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Major PC makers plan to concede tablet market to Apple, Amazon in 2012 - Page 3

post #81 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psych_guy View Post

I'm not so sure this is true. 1) judging from the anecdotal evidence here and other blogs and forums I do not think users mainly use their iPad/tablets to consume entertainment, if you define it as movies, music and possibly books. And before you can make a statement like that, either you or I would need stats of some kind to back that up.

Nice try at a subtle dig at iPad for being a "consumption only" device, though.

You mistake my observation about a minimal requirement with n assessment of what the high end hardware is used for.
post #82 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by palomine View Post

We just tried a demo of Printopia, a $20 app that let's your iPhones iPads print to any printer on your network. It works well, even with my 1st gen iPad. You click on the 'out' arrow in any page or app ( the one that lets you email, bookmark or save etc.). Then the drop down box lists our four printers, our localhost network, Dropbox account, and Send To Mac.
The software needs to be installed on your computer then it can see anything on your network. It automagically appears on all your iPhones iPads in the out arrow dialog box in whatever app you are in. Really happy with it. None of our printers are wifi compatible and some are really old but it works!

Thx palomine, I've heard good things about printopia...good to know!
post #83 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

" r u almost done with the iPad?" of course, I correct her and tell her it's an "iPad2!".

You're not gaining any points.
post #84 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxman View Post

Its not ideal but you can use good reader, apparently, to move pdfs via wifi Check out this thread

As far as video goes why not the Apple iPad camera kit?

No wifi at work for security reasons. If we had wifi I could have used filebrowser (a great app by the way). A file transfer app that uses the docking cable instead of wifi would work but I think that might be against Apple's rules.

I don't have the camera kit. Solution was to run the videos through a converter to get an iPad version, put it in a folder, sync "Photos???" using itunes with the "include video box" checked. All this in spite of the fact that I can transfer or stream the original videos using filebrowser and view them in a video player app
post #85 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Well said. Anecdotal I know, but before my ipad2, my GF would go to our iMac in the den for facebook, emailing, photo mgt, surfing, etc., instead of using her work laptop (dell-ugh!). Now she goes straight for the iPad2 sitting on the coffee table...I get asked a lot, " r u almost done with the iPad?" of course, I correct her and tell her it's an "iPad2!".

Women love to be corrected, particularly on *details*. NOT!
post #86 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimUSCA View Post

That's exactly why people want a PC over an iPad. I love my iPad, but it's not a replacement for a computer. It's an ultra-portable accessory.

Two words: Wireless Printer.
post #87 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

P.S. (Off topic) I'm looking to get a print app for my iPad...any suggestions? Thx.

I did the easy thing and bought an HP printer that has support for the iPad printing. Super easy
post #88 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

The limits Apple puts on it's devices may play into a couple of surveys that strangely show that consumers overwhelmingly prefer Windows as their tablet OS. Whats that you say? What tablets use Windows? My guess is that buyers want computers/tablets with an OS and feature set they're already comfortable with. That's generally Windows.

I suspect the entire tablet space will undergo a change once MS-based tablets start hitting the market, no matter that Apple was the initial player.

http://allthingsd.com/20111005/never...-windows-ipad/

Yup. Windows Tablets. Any day now. It's gonna be a hit. Everyone will want one. As soon as MS-based tablets start hitting the market. Any day now. It's as true today as it was in 1992.

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post #89 of 134
I think HP really messed up.

Their WebOS is decent, and their tablets sold like hotcakes when they got rid of them at fire sale prices.

The lesson is that people would buy them at a lower price point.

They need to somehow get the price point to $99/$150/$199 and then people will buy*them.
post #90 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjwal View Post

No wifi at work for security reasons. If we had wifi I could have used filebrowser (a great app by the way). A file transfer app that uses the docking cable instead of wifi would work but I think that might be against Apple's rules.

You mentioned the USB port earlier, is it an option to just put those pdfs on a USB key and take them home, then load them up in iTunes there? Not a perfect solution, but it's certainly workable. I have a 32GB USB key so I can listen to plenty of music at work, as I don't have an iPhone yet and I've never owned an iPod. This works just fine, until our company finally decides to block USB ports heh
post #91 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimUSCA View Post

That's exactly why people want a PC over an iPad. I love my iPad, but it's not a replacement for a computer. It's an ultra-portable accessory.

For some people, it IS a replacement for a computer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

I think HP really messed up.

Their WebOS is decent, and their tablets sold like hotcakes when they got rid of them at fire sale prices.

The lesson is that people would buy them at a lower price point.

They need to somehow get the price point to $99/$150/$199 and then people will buy*them.

Actually, HP's biggest mistake was marking them to $99. Thousands have been sold on eBay for $200 or more. If HP had marked them down to $200 or $250, they'd probably still have sold all of them - and had millions more dollars in their pocket.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowdog65 View Post

99% of rumors are nonsense and so is this one.

HP, and Dell will likely shift from Android to Win8 tablets. I wouldn't call that conceding the market.

The better Android tablet builders like Asus,Samsung will be in Android and Win8 tablets.

It's really to early to say. No one outside of Microsoft knows enough about how Win8 will perform on a tablet. If they make it a full blown Windows like earlier versions of Windows slates, it may not do well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

There's some evidence that a high percentage of iPad owners may regret their purchase, finding they don't have as much use for it as they originally envisioned. That could be one reason that some of the computer makers may have decided it's a market not worth pursuing right now.

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/laptops/ipad...;siu-container

Really? So in your world, something isn't useful unless you use it daily?

And even if those claims were true, it's still a multi-billion dollar market that's growing rapidly. It would be foolish to ignore it just because the customers don't use the product daily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Also, while you might think that iPad owners find more use than owners of other tablets, not so according to this European study. To the contrary, those cheaper tablets/readers are used more often by their owners than those with the somewhat expensive iPads.

"Interestingly, non-iPad owners are recording an average of 30 minutes more usage a day than people with Apple iconic device. This trend was evident in all markets surveyed. "We found that younger people are more likely to own cheaper non-Apple devices, and that these users tend to be most engaged with social networks," said Garner.

http://site14.fourfiveone.com/2011/1...their-tablets/

Did you notice how your two sources contradict each other? That alone makes your 'evidence' pretty questionable.

Not to mention that there's absolutely nothing to suggest statistical validity. For example, people buying cheaper tablets may well be younger and/or college students - which would explain their greater usage. Without correcting for differences in population, the survey is totally meaningless.
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post #92 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Really? So in your world, something isn't useful unless you use it daily?

It wasn't me they asked. The results were based on iPad owners answers in the UK.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Did you notice how your two sources contradict each other? That alone makes your 'evidence' pretty questionable..

How so? One was referring to iPad owners, while the other included tablet owners/users in general.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Not to mention that there's absolutely nothing to suggest statistical validity. For example, people buying cheaper tablets may well be younger and/or college students - which would explain their greater usage. Without correcting for differences in population, the survey is totally meaningless.

If you read the entire second link you should have seen that those buying the less expensive tablets were likely to be younger and much more prone to socialize with them, just as you were wondering.
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post #93 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Oh I don't know, maybe the PC market to start, maybe Xbox Live, enterprise, Office, just all the other software they produce that they make billions from.

PC's are going nowhere anytime soon, the market keeps growing.

Xbox live is blowing up and MS are constantly striking deals to provide more and more content to the consumer

Enterprise is MS's bread and butter, servers, mail servers ect.... all run MS

Office, number one selling business software suite

I could go on.

I'll pin this on the wall and check it in ten years.
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post #94 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

I did the easy thing and bought an HP printer that has support for the iPad printing. Super easy

I just got one today. Took 2 minutes to have all Macs, iPads and iPhones printing - they all just worked. The Macs did have to grab drivers but they did it automatically over the internet. Amazingly simple. Over half an hour fiddling with Windows 7 to get it working on the same printer!
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post #95 of 134
Again, Apple slaps these guys senseless by simply out competing everyone else... It was a fair fight... I my neighborhood, this is called an old fashioned ass-whoppin..... So what does this leave for Stevie in Seattle ?

N A D A .... His only play is with the Finnish who don't like his kind and will Sabatoge him anywhere they find.....ho,,,ho,,,,ho.....
post #96 of 134
Again, Apple slaps these guys senseless by simply out competing everyone else... It was a fair fight... I my neighborhood, this is called an old fashioned ass-whoppin..... So what does this leave for Stevie in Seattle ?

N A D A .... His only play is with the Finnish who don't like his kind and will Sabatoge him anywhere they find.....ho,,,ho,,,,ho.....
post #97 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by tenzo View Post

Let's get this right....
"Strong enthusiasm for tablets other than Apple's Ipad have already disappeared"

I for one, am very enthusiastic about the next ipad 3. Which will more than likely incorporate siri. That is the main reason i am waiting to buy an ipad!!

Your comment just inspired me... What if Siri on iPad 3 was promoted to schools as a "teacher's assistant", and could it be limited to questions based on the curriculum with geo-fencing?

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post #98 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

I hear u tenzo...it's hard to pull the trigger when a new model is on the horizon. My only regret with my iPad2 is getting the wifi only model instead of the 3G.

I thought I could "tether" it to my ip4...but AT&T said to setup tethering would be $45/mo and I would lose my "grandfathered-in" unlimited data plan! I'm thinking of telling AT&T to stick it up their nose and get a sprint 4s.

Best.

You can also tether your iPad to an Android phone with T-mo.

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post #99 of 134
SNIP:
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidCV View Post

"Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons."
-- Popular Mechanics, forecasting the relentless march of science, 1949

Since I'm assuming you didn't write this, you need to link back to the source... Is this it?

http://www.etni.org.il/quotes/predictions.htm

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post #100 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

P.S. (Off topic) I'm looking to get a print app for my iPad...any suggestions? Thx.

Printopia on the Mac works great for me. Dunno if there is anything like it for Windows. Or if you are PC free, more and more printers are coming with AirPrint support. Might be time to upgrade!
post #101 of 134
All this can be summed up nicely, Apple raised the bar way too high for the rush to the bottom business model the PC makers have been using this past decade. Quality, design and content is king, Apple has led those features wonderfully and it's now dawned on the PC industry they must undergo a philosophical change in order to compete.
post #102 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

It's really dependent on what you use a computer for. For a while, Apple defenders hated the label of a *consumption device* for the iPad. Reality is that the iPad is not only a replacement for the PC for some consumption tasks. It is in fact a superior alternative for reading, web browsing and video watching (unless you want it do this on a larger screen). I think we underestimate how many people at home use a computer primarily for these tasks (plus email).

I know better than to underestimate users in this regard. The vast majority of computer users basically just do a few things: web, email, printing, youtube, maybe scanning. That's about it. For the masses of computer users, the ipad is a great alternative to a desktop pc. This is why sales have been so explosive.
post #103 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

I read this as a vote of zero confidence for Microsoft's tablet OS development. The logical path for major PC makers would have been there rather than Android and I suspect they have seen betas of Ballmer's future creation and didn't like what they saw.

That's a very interesting observation.

I've always thought that the Windows 8 ARM implementation as a MS placeholder until they can get a low power [usage] x86 Tablet -- one that can run Windows 8 Desktop OS and apps.

I don't know if Windows supports the concept of Universal Apps.

I suspect that next WWDC Apple will begin to push development of modular, [more] limited-function, specialist apps that will run on Mac OS X and iOS. iWork and iMovie on iOS are the harbingers of this approach.

Additionally I expect to see AirPlay enhanced and integrated into many apps -- where an OS X device and an iDevice can act as either a Player or a Playee.

I fully expect to be able to buy and run apps like Pixelmator (PhotoShop-like) and Final Cut X on any Apple device that meets hardware requirements -- regardless of OS.
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post #104 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Thanks!

Because of my " matinee idol" good looks I am able to attract beautiful women, but for some reason, not able to hold on to them....oh well, such is life!

...You forgot to mention your humility
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post #105 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerryb View Post

How will Google expand it's malware riddled Android OS without the help of Dell, Acer and HP? I guess they will have to stick to phones to spread the joy.

They'll eventually have to subsidize OEMs with their content profits.
post #106 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

The limits Apple puts on it's devices may play into a couple of surveys that strangely show that consumers overwhelmingly prefer Windows as their tablet OS. Whats that you say? What tablets use Windows? My guess is that buyers want computers/tablets with an OS and feature set they're already comfortable with. That's generally Windows.

I suspect the entire tablet space will undergo a change once MS-based tablets start hitting the market, no matter that Apple was the initial player.

http://allthingsd.com/20111005/never...-windows-ipad/

You do understand that Windows 8 [ARM] Tablets won't be able to run any Windows 8 Desktop Apps -- Word, Excel, PP... and any 3rd-party or legacy Desktop Apps.

These apps would need to be re-written to support ARM, Touch UI, etc.

I believe that MS is counting on an x86 chip that doesn't run the battery down and generate excessive heat -- so they can run Windows 8 [x86] on a tablet. Maybe we'll see such a chip by 2013-2014 -- but MS won't have any desktop-class Tablet deliverables (OS or apps) for two years.

IMO, MS has missed an opportunity by not porting Office to run on the iPad (establish a Tablet toehold for Office while learning and implementing what is needed for the Tablet market) -- and making some money while they're at it.

Of course, MS could be secretly writing an ARM Tablet version of Office for Windows 8 to be released late 2012... but it will be a 1.0 release on a 1.0 OS -- 2 years too late.
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post #107 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by stelligent View Post

This only says the PC manufacturers are giving up (if in fact true), not the likes of HTC, Motorola and Samsung (although Samsung does make PCs).

Furthermore, there is no word from HP that they have given up for sure. Meg is *deliberating*. She is off to a decisive start as CEO.

Cool, at first I read your comment as "Meg is debilitating"
post #108 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

You do understand that Windows 8 [ARM] Tablets won't be able to run any Windows 8 Desktop Apps -- Word, Excel, PP... and any 3rd-party or legacy Desktop Apps.

These apps would need to be re-written to support ARM, Touch UI, etc.

I had forgotten the comments about that a few weeks ago. Thanks for the reminder.
They have a bit of work to do, don't they?
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post #109 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by fecklesstechguy View Post

The PC market is nearing the moribund state, as the major segment of Microsoft's revenue stream starts eroding (enterprise computing) they have struggled with the successful incursion of Linux into the server space, even backing SCO's battles to challenge Linux's code base as containing elements of UNIX they claim they own. If they weren't worried about this they wouldn't be throwing so much money at undermining Linux. In the Office space, they are eyeing Google's Cloud Office for enterprise carefully to see where that is going to impact them. And Google is gunning for the mail side and messaging as well.

A lot of major enterprises are moving off of local hardware and moving to virtualized desktops, which changes the licensing of Office and Windows, and lessens it's profitability.

XBox has only recently in the last couple of years even produced profitable revenue for Microsoft, and again it's in a segment that is threatened by the increasing presence of gaming on mobile devices. YOU may prefer XBox as a platform, but the viability and profitabilty of the platform is marginal according to M/soft's own financials, and the market is divided.

Back to the PC market growing - the only source of real growth in the PC is in developing countries, whose markets don't support the robust costs associated with Windows and Office - most of them have a huge problem of pirated software and illegal licenses - no source of revenue for M/soft there, outside of recouping legal fees trying to sue pirates. All other segments of PC sales are plateauing or declining slowly.

And yes Microsoft has enough presence in the market to keep driving revenues for the near-term (next decade or so), but unless they can expand influence into new markets (a la Windows 8 "on everything" for example) their segments will erode out from under them. Not even putting Windows into Fords, etc. will keep revenues coming in strongly enough to offset the erosion of consumer PCs into mobile devices, Linux and Google into the server space and Google into the Office space.

The only credible profit sources for Microsoft are Office, Windows desktop, and Windows server. XBox scarcely registers on the scale below those. And those are where Microsoft's vulnerabilities lay.

Only a fool would allow Microsoft to continue "business-as-usual" in light of these facts, but Mr. Ballmer could well be that fool.

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post #110 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by bloggerblog View Post

Why doesn't Apple support iOS printing through their AirPort Base Stations?

They do! I have a 5-year old HP DeskJet 5700 plugged into my AirPort extreme -- accessible from any Mac, iPad or iPhone from anywhere in and around the house.
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post #111 of 134
In the vast sea of rumors perhaps this is the dumbest rumor to date. Essentially it states that PC manufactures have independently all decided to commit suicide.

Not bloody likely.

If nothing else, a Win8/ARM Transformer Prime like product would sell as long as the full MS office ran natively. Toss in Visio and MS Project and it would be a killer business tablet.

Intel pushing PC makers into ultrabooks helps gets them ready for the next potential step.

A keyboard dock with a Core i5/i7 base and a ARM based tablet would be the killer combo....MS Office suite even when running ARM and full legacy Windows compatibility when docked with the keyboard.

Combine the Asus UX21 Zenbook with the Asus Transformer Prime running Win8 and you have a good idea of what the product might look like.

Sure, Intel would prefer Atom over ARM but it still sees a Core i5/i7 sale. And what the heck, they can start making ARM chips again if they really wanted.
post #112 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo42 View Post

These sources who say the entire industry is giving up trying to compete with Apple are surely unbiased, right? right?

I actually don't think there is too much bias in there as the same "sources" claim consumer enthusiasm for the iPad is waning. Whether these "sources" are full of sh*t is something else.

Just as interesting is why in the comment about how "strong enthusiasm for tablet PCs has already disappeared" the iPad was inexplicably switched for the Fire and Nook in the AI article.

I don't know who Sam Oliver but this kind of miss-quoting a source so it fits the point you're trying to make is the kind of terrible writing that I'd expect from the AI link-bait trolls like Dilger and Slash Lane.

I really like Josh Ong and Neil Hughes. I wish they would write more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AI

And even with their low prices, sales of newly launched touchscreen tablets from Amazon and Barnes & Noble were not as high as Apple's iPad, which industry insiders see as an indication that "strong enthusiasm for tablet PCs has already disappeared."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Digitimes Source

The sources pointed out that although iPad 2 is also seeing strong demand from consumers, sales were lower than those of iPad, indicating that consumers' strong enthusiasm for tablet PCs has already disappeared.
post #113 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

I think HP really messed up.

Their WebOS is decent, and their tablets sold like hotcakes when they got rid of them at fire sale prices.

The lesson is that people would buy them at a lower price point.

They need to somehow get the price point to $99/$150/$199 and then people will buy*them.


Maybe. But these days, it seems an ecosystem is a major sales point, and they don't even have many apps, much less access to sophisticated entertainment delivery.
post #114 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

I really like Josh Ong and Neil Hughes. I wish they would write more.

Isn't Josh Ong just another nom de plume for Prince Lane?
post #115 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by grmac View Post

When I arrived at the college to deliver the fifty iPads for Kappa Delta Smeg, I noticed that the girls seemed to be having pillow fights. Undaunted, but still apprehensive, I entered the house, sensing danger.

"We've been waiting for you..." said the cheerleader. "It looks like a long, hard evening of iSatisfaction..."

Great story but I have data to refute it. Every time I run a test to see whether my iPad or my pet retired racing greyhound is the bigger chick magnet ... my dog wins, hands down. No offense to the iPad, though.

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post #116 of 134
No surprises. All their offerings were sub par.

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iPod nano 5th Gen 8GB Orange, iPad 3rd Gen WiFi 32GB White
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post #117 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by nht View Post

In the vast sea of rumors perhaps this is the dumbest rumor to date. Essentially it states that PC manufactures have independently all decided to commit suicide.

Not bloody likely.
...

Thank you for this post. Finally some common sense.

HP may be the only quitters here, perhaps Dell too. HP seems to have a death wish, I cannot count the crazy news I've read about them in the past years, their management seems totally erratic, and their laptops are fugly. Dell had a very idiosyncratic approach to the tablet business with the Streak series, and may not see the point in continuing it, but I still have hopes for them (being a happy Streak 5 owner).

But to expect that Motorola, Samsung, Asus and Acer are quitting the tablet business is just crazy... or maybe too much wishful thinking...
post #118 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jahblade View Post

I pass down my iPad to my wife, I got the iPad 2. Her reaction was what I am going to use it for. She preferred her laptop. That was 4 months ago. Today, the iPad is her sofa & bed buddy. The laptop, is jealous. For printing, I have HP wifi printer... Easy setup & she can print from anywhere in the house.

Another plug for HP. This morning, I had a PDF (sent by email) that I needed to print out before leaving te house. I intended to print from my MacBook Pro as usual. After turning on the printer I had the sudden urge to use the toilet, so I grabbed my iPad as I often do. Suddenly it hit me... I opened the email on the iPad, sent the PDF to the HP printer app, and I swear it was way easier to print than had I used my laptop. Didn't have to go back to the laptop before leaving the house, and I saved valuable time. Thanks, HP!
post #119 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Thank you for this post. Finally some common sense.

HP may be the only quitters here, perhaps Dell too. HP seems to have a death wish, I cannot count the crazy news I've read about them in the past years, their management seems totally erratic, and their laptops are fugly. Dell had a very idiosyncratic approach to the tablet business with the Streak series, and may not see the point in continuing it, but I still have hopes for them (being a happy Streak 5 owner).

But to expect that Motorola, Samsung, Asus and Acer are quitting the tablet business is just crazy... or maybe too much wishful thinking...

With the possible exception of Samsung, none of these companies can make any money on Android tablets. I'm guessing that they will not introduce any more Android tablets, and hope that they can later make money on Win8 tablets.

Phones are pretty much the same thing. All profits are going to Apple, RIM, Nokia, Samsung, and HTC, RIM and Nokia are shrinking fast, and very little is split between Samsung and HTC. No telling how many phone manufacturers will stay in the smartphone game if this continues.
post #120 of 134
Quote:
Originally Posted by synp View Post

With the possible exception of Samsung, none of these companies can make any money on Android tablets. I'm guessing that they will not introduce any more Android tablets, and hope that they can later make money on Win8 tablets.

Phones are pretty much the same thing. All profits are going to Apple, RIM, Nokia, Samsung, and HTC, RIM and Nokia are shrinking fast, and very little is split between Samsung and HTC. No telling how many phone manufacturers will stay in the smartphone game if this continues.

I'm curious how you know that. It seems rather far fetched to me to claim that nobody can make any money. What facts do you have to support such an outlandish claim?
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  • Major PC makers plan to concede tablet market to Apple, Amazon in 2012
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