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Android device activations reach 700,000 per day - Page 4

post #121 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichL View Post

Nokia alone sells 400 million phones a year. Do the math.

That's just another similar figure, it doesn't really help to intuit why so many phones are being sold... I don't know, I guess people must treat them like fashion accessories more than I thought.
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post #122 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:24am
.

Tried to read ALL the Comments here - least scan them

But made me sick after a bit

Yada % Market Share this, yada quarterly profit that

Every damn one of you are stuck on Wall Street/Money Chit

Comparing Autos and Platforms and B.S. ?

Why not add in Stanley Steamers from 100 years ago
Didn't they "own the market" for a while ?

What about Titanic and Ocean Liners?
Didn't they "own the market" for a while ?

Ok, so Microsoft and Dell sold a LOT of computers/software
Their "products" are still shit

Oh, and Roman Numerals - they DID "own the market"
For 1,000 years
Along with Sun going around Earth (yea, some 'buy' anything)
How THAT turn out in long run ?

And of the "given numbers" about activations
Is that in USA, Europe, Globally, or what ?
(700k day in 'El Norte' ain't shit, gimme 7M in rest)

.

Yea, yea ... not the most coherent post, but ...
(in a rush at the moment, sorry)

Imagine "some" of you get the idea

The rest of you go back to Wintel
Count your Monopoly Money, Stock Certificates
Enjoy your moment of glory, your Season in Sun
(come back in 20 years, see how you doing then)

Us Real Apple Folks have work to do

The Global Village awaits

And ALL the Money, Market Share, etc
All the 'tech wannabes' and 'vaporware'
That ever existed will never ever ...

Change the World

.
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post #123 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:28am
When I had a HTC Hero I used to test multiple roms per day in an attempt to find one that was actually any good.

As such I could probably activate my phone several times per week, quite often receiving activation emails. The emails read as if I was activating a new phone.

Just thought it worth pointing out that activation does not mean a phone sale.
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post #124 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryV View Post

Actually Apple's % of all mobile profits last quarter dropped from 57% to 52% while Android's rose 12% to near 40%. After this 700K figure, I would not be surprised if Android is sucking up more % of mobile profits than Apple after the Q4 results. They are growing super fast while Apple has flat lined for almost a year now.

This doesn't make any sense!?

Android is not a company, therefor there are no profits to be counted for. If, however, you are trying to say that the 100 or so companies that release Android devices have now acquired 40% of the world's mobile handset profits, then that's an extremely ridiculous comparison to make against the profit of a single company.

I'm sorry, but a company with a tiny profit margin is not a successfully run company at all. If you are barely making any money on the products you're selling then you are skating on very thin ice... The focus of your company is not producing high quality products, but selling the cheapest possible crap you can get away with. In turn, the people who buy your products will have a very low loyalty rate, therefor you must strive towards flooding the market and hope to grab more market share just to sustain your business.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #125 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

This doesn't make any sense!?

Android is not a company, therefor there are no profits to be counted for. If, however, you are trying to say that the 100 or so companies that release Android devices have now acquired 40% of the world's mobile handset profits, then that's an extremely ridiculous comparison to make against the profit of a single company.

I'm sorry, but a company with a tiny profit margin is not a successfully run company at all. If you are barely making any money on the products you're selling then you are skating on very thin ice... The focus of your company is not producing high quality products, but selling the cheapest possible crap you can get away with. In turn, the people who buy your products will have a very loyalty rate, therefor you must strive towards flooding the market and hope to grab market share just to sustain your business.

I pretty much agree with your comments. I think that particular post was targeted more at some here who post things like "Apple gets 90% of the profits from smartphones so who cares". He was pointing out that it may no longer be an accurate presentation.

melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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post #126 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

No, there's a dozen doubters perhaps looking for some way to brush the statement away.

Google considers an activation to be just what most of us would. You buy a smartphone and have a carrier activate it so it can be used as one. Google's activation numbers don't include resold devices (repeats) or software updates, with each device only counted once. The numbers also don't include any forked versions of Android since they don't have a license to Google services. Asian knock-offs, the Kindle Fire, the Nook Color or any other device not offering a license to Google services aren't counted in their activation numbers.

Are you still confused?

Honest questions:

If Google doesn't participate in the activation process, where does it get "activation" numbers?

How are those numbers verified?

It appears that the only time that Google gets involved is when the customer registers for Google services. If that is true, and some number of users never register -- then Google would never see the devices ( just like forked Android devices).

It is possible that more devices are being activated than Google claims!

It is also possible that fewer devices are being activated than Google claims unless it can verify the "activation" numbers (assumed to be provided by carriers or phone manufacturers).
"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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"So at the end of the presentation, Steve came up to me and said: Is the iPhone worth criticizing? And I said: Make the screen five inches by eight inches, and you’ll rule the world."
– Alan Kay –
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post #127 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Honest questions:

If Google doesn't participate in the activation process, where does it get "activation" numbers?

How are those numbers verified?

It appears that the only time that Google gets involved is when the customer registers for Google services. If that is true, and some number of users never register -- then Google would never see the devices ( just like forked Android devices).

It is possible that more devices are being activated than Google claims!

It is also possible that fewer devices are being activated than Google claims unless it can verify the "activation" numbers (assumed to be provided by carriers or phone manufacturers).

I believe that every Android smartphone activated by buyer uses a Gmail address. If you don't have one, you're assigned one. Perhaps it's linked that way. I'm just guessing.

melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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post #128 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:39am
It does matter that an OS called Android is picking up activations. It certainly matters in market share mentality.

But, unlike Windows, Android is many OS's, and many devices with vastly differing features. And the devices now are not business machines, but personal appliances, purchased by individuals, not computers purchased by purchasing departments in massive quantities with issues such as control, maintenance, infrastructure support. Windows and the PC's were of concern to the Suits.

Phones, tablets, music players are individual appliances that have features of the computers of the past, but they are not computers. They are toasters, watches, flavors of cereal, soda pop, potatoes, and fruit.

It's a mistake to view these personal devices the same as the computers of the past. That's not the world in which these devices exist.
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post #129 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

Well, now it's has come to the point that Apple cannot announce activation numbers anymore. Android is overtaking much faster than anyone anticipated. It seems as though Apple can never get ahead no matter what they produce. Except for iTunes and iPod, everything else flames out or ends up 2nd, 3rd or stuck as a niche player.

Huh? Why does Apple need to announce activation numbers... They have a better statistic, sales numbers. Google can't announce sales numbers because they don't sell Android devices, they have to rely on activations to determine how many Android devices are out there.

You can easily calculate Apple's average activation numbers by using the sales figures they provide at the end of every quarter.

They can never get ahead and end up as a niche!? Let's see...

Number ones...

Smartphones
Media players
Tablet computers
All in one desktop computers
Ultra books
Mobile app store
Digital media store
Customer satisfaction
Market profits
Retail profits
Market value (US)
Hell, even their biggest "flop" is selling better than any other set-top box right now.

Have I left anything out?

Sorry, but Apple has done very well in the markets they target and continues to do so. The only time they need to worry is if their sales start falling year over year... And they so far have been able to predict when that will happen and move to the next market. The iPod is a great example of that. Apple saw the PMP market was saturated and users were moving to smartphones, so they move into the smartphone business and expanded on the iTunes ecosystem.
Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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Disclaimer: The things I say are merely my own personal opinion and may or may not be based on facts. At certain points in any discussion, sarcasm may ensue.
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post #130 of 275
12/21/11 at 7:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BC Kelly View Post

.

Tried to read ALL the Comments here - least scan them

But made me sick after a bit

Yada % Market Share this, yada quarterly profit that

Every damn one of you are stuck on Wall Street/Money Chit

Comparing Autos and Platforms and B.S. ?

Why not add in Stanley Steamers from 100 years ago
Didn't they "own the market" for a while ?

What about Titanic and Ocean Liners?
Didn't they "own the market" for a while ?

Ok, so Microsoft and Dell sold a LOT of computers/software
Their "products" are still shit

Oh, and Roman Numerals - they DID "own the market"
For 1,000 years
Along with Sun going around Earth (yea, some 'buy' anything)
How THAT turn out in long run ?

And of the "given numbers" about activations
Is that in USA, Europe, Globally, or what ?
(700k day in 'El Norte' ain't shit, gimme 7M in rest)

.

Yea, yea ... not the most coherent post, but ...
(in a rush at the moment, sorry)

Imagine "some" of you get the idea

The rest of you go back to Wintel
Count your Monopoly Money, Stock Certificates
Enjoy your moment of glory, your Season in Sun
(come back in 20 years, see how you doing then)

Us Real Apple Folks have work to do

The Global Village awaits

And ALL the Money, Market Share, etc
All the 'tech wannabes' and 'vaporware'
That ever existed will never ever ...

Change the World

.

Is that supposed to be a poem?
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post #131 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:04am
Andy is reporting the numbers for pre-christmas week. This is not representative of the overall performance this quarter. The actual average activation number for this quarter will much less. Max 550k but more likely ~500K or even less given more competition from new iphone and a range of cheap new windows phones.

Note that Andy always quotes activations for all DEVICES, not just phones. Currently Analysts like Horace Dediu expect Apple to sell about 58M IOS devices this quarter. This is about 636K iPhones, iPads and iPod Touche activations per day.
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post #132 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

MacVicta askes "What exactly counts as an Android device? Does it include the Kindle Fire and Barnes & Noble Nook Color?"

Do these count for the activations? What about forked versions of Android in China?

Those are fair questions.

Fire and Nook are not counted. I believe Rubin was referring to activations of units sold by members of the Handset Alliance. Even if I am wrong about this, Google can't even track how many units of Fire and Nook are sold or activated. Not sure about Android in China, but I surmise the same answer applies.
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post #133 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyc1976 View Post

Andy is reporting the numbers for pre-christmas week. This is not representative of the overall performance this quarter. The actual average activation number for this quarter will much less. Max 550k but more likely ~500K or even less given more competition from new iphone and a range of cheap new windows phones.

Note that Andy always quotes activations for all DEVICES, not just phones. Currently Analysts like Horace Dediu expect Apple to sell about 58M IOS devices this quarter. This is about 636K iPhones, iPads and iPod Touche activations per day.

iPod Douche? A follow-up to the iPad?

Oh, Touche.
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post #134 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:10am
It's funny how most are responding to slappy instead of dismissing his comment due to the fact that it's either purposeful flame bait or woeful ignorance.

Also you all doubt Google only because they are Google. No other reason.

And to the poster who mentioned flashing ROMs. The easy way to verify how many times your device was registered is to go into the web market after an initial activation. And take note of the device in the list. Wipe your phone. Flash a ROM. Check again. Same device. The web market keeps a list of all devices registered to your account so if it was reregistering as a different device time and time again you'd have 2. But that's not the case.
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post #135 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:10am
quite the opposite is true in my office. A lot of people (more like all actually) who have droids on VZ are replacing them with iphones. One co-worker switched from T-Mobile to Sprint last friday so she could get an iphone.

I know of only one guy who got 4g droid and he is complaining all the time about the batter life. It is actually getting annoying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skyzlmt View Post

One reason:

4g

At my desk on At&t iphone I get .12mb download on speedtest
my coworker on verizon 4g droid... 12mb. 100x faster than my iphone

Granted the wireless provider is a major factor, but those with iphones on sprint or verizon arent much better. My phone is basically unusable during the day


the iphone wave that ran through my building a few years ago and put 100+ iphones into the hands of my coworkers, is now bringing 4g droid phones
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post #136 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garamond View Post



TROLL

Well the truth hurts. I can understand how users are in complete denial and hate seeing the reality of it all. One brings that information and get called a TROLL is just a reaction to denial.
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post #137 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

And whether this is an issue depends on several other questions including

1. What's the rate of deactivation for each. Returns hurt the bottom line after all.

2. How much does Apple etc make on each phone they sell. That Apple is getting half the number of activations means less if they make 3 times as much on each device

These questions doesn't matter at all. What matters is that Google is activating 700K Android devices daily. Thats huge! The media grabbed a hold of it and its now well known that Android activations are blowing Apple right out of the picture. Its as simple as that.
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post #138 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

Android activations are blowing Apple right out of the picture. Its as simple as that.

Might I borrow a response methodology from one of the other questionable members here to respond to that?

The full content of my response (this post) is as follows:

PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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post #139 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I'm glad it's finally clarified.

How much is an Android-based device worth to Google in ad revenue or how many devices have to get activated before their Android investment breaks even?

If the only revenue source from Android were ad revenue, a long time. As it is, my guess is that Google has made a bundle.

Google gets licensing fees for lots of software from nearly every Android device. Android market, for one, where Google takes additional fees. Google Navigation? All that Googley goodness that most every Android device incorporates? All must be licensed and paid for by the manufacturer.

Look at Google financials. They are not losing money on Android.
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post #140 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

Well, now it's has come to the point that Apple cannot announce activation numbers anymore. Android is overtaking much faster than anyone anticipated. It seems as though Apple can never get ahead no matter what they produce. Except for iTunes and iPod, everything else flames out or ends up 2nd, 3rd or stuck as a niche player.

The iPad has another year left, maybe. As of now, sales are spectacular, and Apple has little competition in that sector. They sell around 59% of all the tablet computers out there.

I see the Transformer Prime and similar tablets eating away at the top end, with cheap ICS tablets eating away at the low end, but the iPad appeals to a wide swath of consumers, and will stay mainstream at least until next Christmas.


And BTW, iPod sales are no longer a huge factor in Apple's bottom line. As of now, they have the iPad as a market leader, and the various different iPhones, which sell very well to the unsophisticated value buyer and to the "newest and greatest, as long as it is Apple" crowd.


The Apple TV will be another big iTouch, like the iPad. It will be hyped as the second coming of TV, and it will sell. iDevices will be necessary as the remote control, and will sell as companion purchases.

Whether Apple remains a market leader in these categories or not, they will continue to prosper.
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post #141 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post




Why wouldn't Apple announce numbers anymore? A respectable second place is nothing to be shy about




But...but, Apple is Number One!

What about that?
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post #142 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Just curious... if you're always so "doom and gloom" about Apple... what are your feelings about RIM or Nokia?

I'm not doom adn gloom about Apple, but I'll throw in some predictions anyways (Hey - anybody working on that prediction calendar?)



Nokia will make large amounts of sales of Win7 phones. They will do OK.

RIM will be gone as we know it within 24 months.
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post #143 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Where did Rubin specifically state most of that?

There was no mention at all of "Google services".

See post #67

melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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post #144 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

It's a nice statistic... but it hardly puts Apple in a corner.

There will be a time lag before the devs start developing for Android first. Maybe 6 months?
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post #145 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Might I borrow a response methodology from one of the other questionable members here to respond to that?

The full content of my response (this post) is as follows:


According to CBS News. Thats no laughing matter. Specially when mainstream news are re-affirming that Android has crushed the iPhone.

"Android crushes iPhone, makes Google $5 billion"

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505124_162-57346049/android-crushes-iphone-makes-google-$5-billion/
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post #146 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post

This doesn't make any sense!?

Android is not a company, therefor there are no profits to be counted for. If, however, you are trying to say that the 100 or so companies that release Android devices have now acquired 40% of the world's mobile handset profits, then that's an extremely ridiculous comparison to make against the profit of a single company.

I'm sorry, but a company with a tiny profit margin is not a successfully run company at all. If you are barely making any money on the products you're selling then you are skating on very thin ice... The focus of your company is not producing high quality products, but selling the cheapest possible crap you can get away with. In turn, the people who buy your products will have a very low loyalty rate, therefor you must strive towards flooding the market and hope to grab more market share just to sustain your business.

I don't entirely agree.

To wit, take a look at this: http://ycharts.com/companies/AMZN/pr...=MSFT,AAPL,WMT

It's a chart that compares the profit margins of Apple, Microsoft, Amazon and Walmart. Quite a discrepancy! Yet, which one of these is an unsuccessful company?

Second, a small profit margin is not all about crappy products. I don't think I need to explain that.

That does not mean profits are not important. But, notwithstanding the slappy rants herein, there is more nuance to the discussion than you are suggesting.
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post #147 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by genovelle View Post



Notice the Mac is back




The Mac never went away. You are bastardizing a marketing slogan used for a marketing session: "Back to the Mac".

The Mac is selling OK, but it is dwarfed by the dominant platform. That has never ever been different. The Mac is a classic niche product. It always was, and it looks like it always will be.
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post #148 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post


, since he likely doesn't care about the non-Google Android devices -- as I stated previously, my contention is that Google doesn't see them, cannot count them, and wouldn't bother talking about them in press releases.

When talking about "subscribing to a wireless service", Rubin was specifically addressing phones under contract, which is IMO quite inaccurate.

.

I see where you are coming from but your logic is out:

"since he likely doesn't care about the non-Google Android devices"

- sure he does , he wants to show that android has a massive market share so people actually start designing better apps for it. Just like ES said in his statement recently.

"When talking about "subscribing to a wireless service", Rubin was specifically addressing phones under contract, which is IMO quite inaccurate. "

if they can only see activations and figures from google services like you say , how are they getting the figures from Asia in the figures in the article below ? they certainly are getting counted somehow and they don't have any google marketplace activations.

it's either recorded at point of sale point - for all andoid devices across countries., (more likely - there are no repeat activations recorded) or the device phones home with IMEI and counted that way. Or can you explain how the Asian numbers are recorded in another way ?

http://209.157.64.200/focus/chat/2667688/posts?page=2
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post #149 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by joindup View Post

Hyundai outsells Mercedes. Which would you rather drive?

To continue the analogy, young members of our family truly hate their Hyundai's, but have to keep driving them because they have to use Crickets for pre-paid gas.

To be fair, my Mercedes 4S has never seen more than a 2Mbps wifi connection since 5.0.1 on any wifi system. Luckily the 3GS continues to work well, so not everyone (the most important member of the family) is pissed. After the "let me research the problem and subsequent hang-up" by Express Support, I'm going to give them a chance and wait for 5.1, otherwise it's off to the Mercedes Bar.

I'm thankful this holiday season for my 4-6Mbps ATT 3G connection... with grandfathered unlimited data.
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post #150 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Solipsism, Andy Rubin was perfectly clear about that months ago. It was never one day. His tweet announcing 500K was "there are now 500K Android devices activated every day, and it's growing at 4.4% w/w".

And here's his tweet.
So I agree he qualified his statement more than I thought. He shows a grow pattern. However, he is not as clear as Jobs statement, or as accurate. Jobs stated a very specific "for the last 30 days" and Rubin claimed a "growing at" which doesn't mean he has to be including anything for the past week and could even be projecting the future growth of Android activations.

Everything from Google execs just seems to be clever statements with multiple meanings. Take Schmidt's comment about releasing a tablet of the highest quality in 6 months. Again, not stating anything that has happened but projecting a future that may never come. And how do you define "of the highest quality"? Surely a tablet that cost $1 million to make is of a higher quality than the iPad but we both know he's talking about a tablet at a particular price point. You can read Amazon reviews of the Fire to see people think it's high quality for a $199 tablet. We can't they just announce unambiguous data for has happened over the past 30, 90 or 365 days? Surely you can see the difference.

"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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post #151 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

According to CBS News. Thats no laughing matter. Specially when mainstream news are re-affirming that Android has crushed the iPhone.

"Android crushes iPhone, makes Google $5 billion"

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505124_162-57346049/android-crushes-iphone-makes-google-$5-billion/

Unfortunately, the article is wrong. First of all, Google itself announced $2.5B in mobile ad revenues, not $5B (which is a wild guesstimate from the author of the article). Out of that, a majority comes from iOS devices, which defeats the thesis of the article itself.

So, the article is pretty much a laughing matter, or rather a laughing stock.

But, not withstanding your inaccurate and hyperbolic rants, people here (and elsewhere) should give Android more dues.
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post #152 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by t2af View Post

I see where you are coming from but your logic is out:

"since he likely doesn't care about the non-Google Android devices"

- sure he does , he wants to show that android has a massive market share so people actually start designing better apps for it. Just like ES said in his statement recently.

"When talking about "subscribing to a wireless service", Rubin was specifically addressing phones under contract, which is IMO quite inaccurate. "

if they can only see activations and figures from google services like you say , how are they getting the figures from Asia in the figures in the article below ? they certainly are getting counted somehow and they don't have any google marketplace activations.

it's either recorded at point of sale point - for all andoid devices across countries., (more likely - there are no repeat activations recorded) or the device phones home with IMEI and counted that way. Or can you explain how the Asian numbers are recorded in another way ?

http://209.157.64.200/focus/chat/2667688/posts?page=2

That's Gruber's and Daniel's guess. They thought (or knew better but wanted you to believe otherwise) Google must be including forked Asian versions since he couldn't otherwise explain the Google activation numbers to some of the Apple faithful. Asian buyers with licensed Android versions have access to their Android Market just as North America and Europe do. Just do a search for "Android Market Japan" or "Android Market Korea" if you're doubting.

melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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melior diabolus quem scies

"No theatrics and no more personal attacks, just stick to the logic and tell me why I don't have any argument ~ Jragosta/2012

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post #153 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

According to CBS News. Thats no laughing matter. Specially when mainstream news are re-affirming that Android has crushed the iPhone.

"Android crushes iPhone, makes Google $5 billion"

And the iPhone makes Apple $10 billion. Your point?
PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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PhilBoogie
That's Google alright. For a stupid company they sure do dumb things.
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post #154 of 275
12/21/11 at 8:58am
Who cares if it's 700,000 per day when half of those are garbage phones? Has anyone here ever been to Asia and seen the boatloads of Android phones they sell there that aren't even running Froyo and are locked to the carrier so you can't even install Apps from the Android Market (the carrier blocks this ability).

These are basically "feature phones" that happen to run Android. This is why developer support is still higher for iOS than Android. Developers know where the money is, and they're not going to develop for a platform where half of the devices sold will never be able to download/install their App.

Apple is on track to post 330,000 activations per day for this quarter (iPhone only, excluding iPad sales). People might look and say that's half of Android, but in reality it's more impressive for several reasons:

- It's by a single company vs dozens of companies.
- They represent high-end devices only, not cheap ass carrier locked phones.
- They represent customers who will actually go out and spend money on Apps - great for devs.

I wonder why they never break that 700,000 figure down by device type of manufacturer/region?

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post #155 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:00am
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Originally Posted by EricTheHalfBee View Post

Who cares if it's 700,000 per day when half of those are garbage phones? Has anyone here ever been to Asia and seen the boatloads of Android phones they sell there that aren't even running Froyo and are locked to the carrier so you can't even install Apps from the Android Market (the carrier blocks this ability). . .

I wonder why they never break that 700,000 figure down by device type of manufacturer/region?

Perhaps because as you said in your first sentence: Who cares? It doesn't affect how you spend your money.

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post #156 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:03am
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Originally Posted by sophace View Post

Do people get some sort of inflated self worth because the company of the phone they buy sells more units? Makes more profit? Has more market share?


Their self-worth is directly tied to the claims they can make about Apple. If Apple is not Number One, then they too are inferior.

And Apple is Number One in a VERY limited world, which is getting increasingly smaller. Apple's first claim to Number One was the iPod. But that market is now dying. Then it was the iPhone. But that is being quickly relegated to second-tier. All they have left is the iPad, but that too is looking like it has shrinking market share.

Apple fans will once again have to accept he scrappy underdog role. But that will be hard to do given that Apple is one of Wall Street's biggest.
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post #157 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

According to CBS News. Thats no laughing matter. Specially when mainstream news are re-affirming that Android has crushed the iPhone.

"Android crushes iPhone, makes Google $5 billion"

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505124_162-57346049/android-crushes-iphone-makes-google-$5-billion/

Does it hurt a lot??
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post #158 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slapppy View Post

According to CBS News. Thats no laughing matter. Specially when mainstream news are re-affirming that Android has crushed the iPhone.

"Android crushes iPhone, makes Google $5 billion"

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505124_162-57346049/android-crushes-iphone-makes-google-$5-billion/


"Oh, and Google is likely also making a bundle on its "free" product -- about $5 billion by a reasonable estimate."

So it's an estimate, not a statement of fact. And where is this reasonable source?

I estimate that Google's revenue from services on Android OS are well below $1 billion.

I estimate that Google is in the hole with Android related acquisitions and development.

I estimate that Google makes more from ads on the iPhone than they do from everything that happens on all Android-based devices.


Analyst's "reasonable" estimates for the iPhone this quarter is 36 million units.

Analyst's "reasonable" estimates for the iPhone in 2012 is 190 million units.

Analyst's "reasonable" estimates for the iPad this quarter is 81 million units.

With an average retail price of about $650 we're talking about $176 billion for 2012 and that's without even counting other iOS based devices Apple activates. You think that might be just a tad higher than $5 billion?

Based on revenue to profit ratios Apple's iPhone 4S bested Google's estimate for the year in just the first weekend. Android is winning¡

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post #159 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:11am
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Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

That's Gruber's and Daniel's guess. They thought (or knew better but wanted you to believe otherwise) Google must be including forked Asian versions since he couldn't otherwise explain the Google activation numbers to some of the Apple faithful. Asian buyers with licensed Android versions have access to their Android Market just as North America and Europe do. Just do a search for "Android Market Japan" or "Android Market Korea" if you're doubting.

DrDroppio makes a strong argument as to why forked versions of Android wouldn't be included (and I'm inclined to agree with his reasoning) but it's certainly not conclusive.

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post #160 of 275
12/21/11 at 9:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post

Those numbers seem a bit high to me. If you add the Android and Apple ones together that means a million people activating a new phone or tablet every damn day. How can that be right? How often do people replace their phones anyway?

If the number was the US only, it would mean everybody here getting a new phone once per year (assuming a population of 365 million phone owners, which is high).

But these are worldwide numbers, and there are 20 times more people worldwide.

So is that one person in every 20 getting a new phone once a year? (J-Rag, please check the arithmetic). Seems likely, or even low, but I don't have enough info for these calculations. For example, I am using very rough population stats, rather than exact phone-owner stats.
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