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Samsung to depose Apple's iPhone designers, including Jony Ive - Page 2

post #41 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Idea: Leave, then.

It's funny how quickly you get an infraction point for an ad hominem attack (and I'm okay with that)... but you can skirt around the TOS by just using obvious taunts, trolling and antagonism time and time again without a warning... unless one or more members bitch loudly.

Anyway... off topic.... carry on.

Samsung stinks etc.
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post #42 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Samsung doesn't need Apple. Apple doesn't need Samsung. They should part ways. Both are large enough companies as it is.

That is a very naive statement. These companies are tied at the hip for the moment, and it will take quite some time and effort to unravel that knot.

Thompson
post #43 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

It's funny how quickly you get an infraction point for an ad hominem attack (and I'm okay with that)... but you can skirt around the TOS by just using obvious taunts, trolling and antagonism time and time again without a warning... unless one or more members bitch loudly.

Anyway... off topic.... carry on.

Samsung stinks etc.

You got an infraction?
post #44 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by JONOROM View Post

Sorry, but that is an absurd statement. At minimum Ive is subject to the control of the board, just like Cook. So he is not the most powerful; he has at least one peer.

In his daily work, i.e. at his lab where he determines which designs are more appealing, I don't think anybody (not Cook, and not the board) can gainsay Ive. I think that's all that Jobs' meant when he said nobody can tell Ive what to do. And I think that that's all Ive does, so he is truly unencumbered by direction from above in his daily tasks. He does only what he loves, and nobody tells him how to do it. (Wish I could be so lucky!)

But I agree with you that this is not the same as being "the most powerful".

Quote:
Originally Posted by JONOROM View Post

And I would be extremely surprised if Cook could not fire him, although he may need permission from the board or the COB, but that is not unusual for very high-level employees.

Cook would indeed need the board's approval, and I would be extremely surprised if he got it. When the head coach of the football team has irreconcilable differences with a star player on the team, sometimes its the coach that gets shown the door.

But this is pure fantasy anyway. I think that Tim is perfectly happy leaving the design genius to his work, and I don't see how it would ever come down to irreconcilable differences.

Thompson
post #45 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

That is a very naive statement. These companies are tied at the hip for the moment, and it will take quite some time and effort to unravel that knot.

Thompson

Samsung was doing fine before Apple was even birth. What you smokin'? They technically DON'T need each other. Yes, contractually, yes. But both companies can end their relationship and survive.

Unless you mean they are mergeing.
post #46 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

When they made bullshit immigration threats and pretended to be police so they could ransack that guy's house for their lost iPhone - that was the incident which proved to me just what sort of a nasty megacorporate monster Apple has become.

Well if you followed the story for a week or so (i.e. past the initial headlines) we found out that the Apple folks did not pretend to be police and that there were police there WITH them. They did not have a warrant, but when they asked the occupant whether they could check out his house, he said yes. Apparently, they came and went without any ransacking (and without the phone). I thought that the occupant reported that they were polite.

Was there actually any "ransacking" or "pretending" involved? Did they actually threaten to call immigration in order to get his approval to enter? If so, that would have been a mistake on the part of the police that were there with them. Do you have any information in this regard?

Thompson
post #47 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Samsung was doing fine before Apple was even birth.

True, but the situation NOW is what we are discussing. No?

Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

What you smokin'? They technically DON'T need each other.

Technicalities are not all that matter in business. There is also the business side of things, and what happens to your revenue stream when you suddenly lose customers and/or vendors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Yes, contractually, yes.

Ah, so you kind of get the point. But you so downplay this as well as the effects of your suggestion...

Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

But both companies can end their relationship and survive.

Survival is one thing. But these companies are THRIVING. If either suddenly walked away, the revenue would be strongly diminished until such time as the loss could be replaced... and that doesn't just happen overnight. Going instantly from kings of the tech world to simple "survival" mode just out of spite would be a terribly naive (not to mention stupid) thing to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Unless you mean they are mergeing.

OK, now I'm really concerned for your understanding of business, if that's the only thing you could come up with for my meaning.

Thompson
post #48 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Apple Insider, gets worse and worse everyday. Sensationalist articles.



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post #49 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

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And your point is? Posting my history absolutely means nothing without CONTEXT.
post #50 of 132
@Thompr


Yes, they need in them in the average business sense. But we're talking about Apple. The same company where the CEO said he'd use every last dollar of their cash reserves to get rid of Android. Logic doens't apply here. Reading the Steve Jobs biography, apparently he, and I quote the author, suffers from a "REALITY DISTORTION FIELD".

I hope you know we are talking about the same compnay that doesn't test their products or have sit downs for suggestions. They just do what they want. Go figure.
post #51 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

And your point is? Posting my history absolutely means nothing without CONTEXT.

Apple Insider, gets worse and worse everyday.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
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post #52 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Apple Insider, gets worse and worse everyday.

That's my opinion? Half of the articles have no direct relevance to Apple.
post #53 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sierrajeff View Post

This is ridiculous - speaking as a lawyer, this is nothing more than a stall tactic and annoyance by Samsung's counsel; Apple's product came first, so there's little to nothing to be gained by deposing its designers.

Someone on the forums who knows what is going on (in a sense). Let me be the first to shake your hand!

... at night.

Reply

... at night.

Reply
post #54 of 132
I bet Samsung asks "Mr. Ives, in your own words how do you say aluminum? "

All kidding aside, Samsung is just ridiculous to have gone this far. I don't even think I bought a Samsung product ever. What do they make DVD/Blu-Ray players and TVs?
post #55 of 132
At first I thought it said Samsung is going to dispose of Apple's designers!
post #56 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan Kubrick View Post

I bet Samsung asks "Mr. Ives, in your own words how do you say aluminum? "

All kidding aside, Samsung is just ridiculous to have gone this far. I don't even think I bought a Samsung product ever. What do they make DVD/Blu-Ray players and TVs?

Computers, Jet Fighter Plans, TVS (THE BIGGEST TV MANUFACTRER IN THE WORLD BTW), Cellphones, Ships/Shipyards, Washer/Dryers, Refridgerators, Monitors, Cameras, Textiles, etc. They MUCH bigger than Apple.

Any other quesitons?
post #57 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

@Thompr


Yes, they need in them in the average business sense. But we're talking about Apple. The same company where the CEO said he'd use every last dollar of their cash reserves to get rid of Android. Logic doens't apply here. Reading the Steve Jobs biography, apparently he, and I quote the author, suffers from a "REALITY DISTORTION FIELD".

I hope you know we are talking about the same compnay that doesn't test their products or have sit downs for suggestions. They just do what they want. Go figure.

So you seem to agree with me that both companies need one another for the time being, but you suggest that since Apple does things their own way, they may just do something illogical and cut ties with Samsung without regard for the consequences. Do I understand you correctly?

Note that this is significantly different from your original assertion, i.e. that neither company needs the other. I think that I have proven your original point wrong, and now I stand prepared to debate your new point.

Thompson
post #58 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

They have nowhere to go. They are pretty much without any choice but to enrich Samsung.

Multiple alternatives exist for manufacturing microprocessors and flash RAM. Can you explain why they have nowhere to go?

Recent analysis suggests the Apple has been brilliant in locking out competitors with their manufacturing maneuvers. What you are saying suggests that they have maneuvered themselves into a corner instead. Can you elaborate?
post #59 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post


I hope you know we are talking about the same compnay that doesn't test their products or have sit downs for suggestions. They just do what they want. Go figure.

Who doesn't test their products or have sit downs for suggestions? Apple? Not true. Samsung? Not true either.

Are you talking about another company?
post #60 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

At first I thought it said Samsung is going to dispose of Apple's designers!

Why would they dispose of their top *design team*?
post #61 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

So you seem to agree with me that both companies need one another for the time being, but you suggest that since Apple does things their own way, they may just do something illogical and cut ties with Samsung without regard for the consequences. Do I understand you correctly?

Note that this is significantly different from your original assertion, i.e. that neither company needs the other. I think that I have proven your original point wrong, and now I stand prepared to debate your new point.

Thompson

Not much.

In essence, Apple will still be Apple regardless of what happens. That entity stays the same. But the mess that would result would be enormous. I think the cost for Apple themselves would go up. Samsung would be affected, but I don't think nearly as much as they do make several products for differnet companies. Its a partnership that has to stay for the time being.

We have already witnessed legal messes when companies drift apart. Heck, look at what happened to Rare when Nintendo sold them to Micosoft. So many games can't have a sequel made just because Nintendo holds the orignal liscence.

I would picture the iPhone 4 would be dropped off if this happend. I don't want to even know the implications of this. Not to mentioned the new company making the chips on a large scale (Texas Instruments maybe?) could have some issues.

I'm keeping my orginal statement. The two don't need each other. If they decide to destory themselves, it's capitalism and are free to do so. But it's like having to pay for a patent....you don't like it but you have to to survive.

Half of the people here think Apple is going to do so well without any company (Siri will overtake google, Apple gets rid of Samsung for life). Ironically, I'm trying to sound less pro Android/Samung but apparently I'm sound more Appely. That's not the case. They don't need to each other. Just like Apple could close their stores down for an entire month. HOWEVER, a big mess is going to be made that they can't recover.

Also, Apple needs to be careful. Most of it's history it hasn't been as consistently successful like Microsoft (Apple has only been releveant in the last 10 years). Don't bit the hands that feed ya.
post #62 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

That is a very naive statement. These companies are tied at the hip for the moment, and it will take quite some time and effort to unravel that knot.

Thompson

Tied at the hip ... knot unraveling ...

That's serious metaphor mixing, dude.
post #63 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Who doesn't test their products or have sit downs for suggestions? Apple? Not true. Samsung? Not true either.

Are you talking about another company?

Apple tends to not put in things that are become standard in the industry. Is their slogan Think Different?
post #64 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Computers, Jet Fighter Plans, TVS (THE BIGGEST TV MANUFACTRER IN THE WORLD BTW), Cellphones, Ships/Shipyards, Washer/Dryers, Refridgerators, Monitors, Cameras, Textiles, etc. They MUCH bigger than Apple.

Any other quesitons?

They much bigger than Apple?

Not really. In terms of number of employees? Yes, much bigger. In terms of revenues? About twice as much, I believe, which does not qualify as *much* bigger.
post #65 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Apple tends to not put in things that are become standard in the industry. Is their slogan Think Different?

That does not equate not testing and not meeting.

Is your slogan to Think Different Topic when caught unable to back up with facts?
post #66 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Tied at the hip ... knot unraveling ...

That's serious metaphor mixing, dude.

Mixing metaphors is my specialty. A blessing and a curse. :-)

Thompson
post #67 of 132
And I thought we were done with Samsung news in 2011
post #68 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

It's funny how quickly you get an infraction point for an ad hominem attack (and I'm okay with that)... but you can skirt around the TOS by just using obvious taunts, trolling and antagonism time and time again without a warning... unless one or more members bitch loudly.

Anyway... off topic.... carry on.

Samsung stinks etc.

You guys like to label people as trolls or put us on ignore list whenever someone takes a different viewpoint. This clique mentality is so teenage girlish.

If you disagree with someone, then debate with facts, rather than reciting slogans and throwing tantrums.

If you really don't like the discussion, then just engage with different people. Has the sophomoric tactic of troll-labeling gained you anything at all? Anything?
post #69 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Tied at the hip ... knot unraveling ...

That's serious metaphor mixing, dude.

I'm not so sure. Not that it matters much but tied at the hip does imply an untying in order to separate, as in a knot. If he had said joined at the hip I would agree. Again not that it matters much, I'm just trying not to respond to the troll fest going on around here lately.

Edit: I see you're raking umbrage with the word troll here and I thought I'd be clear I wasn't talking about you in my troll fest part of my comment.
post #70 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

I'm keeping my orginal statement. The two don't need each other. If they decide to destory themselves, it's capitalism and are free to do so.

Implicitly you are admitting that the alternative to keeping each other around until they find replacements is self-destructive. Truly it is. In a world where Wall Street punishes you for missing growth targets, a company gets absolutely devastated if they show negative growth. Samsung may have a lot of other customers, but if Apple suddenly ceased being one of them then their earnings would definitely suffer a hit. Likewise, if Apple's manufacturing capability decreases now, at a time when they already struggle to meet great demand, their earnings will take a hit.

Neither company will let that happen. Period. Apple will get their replacements lined up FIRST, and that won't be as easy as others on this thread make it out to be. It will take time, and build schedules look many months ahead. Tim Cook is the guru of supply chain management, and he is nobody's fool. Meanwhile, Samsung is not going to stop supplying parts to Apple just due to a fight on the other side of their business.

Big corporations don't act purely out of spite like individuals do. When they get a chance to satisfy their spite as a bonus, they do. But they won't cut off their nose for it. So these companies will continue doing business with one another until they can ramp away to a replacement. For the time being though, they absolutely need each other. It is much the same in many competitive industries: corporations are teammates and rivals at the same time. They manage to compartmentalize stuff much better than individuals. But many people on this thread are thinking of Samsung and Apple as individuals at war. That is a naive way to look at it.

Thompson
post #71 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by thompr View Post

Implicitly you are admitting that the alternative to keeping each other around until they find replacements is self-destructive. Truly it is. In a world where Wall Street punishes you for missing growth targets, a company gets absolutely devastated if they show negative growth. Samsung may have a lot of other customers, but if Apple suddenly ceased being one of them then their earnings would definitely suffer a hit. Likewise, if Apple's manufacturing capability decreases now, at a time when they already struggle to meet great demand, their earnings will take a hit.

Neither company will let that happen. Period. Apple will get their replacements lined up FIRST, and that won't be as easy as others on this thread make it out to be. It will take time, and build schedules look many months ahead. Tim Cook is the guru of supply chain management, and he is nobody's fool. Meanwhile, Samsung is not going to stop supplying parts to Apple just due to a fight on the other side of their business.

Big corporations don't act purely out of spite like individuals do. When they get a chance to satisfy their spite as a bonus, they do. But they won't cut off their nose for it. So these companies will continue doing business with one another until they can ramp away to a replacement. For the time being though, they absolutely need each other. It is much the same in many competitive industries: corporations are teammates and rivals at the same time. They manage to compartmentalize stuff much better than individuals. But many people on this thread are thinking of Samsung and Apple as individuals at war. That is a naive way to look at it.

Thompson

Well, it's a good thing Steve Jobs didn't have full power over Apple....
post #72 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post

I'm not so sure. Not that it matters much but tied at the hip does imply an untying in order to separate, as in a knot. If he had said joined at the hip I would agree. Again not that it matters much, I'm just trying not to respond to the troll fest going on around here lately.

Edit: I see you're raking umbrage with the word troll here and I thought I'd be clear I wasn't talking about you in my troll fest part of my comment.

In my best medical opinion, it is not possible to tie two hips in a knot. So I would consider "tied at the hip" and "unraveling a knot" to be mixed metaphors, particularly since the common saying is "joined" rather than "tied" at the hip (arguably, that alone is a mixed metaphor).

No worries about the troll remark. I wasn't so much taking or raking umbrage as I was giving hopefully well received (fat chance) advice.
post #73 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

That does not equate not testing and not meeting.

Is your slogan to Think Different Topic when caught unable to back up with facts?

It's been proven. Can you back up your facts? Don't come running in here wanting facts and you yourself have yet to bring in a single piece of evidence. Seems like there is a huge problem. Apple doesn't have focus groups like several other companies. In fact, some companies like Kellogs have launched products that failed because of that.

Lemme just leve this here:
Quote:
Its not about pop culture, and its not about fooling people, and its not about convincing people that they want something they dont. We figure out what we want. And I think were pretty good at having the right discipline to think through whether a lot of other people are going to want it, too. Thats what we get paid to do. So you cant go out and ask people, you know, whats the next big [thing.] Theres a great quote by Henry Ford, right? He said, If Id have asked my customers what they wanted, they would have told me A faster horse------Steve Jobs

Now, where's your evidence?
post #74 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Why would they dispose of their top *design team*?

[insult removed] I was only joking. Lighten up.
post #75 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

And I thought we were done with Samsung news in 2011

We have two months left, man; what're you thinking?

That's time at least for fifteen more major articles, and not just here, I'll tell you.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #76 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by boeyc15 View Post

Exactly. First to market does not a long term winner always make.

Your right Yoda, as usuall!
post #77 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

Well, it's a good thing Steve Jobs didn't have full power over Apple....

Jobs long ago put Cook in charge of the supply chain and logistics, with stunning effect. Jobs also let Cook be the guy that presided over the quarterly conference calls. Jobs knew that Cook was hell-on-wheels at that type of thing, and ultimately decided he would be best to run the show after.

There were certain things that Steve just left to Tim, and in spite of the former's micromanagement persona, he liked it when people brought competent arguments against him. My hunch is that Tim Cook won his share of disagreements with Steve when it came to such things. I could imagine the scene now...

Steve: I am going to nuclear war with Android right now, and I think we should just instantly stop all business with Samsung in order to hit them where it hurts. And we'll take down all others the same way if we have to, regardless of what it does to us.

Tim: I don't think that's a good idea, and here's why...

[Followed by a dazzling display of operational intellect that suggests another way that Apple can hit Samsung where it hurts and doesn't hurt Apple's operations in the slightest. The only con would be delayed gratification of Mr Steve's desire.]

Steve: Good, then. Carry on.



Thompson
post #78 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

In my best medical opinion, it is not possible to tie two hips in a knot. So I would consider "tied at the hip" and "unraveling a knot" to be mixed metaphors, particularly since the common saying is "joined" rather than "tied" at the hip (arguably, that alone is a mixed metaphor).

Yes, indeedy, I am known for my mixed metaphors. I love mixing 'em up. Why use only one metaphor when two can amuse? Love to kill the two birds, ya know? After all, a hand in the bush is better than two birds!

;-)

Thompson
post #79 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by linkgx1 View Post

[insult removed] I was only joking. Lighten up.

Lighten up? You're the one *raking* umbrage.

There's a saying, it goes something like this: If you can't take, don't give.
post #80 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

Lighten up? You're the one *raking* umbrage.

There's a saying, it goes something like this: If you can't take, don't give.

That absolutely makes no sense. That didn't answer my question.
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