.  

 

Humans exhale CO2. That is a fact.

 

You want governments to regulate CO2. That is a fact.

 

You want governments to regulate a gas that humans exhale. That is a fact.

 

Or am I wrong?

 

All correct as I understand the discussion, but just to clarify, are you arguing that because it is a gas that is naturally exhaled as a byproduct of respiration that it automatically follows that it should be unregulated? Even if an alternative unnatural source of it alters the atmospheric concentration of CO2 to a level that could be harmful?

 

If so, consider that O2 is inhaled and depleted via normal respiration. Does that mean that if one were to develop an industrial process that used up large quantities of atmospheric O2 and reduced the atmospheric O2 concentration that it would inappropriate to regulate? Just curious how far you want to take that argument.

post #196 of 244
Global warming I believe is real. Time for new energy. Not oil. Which is good, because there's no more oil anyway.
post #197 of 244
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sr2012 View Post

Global warming I believe is real. Time for new energy. Not oil. Which is good, because there's no more oil anyway.

 

False.  There is plenty of oil.  In fact, oil may not even be a finite resource.   

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #198 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetry View Post

 

All correct as I understand the discussion, but just to clarify, are you arguing that because it is a gas that is naturally exhaled as a byproduct of respiration that it automatically follows that it should be unregulated? Even if an alternative unnatural source of it alters the atmospheric concentration of CO2 to a level that could be harmful?

 

To answer both questions: yes. Giving the government the power to control a gas that humans exhale - under the pretext that said gas will destroy the planet - gives them the power to control the humans themselves, and I am ardently against slavery.

 

It hasn't even been conclusively proven that CO2 is driving climate change. Some scientists posit that changes in CO2 levels follow climate change rather than drive it.

 

I am all for exploring alternative, renewable, efficient energy sources, but not through the violent force of government. I believe most of the problems individuals face can be resolved through voluntary exchange and interaction, which is inhibited and discouraged in varying degrees by most governments.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #199 of 244

I like how you ignored muppetry's other question about O2.  I also like how you spit in logic's face and made a giant leap from limiting commercial and industrial releases of a gas (that humans happen to unrelatedly exhale) to slavery.  

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #200 of 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I like how you ignored muppetry's other question about O2.  I also like how you spit in logic's face and made a giant leap from limiting commercial and industrial releases of a gas (that humans happen to unrelatedly exhale) to slavery.  

 

I didn't answer the other questions because I would have been repeating myself.

 

If you believe governments would stop at absolute commercial and industrial control (which I am also obviously opposed to) you're ignorant of history.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
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