Originally Posted by caliminius
I know you despise Google, but why do you insist on making stuff up? Google doesn't approve of every Android device. If they did, do you think the Kindle Fire would be on the market which removes most of Google's applications?
Which begs the question, why are you so okay with Apple gathering this data but when it comes to Google, it must be for nefarious purposes. Except that Google doesn't gather this data. The carriers gather this data.
Which comes back to the question, why is it okay for Apple to do this and not Verizon? Since that data is definitely going to Apple. The data Verizon collects isn't going to Google.
Well, actually yes. Not everyone has built up the tin foil hat, orbital mind control satellite conspiracy theories about Google that you have. Or are stupid enough to ignore just how much data Apple has about you. And how much data they continue to collect. I remember that report from earlier this year about Apple somehow changing App Store ratings based on user usage of the apps; Not a single person here questioned how Apple would get such data.
And yet you don't care about the spyware that Apple is using? You already stated you believe that they've moved to an alternative version of CIQ-like software.
Here are the simple facts since you seem blind to them: Stock Android* NEVER included CIQ. Stock iOS has included CIQ but has started to include something different.
Feel free to make up whatever crap you want, but those are the facts.
* and since you seem to need this bit of info: Stock Android is the version that Google creates. It is the only version of Android they are responsible for. They aren't responsible for the changes Motorola or Samsung or whoever makes to the software.
That's pretty amusing stuff you wrote there, but entirely mistaken. (Except for the part about me despising Google.)
Yes, Google does control the Android platform by arbitrarily controlling what an "Android" phone can have installed on it by default. That's what the Skyhook lawsuit is all about.
Several other points you don't understand what you are talking about:
- It's well established that CIQ on iOS is not (if it's still even active) the root kit that Google approved for Android phones. It's also opt-in on iOS, which it's not on Android. So all your points about "Apple is doing it too," "why is it OK for Apple but not Verizon," etc. are just a lot of hot air conflating entirely dissimilar things.
- Next, how do you know Google isn't getting this data? Not directly from your phone, and maybe not from CIQ, but no one knows what the carriers are doing with it. That point exactly is a major part of why this sort of spying is a problem: because we don't know what the spies are doing with the data. So, it's entirely possible that the carriers are passing it on to Google. I don't know that they are, but you don't know that they aren't
- Lastly, you seem to have been in such a passion that you were unable to understand several points:
It's a certainty that Google's Nexus phones come with some mechanism for reporting data back to Google. This, in at least a limited way, is a feature of every modern operating system. Google has indicated through "sources" that they don't use CIQ, but they haven't come out and said, "We don't include any software on our Nexus phones that sends any data back to us."
First of all, they can't make that statement, because it wouldn't be true. Lot's of software on the Nexus phones sends information back to Google. Lot's of software on iOS sends data back to Google. A high percentage of web sites send data about you back to Google. Ditto for Windows and Mac OS X software released by Google.
So, they'd either have to simply lie, or craft a convoluted press release that reeked of bullshit. Probably best to just keep their mouths shut.
But, considering how long people have been hacking their Android phones, and that this CIQ information is just coming out now, it's not unreasonable to suspect that Google's official silence and Verizon's weaselly words are indications that while they don't have CIQ on their phones, they have something equivalent, or nearly so.
Especially in the Verizon case, where they issued a flat denial, then, later, what practically amounts to a retraction of everything but the letter of their first statement, suspicions ought to be aroused that they are in fact doing exactly the same thing with different software. Otherwise, why any need to "elaborate", other than to cover their asses legally. Verizon is definitely using software equivalent to CIQ.
Google is admittedly in a difficult position. Their entire business model is spying on people for their customers. That's, by their own admission, the whole point of Android, to make sure they can keep spying so they can keep selling ads. They are collecting all kinds of information on people all the time. (For example, how many of you have given Google your user names and passwords to certain things? ) They operate through trojans, social engineering and "wiretaps" (Google Analytics) to get access to as much information on everyone as they can.
Clearly they can't issue a PR release saying they don't collect data, including passwords. No one knows if carriers are sharing data with them. They could have their own key logger on Nexus phones, which could be benign or highly malignant. Maybe Google doesn't really need CIQ because they already have most of that data anyway. Maybe they are keeping their mouths shut so the carriers don't start pointing fingers at them. Or, maybe they are just trying to lay low and keep attention away from the data collection we already know they do do.
Whatever the reason, Google's official silence means something. What exactly that is, we may not be sure, but we (which apparently does not include you) do know that they control and approve what software can be installed by default on "Android" branded phones, and the carriers aren't doing this without their knowledge.
Edit: oh, yeah, almost forgot, tin foil hats, hahaha, very funny stuff there.