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Apple accuses Samsung lawyers of stalling in court

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
Apple's legal counsel believe their efforts for an expedited trial in their patent infringement suit against Samsung are being held up by Samsung's uncooperative attorneys.

Apple is preparing a motion to compel Samsung to present more evidence in its case in a California court. But according to Florian Mueller of FOSS Patents, Apple can't bring that motion until it holds a "meet and confer" between its lead counsel and Samsung's.

Samsung's lead counsel, Charles Verhoeven, is in Washington D.C. representing Motorola at a hearing at the International Trade Commission against Apple, and will be involved in hearings until Dec. 16. And by the time Verhoeven returns, it will be too late for Apple to have its motion against Samsung to be heard by the end of 2011.

In August, the court granted Apple's wish for an expedited trial. Currently, the trial is scheduled to start on July 30, 2012, but that date could be pushed back if the case isn't trial-ready.

"There are two timing issues here," Mueller wrote. "The primary issue is that Samsung is, according to Apple, uncooperative with respect to the production of evidence. The second one is that the unavailability and inflexibility of Samsung's lead counsel now prevent Apple from tackling the primary issue through a motion to compel."

In a filing with the court, Apple noted that Samsung has produced very little evidence of late. Apple said Samsung has only produced 71 documents totaling 241 pages since Oct. 13, while Apple has provided over one million pages to the court.

Apple's attorneys said once they receive the documents from Samsung, the Korean-language filings will need to be translated, technical materials and source codes will need to be analyzed, and a detailed history of more than 30 accused Samsung products need to be assembled before Apple's attorneys can travel to Korea and begin depositions.

"If Apple does not receive production of the core design, marketing, and technical documents sought in the motion to compel well before January 2012, Apple's ability to conduct meaningful depositions and properly defend its own witnesses in depositions will be unduly compromised."

Apple's attorneys now hope that Judge Lucy Koh will grant them relief from the meet-and-confer requirement, allowing the lawyers to bring their motion to compel immediately. The Apple legal team hopes that the court will be able to hear the motion on or around Dec. 16, giving them the ability to move forward and potentially meet their own deadlines.

Apple first sued Samsung in April, accusing its rival of copying the look and feel of its popular iPhone and iPad products. Samsung has fired back with its own patent infringement allegations, and the legal battle has since spread across the globe, with each company filing lawsuits against the other in numerous countries.
post #2 of 39
when this s#it is going to stop?!
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post #3 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post


"There are two timing issues here," Mueller wrote. "The primary issue is that Samsung is, according to Apple, uncooperative with respect to the production of evidence. The second one is that the unavailability and inflexibility of Samsung's lead counsel now prevent Apple from tackling the primary issue through a motion to compel."



Dear Apple Lawyers:

When you declare that the game is going to be hardball, don't expect the other side to use a whiffle bat.

HTH.
post #4 of 39
they just need to make up

i keep reading how TSMC is screwing up their 28nm upgrade and it doesn't bode well for the A6 being made by them
post #5 of 39
Samsung's lawyers aren't stalling, they're still trying to figure out which is the Galaxy Tab and which is the iPad.

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post #6 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Samsung's lead counsel, Charles Verhoeven, is in Washington D.C. representing Motorola at a hearing at the International Trade Commission against Apple

How is that not a conflict of interest? Don't Samsung and Motorola consider themselves
to be competitors?
post #7 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2992 View Post

when this s#it is going to stop?!

Lawsuits between technology companies have been going on for as long as there have been technology companies. It's only now that Apple sites like AppleInsider and MacRumors have decided to put every little move on the front page.
post #8 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

How is that not a conflict of interest?

They're both fighting against Apple. Sounds more like an alignment of interests

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post #9 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Samsung's lawyers aren't stalling, they're still trying to figure out which is the Galaxy Tab and which is the iPad.


Probably closer to the truth than not...

But Apple send over 1M pages, let see how fast Samsung can go through that to find what is truly relevant. Apple is playing the inundate them with too much information and Samsung is playing do not share any information.
post #10 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Samsung's lead counsel, Charles Verhoeven, is in Washington D.C. representing Motorola at a hearing at the International Trade Commission against Apple

Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

How is that not a conflict of interest? Don't Samsung and Motorola consider themselves to be competitors?

And I also don't see how "We're busy suing Apple, so we don't have to appear in court to defend against Apple's lawsuit" is an excuse either. FURTHER, I don't see how the court will accept Samsung's claim to only have one lawyer.
post #11 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConradJoe View Post

Dear Apple Lawyers:

When you declare that the game is going to be hardball, don't expect the other side to use a whiffle bat.

HTH.

Exactly....

So basically Apply is pouting when the other side uses the legal system it it's full advantage....
post #12 of 39
i really hate who did it first argument but really apple shouldn't have accused of samsung so negatively and pissed them off.

then, there may be some cooperation.
post #13 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

And I also don't see how "We're busy suing Apple, so we don't have to appear in court to defend against Apple's lawsuit" is an excuse either. FURTHER, I don't see how the court will accept Samsung's claim to only have one lawyer.

it's not that the counsel wouldn't appear, it's more like that it is physically "impossible."
the question is whether that impossibility is created with bad faith.
post #14 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loptimist View Post

i really hate who did it first argument but really apple shouldn't have accused of samsung so negatively and pissed them off.

then, there may be some cooperation.

Blame the now dead Steve Jobs.

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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post #15 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

How is that not a conflict of interest? Don't Samsung and Motorola consider themselves
to be competitors?


I believe Motorola also is one of Samsung's larger clients (#6 or #7 - after Sony, Apple, HP, Dell, Verizon)..
post #16 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by iPedro View Post

Lawsuits between technology companies have been going on for as long as there have been technology companies. It's only now that Apple sites like AppleInsider and MacRumors have decided to put every little move on the front page.

hmm... well, if so, then I can only say that it doesn't look good on the first page. At least, I don't like it.
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post #17 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

But Apple send over 1M pages, let see how fast Samsung can go through that to find what is truly relevant. Apple is playing the inundate them with too much information and Samsung is playing do not share any information.

Not surprising : both tactics have proved to be very efficient to reach the same effect ....
post #18 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2992 View Post

when this s#it is going to stop?!

As soon as you closer your browser. Remember, it's an ongoing lawsuit, AppleInsider is just reporting on it 15 times each day

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
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"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

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post #19 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post

Exactly....

So basically Apply is pouting when the other side uses the legal system it it's full advantage....

I see, a mutual admiration society among trolls. Good riddance to both of you.
post #20 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

As soon as you closer your browser. Remember, it's an ongoing lawsuit, AppleInsider is just reporting on it 15 times each day

Exactly. That why I'm removing AppleInsider from my RSS feed. I get several notifications about damn lawsuits that I could care less about. This isn't AppleLegalInsider
post #21 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by iBill View Post

I see, a mutual admiration society among trolls. Good riddance to both of you.

what of those two comments you referred to is trollish?

Also, what do you think the establish internet definition of troll is?
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by iBill View Post

I see, a mutual admiration society among trolls. Good riddance to both of you.


Why do you think I am a troll?

I own two iPads, Two Macbook Pros, Two Mac Mini's.....

I do prefer Android Phones because they have a few Key features that help me in my work that the iPhones lack. In particular, the ability to download driver/firmware files from the internet and transmit them via USB to my clients computers without having to worry about getting on their WiFi systems. The voice guided Navigation in Android is significantly better than what is offered in the iDevices....

I basically like Apple products. I simply disagree with all of the Look and Feel lawsuits that Apple started.... I think that is hurts innovation and is not enforceable in the long run....

I have to ask. Why is it that Apple fanboys think that an Apple user must agree with ANYTHING that Apple does or they have to be a troll??????
post #23 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

In a filing with the court, Apple noted that Samsung has produced very little evidence of late. Apple said Samsung has only produced 71 documents totaling 241 pages since Oct. 13, while Apple has provided over one million pages to the court.

I guess Apple could have used a really big font size but that's insane. How do they even have a million pages of anything? Maybe they should get their lawyers into software development. They'd churn out some decent Pro Apps in no time. Of course you wouldn't want to use them as the terms of use would be heavily in their favour but feature rich that's for sure.

Geez, it's no wonder Apple's cases are being overturned. The courts probably just don't want to deal with the paperwork.

Judge: Samsung do you have anything to submit to the court?
Samsung: Sure here's a couple of hundred pages.
Judge: Apple?
Apple: Here's a million pages.
Judge: Uh, yeah, Samsung you have a point, case dismissed.

I really hoped something more substantial would come of this court case with Samsung. They've been blatantly ripping off Apple's designs and the courts are doing nothing about it. I can see enough differences to avoid infringement but the intent is obvious. What is more irritating than anything is when the anti-Apple crowd come along and condemn Apple for the court cases suggesting they innovate instead, knowing full well Google ripped them off with Android and Samsung ripped off their hardware design. Ballmer was so smug about this sort of thing too saying that Apple couldn't win the long race, I'm sure it was because he felt innovation was limited and all the competition has to do is keep copying until the innovation dries up and then undercut the price.

That's how business people think. They treat creativity like office supplies. The Asian market seriously needs to get this attitude in order too. Plagiarism has become dangerously embedded in that culture. If Apple can't protect themselves from this, this problem is just going to escalate in future, the more that processing power allows such minimalist designs.
post #24 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

:

That's how business people think. They treat creativity like office supplies. The Asian market seriously needs to get this attitude in order too. Plagiarism has become dangerously embedded in that culture. If Apple can't protect themselves from this, this problem is just going to escalate in future, the more that processing power allows such minimalist designs.


Well said Marvin I think this is the battle of the century. If Western countries can't defend their intellectual property then the likes of Samsung will own the future, And that will be bad. When Samsung no longer has something to copy we will hit global stagnation.
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post #25 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post



I really hoped something more substantial would come of this court case with Samsung.


Maybe if Apple's Army of lawyers would spend a little less time complaining, and a little more time, y'know, like actually working, things would improve.
post #26 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post

Why do you think I am a troll?

I own two iPads, Two Macbook Pros, Two Mac Mini's.....

I do prefer Android Phones because they have a few Key features that help me in my work that the iPhones lack. In particular, the ability to download driver/firmware files from the internet and transmit them via USB to my clients computers without having to worry about getting on their WiFi systems. The voice guided Navigation in Android is significantly better than what is offered in the iDevices....

I basically like Apple products. I simply disagree with all of the Look and Feel lawsuits that Apple started.... I think that is hurts innovation and is not enforceable in the long run....

I have to ask. Why is it that Apple fanboys think that an Apple user must agree with ANYTHING that Apple does or they have to be a troll??????

People who have no intelligence resort to name-calling. To them, the world is black or white. Apple is always the angel in every situation and Samsun is an evil copycat.
post #27 of 39
How few or many Apple products you own is not an indictment or endorsement to whether you are anti or pro Apple.

Your purchases have nothing to do with your complete ignorance of Patent Law and Corporate Law Practices being pulled by DC Lobbyists defending Motorola and Samsung.
post #28 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post

So basically Apply is pouting when the other side uses the legal system it it's full advantage....

Huh? Where did Apples attorneys "pout"? Stop making shit up or ascribing emotions that weren't there.

And if you and the troll ConradJoe think filing standard motions are "hardball" - well, I can see why neither of you are lawyers
post #29 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by DocNo42 View Post

Huh? Where did Apples attorneys "pout"? Stop making shit up or ascribing emotions that weren't there.

And if you and the troll ConradJoe think filing standard motions are "hardball" - well, I can see why neither of you are lawyers

Yes,

When a bunch of lawyers who complain that the other side is stalling ( actually using valid legal tactics) I call it what it is pouting or whining if you prefer...

Also I never said these were not valid legal tactics, I simply said I though it was WRONG for Apple to go after these stupid look and fell law suits to start with... Simply because you can do something DOES NOT make it right....
post #30 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sranger View Post

Why do you think I am a troll?

I own two iPads, Two Macbook Pros, Two Mac Mini's.....

I do prefer Android Phones because they have a few Key features that help me in my work that the iPhones lack. In particular, the ability to download driver/firmware files from the internet and transmit them via USB to my clients computers without having to worry about getting on their WiFi systems. The voice guided Navigation in Android is significantly better than what is offered in the iDevices....

I basically like Apple products. I simply disagree with all of the Look and Feel lawsuits that Apple started.... I think that is hurts innovation and is not enforceable in the long run....

I have to ask. Why is it that Apple fanboys think that an Apple user must agree with ANYTHING that Apple does or they have to be a troll??????

Thanks for the update. It was all too easy in this case to lump you in with the other and I was perhaps too quick to make that judgement.

Nevertheless, I definitely disagree with your views on this topic. Apple has every right to defend their ip vigorously, and I hope that they are fully successful when this legal process runs its course.
post #31 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by iBill View Post

Thanks for the update. It was all too easy in this case to lump you in with the other and I was perhaps too quick to make that judgement.

Nevertheless, I definitely disagree with your views on this topic. Apple has every right to defend their ip vigorously, and I hope that they are fully successful when this legal process runs its course.

Technology yes... Look and feel no... It is just my opinion...I respect your as well...
post #32 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eluard View Post

If Western countries can't defend their intellectual property

Western countries should close all of their unauthentic Asian restaurants. Stop copying others.

Quote:
then the likes of Samsung will own the future, And that will be bad. When Samsung no longer has something to copy we will hit global stagnation.

The Whopper was invented in 1957, and the Big Mac appeared ten years later.... No lawsuits, yet new and better sandwiches are still being made.
post #33 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple In Cider View Post

The Whopper was invented in 1957, and the Big Mac appeared ten years later.... No lawsuits, yet new and better sandwiches are still being made.

If you think that they're in any way related, you need to get something checked out.

Originally posted by Relic

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post #34 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple In Cider View Post

The Whopper was invented in 1957, and the Big Mac appeared ten years later.... No lawsuits, yet new and better sandwiches are still being made.

You're claiming that this:

is a copy of this:

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #35 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

If you think that they're in any way related, you need to get something checked out.

My point was that they are not related. Thanks for backing me up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

You're claiming that this ... is a copy of this ...

Are these more confusing to you?

post #36 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple In Cider View Post

Are these more confusing to you?

You are the one that seems to be confused if you can't tell a Whooper from a Big Mac, if you think Burger King invented the hamburger, if you think a 7" tablet is identical to a 10" tablet, if you think patent infringement has to do solely with look and feel, or if you think Samsung's lawyer couldn't tell the 7" tab from the iPad.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #37 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple In Cider View Post


Come off it. You know that's not the issue here.

Originally posted by Relic

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Originally posted by Relic

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post #38 of 39
In all the threads that we've had on this issue of IP protection not a single Samsung defender has ever made an intelligent point. This hits an all-time low.
AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

I've used macs since 1985 when I typed up my first research paper. Never used anything else never wanted to.
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AppleInsider = Apple-in-cider. It's a joke!

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post #39 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eluard View Post

In all the threads that we've had on this issue of IP protection not a single Samsung defender has ever made an intelligent point. This hits an all-time low.

Who are you? You can say the same thing about Apple defenders. I think I will....

In all the threads that we've had on this issue of IP protection not a single Apple defender has ever made an intelligent point.

See?
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