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Australian court overturns ban on Samsung Galaxy Tab 10.1, Apple to appeal - Page 2

post #41 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jd_in_sb View Post

Now Samsung is free to have zero sales in Australia.


post #42 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

If that is the case I can't see how you end up at the conclusion that the Galaxy Tab is a copy of the iPad. The Galaxy Tab and the iPad are different in both form and function.

If you had spent any amount of time with Android tablets and the iPad you would know what I mean.

What you can reasonably (and correctly) say is that Samsung copied Apple's market strategy.

I guess that's why the Galaxy Tab hasn't been banned in several jurisdictions...

...oh, hang on.

Samsung aren't out of the woods yet, an injunction pending the main court case was overturned, hearings are still proceeding, including those in the US.
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post #43 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post

Oh please, get off your shaky pedestal and stop spinning this to make it sound like it's for the "consumers".

Simple fact. Company A makes a product, Company B copies it. Company B lets Company A do all the R&D on everything from the product, packaging, presentation, advertisement and shamefully pass it off as their own.

This has nothing to do with what's best for consumers. This is about protecting one's IP, and you very well know it.

You want what's best for consumers? Let Samsung actually design their own products and create a truly unique product and experience. That's consumer choice. That way, we all win.

OMG...come back to reality! Businesses copy each other for EVERYTHING! Apple didn't invent the tablet! They just made one hell of a great product! Now every other business is going to come out with a tablet. It is just good business. Name ONE great product in history that was not copied reproduced or imitated!! You can't because when one company invents or produces a product in a way that captures the consumers attention....more of the same will follow from other companies. It is the bloodline of the free market system. Should Samsung copy Apple products EXACTLY? No they shouldn't and Apple has every right to sue. But you can'r sue on "look and feel" of a product as Apple is doing in this suit. I am not surprised the ban gets lifted. But i think there is a whole lot more to come. This might be the start of more bans being lifted in other countries....

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post #44 of 120
So basically this judge is saying it is legal to copy and steal someone elses invention. Why innovate? Why take risks if others can just steal your work?
post #45 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

So basically this judge is saying it is legal to copy and steal someone elses invention. Why innovate? Why take risks if others can just steal your work?

If it was an exact copy or stolen I don't think they'd allow it. Apparently the judge decided it was neither at this point.
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post #46 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

A person would have to be a complete idiot to look at a Galaxy Tab and an iPad and think they were the same thing.

I'll just leave this here: Even Samsung can't tell the difference between it's tablet and ipad.
post #47 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

So basically this judge is saying it is legal to copy and steal someone elses invention. Why innovate? Why take risks if others can just steal your work?

Actually they are not, what they are saying is that the illegality of any alleged copying in this case, has not been shown sufficiently to justify a ban at this stage.

The legality of Samsung's actions have yet to be determined which will happen in the upcoming main hearing.
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post #48 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Actually they are not, what they are saying is that the illegality of any alleged copying in this case, has not been shown sufficiently to justify a ban at this stage.

The legality of Samsung's actions have yet to be determined which will happen in the upcoming main hearing.

That is entirely correct......there will be a lot more to follow.

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post #49 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Though my Galaxy Tab 10.1 is of a completely different aspect ratio, material composition, and screen resolution than either my iPad or iPad 2, the camera locations are completely different as are the operating systems on which the devices run, and the GT 10.1 doesn't feature a single [HOME] button anywhere on its front surface, in addition to being both thinner and lighter than either of my Apple tablets.

Anyone who could go into a store, see a Samsung Galaxy Tab in a box clearly marked SAMSUNG GALAXY TAB and Android Technology, and still thinks it's an Apple iPad is likely too daft to ever use a modern piece of technology anyway.

So how do you explain the fact that the Samsung lawyer who had probably been working on nothing else for months couldn't tell them apart?
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post #50 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

So how do you explain the fact that the Samsung lawyer who had probably been working on nothing else for months couldn't tell them apart?

because...obviously Samesung did not copy, their product is very different.
post #51 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

A person would have to be a complete idiot to look at a Galaxy Tab and an iPad and think they were the same thing.

Originally, I would have thought it was a stretch to say that they looked identical, but humor me this: Up until early 2007, it was easy to tell the difference between a Blackberry, Nokia, Motorola, Samsung, or LG smartphone. They all had their own little gimmicks that helped to identify them as people were using them. This established each company's brand.

Today, Apple's brand is diminished by the fact that different manufacturer's handsets and tablets look like Apple's flagship phone/tablet. HTC does differentiate some on their phones, and Blackberry still has their own ticks, even with the touchscreen devices.

But, to tell a Samsung Galaxy Tab from an iPad in use by your neighbor, you have to look very closely at the openings on the top (especially when it is in a case). That is the only easily discernible detail to differentiate it. The trim is a little different, but it blends in.

If we don't have products in the market that have their own identity, there will be no further innovation. When other companies copy a unique identity, they should be stopped.
post #52 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

Originally, I would have thought it was a stretch to say that they looked identical, but humor me this: Up until early 2007, it was easy to tell the difference between a Blackberry, Nokia, Motorola, Samsung, or LG smartphone. They all had their own little gimmicks that helped to identify them as people were using them. This established each company's brand.

Today, Apple's brand is diminished by the fact that different manufacturer's handsets and tablets look like Apple's flagship phone/tablet. HTC does differentiate some on their phones, and Blackberry still has their own ticks, even with the touchscreen devices.

But, to tell a Samsung Galaxy Tab from an iPad in use by your neighbor, you have to look very closely at the openings on the top (especially when it is in a case). That is the only easily discernible detail to differentiate it. The trim is a little different, but it blends in.

If we don't have products in the market that have their own identity, there will be no further innovation. When other companies copy a unique identity, they should be stopped.

The Samsung Galaxy Tab clearly 'has its own identity', one quite different than that of Apple devices, as it features a completely different aspect-ratio/screen resolution, is constructed using a completely different materials, has absolutely no [HOME] button anywhere on its front surface, has cameras in completely different locations, utilizes a completely different back panel design, and is both thinner and lighter than my iPad 2.

The differences become even more obvious when one powers up each device to find completely different unlock screens, and Completely Different Operating Systems.

As for your 'neighbor argument': Some of my neighbors still ask my wife if her Jaguar XKR is an Aston Martin, but that says more about their individual ignorance than anything else, which is clearly the case with those who can't tell a Samsung Galaxy Tab from and iPad 2.





Apple's doing little more than trying to block the competition, and it appears that some in the legal system won't support such an attempt purely for anti-competive purposes.
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post #53 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

If something *that* much a copy doesn't get banned then nothing will. Patents are obviously meaningless in Australia. Or those judges think their job is to dispense "fairness." No sorry, it's to dispense justice, i.e. to punish wrongdoers, such as Samsung in this case. So do your job.


Try reading up on patent and trademark law before pontificating and making stuff up.
post #54 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaarrrgggh View Post

Originally, I would have thought it was a stretch to say that they looked identical, but humor me this: Up until early 2007, it was easy to tell the difference between a Blackberry, Nokia, Motorola, Samsung, or LG smartphone.



Not necessarily. Check out the LG Prada, released well in advance of the 1st gen iPhone.


post #55 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack99 View Post

Not necessarily. Check out the LG Prada, released well in advance of the 1st gen iPhone.

First of all, the LG Prada KE850 looks to have went on sale 2-4 months before the iPhone. It's hard to find any official release date as if they were trying to beat the iPhone to market so they were pushing them out the door before they could build up capacity. Before that we have an announcement of the LG Prada the month before the iPhone was demoed, but I don't think we saw an actual pic of it until after the iPhone was demoed.

Secondly, and most importantly, it's a silly argument to claim either company copied the other in such a short time frame and that's without considering how different the HW and UI looks. There is only one reason to bring up the Prada and that's because it was the first smartphone to market with a capacitance touchscreen, but i wasn't multi-touch, something that is highly important to Apple's success in the market.

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post #56 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack99 View Post

Not necessarily. Check out the LG Prada, released well in advance of the 1st gen iPhone.



Too bad this is a lie. the first iphone was shown on Jan 9, 2007. The first (photoshop) picture of the LG Prada was shown on Jan 18, 2007, some nine days after Apple showed a working device, not a picture.
post #57 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

The Samsung Galaxy Tab clearly 'has its own identity', one quite different than that of Apple devices, as it features a completely different aspect-ratio/screen resolution, is constructed using a completely different materials, has absolutely no [HOME] button anywhere on its front surface, has cameras in completely different locations, utilizes a completely different back panel design, and is both thinner and lighter than my iPad 2.

Nice of you to repeat that claim.

Now, where are you going to explain why a Samsung lawyer who had presumably been working on this case full time for quite a while couldn't tell the difference?
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post #58 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

The Samsung Galaxy Tab clearly 'has its own identity', one quite different than that of Apple devices, as it features a completely different aspect-ratio/screen resolution, is constructed using a completely different materials, has absolutely no [HOME] button anywhere on its front surface, has cameras in completely different locations, utilizes a completely different back panel design, and is both thinner and lighter than my iPad 2.

The differences become even more obvious when one powers up each device to find completely different unlock screens, and Completely Different Operating Systems.

As for your 'neighbor argument': Some of my neighbors still ask my wife if her Jaguar XKR is an Aston Martin, but that says more about their individual ignorance than anything else, which is clearly the case with those who can't tell a Samsung Galaxy Tab from and iPad 2.





Apple's doing little more than trying to block the competition, and it appears that some in the legal system won't support such an attempt purely for anti-competive purposes.

You pictures show it truely is a copy. Exactly same curved corners. Exactly same width bevel. Exactly same aluminum trim. Oh, the aspect ration is different. Clearly Samesung innovated there. Of course, their tablets before the iPad looked nothing remotely like this is beyond the point, right?
post #59 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

I hear a clock ticking on Samsung TV dominance.
They'll get theirs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

You wish.

I do. The status quo in TV is currently unrocked. A lazy stasis hangs in the musty air. It's a ripe market for the picking.

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post #60 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

You pictures show it truely is a copy. Exactly same curved corners. Exactly same width bevel. Exactly same aluminum trim. Oh, the aspect ration is different. Clearly Samesung innovated there. Of course, their tablets before the iPad looked nothing remotely like this is beyond the point, right?

Did you know: most people have pictures of their kids in their wallets. DaHarder has pictures of his tablets.

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post #61 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

A person would have to be a complete idiot to look at a Galaxy Tab and an iPad and think they were the same thing.


Apple is targeting a broad demographic. Complete idiots are valued customers., Apple doesn't want to lose them to Samsung. Indeed, Apple is going to extraordinary lengths to dominate the complete idiot market.
post #62 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

So basically this judge is saying it is legal to copy and steal someone elses invention.

That is exactly what he is saying. And therefore, the judge must be impeached.
post #63 of 120
Thank God, the injunction should have NEVER been granted in the first place. I hate the look and feel issues....

Only a complete idiot could buy the Galaxy and think it was an iPad. You cannot stupid proof a product...
post #64 of 120
Someone's sarcasm detector needs adjustment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Firefly7475 View Post

I completely and utterly disagree. The Galaxy Tab isn't a new device category at all.

The Galaxy Tab is definitely Samsung's/Google's take on the same tablet market the iPad is in.
post #65 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

The Samsung Galaxy Tab clearly 'has its own identity', one quite different than that of Apple devices, as it features a completely different aspect-ratio/screen resolution, is constructed using a completely different materials, has absolutely no [HOME] button anywhere on its front surface, has cameras in completely different locations, utilizes a completely different back panel design, and is both thinner and lighter than my iPad 2.

The differences become even more obvious when one powers up each device to find completely different unlock screens, and Completely Different Operating Systems.

As for your 'neighbor argument': Some of my neighbors still ask my wife if her Jaguar XKR is an Aston Martin, but that says more about their individual ignorance than anything else, which is clearly the case with those who can't tell a Samsung Galaxy Tab from and iPad 2.





Apple's doing little more than trying to block the competition, and it appears that some in the legal system won't support such an attempt purely for anti-competive purposes.






Why did Samsung make it 16:9 if the intent was to slavishly copy the iPad? It seems that it would look a lot more like an iPad if it were the same shape as an iPad. As it is, it looks like a stark and distinct choice.
post #66 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

You pictures show it truely is a copy. Exactly same curved corners. Exactly same width bevel. Exactly same aluminum trim. Oh, the aspect ration is different. Clearly Samesung innovated there. Of course, their tablets before the iPad looked nothing remotely like this is beyond the point, right?

Really?

The radius on the corners of my Galaxy Tab are much tighter than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong

The bevel on the Galaxy Tab is considerably more rounded than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong.

The casing of my Galaxy Tab is made completely of HQ plastics, not aluminum... So, Wrong Again!

So... Given the level of complete ignorance you've displayed in your post, it's likely that you don't even own both devices, and until you do, you'll just be another talking-point spewing fanatic with absolutely no idea what you're talking about.





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post #67 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Really?

The radius on the corners of my Galaxy Tab are much tighter than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong

The bevel on the Galaxy Tab is considerably more rounded than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong.

The casing of my Galaxy Tab is made completely of HQ plastics, not aluminum... So, Wrong Again!

So... Given the level of complete ignorance you've displayed in your post, it's likely that you don't even own both devices, and until you do, you'll just be another talking-point spewing fanatic with absolutely no idea what you're talking about.








http://osxdaily.com/2011/08/18/table...fter-the-ipad/

It sure is strange how tablets looked nothing remotely like the iPad before the iPad was introduced, and now all look like the iPad. Oh but it has a slightly different resolution, and a slightly different this or that...obviously it is not a blatant rip off...just a coincidence. Or as the fandroids and microsoft drones like to say, that is how the technology was naturally evolving.
post #68 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Really?

The radius on the corners of my Galaxy Tab are much tighter than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong

The bevel on the Galaxy Tab is considerably more rounded than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong.

The casing of my Galaxy Tab is made completely of HQ plastics, not aluminum... So, Wrong Again!

So... Given the level of complete ignorance you've displayed in your post, it's likely that you don't even own both devices, and until you do, you'll just be another talking-point spewing fanatic with absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

Now Now,

You are bringing logic and reason to a fanboy internet discussion. That cannot be tolerated....
post #69 of 120
[insult removed]

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post #70 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

http://osxdaily.com/2011/08/18/table...fter-the-ipad/

It sure is strange how tablets looked nothing remotely like the iPad before the iPad was introduced, and now all look like the iPad. Oh but it has a slightly different resolution, and a slightly different this or that...obviously it is not a blatant rip off...just a coincidence. Or as the fandroids and microsoft drones like to say, that is how the technology was naturally evolving.

It sure is strange (read: desperate) how you've now changed your argument from 'comparing radii' to the nonsense you posted above.

...and in an effort to elevate you from your current state of complete ignorance, my 2003 Compaq TC1000 'looks very similar' to my iPads, featuring numerous design elements that were, some 7 years later, to appear on the Apple iPad almost verbatim, including a bezel width that is remarkably similar, the exact same corner radii, the same native/portrait display orientation, as well as exactly the same screen aspect ratio and resolution.

...just a coincidence - Most Likely Not. ;-)

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post #71 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

Really?

The radius on the corners of my Galaxy Tab are much tighter than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong

The bevel on the Galaxy Tab is considerably more rounded than my iPad 2... So, You're Wrong.

The casing of my Galaxy Tab is made completely of HQ plastics, not aluminum... So, Wrong Again!

So... Given the level of complete ignorance you've displayed in your post, it's likely that you don't even own both devices, and until you do, you'll just be another talking-point spewing fanatic with absolutely no idea what you're talking about.















I think that a lot of people like the "grid of icons" look and feel of the iPad. All the icons are in neat rows, and all of the folders look basically the same, which adds a lot of comfort and the promise of simplicity.

The Samsung UI is not nearly so simple.
post #72 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

I think that a lot of people like the "grid of icons" look and feel of the iPad. All the icons are in neat rows, and all of the folders look basically the same, which adds a lot of comfort and the promise of simplicity.

The Samsung UI is not nearly so simple.

As one who owns over a dozen iOS devices, I, too, appreciate the simplicity of the UI (and the same configuration can be utilized on Android devices), but there are other times when I just want information at a glance (via live widgets/tiles and the like), which is where my Android and WP7 devices come in.

Of course, your post really has nothing to do with the debate a hand, though your input is still appreciated.
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post #73 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

It sure is strange (read: desperate) how you've now changed your argument from 'comparing radii' to the nonsense you posted above.

...and in an effort to elevate you from your current state of complete ignorance, my 2003 Compaq TC1000 'looks very similar' to my iPads, featuring numerous design elements that were, some 7 years later, to appear on the Apple iPad almost verbatim, including a bezel width that is remarkably similar, the exact same corner radii, the same native/portrait display orientation, as well as exactly the same screen aspect ratio and resolution.

...just a coincidence - Most Likely Not. ;-)



But the iPad is much thinner.
post #74 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

But the iPad is much thinner.

...and my Galaxy Tab 10.1 is also thinner than my iPad 2.

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post #75 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

http://osxdaily.com/2011/08/18/table...fter-the-ipad/

It sure is strange how tablets looked nothing remotely like the iPad before the iPad was introduced, and now all look like the iPad. Oh but it has a slightly different resolution, and a slightly different this or that...obviously it is not a blatant rip off...just a coincidence. Or as the fandroids and microsoft drones like to say, that is how the technology was naturally evolving.

not that picture again ......... all that rugged tablet, seriously?
they still sell it anyway
http://www.panasonic.com/business/to...ughbook-h2.asp




and the Joojoo tablet



post #76 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

It sure is strange (read: desperate) how you've now changed your argument from 'comparing radii' to the nonsense you posted above.

...and in an effort to elevate you from your current state of complete ignorance, my 2003 Compaq TC1000 'looks very similar' to my iPads, featuring numerous design elements that were, some 7 years later, to appear on the Apple iPad almost verbatim, including a bezel width that is remarkably similar, the exact same corner radii, the same native/portrait display orientation, as well as exactly the same screen aspect ratio and resolution.

...just a coincidence - Most Likely Not. ;-)


Sure as hell destroyed that argument.
post #77 of 120
I'm laughing at all the pictures of the corners posted by DaHarder. More picturez won't make that dead horse die any faster. Look, just because this abomination doesn't match a BMW X5 up close, curve for curve, doesn't mean it wasn't a blatant design rip-off.

Sure, you could park one next to a real X5 and say, "you have to be blind to mistake that for a BMW!" But it's still an intentional copy.

From http://www.businessweek.com/autos/au..._mercedes.html

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post #78 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

Sure as hell destroyed that argument.

Thanks - It's a gift...
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post #79 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

I'm laughing at all the pictures of the corners posted by DaHarder. More picturez won't make that dead horse die any faster. Look, just because this abomination doesn't match a BMW X5 up close, curve for curve, doesn't mean it wasn't a blatant design rip-off.

Sure, you could park one next to a real X5 and say, "you have to be blind to mistake that for a BMW!" But it's still an intentional copy.

Desperate (and ultimately fail-laden) stawman argument you're attempting there.

I wasn't the one who initially made all those outlandish claims of 'copying', but I sure shut them down - With Photographic Facts!!
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post #80 of 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaHarder View Post

It sure is strange (read: desperate) how you've now changed your argument from 'comparing radii' to the nonsense you posted above.

And, yet, you STILL haven't explained how the Samsung attorney was unable to tell them apart if they're nothing alike.
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