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Review roundup: Amazon Kindle Fire a bargain, but no threat to Apple's iPad - Page 3

post #81 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I'm not saying it's a strike against the iPad, I'm saying it's buying into lazy assumptions about what tablets are for and concluding some things that may not be true.

people will use a device in whatever manner they see fit as value to them. enjoy your iPad and while others enjoy their Kindle Fire.
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post #82 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

Seriously?

You just quoted the two least reliable video news sources, and the single most unreliable web-based tech news source.

Especially if Gizmodo likes it, you know it's bad.
They are contrarians at best and rarely correct about anything at all.

It ranks about the same as the reviews appleinsider placed up, while leaving other, less rah rah apple ones down the bottom as links...

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Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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post #83 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

people will use a device in whatever manner they see fit as value to them. enjoy your iPad and while others enjoy their Kindle Fire.

You seem to want to turn this into some kind of you against the fan boys deal, I'm not interested. I'm interested in what "tablet computing" actually means, and how that market is going to develop. I'm not denying anyone their Fires, or claiming they won't enjoy them. I'm wondering if, at some point in the near future, "cheap and limited" is going to seem as good of a deal, once tablet computing becomes more ubiquitous.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #84 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

yes, however, it doesn't change the fact that several prominent reviews online, thus far, are giving praise to the Kindle Fire; it's a great product.

I don't know if I'd call Mashable and Verge "prominent" but I understood your point.
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post #85 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

It ranks about the same as the reviews appleinsider placed up, while leaving other, less rah rah apple ones down the bottom as links...

IMO, I think Gizmodo carries a wee bit less credibility than the three the main article quotes (Pogue, Wired and ZDNet).
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post #86 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

My iPhone absolutely never does this. Antidote to your anecdote.

My iphone does, so does my wifes iphone. So does my ipad, and her ipad. Never mind my kids ipod touches. The biggest apple trouble maker is the email app, photos does it occasionally. The best item at killing stuff is the twitter/facebook apps.

Six antidotes for your anecdote

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Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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post #87 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

IMO, I think Gizmodo carries a wee bit less credibility than the three the main article quotes (Pogue, Wired and ZDNet).

gizmodo suck up to anyone they think will provide them advertising dollars. Wired is apple central, zdnet is all over the place on reviews and pouge is about the best of that lot

Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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post #88 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob55 View Post

I don't know if I'd call Mashable and Verge "prominent" but I understood your point.

Verge is Engadget, without AOL

Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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Household: MacBook, iPad 16gb wifi, iPad 64gb wifi, iPad Mini 32gb, iPhone 4S 32gb, iPhone 32gb, iPod Touch 4th gen x2, iPod touch 16gb gen 2, iPod nano 16gb gen 5 x2, iPod nano gen 3 8gb, iPod...

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post #89 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

My iphone does, so does my wifes iphone. So does my ipad, and her ipad. Never mind my kids ipod touches. The biggest apple trouble maker is the email app, photos does it occasionally. The best item at killing stuff is the twitter/facebook apps.

Six antidotes for your anecdote

I know 1000 people, personally, that never see this behavior. I win.
They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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They spoke of the sayings and doings of their commander, the grand duke, and told stories of his kindness and irascibility.
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post #90 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

My iphone does, so does my wifes iphone. So does my ipad, and her ipad. Never mind my kids ipod touches. The biggest apple trouble maker is the email app, photos does it occasionally. The best item at killing stuff is the twitter/facebook apps.

Six antidotes for your anecdote

One family's worth of devices all synced to the same place from the same set of softwares.

You need to redownload the software and reinstall it on every device. You are not the norm.
PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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post #91 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

gizmodo suck up to anyone they think will provide them advertising dollars. Wired is apple central, zdnet is all over the place on reviews and pouge is about the best of that lot

Right. I was being kind about Giz having "a wee bit less credibility".
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post #92 of 127
11/14/11 at 10:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by troyp View Post

Why build a tablet and sell it at a loss when they could have just built an app?

Because the way they did it, the app is open every time you use the device, in a manner similar to Apple TV.
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post #93 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post



What 15" laptops are selling w/ARM processors? Netbooks have had shrinking sales for awhile now.

I had in mind stuff like this:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Toshiba+...&skuId=3438577

It uses an AMD E-Series SOC. I said similar for a reason.


Quote:
How is the MBA a netbook? Netbooks used shitty Atom processors and XP, Linux or Win 7 Starter. The MBA has Sandy Bridge i5 and i7 processors and SSD drives, plus a full modern OS w/o limitations. How is that at all similar?

I think you skipped over a couple of the adjectives I used to qualify my statement. It is true, but trivial, that the guts of the MBA are better than netbooks of yore. I also think you overlook the form factor similarities, and the fact that the MBA actually fulfills the promise of the netbook - a tiny laptop computer that works pretty good for most stuff.
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post #94 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by strask View Post

25% of the overall use of the tablet is the experience, not the utility.


A good dictionary might serve you well. The RDF stuff never works except face to face, and even then, it is difficult to pull it off.
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post #95 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post


$499 will buy you TWO Kindle fires that do 80% of what an iPad will do.

And after you buy two, one for you and one for your squeeze, you will still have $100.00 left over to spend on music, books and movies.
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post #96 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:30am
The Kindle Fire is crap and pales in comparison to the iPad.

There might be some cheap and some poor people who might justify getting one, but as we all know, you get what you pay for, and for $200, the Fire is miles away from an iPad, both in price and in quality. It's Android, and Android is crap. Android is not smooth, it's jerky, unresponsive and laggy, and the reviews here confirms that.
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post #97 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

And after you buy two, one for you and one for your squeeze, you will still have $100.00 left over to spend on music, books and movies.

Might be closer to $20 if you count the Amazon Prime subscription for $80.
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post #98 of 127
11/14/11 at 11:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I'm not saying it's a strike against the iPad, I'm saying it's buying into lazy assumptions about what tablets are for and concluding some things that may not be true.

if, in fact, "all anyone wants" is easy consumption of media and services, then a device like the Fire will no doubt be very successful. However, if there is a growing perception that tablets should rightfully be PC replacements, than something like the Fire becomes a bit of a cul-de-sac, similar to certain limited computing appliances from the early days of desktop machines.

That's a fundamental distinction that doesn't have much to do with championing the iPad or dismissing other approaches, and time will tell what's true.

This is true -- and a very astute observation.


I remember the days when IBM/PC !~= IBM PC/jr.

So, if Tablet == iPad...

Then, Tablet/jr == Fire || Nook ||PlayBook || Galaxy Tab 7....

and Tablet/jr == Tablet/castrati

They are missing the bits that make a Tablet a Tablet.

Hell, the Tablet/castratati don't even qualify as big iPod Touches.

"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #99 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:16pm
reading the reviews it is very clear the new Fire is a flawed and significantly limited Amazon prototype tablet. basically, a V.1 beta product with warmed-over PlayBook hardware.

now i expect Amazon will put a much improved version on the market next year with new hardware, maybe in six months. so it has real potential - but anyone who buys one now is being played for a sucker.

but the hype! in spite of the obvious problems with this initial model, many sites are gushing over it. Gizmodo declares Apple should "be afraid." talk about a reality distortion field ...

get ready for the wave of buyers' remorse, to come next year in the millions apparently.
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post #100 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:19pm
Here's a comparison chart:



Some things of note:

1) The Asus Eee Pad Transformer Prime appears to have the specs of a "Tablet" -- but how well it is executed remains to be seen

2) BT availability is not shown -- The iPad has it and the Fire & Nook do not -- so there is no way to connect any BT accessories

3) In the last row, "Battery Life Claim" is shown -- The Fire and Nook have significantly less claimed battery life that the iPad. (The iPad exceeds its claimed life).

4) The Fire and Nook "Battery Life Claim" is for WiFi OFF -- The iPad is for WiFi ON


Doesn't it seem a little odd that the Fire and Nook are limited-storage devices mainly used for consuming streamed content -- yet they can only claim adequate battery life when WiFi is turned OFF...

It seems to me that these Tablet/casterati will need to be tethered to a power source in order to perform their basic functions

"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #101 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

It works relatively well. It is cheap. It doesn't work as well as a device costing (up to) more than 4 times its cost.

Surprised?

If the thing can surf the web and read ebooks and play videos and check email, it does 90% of what most people use the iPad for. Even if the animations are not quite as pretty.

What you are describing could easily apply to the $199 Netbooks from Acer or Asus. It's good enough for 90% of what most people use the MacBook Pro for. Even if the animations are not quite as pretty.
"And just like that, everyone here realizes you're just another sweaty little Google licker with an axe to grind and no idea what he's talking about." --addabox
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"And just like that, everyone here realizes you're just another sweaty little Google licker with an axe to grind and no idea what he's talking about." --addabox
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post #102 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

reading the reviews it is very clear the new Fire is a flawed and significantly limited Amazon prototype tablet. basically, a V.1 beta product with warmed-over PlayBook hardware.

now i expect Amazon will put a much improved version on the market next year with new hardware, maybe in six months. so it has real potential - but anyone who buys one now is being played for a sucker.

but the hype! in spite of the obvious problems with this initial model, many sites are gushing over it. Gizmodo declares Apple should "be afraid." talk about a reality distortion field ...

get ready for the wave of buyers' remorse, to come next year in the millions apparently.

Ya' know...

It would have been interesting if HP had made the Leo--->Meg upgrade a few weeks sooner...

The 16 GB TouchPad for $399 had decent specs, decent execution, and a well-received OS. Supposedly, that model had $296 worth of parts (the more expensive 32 GB had $318 worth of parts).

Conceivably, HP could have made a profit with pricing of $329 and $379 respectively.

As it is, the EOLed Touchpad at $99 appears to have been a much better deal than either the Fire or Nook.
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
Reply
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #103 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:48pm
Hmmm...Engadget seems to deem otherwise.

Also, we'll have to see the sales. Then if by some magical reason it does sale exceeding well, "they aren't in the same category" (which they aren't btw).
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post #104 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdonisSMU View Post

Summary: It's a good product for $199. Price matters because the price is the selling point. Apple is selling the whole experience.

Whole experience of what? I can play Portal 2 on it?

Tablets by their very defintion are crippled due to price concerns. Apple benefits being a leader in the tablet-verse but even then you can't really define 'whole experience' without throwing in the competition.
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post #105 of 127
11/14/11 at 12:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by emacs72 View Post

the Kindle Fire exists in a different market than the iPad. there's no need for you to be so threatened by Amazon's offering.

Threatened? LOL. The Kindle Fire is absolutely no threat to anything but Amazons profits. I thought I was clear when i said it was DOA and pointed out how it is terrible.
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post #106 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:04pm
Looks like a good tablet - I checked out the Verge review.

Not as ambitious as the iPad as Amazon is making its money off content. Not as good as the iPad as it's cheaper of course. But will be interesting to see how many people want consumption device and how many people want a proper computer replacement. Of course guys here will favour the full fledged feature, but looking at the top apps on the App Store it's not yet clear.

No one really mentioned that the Kindle App Store only has 10,000 apps - far behind iPad and Android numbers. The apps aren't that great yet either, waiting to see if this improves and if the Kindle can have well designed apps rather than the stretched out shit we've seen on other (7") Android tablets.

Sure the gap between devices like the Kindle Fire and the iPad will widen as the latter gets more functionality. Amazon has no answer for stuff like iCloud.
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post #107 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:12pm
The Kindle is a league of it's own. Even if it does become a large seller, it's still tied to Amazon. If it did destroy Apple's sales, it's not exactly the same market iPad is catering to. Yes, the sales still matter but it doesn't at the same time. What will matter to Amazon is the profit's it's making. I think people are forgetting about the new Nook honestly though...
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post #108 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

...
As it is, the EOLed Touchpad at $99 appears to have been a much better deal than either the Fire or Nook.

Well, duh!

If anything, the Kindle Fire proved to be a suitable straw man to put up against the iPad. Amazon doesn't claim it competes with the iPad, people who show interest in the Kindle admit it is technologically inferior to an iPad, yet a large number of professional and casual commentators insist on comparing it to the iPad. Why?

My pet theory is that the Kindle Fire and the Nook are to full-price tablets as netbooks are to laptops. They are a different category, however they will eat into tablet sales the same way that netbooks ate into laptop sales, and the way later iPad, although in a completely different category, drank up the netbooks' milkshake.

Increasing diversity in this segment of the market will increase competition, with more choices for the consumer at lower price points. Producers will have to lower their profit margins, as people's perception of the value of tablets is no longer anchored at $500 and above.
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post #109 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robodude View Post

...Amazon has no answer for stuff like iCloud.



You're kidding, right?
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post #110 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post



You're kidding, right?

Because the Amazon Cloud Music Player just shows a whole bunch of clouds....
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post #111 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post



You're kidding, right?

Syncing documents.

Syncing photos.

Calendar, email and contacts (not even sure if the Kindle has a calendar app).

I wasn't kidding. Maybe you thought iCloud was just for music...
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post #112 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by addabox View Post

I'm wondering if, at some point in the near future, "cheap and limited" is going to seem as good of a deal, once tablet computing becomes more ubiquitous.

'cheap and limited' is subjective and does not describe the Kindle Fire or the Apple iPad in any fashion.
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post #113 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

I thought I was clear when i said it was DOA and pointed out how it is terrible.

others disagree with your opinion. the market will be best judge on how the Kindle Fire fares in the market.
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post #114 of 127
11/14/11 at 1:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Amazon doesn't claim it competes with the iPad, people who show interest in the Kindle admit it is technologically inferior to an iPad, yet a large number of professional and casual commentators insist on comparing it to the iPad. Why?

although there are likely many reasons, it's a silly comparison (especially by the casual commentators). both devices have done / will do well in the market(s) they target.
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post #115 of 127
11/14/11 at 2:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robodude View Post

Syncing documents.

Syncing photos.

Calendar, email and contacts (not even sure if the Kindle has a calendar app).

I wasn't kidding. Maybe you thought iCloud was just for music...

Of course I know it's not just music. However, music and video paid services deal with copyrighted content, are therefore the services that you don't find elsewhere for free. As to the rest, I have been using cloud services for years. Documents, photos, calendars, contacts, most with auto syncing between devices. Kindle may not have as tight integration with Google, but still runs Android, so the solutions will be there. You may be buying too much into the iCloud hype.
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post #116 of 127
11/14/11 at 3:10pm
I have been playing with my Fire for the past 3 hours, and its quite apparent to me that the only similarity this has to an Ipad is that they both are called "tablets."

I use my Ipad 2 for a variety of tasks/enjoyment and find it to be an excellent replacement to a laptop for many uses, and much more user friendly often. The Fire's screen is 1/2 the size, making it a joke for viewing video or photographs if you really want to enjoy them. It is very bad as an e-reader, a regular Kindle is far superior. Its slow, doesn't respond well to gestures, is choppy and I definitely will send mine back for a refund and just buy a $79 Kindle.

I originally planned to give it to my 10 year grandson as a holiday present, but to be truthful, its an embarrassment if you ever used an Ipad or a decent computer at all.

A piece of junk for $200 masquerading as an inexpensive smaller Ipad.

Bezos and Amazon should be ashamed of themselves.
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post #117 of 127
11/14/11 at 3:25pm
Well the good news is there's 30 day return with no restocking fee.
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post #118 of 127
11/14/11 at 3:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by happyden View Post

... Its slow, doesn't respond well to gestures, is choppy ...

Lol, this has got to be the least informative review ever. Slow, doesn't respond well to gestures (read: slow), and is choppy (read: slow). In two words, one of them being a contraction, it's slow. Slower than the iPad2, in any case. Apparently, its screen is also smaller than iPad's, quite the shocker considering the well publicized specifications.

Don't forget to loan your lipstick to whomever you'd be giving this as a present.
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post #119 of 127
11/14/11 at 3:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Lol, this has got to be the least informative review ever. Slow, doesn't respond well to gestures (read: slow), and is choppy (read: slow). In two words, one of them being a contraction, it's slow. Slower than the iPad2, in any case. Apparently, its screen is also smaller than iPad's, quite the shocker considering the well publicized specifications.

Don't forget to loan your lipstick to whomever you'd be giving this as a present.

I normally don't respond to tards, but if you can't recognize the difference between a device that has choppy video versus slow video; they are two different phenomena. And I would bet that many potential buyers (likely including yourself) don't even know that a 7" diag. device is 50% smaller than a 10" diag. device, not 7/10. Good luck with your new Fire, and likely your Chevy Aveo, Dell laptop, and your MacDonald's happy meals.

Variety is the spice of life!
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post #120 of 127
11/14/11 at 3:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by happyden View Post

I normally don't respond to tards, but if you can't recognize the difference between a device that has choppy video versus slow video; they are two different phenomena. And I would bet that many potential buyers (likely including yourself) don't even know that a 7" diag. device is 50% smaller than a 10" diag. device, not 7/10. Good luck with your new Fire, and likely your Chevy Aveo, Dell laptop, and your MacDonald's happy meals.

Variety is the spice of life!

Easy there, first you never mentioned video, and second the reason a video would appear choppy is because of dropped frames, which in turn is caused by slow processing of the video data. As to the screen size, you have the nerve to lecture me on geometry after you couldn't figure out how big the screen would be just from reading the specs? Sheesh!

Good luck with your smugness and your out-of-place proverbs.
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