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Amazon rumored to launch 8.9-inch Kindle Fire in Q2 2012

post #1 of 38
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Amazon is prepping an 8.9-inch Kindle Fire model for launch by the end of the second quarter of 2012, a new report claims.

Sources within supply chain makers for the online retailer said the company decided on the 8.9-inch form factor in order to avoid direct competition with 9.7-inch and 10.1-inch tablet makers, Taiwan's DigiTimes reported on Monday. Promotion of the 8.9-inch display panels by LG Display and Samsung Electronics was also said to be a factor in Amazon's decision.

Foxconn is believed to be the Original Design Manufacturer scheduled to build the device and will begin production in the "middle of the second quarter of 2012," according to the report. The ODM will also step in as a second manufacturer for the current-generation Fire in the first quarter of 2012, sources said.

Though Amazon has traditionally gone with Foxconn as its partner for its Kindle e-readers, the Fire was built by Quanta. Some industry sources claim Foxconn turned down orders for the Fire because its capacity was already booked by Apple for the iPad.

Earlier reports had suggested that Amazon was looking into a 10.1-inch tablet as a follow-up to the first-generation Fire, but the supply chain now claims that an 8.9-inch version will come first.



AppleInsider reported in September that Amazon was planning an 8.9-inch tablet with an "amazing form factor" for 2012 after testing the waters with the 7-inch Kindle Fire.

The Kindle Fire was unveiled in late September, but it didn't go on sale until last week. At $199, the device is markedly cheaper than similar tablet offerings. Some industry watchers believe the aggressive price of the Fire forced Research in Motion to slash the price of its BlackBerry PlayBook tablet by $300.

Amazon's entry into the tablet market has received a mixed reception, with some reviewers praising it as a bargain, while others have criticized it for inconsistent performance. For more about the Kindle Fire, see AppleInsider's in-depth review of the device.

In addition to the iPad, Amazon may be gunning for Apple's iPhone as well. Rumors recently surfaced that Amazon is also jointly developing a Kindle-branded smartphone with Foxconn.
post #2 of 38
At 7" and $200 I think they have a strong product, but if they want to fly closer to the sun they make sure their OS isn't made of so much wax.

Maybe at $300 for an 8.9" they would still be until the radar for those unaware of what you can get a used or refurbished iPad first from Apple. Right now, a refurbished 1st generation32GB iPad with Wi-Fi+3G 32GB is $400.
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post #3 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Amazon is prepping an 8.9-inch Kindle Fire model for launch by the end of the second quarter of 2012, a new report claims.

...in order to avoid direct competition with 9.7-inch and 10.1-inch tablet makers...

Good thinking.

What we need is more choice to better compete with the other"s".

7.1 in, 7.9 in, 8.9 in, 9.7 in, 10.1 in, such that the consumers are not "locked down" by the few existing "proprietary" (read: "closed") form factors.

And most of all, all kinds of aspect rations, especially the very elongated ones. What a great opportunity to offer even more choice!
post #4 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Right now, a refurbished 1st generation32GB iPad with Wi-Fi+3G 32GB is $400.

I guess it depends on if somebody really needs 3G or not, but I would personally rather choose the $450 refurbished iPad 2 16 GB WIFI.

By the way, does anybody know if Apple usually has a Black Friday sale? LIke 10% off everything at Apple.com? Is that how it has been in the past, or is it only certain items?
post #5 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

I guess it depends on if somebody really needs 3G or not, but I would personally rather choose the $450 refurbished iPad 2 16 GB WIFI.

I chose the cheapest of the original iPads because performance wise it's closer to the Kindle. They just didn't have any 16GB WiFi-only models to choose from, but that would get you closer to $300 by dropping 3G+GPS and halving the storage. IOW, I think Amazon won't be able to sell a larger Kindle Fire without first making the OS much more robust and versatile.

Quote:
By the way, does anybody know if Apple usually has a Black Friday sale? LIke 10% off everything at Apple.com? Is that how it has been in the past, or is it only certain items?

"Apple's Black Friday sale offers $101 off MacBook Pros, iMacs and 13-inch MacBook Airs, in addition to $41 off iPads, up to $21 off iPod nanos, and up to $41 off iPod touches, plus a handful of accessory deals. In every case but the iPad, however, resellers have well undercut Apple, as can be seen in AppleInsider's Mac Pricing Guide, below."

»

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._mac_pros.html
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post #6 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

"Apple's Black Friday sale offers $101 off MacBook Pros, iMacs and 13-inch MacBook Airs, in addition to $41 off iPads, up to $21 off iPod nanos, and up to $41 off iPod touches, plus a handful of accessory deals. In every case but the iPad, however, resellers have well undercut Apple, as can be seen in AppleInsider's Mac Pricing Guide, below."

»

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._mac_pros.html

Great, thanks!

post #7 of 38
Oh great, another screen size for Android developers to support. :P
post #8 of 38
Great if true, the 8.9'' is currently my favorite form factor, after seriously considering the 8.9'' Galaxy Tab. Both the size and the resolution of Samsung's tablet are superior to current alternatives (HD screen at 170 ppi, 97% of the width of iPad/HP Touchpad when watching video), thinnest on the market, and nearly as light as the smaller 7'' ones (~440 g).

It would be nice if Amazon learns from the critiques on their current tablet and provides more hardware features supporting additional applications (camera, microphone, hardware volume controls). I also expect they will update the software to allow more flexibility. If they do that, they can probably manage to sell it at a profit
post #9 of 38
Little problem, not mentioned in the article. Currently, the Fire uses apps designed for phones using Froyo (at least I think it's Froyo, but might be Frodo or some other hobbit), and the app is simply enlarged to fit the screen. Moving to a larger screen is going to cause issues, unless ICS has somehow magically cured this. Not to mention, if Amazon uses apps designed for Android tablets, they won't have many to choose from.
post #10 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac.World View Post

Little problem, not mentioned in the article. Currently, the Fire uses apps designed for phones using Froyo (at least I think it's Froyo, but might be Frodo or some other hobbit), and the app is simply enlarged to fit the screen. Moving to a larger screen is going to cause issues, unless ICS has somehow magically cured this. Not to mention, if Amazon uses apps designed for Android tablets, they won't have many to choose from.

Not a problem. Android has never been tied to a single resolution. There's no magic involved, just good planning. If you want to learn more about Android's design philosophy, follow the link:

http://developer.android.com/guide/t...fragments.html
post #11 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Great if true, the 8.9'' is currently my favorite form factor, after seriously considering the 8.9'' Galaxy Tab. Both the size and the resolution of Samsung's tablet are superior to current alternatives (HD screen at 170 ppi, 97% of the width of iPad/HP Touchbook when watching video), thinnest on the market, and nearly as light as the smaller 7'' ones (~440 g).

do you even know what you are talking about? I gotta ask, because I'd like to know what an HP Touchbook is?
post #12 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac.World View Post

do you even know what you are talking about? I gotta ask, because I'd like to know what an HP Touchbook is?

Sorry I meant the HP TouchPad. Corrected.

(I may have forgotten the name, but I am still bitter that I didn't manage to grab one for $99)
post #13 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Sorry I meant the HP TouchPad. Corrected.

(I may have forgotten the name, but I am still bitter that I didn't manage to grab one for $99)

He he. Had to point it out. My flippant remark, was my way of being an a$$. Sorry.

And I did grab a 32gb one for $150. Only took 3 hours of my life trying to get through their online form, which would error out constantly!
post #14 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac.World View Post

Little problem, not mentioned in the article. Currently, the Fire uses apps designed for phones using Froyo (at least I think it's Froyo, but might be Frodo or some other hobbit), and the app is simply enlarged to fit the screen. Moving to a larger screen is going to cause issues, unless ICS has somehow magically cured this. Not to mention, if Amazon uses apps designed for Android tablets, they won't have many to choose from.

eh, not really a problem.

Solution? Don't buy an Android tablet...at least not yet anyways.

Get an iPad 2...even an old semi broken iPad 1 is better than a majority of Android tablets today.
post #15 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

<..>...even an old semi broken iPad 1 is better than a majority of Android tablets today.



It's now or never, didn't you get the memo? There won't be any Android tablets as of 2012:

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...n_in_2012.html
post #16 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

At 7" and $200 I think they have a strong product, but if they want to fly closer to the sun they make sure their OS isn't made of so much wax.

Maybe at $300 for an 8.9" they would still be until the radar for those unaware of what you can get a used or refurbished iPad first from Apple. Right now, a refurbished 1st generation32GB iPad with Wi-Fi+3G 32GB is $400.

I agree...those are great selling/marketing price points.

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post #17 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post



It's now or never, didn't you get the memo? There won't be any Android tablets as of 2012:

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...n_in_2012.html

Nah I saw that...I just think those companies need to stop.

Just like with phones there seems to be two clear winners in the Android race I think the same might happen with tablets.
post #18 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

Nah I saw that...I just think those companies need to stop.

Just like with phones there seems to be two clear winners in the Android race I think the same might happen with tablets.

The race has hardly begun, it's too early to be calling out the winners.
post #19 of 38
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Originally Posted by Onhka View Post

What the hell does that mean?

I believe it is in reference to the story below this one. A UK Rabbi blames Apple for the ego-centric attitude of our culture.
post #20 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post



It's now or never, didn't you get the memo? There won't be any Android tablets as of 2012:

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...n_in_2012.html

You seem to forget that content providers include Sony, HTC and Samsung.
post #21 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nairb View Post

You seem to forget that content providers include Sony, HTC and Samsung.

Okay, good for them. I don't buy that story anyway, I was just joking. Content is peanuts to hardware companies, they can not use it in place of revenue from their core business.
post #22 of 38
The pressure isn't on the iPad, the pressure is on the Touch. That's the price point that we're looking at and as such Apple needs to get its' ducks in a row in regards to the Touch which will suffer if Apple insists on continuing to make it an iPhone sans the phone part.

If Apple offers a 5-inch Touch for about the same price as the smaller Fire, that would go a long way to addressing the challenge. If a larger Fire is introduced, it will be more money, obviously, and when it starts to inch closer in price to the iPad, its' inferior technology and software will dissuade most consumers from taking it seriously.

If Apple refuses to build the Touch with a somewhat larger screen, which is the most obvious upgrade that should be made, it's going to be harmful to Apple over the long haul. At least that's how I see it.

One more thing. If Apple doesn't see fit to tweak its' products as required as if this were disrespectful to Steve Jobs' memory, the company is doomed. Jobs never settled for letting products stagnate and Apple can't afford to provide the competition with a stationary target. The Touch is what Apple says it is. If Apple decides the Touch should have a 5-inch screen then that's what the Touch is. For example, what exactly is there that really links the iMac Version One with the current iMac.

I keep pushing for such a change of direction for the Touch but it really seems to me to be a rather obvious progression. Besides, there isn't that much risk in going this route. I doubt Apple would have any trouble selling lots of 5-inch Touch models selling for similar prices to the current Touch and if there is a demand for something similar to the current Touch, the Nano can be morphed into such a device. Bring out the new Touch alongside the iPad in a couple of months and if necessary upsize the Nano in the fall to fill the void, if one is created.

If Apple does this, neither Fire model would be much of a threat.
post #23 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanFruniken View Post

Good thinking.

What we need is more choice to better compete with the other"s".

7.1 in, 7.9 in, 8.9 in, 9.7 in, 10.1 in, such that the consumers are not "locked down" by the few existing "proprietary" (read: "closed") form factors.

And most of all, all kinds of aspect rations, especially the very elongated ones. What a great opportunity to offer even more choice!

Blah, blah choice. Tablets (real tablets and not just PDAs) have been around for over 20 years, using all sorts of display types, input methods and operating systems. There has always, repeat, ALWAYS been choice. That consumers have voted one size and aspect ratio their favorite doesn't mean they weren't given choices. They were, and they made their choice. Deal with it.

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post #24 of 38
Holy Cow! This may cause Apple to rethink their Apple tax...
post #25 of 38
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Originally Posted by xSamplex View Post

Holy Cow! This may cause Apple to rethink their Apple tax...

If you mean to lose money on every tablet sold like Amazon, then yes.

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post #26 of 38
I'm really curious how Amazon thinks they can optimize the tablets for all the different screen sizes. I just picture a miserable long-term experience in terms of software. There is a big difference in how you interact with a 7" screen vs a 9" screen... vs a potential phone.
post #27 of 38
You certainly can't accuse Amazon of not being aggressive in their mobile strategies, and that extends even to their core business, retail sales. They've announced an impressive sale this week on the ATT, Verizon and TMobile flagship (Android) phones. The best of the bunch IMHO is the $800 Motorola RAZR for one penny, of course with the obligatory 2-year contract. I guess the old "I'll make it up in volume" is Amazon's holiday sales motto.

http://9to5google.com/2011/11/21/fla...zon-this-week/
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post #28 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by xSamplex View Post

Holy Cow! This may cause Apple to rethink their Apple tax...

What 'Apple Tax'? Third-party tablets with the same specs as the iPad cost $6, 7, and 800 for the BASE model.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #29 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

I'm really curious how Amazon thinks they can optimize the tablets for all the different screen sizes. I just picture a miserable long-term experience in terms of software. There is a big difference in how you interact with a 7" screen vs a 9" screen... vs a potential phone.

It's really simple. The 8.9'' panel that is in the Samsung tab and will likely be used for the 8.9'' Amazon tablet has the exact same ppi as the 7'' panel in the Kindle Fire. Which means that graphical elements that are defined by the same pixel dimensions will have the same size, and will be equally easy to interact with. The spacing between elements is trivial to recalculate, and works similar to desktop OSes which utilize different screen sizes.

So there will be no need for separate interfaces as there is for iPhone and iPad, which have nearly the same pixels count but a threefold size difference.
post #30 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

It's really simple. The 8.9'' panel that is in the Samsung tab and will likely be used for the 8.9'' Amazon tablet has the exact same ppi[read as pixels along the x and y] as the 7'' panel in the Kindle Fire. Which means that graphical elements that are defined by the same pixel dimensions will have the same size, and will be equally easy to interact with. The spacing between elements is trivial to recalculate, and works similar to desktop OSes which utilize different screen sizes.

So there will be no need for separate interfaces as there is for iPhone and iPad, which have nearly the same pixels count but a threefold size difference.

Um… no they won't be the same size because you defined the pixels as being identical and the dispaly areas as being larger, which by definition means the pixels will be larger.

Or they can have the same poi, but the resolution is different and there it's a different UI.
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post #31 of 38
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Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

What 'Apple Tax'? Third-party tablets with the same specs as the iPad cost $6, 7, and 800 for the BASE model.

Perhaps at full retail pricing. Comparable tablets from Samsung, Acer, Toshiba and especially ASUS all commonly come in under Apple's least expensive iPad2 model at Best Buy, HH Gregg, Amazon and other big retailers. That doesn't mean there's an Apple tax since Apple's product would be considered premium, but they certainly aren't hurting on margins.
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post #32 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

Um… no they won't be the same size because you defined the ppi as being identical and the dispaly areas as being larger, which by definition means the pixels will be larger.

Read my post again. Elements with the same pixel dimensions (as in 64 by 64 pixels) will have the same size (in inches) on screens with the same ppi (pixels per inch). Same ppi means same pixel size.
post #33 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow415 View Post

I believe it is in reference to the story below this one. A UK Rabbi blames Apple for the ego-centric attitude of our culture.

Probably. Bcause the post takes one individual's comments and paints a whole people with it, I deleted it as a racist comment.
post #34 of 38
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Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Probably. Bcause the post takes one individual's comments and paints a whole people with it, I deleted it as a racist comment.

Thank you Jeff.

I deleted my comments as well.
post #35 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Same ppi means same pixel size.

Yes, but the element spacing is different. On some things it is functional, others it isn't. Keyboards are especially a pain, as the key spacing changes, or the assumption of where a thumb or finger can reach needs to change.

It is easy to kludge a solution together to make things display, but from an interaction perspective it is broken.
post #36 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

Read my post again. Elements with the same pixel dimensions (as in 64 by 64 pixels) will have the same size (in inches) on screens with the same ppi (pixels per inch). Same ppi means same pixel size.

You're right, I read your PPI to mean total number of pixels, same resolution. But that just makes your point worse because while items, like icons, on the display will be the same size there is now a lot more display area to cover. This makes a new UI even more difficult as you have to build from the ground up to deal with a new resolution.

Assuming a 16:9 aspect ratio for the Kindle Fire your talking a about 20.92"^2 for a 7" display and 33.82"^2 for an 8.9" display. That over 50% more display area. Are you just going to have a black unused border for anything that is different from the 7" resolution? Of course not, you create a UI that can take advantage of this new resolution as display size.
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post #37 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

Yes, but <..>

But, but, but... give it a break, we are discussing a non-existent hypothetical UI, for crying out loud. 7'' is not very different form 8.9'', the effort to adapt the UI will be minimal. I am sure they have much more serious issues to resolve than adapting to a slightly different screen size.
post #38 of 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by solipsism View Post

You're right, I read your PPI to mean total number of pixels, same resolution. But that just makes your point worse because while items, like icons, on the display will be the same size there is now a lot more display area to cover. This makes a new UI even more difficult as you have to build from the ground up to deal with a new resolution.

Assuming a 16:9 aspect ratio for the Kindle Fire your talking a about 20.92"^2 for a 7" display and 33.82"^2 for an 8.9" display. That over 50% more display area. Are you just going to have a black unused border for anything that is different from the 7" resolution? Of course not, you create a UI that can take advantage of this new resolution as display size.

Solipsism, if you want to familiarize yourself with how Android handles scaling, particularly on tablets, here's a link. It's different from Apple.
http://developer.android.com/guide/p...gTabletLayouts
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