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UK's chief rabbi blames Apple for 'egocentric culture'

post #1 of 116
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Lord Sacks, the Chief Rabbi in the U.K., has blamed Apple for creating a consumer society, comparing the iPad touchscreen tablet to a modern-day version of Moses' stone tablets that bore the Ten Commandments [updated].

A spokesman for Sacks has followed up with a clarification to note that the rabbi meant no criticism toward Steve Jobs or Apple as a company. Instead, he said it's the "potential dangers of consumerism" which can be taken too far by some individuals.

Sacks made the comments in the presence of the Queen at an interfaith reception last week, reinterpreted the "i" in Apple's popular naming scheme as an indication of an increasingly selfish society, as noted by The Telegraph.

The consumer society was laid down by the late Steve Jobs coming down the mountain with two tablets, iPad one and iPad two, and the result is that we now have a culture of iPod, iPhone, iTune, i, i, i," he said. When youre an individualist, egocentric culture and you only care about 'i, you dont do terribly well.

The rabbi went on to say that the consumer ethic fosters ingratitude because it makes people unhappy with what they have. People should instead spend their time thanking God for things they do have, Sacks said.

"The consumer society is in fact the most efficient mechanism ever devised for the creation and distribution of unhappiness, he added, singling out consumer desire for new iPhone models as an example.

Sacks called on the devout to observe the traditional Jewish day of rest, the Shabbat, in order to avoid the trap of materialism. "Therefore the answer to the consumer society is the world of faith, which the Jews call the world of Shabbat, where you cant shop and you cant spend and you spend your time with things that matter, with family," he said.

At least one of the audience members present at the meeting was an iDevice owner, as reports revealed earlier this year that Queen Elizabeth II was so impressed with her grandsons' iPads that she ordered one for herself. The Queen is said to be a "big fan" of Apple's products and reportedly owns two iPods, including one given to her as a gift by U.S. President Barack Obama in 2009.

For his part, Jobs was considered for knighthood in the U.K. 2009, but the plans were said to have been scrapped because he declined an invitation to speak at a political conference. However, Apple's lead designer and U.K. citizen, Jonathan Ive, has received the title of Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire, one step below knighthood.
post #2 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Sacks made the comments in the presence of the Queen at an interfaith reception last week, reinterpreted the "i" in Apple's popular naming scheme as an indication of an increasingly selfish society

flying in the face of the past fifteen years of the real meaning behind the lowercase I.

Quote:
When youre an individualist, egocentric culture and you only care about 'i, you dont do terribly well.

Correct, but not very relevant.

Anyway, I imagine this thing will be moved to PoliticalOutsider in short order.

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Originally Posted by Marvin

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post #3 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

spend your time with things that matter, with family

And if you use the iPad on the other six days to communicate with family, does that suddenly make it holy? I love religious "logic".
post #4 of 116
Lots of Jews work at Apple.

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"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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post #5 of 116
I do think that modern day Apple users are insatiable and materialistic to the point of ridiculousness. It makes me when I read users posting that they sold their iPhone 4 so they can upgrade to an iPhone 4S. Seriously? Are you that dissatisfied with your life? I believe that it is the newer bandwagon Apple users that are like this, though. The old school fellas like myself tend to be loyal and stick with our Macs like we do with our underwear- until it is absolutely necessary to upgrade.
post #6 of 116
I suggest rabbi reads on wealth of nations and how caring about your own interest translates into good for all. Than he should study up on communism and how collectivst societies fail. After that he should read somephysics and coding textbooks to see how many people it takes to make an idevice. Finally he should pull his head out of the gutter and see that we are living in the best of times, people are much more tolerant and caring than they have ever been, and apple has recently started an employee confrubution scheme.

I give the same suggestion to muslims and every ofher religious leader complaing about modern society.
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post #7 of 116
Some are worse than others, but all religion is a bunch of crap.
post #8 of 116
Ah, c'mon. "Lord Sacks" is just jealous. They all are trying to stay relevant in modern society. Sacks and Ballmer have one thing in common: they both feel threatened by tablets. How odd is that? It's always the status quo who have the hardest time digesting a revolution. I wonder why?

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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post #9 of 116
This man must not have any technology in his house?? If he does then, does that make him a victim of his own preaching? How easy it is for such a man to point fingers and blame.

Both parents work today. At least most of them. By families connecting via iPHone and iPad the family can connect and communicate (stay in touch). By having a big screen TV the family can enjoy wonderful Pixar movies via Apple TV.

I think this man is technologically handicapped. I think the i technology intimidates him. Or maybe he doesn't have enough friends who use such devices so he can stay in touch.

And this comment about Steve coming down the mountain with two iPads like the ten commandments. Steve is dead. This man has no dignity for a man who suffered and died from cancer? How would his family like it is he died and some one made a crude insulting comment about him? Have some respect for the dead and those who were suffering.

It's so easy to judge isn't it. We all do it. He just happens to be a public figure who thinks his opinion matters!

So lets break down the meaning of the lower case i in i devices. Google it and you will find out that the iMac was the first i device Apple came out with. The i was meant to be interpreted as internet. i for internet. iMac internet mac. The i stuck with Apple (Steve Jobs) and was branded as a device identifier. So if he really wants to criticize i or iPad then he should have the understanding behind the meaning of i. He talks like the i in iPad, iPod and all other devices branded with the i is bad as if it is taking over our lives. But really if you look at the i it is not taking over our lives. In my opinion it is enhancing our lives. But we do have to remember that too much of a good thing is not good for you. The key is balance. Apple has revolutionized an industry and has changed the modern world. I think that has enhanced our lives.

Weather he likes it or not technology will advance and evolve. It is here to stay and is only going to get better. We are in a technological revolution. Only those who are threatened by it are gonna criticize. Whats that saying? Out with the old in with the new.

Maybe when his life is in jeopardy and the doctor walks in with an iPad that just happens to have his EKG the rabbi will faint.
An Apple man since 1977
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An Apple man since 1977
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post #10 of 116
What makes the rabbi's opinion any more relevant than anybody else's opinion?

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

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"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." Douglas Adams

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post #11 of 116
This rabbi doesn't know the half of it:

http://objectiveministries.org/creation/propaganda.html

"Given the now obvious anti-Christian and cultish nature of Apple Computers, is it any wonder that they have decided to base their newest operating system on Darwinism?"

And that's just the beginning...
post #12 of 116
If anyone is serious about learning about the moral ramifications of technology they need to read the works of Marshall Mcluhan (@ http://marshallmcluhan.com/biography/ ), Nicholas Carr (@ www.roughtype.com ), and Kevin Kelly (editor at large for Wired) ( @ http://www.kk.org/thetechnium/archiv...rn_digital.php )
We become what we behold. We shape our tools and then our tools shape us.- Marshall McLuhan

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We become what we behold. We shape our tools and then our tools shape us.- Marshall McLuhan

Join 'The New Middle Class Movement' @ http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Ne...45269528896164
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post #13 of 116
Perhaps the Ipad can help spread what religion and the Bible is all about. To single out any technology and blame that for an 'Egocentric culture' is equivalent to blaming lack of knowledge as the cause of stupidity.
Perhaps the chief Rabbi doesn't realize the benefits if an Ipad.
post #14 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler82 View Post

I do think that modern day Apple users are insatiable and materialistic to the point of ridiculousness. It makes me when I read users posting that they sold their iPhone 4 so they can upgrade to an iPhone 4S. Seriously? Are you that dissatisfied with your life? I believe that it is the newer bandwagon Apple users that are like this, though. The old school fellas like myself tend to be loyal and stick with our Macs like we do with our underwear- until it is absolutely necessary to upgrade.

Such pomposity. Although I haven't sold my iPhone 4 to buy a 4s, I can understand why someone might. And it has nothing to do with dissatisfaction with life. Quite the opposite. It has to do with desire and excitement. Is it a form of materialism? It certainly can be. It might just as easily be an expression of a childlike sense of wonder and desire for play. But at least it's in some form an expression of joy.

And then there's the drab existence of people whose only laughter is the humorless barking laughter of the angry man who sees people enjoying life and understands nothing except how different from him they are. Such a man might flatter himself with the thought that his inability to take pleasure at a new iPhone somehow suggests he has a rich inner world.

Sometimes, though, still waters *don't* run deep. They just stagnate.
post #15 of 116
Some people will say absolutely anything for publicity.
Mac user since August 1983.
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Mac user since August 1983.
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post #16 of 116
1) I think he's right that we in the industrialized world need to learn gratefulness, mindfulness, and being satisfied.

2) Having said that, I don't see the logic behind singling out Apple. And he doesn't even know what the "i" stands for. A simple search on YouTube will bring you the 1998 keynote where Steve Jobs explained the naming scheme for the original iMac:

internet, individual, instruct, inform, inspire.

Of course, perhaps the Rabbi doesn't have a computer, so I guess that explains it. In any case, the "i" thing has become a branding thing more than anything else.

3) I'm a man of faith and a huge fan of Apple products. Yes, there is often a line to be walked between materialism and faith. don't think there's anything wrong with possessions - so long as you own them, and they don't own you. The world is there for us to use as well as take care of. (If you've ever eaten a single plant or animal, you've "used" the world for your own gain). All living things do this, but humans just do it at an incredibly high rate and need to figure out how to not screw things up.

4) When will religious people learn that making blanket, misinformed, statements of attack just turns off people to faith?
post #17 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by acslater017 View Post

1) I think he's right that we in the industrialized world need to learn gratefulness, mindfulness, and being satisfied.

2) Having said that, I don't see the logic behind singling out Apple. And he doesn't even know what the "i" stands for. A simple search on YouTube will bring you the 1998 keynote where Steve Jobs explained the naming scheme for the original iMac:

internet, individual, instruct, inform, inspire.

Of course, perhaps the Rabbi doesn't have a computer, so I guess that explains it. In any case, the "i" thing has become a branding thing more than anything else.

3) I'm a man of faith and a huge fan of Apple products. Yes, there is often a line to be walked between materialism and faith. don't think there's anything wrong with possessions - so long as you own them, and they don't own you. The world is there for us to use as well as take care of. (If you've ever eaten a single plant or animal, you've "used" the world for your own gain). All living things do this, but humans just do it at an incredibly high rate and need to figure out how to not screw things up.

4) When will religious people learn that making blanket, misinformed, statements of attack just turns off people to faith?

I agree with you whole heartedly.
An Apple man since 1977
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An Apple man since 1977
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post #18 of 116
iGod advised iJesus: Ask Siri!
post #19 of 116
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Originally Posted by whytoi View Post

iGod advised iJesus: Ask Siri!

iAm that iAm.

Anyone? I'm going to hell for that one...
post #20 of 116
It has become painfully obvious to me that the chief poobah of any religion is always, without fail, the most out-of-touch, the most self-deluded, and certainly, the most ridiculous member of whatever church, sect, cult, or make-believe club that he heads. It would be funny if they weren't so malevolent.
post #21 of 116
Yes there has always been a fight between magical vs religious topics. He forgot you can also download the bible and read on these devices?
post #22 of 116
Really!
Apple did not invent consumerism, they just perfected it!
What has this man been smoking.
post #23 of 116
Yet another example of how totally out of touch (and possibly self-deluded) the clergy (irrespective of religion) are. Perhaps Mr. Sacks should have focussed on the availability of religious manuscripts which can be read on the iPad by people with poor sight thanks to its "miraculous" ability to make the fonts bigger ? Having an iPad and iPhone and iMac has not made me an egocentric person as far I know, in fact I would say the opposite given the amount to time I spend helping people embrace and learn to use these wonderful new technologies. I do, however, struggle to think of anything any non specific deity has ever done for me or my family and friends or even the world at large. In fact, surely if there is a supreme being, he/she/it seems to cause more misery and conflict around the world than any piece of Apple equipment
post #24 of 116
Gee, this is strange because religious people have never been wrong about technology.
post #25 of 116
Old Lord Sacks is just angry that he grew up with Windows and resents Apple users because he's Lord Sacks and nobody deserves better gadgies than him!
post #26 of 116
Rubbish religious bullshit!! Doesn't belong here at all!!!
post #27 of 116
He should be thanked for reminding us that evangelical christians and catholics do not have exclusive ownership of stupidity.
post #28 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by inkswamp View Post

Gee, this is strange because religious people have never been wrong about technology.

Noah had the ultimate technology of the day. Even to this day, no one has developed similar to carry one pair of every specie on this planet. I never worked out how Noah paired those E Coli and H5N1 amongst so many others. It was just amazing!
post #29 of 116
I'm used to Christians saying people are too materialistic, but this is the first I've heard of a Rabbi saying it. Anyway they're entitled to their opinion.

In theory, capitalism requires you to pay for everything. And you can only spend what you previously earned. So having an iPhone is just a sign of having worked, and nothing immoral about that.
post #30 of 116
Pluh-ease! Consumerism started wwayyy before Apple, Steve Jobs, or the iProducts.
post #31 of 116
As if the israelis and their lack of ethicse.g., building on Palestinian land, cutting down their olive trees, blocking their export of food, jailing them for no reason, not negotiating in good faith, aren't giving the world enough reasons for anti-semitism, Rabbi Putz-berg adds to the reasons to dislike the Jewsand I'm half Jewish.

Materialism indeed.

When I got the first gen iPhone, I made of list of things (stuff) that I no longer needed, including a watch (haven't had a watch for years), PDA, iPod, etc and by current iPhone standards, it was pretty primitive. The current gen iPhone has a so much more, including movie camera, a pocket secretary, books and apps that are only limited by the developer community's imagination. If anything, an iPhone REDUCES materialism. It's a tool.

The only way that idiot can defend his position is if he rides a donkey (ass on an ass?), lives without electricity 24/7, has no TV, microwave, etc.
post #32 of 116
Asks for iOS source code, before he can certify iDevices as "kosher"
I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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I've accomplished my childhood's dream: My job consists mainly of playing with toys all day long.
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post #33 of 116
So AI is now publishing sermons that are critical of Apple? Geez. So he used as Apple as an example of consumerism. Is he wrong? When was the last time you saw that many people line up to volunteer at a homeless shelter?

Wrong to single out Apple? Perhaps. But the sentiment? Not entirely so. Every once in a while, we all need a reminder that there's more important things in life than our gadgets.
post #34 of 116
The Rabbi is absolutely right to encourage people to be thankful for what they have, rather than giving in to lust for a new product. But I don't think that Apple's culture supports gluttonous consumerism at all. Apple products are built to last. "Applecare" is meant to extend the life of a product so that you don't have to buy a new one.

The fact that lots of Apple products begin with "i" does not promote ego-centricism at all. Steve Jobs said it stood for "internet," although another facet of it was just that it was artsy and open for interpretation just like the "e" in NeXT. Arguably, when you take "i" to stand for internet, Apple products then seem intended to promote sociableness and sharing (of information and personalities).

Many "i's" make One world.


Think different, my friends.
post #35 of 116
Check out the Rabbi's Official site, http://www.chiefrabbi.org/

You will not be disappointed!

/Users/kutub/Desktop/Screen shot 2011-11-21 at 07.43.25.png
post #36 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

It has become painfully obvious to me that the chief poobah of any religion is always, without fail, the most out-of-touch, the most self-deluded, and certainly, the most ridiculous member of whatever church, sect, cult, or make-believe club that he heads. It would be funny if they weren't so malevolent.

Actually he isn't that out of touch. Today's society if very materialistic and yes there are huge numbers of folks that are too busy playing with their smart phones etc to bother to notice other things. I believe it was Miley Cyrus that was bashed by her fans for dumping her Facebook and twitter. but she explained it as being that she realized she was doing things so she would have something to post about, not to just enjoy doing it.

Where he is wrong is blaming Apple for this whole consumer 'i' trend. Apple and Jobs didn't create it. They just happen to be the ones that make what the culture wants. If the culture wasn't there, the sales wouldn't be there either

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #37 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Lots of Jews work at Apple.

It has nothing TO do with Jews!


… And he blame also Wall Street?

when will people realize that Apple IS more engineer( which IS designing/building from a country THAT no longer builds A thing but shadow banks )-wise than A trend creator?
post #38 of 116
As a Christian I can say this article that is linked to below sucks! It is really poor, self-opinionated without offering any real evidence. Reminds me of the Microsoft and 666 stuff!


I would say a believer, that Jobs was no saint, however we can easily acknowledge his creative gift that we would say is God given, whether Steve believed in God or not.

Being part of the tech scene I would say Steve Jobs has benefited society. Without him we would not have Mac OS or the Windows OS (look at feel). Apple raised the bar in the computer industry that kept it going for 15 or so years. The iPhone especially raised the bar in the mobile industry, when many OEMs were very uninspiring with their devices. And the iPod changed the music industry for the better (if you are a consumer anyway).

I am also a bit saddened by the Rabbi's comments. We talk about technology as if it is the problem. Rather than it is a tool that can work for good or evil! Society is breaking down not as a result of technology rather the Churches all too often inability to relate.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dlux View Post

This rabbi doesn't know the half of it:

http://objectiveministries.org/creation/propaganda.html

"Given the now obvious anti-Christian and cultish nature of Apple Computers, is it any wonder that they have decided to base their newest operating system on Darwinism?"

And that's just the beginning...
post #39 of 116
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


For his part, Jobs was considered for knighthood in the U.K. 2009, but the plans were said to have been scrapped because he declined an invitation to speak at a political conference.


That was Gordon Browns doing. A corrupt asshole of a man.
post #40 of 116
and I blame religion for corrupting philosophy, morality and politics for the last 5000 years.

thing is, I'm right, and he's wrong.
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