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Adobe releases Photoshop, Premiere Elements 10 on Apple's Mac App Store

post #1 of 35
Thread Starter 
"Special editions" of Adobe's consumer-oriented editing software, Photoshop Elements 10 and Premiere Elements 10, are now available to purchase on Apple's Mac App Store.

Both Adobe Photoshop Elements 10 Editor and Adobe Premiere Elements 10 Editor are available on the Mac App Store for $79.99 each. The "Editor" portion of the name reflects the fact that the Mac App Store versions of the software do not include the Elements Organizer or support case-sensitive HFS volumes, while Premiere Elements 10 Editor also lacks Smartsound capability.

The release of "special editions" of Adobe's consumer photo and video editing software comes less than two months after they were released at retail. The full version of both Photoshop Elements 10 and Premiere Elements 10 come at a higher suggested price of $99.99 each.

Adobe originally debuted on the Mac App Store in July with the release of Photoshop Elements 9 Editor. Adobe's support of the Mac App Store is noteworthy, as many of Apple's competitors have chosen to avoid the digital distribution storefront, which gives Apple a 30 percent cut of sales.

Adobe Photoshop Elements 10 Editor

Adobe is pitching its Mac App Store version of Photoshop Elements 10 as a product that "works great with iPhoto when you're ready to go beyond the basics." The $79.99 purchase includes all of the editing features of the full version, and can be installed in English, German, French and Japanese.

The "top features" of Photoshop Elements 10 Editor, according to Adobe, are:
Go from flawed to phenomenal in seconds with automated options that help you get great results with just a few clicks. Simply paint effects and patterns on photos to achieve stunning results.
Count on step-by-step assistanceLet Guided Edits help you achieve both basic edits and artistic effects by walking you through each step. New options help you create dramatic Depth of Field, Picture Stack and Orton effects.
Make unwanted photo elements vanish with one stroke of the enhanced Spot Healing Brush that fills in backgrounds beautifully, powered by the content-aware fill technology from Adobe Photoshop.
Create the perfect photo by easily combining the best from multiple photos. Create great group shots, expanded panoramas, perfectly lit shots, and more.
Share the way you want using flexible templates to create photo books, cards, calendars, and more. Add curvy, flowing text that automatically flows around subjects, shapes or any path you choose.


Adobe Photoshop Elements 10 Editor requires Mac OS X 10.6.6 or later. It is a 1.21GB download. Other features of the "special edition" software listed by Adobe are:
Layers-based image editing with enhanced support for layer masks and layer styles
Transform images using powerful compositing and image extraction tools
Over 50 tools for selecting cropping, painting, typing, retouching and adjusting
Powerful, automated color correction tools with precise control over different image parameters
Hundreds of filters with unlimited options
Extensive 3rd party plug-in support
Advanced text typography
Adjust image size and resolution
Prepare and export images for the web
Create Picture Packages and Contact Sheets for fantastic print output
Adobe Premiere Elements 10 Editor

Like Photoshop Elements 10 Editor, Premiere Elements 10 Editor can be installed in English, German, French and Japanese. Adobe's description touts that its award-winning video editor allows users to "turn your video clips into memorable movies." Top features are:
Create a polished movie instantlyInstantMovie automatically edits together your best clips with coordinated music, titles, and effects from your choice of movie theme. Enjoy over 30 fun themes.
Save time with automated optionsFix shaky footage, color and lighting problems, trim away all but your best footage, and balance audio elements to give you professional-quality sound throughout your movie.
Easily do more with video clips and photosMake all your memories shine whether theyre captured on video or in photos. Enhance color in video clips as easily as with photos, and quickly bring photos to life using customized pan and zoom motions.
Quickly add professional polish with TV-style visual and audio effects.
Showcase clips and movies anywhere, including on discs, HD TVs, Facebook and YouTube. Also share via convenient DVD-style viewing experience online.


Adobe Premiere Elements 10 Editor also requires Mac OS X 10.6.6 or later. It is a 924MB download from the Mac App Store. Additional features listed by Adobe are:
Storyboard or timeline view with 99 audio and video tracks for unlimited creative possibilities
Hundreds of effects and transitions
Professional quality audio effects and controls
HD or SD format support for importing, editing and sharing
Automatic trimming of poor footage (SmartTrim)
Full keyframing for effects and motions
Powerful compositing options including blue/green screen and multiple picture-in-picture effects
Effects masking & motion tracking
Customizable, flexible workspace
Easy title creation with dozens of templates and full creative control of backgrounds, text formatting, animations and more
Custom disc menus
Export to AVCHD, burn to DVD or Blu-ray, all within a single program
Burn HD video to standard DVDs
post #2 of 35
Any word on upgrades?

I bought v9 from the Mac App Store last month, as I didn't expect a significant update so quickly after the July release. I'll be disappointed if support (including bug fixe releases) for v9 doesn't happen now that v10 is released.
post #3 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by G_Warren View Post

Any word on upgrades?

I bought v9 from the Mac App Store last month, as I didn't expect a significant update so quickly after the July release. I'll be disappointed if support (including bug fixe releases) for v9 doesn't happen now that v10 is released.

I doubt you'll get an upgrade. Remember, this is Adobe we're talking about, who charged full prices for a point update of their Creative Suite (5.5). Just remember, though, that Apple, who will give you unlimited installs and lifetime updates of their App Store apps, is still somehow more evil than anything else on the entire planet combined.
post #4 of 35
I am not a developer - or at least the only code I have written has been for internal consumption - not that I don't have ideas - but have never put anything out there for sale - nor have I ever run a distribution business (though I worked for one - in a technical sales role) - but it would seem to me that Apple could pretty easily setup some sort of tiered model - 30% up to $50 - 20% for titles from $51 to $199 - and 10% for anything $200 an up maybe. Not sure how that compares to other distribution models. That is an interesting question, though, just what is the percentage that other distribution companies take - whether you are talking about Amazon or a Music label or even Best Buy etc - everyone wants their cut - and I would imagine that there is a wide range of percentages taken out there depending on the relative bargaining strength of each partner in any given transaction.

So I suppose - no matter how you feel about the 30% Apple cut - the fact that it is a public number that is not negotiable regardless of whether your product is $1 or $100 or $500 - could be a good thing. And I would imagine that except for very large companies, not needing to have your own servers and distribution mechanism and payment collection processing and perhaps even less $ spent on advertising - 30% might start to look good. on the other hand - if you have all that stuff yourself already - 30% likely sounds really steep.
post #5 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by G_Warren View Post

Any word on upgrades?

I bought v9 from the Mac App Store last month, as I didn't expect a significant update so quickly after the July release. I'll be disappointed if support (including bug fixe releases) for v9 doesn't happen now that v10 is released.

You can buy cheap upgrades from Adobe Directly, though you'll loose your five mac install license and unlimited downloads from the App Store.

Knowing Adobe, the update wont be that substantial. I Moved from Photoshop 7 to CS3 and the list of new features was impressive at the time. CS3 to CS5.5 (technically 3 versions later) and I don't see anything different. Wait 4 or 5 years and then it'll be worth the upgrade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

I doubt you'll get an upgrade. Remember, this is Adobe we're talking about, who charged full prices for a point update of their Creative Suite (5.5). Just remember, though, that Apple, who will give you unlimited installs and lifetime updates of their App Store apps, is still somehow more evil than anything else on the entire planet combined.

Because customer satisfaction is evil. How dare they try and be fair and level headed regarding a customer's possessions!

... at night.

Reply

... at night.

Reply
post #6 of 35
Ah Adobe Premiere. For when Final Cut and Avid Media Composer aren't available without a day's journey.

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White iPad (3G) with Wi-Fi | 16GB | Engraved | Blue Polyurethane Smart Cover
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MacBook Pro 15" | Intel Core2 Duo 2.66GHz | 320GB HDD | OS X v10.8
White iPad (3G) with Wi-Fi | 16GB | Engraved | Blue Polyurethane Smart Cover
White iPhone 5 | 64GB | On 3UK

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post #7 of 35
When an App includes the version number in the name, you know you will have to pay again for whole new versions. e.g.
Photoshop 10
Aperture 3
iPhoto '11
OS X Lion
Unison 2
Smultron 4

but when they don't you can expect a lifetime of free upgrades.
Pages
Xcode
Entropy
Raskin
post #8 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"Special editions" of Adobe's consumer-oriented editing software, Photoshop Elements 10 and Premiere Elements 10, are now available to purchase on Apple's Mac App Store.



Adobe is smart to release consumer-grade software for the Mac. The Pro market is slowly but surely being abandoned by Apple.


But when did the Windows version come out? Maybe they are just too lazy!
post #9 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by G_Warren View Post

Any word on upgrades?

I bought v9 from the Mac App Store last month, as I didn't expect a significant update so quickly after the July release. I'll be disappointed if support (including bug fixe releases) for v9 doesn't happen now that v10 is released.

I have difficult equating Adobe Photoshop Elements Editor with Adobe Photoshop Elements. That aside, I have used Adobe Photoshop Elements since Adobe Photoshop Elements 2.0. I have no recollection of Adobe's ever offering an upgrade price or discount for users of older versions. I currently use Adobe Photoshop Elements 10. I recall no upgrade price for users of Adobe Photoshop Elements 9. Adobe Photoshop Elements Editor is less expensive than Adobe Photoshop Elements making any discount less attractive to the buyer and less profitable for Adobe. Lacking evidence to the contrary, my best answer to your question is "It ain't happening."
post #10 of 35
Troll.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

I doubt you'll get an upgrade. Remember, this is Adobe we're talking about, who charged full prices for a point update of their Creative Suite (5.5). Just remember, though, that Apple, who will give you unlimited installs and lifetime updates of their App Store apps, is still somehow more evil than anything else on the entire planet combined.
post #11 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

Adobe is smart to release consumer-grade software for the Mac. The Pro market is slowly but surely being abandoned by Apple.

What does Apple have to do with Adobe releasing consumer grade, tiered products? Or are you just trolling again, Tech Stud? Don't you ever get tired of it?
post #12 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Troll.

LOL, are you serious? I was calling out Adobe and obviously being sarcastic about Apple. Look at any of my hundreds of previous posts and tell me again that I'm a troll. I'm still laughing so hard that I can barely finish this post!
post #13 of 35
deleted
post #14 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Proximityeffect View Post

What does Apple have to do with Adobe releasing consumer grade, tiered products?

ISTM that Adobe is skating to where the puck is going - the consumer market, rather than where it used to be - the pro market, when it comes to Mac software.

The pro market for Macs is drying up. Apple is leading the charge. Adobe is just following their lead.

Apple is too big and too focused to deal in niche areas. They are aiming squarely at the great unwashed with their offerings. Why should Adobe release pro software for consumer grade hardware?
post #15 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

When an App includes the version number in the name, you know you will have to pay again for whole new versions.

but when they don't you can expect a lifetime of free upgrades.

Er Every numbered version of Pages is paid. Same with the rest of the iWork and iLife applications.

Unless you're referencing the fact that Adobe is now charging for x.x(.x) updates, and then I completely agree with you and want to crack Adobe's collective skull open with a sledgehammer.

In fact, Apple's desire to charge for numbered versions of iWork/iLife is very probably the reason they haven't updated them since the Mac App Store came out.

The idea behind iOS apps is pay once, update forever. When the Mac App Store came out, companies did that, too. If you bought Pixelmator from the Store, you got 2.0 free. If you didn't, you paid for it.

But iLife and iWork? I think we'll be paying for them. Apple just has to throw out an update to the Mac App Store application, I guess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

Troll.

You've misread his post. Please read it again.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #16 of 35
I want Photoshop (FULL) for $199. Fsck you Adobe.
post #17 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yours Smugly View Post

I want Photoshop (FULL) for $199. Fsck you Adobe.

Buy Pixelmator, then. Enough people stop buying Adobe products, they lose their monopoly and don't get to charge $5,000 for one piece of software.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #18 of 35
deleted
post #19 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


I ... want to crack Adobe's collective skull open with a sledgehammer.


Why be so mild? Wouldn't you be happier if you tied them up and slowly killed them by drilling through their skulls with an electric drill? You could use a huge stadium, and make the weaker ones watch the stronger ones get slaughtered first. The biggest ones could be killed the most slowly.

By the time you were done, you might have less gore and fewer pieces of brain and skull littering the landscape, but you'd still be happier.
post #20 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilgto64 View Post

- but it would seem to me that Apple could pretty easily setup some sort of tiered model - 30% up to $50 - 20% for titles from $51 to $199 - and 10% for anything $200 an up maybe..

They could. They don't want to. In part because folks would argue it should be the other way. 10% on the cheap apps etc.

But then they would play pricing games to keep themselves as cheap as they can handle and cut Apple out as much as possible. A lame move since they could cut Apple out completely and sell off their own site, but many of them want the easy advertising of being on MAS.

30% flat means that everyone is treated the same. No one can claim that the big boys are getting a better deal cause they are bigger and more important or whatever else they might want to claim.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply
post #21 of 35
As a longtime Creative Pro, I have bought nearly EVERY new »»»OPEN««« Mac model, beginning with the Macintosh IIx, my first Mac.

(If Jean Louis Gassée did anything right, he fought internally at Apple for a Mac with "slots," and even had a vanity license plate on his car that read: OPENMAC. Then he finally got his way with the Macintosh II.)

It is a fait accompli: Apple is going to kill the Mac Pro and release the iMac Pro (which will exist only temporarily -- kind of like Rosetta). (They'll just need to convince Pros that it is indeed a Pro machine and convince consumers that the regular "iMac" is a Consumer machine -- if they can have it both ways.)

Meanwhile, for Pro software that appears on the segregated, "separate-but-equal" Mac App Store (much the easier to kill when the time comes than if it were integrated into iTunes/App Store), I'll be buying from the ISVs themselves or elsewhere -- NOT Apple.

Oh, I'll still buy the occasional Pixelmator and like to support small developers and encourage greedy, monopolistic software makers to slash their exorbitant prices, but Adobe's and Autodesk's sales will increase at the expense of whatever cut Apple gets when a high-priced Pro app or suite like theirs' is bought via Apple.

Counterproductive you ask?

Mac App Store sales drop and that gives more reason the kill the Mac, let alone the Mac Pro?

Again, the death of the Mac that has eight RAM slots for up to 96GB RAM, four storage device bays for up to 12TB of internal storage, RAID support, three PCI slots, upgradeable Graphics Card, two optical drive bays and ample connection ports (they can fit more on a machine with a larger form factor. That's why the 17" MacBook Pro has three USB 2.0 ports and the 17- and 13-inch models have only two) -- namely, the Mac Pro is a fait accompli.

Next comes the death of the Mac altogether (and with it only one of the most recognized brand names in the world, worth billions in equity).

The first shoe to drop will be the MacBook Air, which Apple will give "The Apple TV Treatment" to -- iOS on an ARM variant (and probably be renamed with "Mac" removed).

Then, up the chain it goes until there is only a single computing platform. GUESS WHICH ONE!

Apple has a bedraggled track record when it comes to amicable partnership dissolutions. It was GTH Motorola. GTH IBM. And when the platform is 100% ARM-based, it will be GTH Intel, too. Keep burnin' them bridges, now.

The "Back to the Mac" event was a placating, perfunctory (kind of like "bag of hurt" charade) 85 minute prelude to the biggest news of the event: the last 5 minutes when they unveiled -- YOU GUESSED IT -- a new MacBook Air! -- 'what we see as the future of computing' Apple is on record saying.

Oh, and all demos of Lion at WWDC were done on MacBook Airs. No other Mac was worthy.

I don't know about any other Creative Pros, but I can't see myself experimenting a lot with different Maya transforms or Photoshop filters on a "dumb" "client" device with almost no memory or storage, inextricably tethered to the great "Cloud in the Sky" (which, behind the curtain, is a lot of "Heavy Servers on the Ground").

Larry Ellison used to repeat the mantra, "The network is the computer." Then he bought Sun.

It can be both!!! REALLY!

You can have machines equipped to run certain software better using "local" resources (storage, RAM, GPGPU, etc.) and you can have "thin" client devices COHABITATING! (Imagine!)

There can be the bath water AAAAAAAND the baby.

(Most Pro users I know have a Mac Pro and a MacBook Pro -- AT THE SAME TIME! Although I can't prove it as I've never seen both at once -- except in my own case.)

Why Apple would rather sell me an iOS device alone instead of having me buy an expensive tower Mac PLUS a notebook Mac PLUS an iPad PLUS and iPhone -- and a perpetual stream of revenue from their respective "Apps Stores" is beyond me.

P.S. Did you know the MacBook Air does not come with an Ethernet port?

P.P.S. If you doubt the thought that the Mac platform has no future, just look at the paucity of non-user-facing, or "under the hood" changes to Lion -- four years after Leopard. Resources need to be allocated at at company after all.

P.P.P.S. Please, oh please, God, don't force me to use Windows. : ( I've got to live down here!
post #22 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac: an Endangered Species View Post

Only post

You want to whine about the death of the Mac Pro, we have a thread for that already.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply
post #23 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac: an Endangered Species View Post

As a longtime Creative Pro, I have bought nearly EVERY new »»»OPEN««« Mac model, beginning with the Macintosh IIx, my first Mac.

(If Jean Louis Gassée did anything right, he fought internally at Apple for a Mac with "slots," and even had a vanity license plate on his car that read: OPENMAC. Then he finally got his way with the Macintosh II.)

It is a fait accompli: Apple is going to kill the Mac Pro and release the iMac Pro (which will exist only temporarily -- kind of like Rosetta). (They'll just need to convince Pros that it is indeed a Pro machine and convince consumers that the regular "iMac" is a Consumer machine -- if they can have it both ways.)

Meanwhile, for Pro software that appears on the segregated, "separate-but-equal" Mac App Store (much the easier to kill when the time comes than if it were integrated into iTunes/App Store), I'll be buying from the ISVs themselves or elsewhere -- NOT Apple.

Oh, I'll still buy the occasional Pixelmator and like to support small developers and encourage greedy, monopolistic software makers to slash their exorbitant prices, but Adobe's and Autodesk's sales will increase at the expense of whatever cut Apple gets when a high-priced Pro app or suite like theirs' is bought via Apple.

Counterproductive you ask?

Mac App Store sales drop and that gives more reason the kill the Mac, let alone the Mac Pro?

Again, the death of the Mac that has eight RAM slots for up to 96GB RAM, four storage device bays for up to 12TB of internal storage, RAID support, three PCI slots, upgradeable Graphics Card, two optical drive bays and ample connection ports (they can fit more on a machine with a larger form factor. That's why the 17" MacBook Pro has three USB 2.0 ports and the 17- and 13-inch models have only two) -- namely, the Mac Pro is a fait accompli.

Next comes the death of the Mac altogether (and with it only one of the most recognized brand names in the world, worth billions in equity).

The first shoe to drop will be the MacBook Air, which Apple will give "The Apple TV Treatment" to -- iOS on an ARM variant (and probably be renamed with "Mac" removed).

Then, up the chain it goes until there is only a single computing platform. GUESS WHICH ONE!

Apple has a bedraggled track record when it comes to amicable partnership dissolutions. It was GTH Motorola. GTH IBM. And when the platform is 100% ARM-based, it will be GTH Intel, too. Keep burnin' them bridges, now.

The "Back to the Mac" event was a placating, perfunctory (kind of like "bag of hurt" charade) 85 minute prelude to the biggest news of the event: the last 5 minutes when they unveiled -- YOU GUESSED IT -- a new MacBook Air! -- 'what we see as the future of computing' Apple is on record saying.

Oh, and all demos of Lion at WWDC were done on MacBook Airs. No other Mac was worthy.

I don't know about any other Creative Pros, but I can't see myself experimenting a lot with different Maya transforms or Photoshop filters on a "dumb" "client" device with almost no memory or storage, inextricably tethered to the great "Cloud in the Sky" (which, behind the curtain, is a lot of "Heavy Servers on the Ground").

Larry Ellison used to repeat the mantra, "The network is the computer." Then he bought Sun.

It can be both!!! REALLY!

You can have machines equipped to run certain software better using "local" resources (storage, RAM, GPGPU, etc.) and you can have "thin" client devices COHABITATING! (Imagine!)

There can be the bath water AAAAAAAND the baby.

(Most Pro users I know have a Mac Pro and a MacBook Pro -- AT THE SAME TIME! Although I can't prove it as I've never seen both at once -- except in my own case.)

Why Apple would rather sell me an iOS device alone instead of having me buy an expensive tower Mac PLUS a notebook Mac PLUS an iPad PLUS and iPhone -- and a perpetual stream of revenue from their respective "Apps Stores" is beyond me.

P.S. Did you know the MacBook Air does not come with an Ethernet port?

P.P.S. If you doubt the thought that the Mac platform has no future, just look at the paucity of non-user-facing, or "under the hood" changes to Lion -- four years after Leopard. Resources need to be allocated at at company after all.

P.P.P.S. Please, oh please, God, don't force me to use Windows. : ( I've got to live down here!

One word "freak". Conspiracy theory much?

Mac Pro will probably die. If I were Apple and the sales were low I would kill it as well. The advancment in CPU technology is killing the Mac Pro. A 3.4 ghz i7 based iMac with 16gigs of RAM fufilles the requirements of 99% of Mac Pro users and at a cheaper price.

Thunderbolt (dual ports) can provide all the storage you will ever need, and at 10gig, and you never have to crack the case again to upgrade it. Daisy chain a few more monitors off it if you need it.

I think all Macbooks will be AIR like, that is slim 15inch models soon. Nothing wrong only selling the models that actually sell.
post #24 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

10gig, and you never have to crack the case again to upgrade it.

When the iMac can bench twice the current Mac Pro and can have 196GB of RAM, then they can kill the Mac Pro.

Until then, we need it. The Mac Pro is a workstation, not a desktop. The iMac can't really replace it.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply
post #25 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac: an Endangered Species View Post

(Most Pro users I know have a Mac Pro and a MacBook Pro -- AT THE SAME TIME! Although I can't prove it as I've never seen both at once -- except in my own case.)

Hmmm, I found that the Mac Pro + MacBook Air 11 (i7) is the perfect combo. Real heavy work at the desk or with Back to My Mac, but ultimate portability and enough horsepower for some Xcode / Photoshop / 3 modeling (if not large texture baking) to go.

Quote:
P.S. Did you know the MacBook Air does not come with an Ethernet port?

Yep, that port would have made the Air thicker - and for the 1 time I wanted to use wired, I'll live. You can always pick up the adapter if you care.

Quote:
P.P.S. If you doubt the thought that the Mac platform has no future, just look at the paucity of non-user-facing, or "under the hood" changes to Lion -- four years after Leopard. Resources need to be allocated at at company after all.

Snow Leopard had a ton of under the hood changes (amongst others Blocks and GCD). Lion less so from what I've seen, but it hasn't been 4 years since significant MP/MT improvements. Of course, if the Pro apps & machine are being sidelined over time, that will pretty much be a tech that ends up used for multi-core portable devices instead of real heavy lifting...

Quote:
P.P.P.S. Please, oh please, God, don't force me to use Windows. : ( I've got to live down here!

I definitely agree there, though after trying the Windows 8 beta, I have the feeling Apple could reduce their entire lineup to the 20" iMac and I'd still rather use that than move to the next fine Microsoft OS. If you want to see what a real disaster looks like, fire it up! \
post #26 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

When the iMac can bench twice the current Mac Pro and can have 196GB of RAM, then they can kill the Mac Pro.

Until then, we need it. The Mac Pro is a workstation, not a desktop. The iMac can't really replace it.

Tallest Skil:

I would refer you to this post.
post #27 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

Adobe is smart to release consumer-grade software for the Mac. The Pro market is slowly but surely being abandoned by Apple.

1) Adobe has been releasing consumer-grade software for the Mac for pretty much as long as it has been releasing consumer-grade software. This is just their venture into the App Store.

2) I'm not sure what the Mac Pro has to do with Adobe's professional software suites. Even if Apple kills the Mac Pro the same professionals who use Adobe's professional software today will be using it at that point as well (unless someone comes along who can replace relevant Adobe products with viable and worthwhile alternatives). They'll just be doing it on a high-powered iMac, or something along those lines, after they upgrade their computers.

3) Apple may kill the Mac Pro, and there is an argument for it, but 'slowly and surely' does not seem accurate. To date they have been upgrading and maintaining it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

When the iMac can bench twice the current Mac Pro and can have 196GB of RAM, then they can kill the Mac Pro.

Until then, we need it. The Mac Pro is a workstation, not a desktop. The iMac can't really replace it.

This is true for some professions. For example, I'd be very upset about the death of the Mac Pro if I did a great deal of video rendering, or other highly intensive tasks (such as various scientific calculation, though there are alternatives for that). On the other hand, most professions which once benefited strongly from the Mac Pro can now easily transition to iMacs, upgrade more frequently, and save money on the long run. I probably fall into the later category as I type this on my Mac Pro.
The true measure of a man is how he treats someone that can do him absolutely no good.
  Samuel Johnson
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The true measure of a man is how he treats someone that can do him absolutely no good.
  Samuel Johnson
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post #28 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac: an Endangered Species View Post

Tallest Skil:

I would refer you to this post.

Exactly, there's no reason for it to be here.

Don't get all whiny because I responded to a troll about it; the trolls won't move over to the appropriate threads.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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post #29 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

One word "freak". Conspiracy theory much?

Pas de tout. Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone, the 9/11 Commission Report is imperfect, but accurate, and Osama bin Laden is dead.

I was called much worse -- scorched by flames -- three years ago when in a forum I said the "bag of hurt" alibi for why Blu-ray was not offered to Mac buyers would portend far greater things in the future than the immediately apparent meaning, and that integrated optical drives altogether would systematically disappear from each and every Apple product -- NOT to make them thinner and still allow you to use an external one -- but to drop support of it in an effort to kill it! All content would be obtained by digital means -- namely, iTunes. (Heard what's planned for the REAL Apple TV?)

Was I a mere "Conspiracy Theorist" then? Or was I proven right in time?

In the "bag of hurt" statement it was said that Apple was just "waiting till things settle down" with Blu-ray before availing it to Mac buyers.

Yes, you can buy an external optical drive, but 1.) who wants to hook it up to watch a DVD on your laptop on a plane trip (assuming the drive's 100% USB powered), and I fly a lot -- too much? 2.) Apple actually offered an external 3.5" floppy drive for the Bondi iMac (now killing THAT storage format was one I could get behind) to pacify complaints and then yanked it. After they took them out of Macs, Apple offered external USB modems and then yanked them. And they'll yank the Apple external SuperDrive at the right time as well. It is a pacifier. Trust me, Apple would rather you NOT buy one. 3.) As far as the Mac mini -- A.K.A. the non-transportable laptop -- there's room for an optical drive -- even a connector -- but an integrated optical drive isn't even a BTO option, ostensibly to make the mini EVEN smaller. But if you have to buy an external SuperDrive if you want optical, your neat and tidy little "mini" starts to look a tad bigger and unwieldy.

They'll yank the USB Ethernet adaptor they sell. Right now, it's a pacifier. (But I'd actually rather see Thunderbolt used for wired connections and MUCH faster high-speed Internet services.)

There are no alibis -- the goal is not to further in any way Blu-ray's (slow) adoption -- to kill it, the DVD and the CD. (Apple got a sense of their powerful influence when they introduced the legacy-free all-USB Bondi iMac -- the same USB that Intel had been unsuccessfully shopping around to gutless PC makers. Then Apple does it and BAM! -- toppling bandwagon.)

[Footnote: major companies are hard at work on HVD. I may be alone, but I think it's exciting.]

[There is a lengthy list of companies on HVDs consortium, including, APPLE! ]

In that press conference three years ago, were they serious when, further addressing the Blu-ray issue, they said, "We have the best HD movie and TV options in iTunes"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

Mac Pro will probably die. If I were Apple and the sales were low I would kill it as well. The advancment in CPU technology is killing the Mac Pro. A 3.4 ghz i7 based iMac with 16gigs of RAM fufilles the requirements of 99% of Mac Pro users and at a cheaper price.

Oh, I'm sure it's not selling. I (as always) bought the top of the line dual, 12-core, 2.93GHz model when it was launched about a year and four months ago.

I'm part of the problem. The reason I haven't contributed to addition Mac Pro sales lately IS BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T BEEN UPDATED FOR A FRICKIN' YEAR AND FOUR MONTHS!

And more cores and higher clock rates are not the only way you can radically improve a machine -- they don't HAVE to wait until late Q1 2012 for the Xeon Sandy Bridge chipset to come out.

I'd buy another Westmere if they improved it by adding a second 16-lane PCI slot (with spacer) and upgraded the 4x slots to 8x (REALLY opens up a lot of RAID options to you).

Partner with both nVidia and AMD/ATi to port SLI and CrossFireX to [Mac] OS X -- or fortify OpenCL with GPU card parallel processing support. (CrossFireX allows FOUR cards working in parallel.)

Or at least they could offer Mac Pro buyers the option of installing one of the dual-GPU chip, single card options that are now available.

Photography, CAD, Videography & editing, Motion Graphics, etc. professionals would eat it up.

Graphics card limitations have really been injurious to the Mac Pro.

And have yields of 6-core clock speeds above 2.93GHz not been realized yet -- in a year and four months?! No 3.33?

And has volume production not brought the cost down at all from the $1,200 premium you pay for the 2.93GHz over the 2.66GHz model -- in a year and four months (and counting)?

You're correct. The top-most configuration of the iMac (with a next generation GPU compared to the Mac Pro options) with 2GB GDDR5 beats the fastest currently available Mac Pro in some benchmarks. The Mac Pro kicks its A$$ in other benchmarks.

And ISVs are too lazy to truly optimize their apps to take full advantage of [Mac] OS X technologies like GCD, OpenCL, OpenGL 3.2, 64-bit and more. The best iMac is a single-CPU, 4-core machine. The best Mac Pro is a dual-CPU, 12 core machine. Which of the two do you think would benefit most from ISVs optimizing their products to take full advantage of software technologies like GCD and OpenCL?

And the reason is clear why the iMac may look attractive to Pros: Apple has GREATLY enhanced it with SATA III 6G, a killer graphics card, Thunderbolt, etc. and left the Mac Pro to languish with an overwhelming two graphics card options, SATA II 3G, no Thunderbolt, and more.

I don't blame these Pros for finding the iMac an attractive proposition. (But I'd wager anything that Apple's makes significantly more off the sale of a Mac Pro than an iMac. So the iMac is probably cannibalizing Mac Pro sales -- yet another factor.)

So, when it's all so obvious even to a freak like me, why is Apple left scratching their heads in perplexity over poor Mac Pro sales? They created the conditions that led to this. The top iMac has been made mightier, while the Mac Pro has received no attention, and the top iMac's specs and performance are starting to overtake the Mac Pro. Simple.

Neglect a product and why would you expect a different outcome?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

Thunderbolt (dual ports) can provide all the storage you will ever need, and at 10gig, and you never have to crack the case again to upgrade it. Daisy chain a few more monitors off it if you need it.

Oh, snap! Thunderbolt! Yeah, how about fortifying the Mac Pro with 2(two) Thunderbolt ports -- each with their own bus! (Or, is it buss?)

EVERY Mac now has Thunderbolt -- save for one: the Mac Pro.

EVERY Mac now has SATA III 6G -- save for one: the Mac Pro.

Macs and other products are starting to all get Bluetooth 4.0.

Do I need to act it out with hand puppets to you, Apple?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

I think all Macbooks will be AIR like, that is slim 15inch models soon. Nothing wrong only selling the models that actually sell.

Except Apple operates the other way around (third quotation down).

They haven't "Thought Different" about the tower Mac in a long time. Even the Industrial Design remains unchanged since 2003, roughly 8 years, and looks as outdated as a Bondi iMac.

After 8 long years the "Radiator" or Cheese Grater" needs an ID overhaul.

But ID is the least of the problem.

It should not be positioned as a "pc," but as a Work Station. Maybe it should not be called a Mac, to differentiate it from its consumer line. Apple in the past has had "PowerBooks," and other brand names. VW has Audi. Nissan has Infiniti. Toyota has Lexus. Honda has Acura.

For years now, SIGGRAPH attendees who really want to use an Apple machine for loyalty and philosophical reasons complain about Apple's limited Graphics Card support and its allowance for almost NO customization of these programmable cards (the same card, configured optimally, say, for AutoCAD, might perform poorly on another high-end, graphics-intensive app, and vice-versa. That's why GPU makers make their cards programmable and customizable -- no one configuration is optimal for every application).

These Pros with Apple in their heart are forced to use Windows machines against their strongest wishes for unfortunate, but realistic business considerations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bettieblue View Post

One word "freak".

Oh, and I won't respond in kind to the ad hominem "freak" description, because, however juvenile, it is in fact accurate.

"Here's to the crazy ones."
post #30 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Buy Pixelmator, then. Enough people stop buying Adobe products, they lose their monopoly and don't get to charge $5,000 for one piece of software.

I'd very much like to, if only it were as powerful as PS, which, for all its bloat and excessive pricing, is still THE graphics tool to use.
post #31 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Exactly, there's no reason for it to be here.

Don't get all whiny because I responded to a troll about it; the trolls won't move over to the appropriate threads.

Don't get all whiny because I responded to your response to a troll.

People don't post on the 11th page of a forum because it will be read about twice -- and that's if the author reads it twice.

They go STALE!

And what's with this knee-jerk, low-hanging-fruit "troll" description.

When I'z a yungin' "troll" actually meant something. Now it means nothing -- except maybe to describe anyone who does not share your identical point-of-view.

And don't get whiny again until you've read this.
post #32 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac: an Endangered Species View Post

People don't post on the 11th page of a forum because it will be read about twice -- and that's if the author reads it twice.

They go STALE!

You ARE new here, aren't you?

That's a great thread. Great discussion there. This isn't like some forums; we're living documents.

Quote:
And don't get whiny again until you've read this.

You keep linking to my post as though you have a point. It's funny.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
Reply
post #33 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

You ARE new here, aren't you?

Actually, no. I've been with AppleInsider since its inception (maybe 13 or so years longer than you? IDK).

It's just that I'm not a "serial poster," post rarely, and I SUCK WITH PASSWORDS!

I should "crawl" my .MBOX files to see what my membership was and have AppleInsider delete the account or combine them. Wouldn't want to overburden their servers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

You keep linking to my post as though you have a point. It's funny.

HILARIOUS!

post #34 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by hittrj01 View Post

I doubt you'll get an upgrade. Remember, this is Adobe we're talking about, who charged full prices for a point update of their Creative Suite (5.5). Just remember, though, that Apple, who will give you unlimited installs and lifetime updates of their App Store apps, is still somehow more evil than anything else on the entire planet combined.

Adobe offers upgrade pricing on non-Elements versions of virtually every software package and suite they sell. The only thing they do that I don't necessarily agree with is charging more based on how many versions back you are. If you upgrade from CS 5 to 5.5, it's a relatively minor charge. Go from 3 to 5.5, and you're paying a lot more.
post #35 of 35
Oh good, I'm glad I paid more for the previous version only 6 weeks ago. There is no upgrade option and the Adobe site doesn't sell the Editor version.

It's a shame that Adobe's idea of fixing bugs is releasing a new version with totally new bugs in it.
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