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Amazon says 2011 was best holiday yet for Kindle family, still won't reveal sales

post #1 of 43
Thread Starter 
Amazon once again on Thursday touted the success of its Kindle lineup, including the new Kindle Fire, but declined to get into specifics on sales figures.

As it revealed earlier this month, Amazon once again said that it has sold more than a million devices from the Kindle family per week in the holiday shopping season. The online retailer went slightly further and said that "well over 1 million" Kindle devices were sold each week in December, but did not give any greater specifics.

The Kindle Fire, Amazon's new color touchscreen tablet, also remains the best selling, most gifted and most wished for product among the millions of items available at Amazon. It's also the best-selling product on Amazon.com's mobile website and across all of its mobile applications.

Sales of the Kindle Fire were followed by the Kindle Touch and entry-level Kindle, making up the top three selling items at all of Amazon. Christmas Day was also the biggest day ever for Kindle book downloads.

"We are grateful to our customers worldwide for making this the best holiday ever for Kindle," said Jeff Bezos, Amazon.com founder and CEO. "And in a huge milestone for independent publishing, we’d also like to congratulate Darcie Chan, the author of 'The Mill River Recluse,' and Chris Culver, the author of 'The Abbey,' for writing two of the best-selling Kindle books of the year."

Those authors both published their titles independently using Amazon's Kindle Direct Publishing, and became the No. 1 and No. 4 best-selling Kindle books released in 2011.

One estimate issued earlier this month said Amazon would ship 3.9 million units of the Kindle Fire during the holiday shopping season. Apple, meanwhile, is expected to have a record breaking quarter, topping the 11.2 million iPad sales it achieved last quarter.



Some have suggested that the low $199 price of the Kindle Fire will have a negative effect on Apple and sales of its iPad, though Apple executives have indicated they are not concerned about the device, which they believe will further fragment the Android platform.

Though the Kindle Fire is believed to have gotten off to a strong start, one usability study found that Amazon's first touchscreen tablet has a "disappointingly poor user experience," particularly for Web browsing and magazine reading. Amazon already issued an update last week to address some of those concerns, specifically input lag.
post #2 of 43
Two Kindle purchases here. One standard and one Fire. So far kids are very happy. Probably $100 spent between them on content, books, movies ect..... My only complaint is that the Fire is associated to my account and credit card with no way of changing that. My Daughter could order without my permission. I know she wont but the threat is still there. I hope they fix that or there is going to be some very upset parents which may result in many returns of the Fire.
post #3 of 43
1 million a week. So 4 million in December. Heck it took Apple a couple of days to sell that many iPads.....

At more than twice the price.
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post #4 of 43
So much for iPad-killer. At best it'll kill the low-end Android tablets.

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post #5 of 43
"Yeah, we, uh we sold the most Kindles we've ever sold."

" Okay, can you tell us how many you sold?"

" No."

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post #6 of 43
Apple should start a program where disappointed Kindle owners can trade in their Fires for iPads. Making Kindle Fire = disappointment is a great strategic move for Apple. Hopefully, it will join the Zune in the graveyard of would-be killers.
post #7 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

My only complaint is that the Fire is associated to my account and credit card with no way of changing that.

So does this mean one can never resell their Kindle Fire?
post #8 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by macFanDave View Post

Apple should start a program where disappointed Kindle owners can trade in their Fires for iPads. Making Kindle Fire = disappointment is a great strategic move for Apple. Hopefully, it will join the Zune in the graveyard of would-be killers.

amazon pulled off a good one on apple. usually it take apple 3-4 years to come out with a low end product in a new product line. amazon beat them to it. next year it's going to be a 10" kindle for $199

it's good enough to do what it's made for for a nice price which is why it's selling
post #9 of 43
I can't wait for Amazon to report earnings. This stock is going sub $100. The PE is astronomical. Yet, the company has no plan or projection to get to a sustainable 10%/yr earnings environment. None

Christ, they still do not even report unit volumes

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post #10 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

One estimate issued earlier this month said Apple would ship 3.9 million units of the Kindle Fire during the holiday shopping season.

I wasn't aware of Apple's new strategy to ship Kindle Fires as well. Boy, do I miss Steve...

Ah, thanks for the correction. Fortunately just a typo.
post #11 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

1 million a week. So 4 million in December. Heck it took Apple a couple of days to sell that many iPads.....

At more than twice the price.

Can you read? That's 1 million "Kindles" not "Kindle Fire".

Sorry, e-readers don't count.

If the "Kindle Fire" sold so well, why not break out the sale numbers?

Simple. "Kindle Fire" sales number are underwhelming.
post #12 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

"Yeah, we, uh… we sold the most Kindles we've ever sold."

"… Okay, can you tell us how many you sold?"

"… No."

"...Well, okay: the ones that we no longer have in inventory...yeah, those are the ones we sold."

Of course, defenders of Amazon will try to point out that Apple hasn't been forthcoming on Apple TV numbers either, but the reality is that Steve wasn't in-the-media's-face tweeting "We sold more of dem!!!" every two months.

FWIW, based on some analysis I read the other day, it looks like a reasonable guess for the Kindle Fire is that it was roughly 40-50% of the Kindle sales...ie, roughly 400K-500K units. That doesn't really put it all that much higher than the first day's sales of the iPad-1.

-hh
post #13 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Amazon once again on Thursday touted the success of its Kindle lineup, including the new Kindle Fire, but declined to get into specifics on sales figures.

Amazon announces sales figures using the Aborigine Numbering System: Few and Many

But, we should be able to reverse-engineer the actual numbers from the next AMZN financials...
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post #14 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Two Kindle purchases here. One standard and one Fire. So far kids are very happy. Probably $100 spent between them on content, books, movies ect..... My only complaint is that the Fire is associated to my account and credit card with no way of changing that. My Daughter could order without my permission. I know she wont but the threat is still there. I hope they fix that or there is going to be some very upset parents which may result in many returns of the Fire.

I bought two Kindle Fires for each of my kids too. No threat of running the card up though; the kids can't even find them half the time because they are always using mine and the wife's iPads and have dropped the kindles someplace.
post #15 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radjin View Post

I bought two Kindle Fires for each of my kids too. No threat of running the card up though; the kids can't even find them half the time because they are always using mine and the wife's iPads and have dropped the kindles someplace.

As Weekend Update on SNL so presciently reported, "This holiday season, the Kindle Fire is expected to be a very popular gift choice among 'parents who always buy the wrong thing.' "
post #16 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by DESuserIGN View Post

As Weekend Update on SNL so presciently reported, "This holiday season, the Kindle Fire is expected to be a very popular gift choice among 'parents who always buy the wrong thing.' "

Spot On!

Then, there's this via Gruber:

People Who Didn't Get What They Wanted For Christmas
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post #17 of 43
Have you heard of anyone boasting about his beautiful wife but hiding her in the attic and refuses to introduce her in public? Amazon must be one of a narcissistic husband going out for cheap publicity in a moment of drunken stupor with his buddies but does not dare to prove the claim.
post #18 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post

So does this mean one can never resell their Kindle Fire?

No. I can dis-associate the Fire. I could do that too my Daughter but we share an extensive Kindle library and that would cut her off. I do not see her selling it anytime soon though, she really likes it. The size is a big plus for her. She is 14 and likes the ability to slip it into her purse. Kids are simple sometimes.
post #19 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radjin View Post

I bought two Kindle Fires for each of my kids too. No threat of running the card up though; the kids can't even find them half the time because they are always using mine and the wife's iPads and have dropped the kindles someplace.

Sorry you did not know your kids well enough to know the things they want or like. Waste of $400.
post #20 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Amazon announces sales figures using the Aborigine Numbering System: Few and Many

But, we should be able to reverse-engineer the actual numbers from the next AMZN financials...

Has any manufacture announced sale numbers? I see tons of third party speculation but no manufacture numbers.
post #21 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Has any manufacture announced sale numbers? I see tons of third party speculation but no manufacture numbers.

Apple announces both sales numbers and channel inventory for most key products at every earnings call.

Sales == sales to end users and sales to resellers.

Channel Inventory == weeks of inventory at, or in transit to resellers.

For high-demand products (like the iPhone 4S with 1-2 week delivery) the Channel Inventory is essentially 0 -- it gets sold to end users as soon as it is received at the resellers.

So, iPhone 4S sales ~= sales to end users.

For other products, you can calculate the sales to end users ~= Beginning Channel Inventory - Ending Channel Inventory + Sales.
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post #22 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Has any manufacture announced sale numbers? I see tons of third party speculation but no manufacture numbers.

Here's a phrase you can search for: "Apple 10-Q". Once you get there, search for "iPad sales" within the document.

Heck, it's audited too!

Why are your Android people so hesitant to provide actual data? What do you think they are hiding?
post #23 of 43
undisclosed sales = disappointing sales
post #24 of 43
Sales have probably been good for the kindle fire. It is the most popular kindle and they must have sold at least 4 million kindles in December so that would probably put the Fire's numbers at least at 1.5 million during the month. Definitely more successful than any other tablet launch sans the iPad.

The thing that will probably be more telling is what the return rate is. If the return rate is as high as some of the scuttlebutt out there, this will not have been a very successful launch for Amazon from a profit perspective. The next Amazon earnings report will be interesting to see.

Neal
post #25 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Two Kindle purchases here. One standard and one Fire. So far kids are very happy. Probably $100 spent between them on content, books, movies ect..... My only complaint is that the Fire is associated to my account and credit card with no way of changing that. My Daughter could order without my permission. I know she wont but the threat is still there. I hope they fix that or there is going to be some very upset parents which may result in many returns of the Fire.

So basically, Amazon hasn't even broken even with your purchase as they probably lost much more than $100 between the two devices when factoring in opportunity costs (costs of money), general overhead, sales marketing, distribution, shipping, warranty, returns, etc. etc. etc. Now factor in that the $100 you spent on top of the devices only returns a 2-3% margin and they have a long way to go. Also, basically what you are indirectly implying is that it's a good device for kids.
post #26 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave K. View Post

So does this mean one can never resell their Kindle Fire?

Good question!
post #27 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

but declined to get into specifics on sales figures.
but declined to get into specifics on sales figures.
but declined to get into specifics on sales figures.

post #28 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by studentx View Post

Can you read? That's 1 million "Kindles" not "Kindle Fire".

Sorry, e-readers don't count.

If the "Kindle Fire" sold so well, why not break out the sale numbers?

Simple. "Kindle Fire" sales number are underwhelming.

Maybe they are following Apples lead, Apple doesn't split their sales numbers either.
post #29 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Here's a phrase you can search for: "Apple 10-Q". Once you get there, search for "iPad sales" within the document.

Heck, it's audited too!

Why are your Android people so hesitant to provide actual data? What do you think they are hiding?

Does not list this Decmeber numbers, the ones this article is talking about. PS - Fire is Android based but is not an Android device. Figured you would know that.
post #30 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


Here's a phrase you can search for: "Apple 10-Q". Once you get there, search for "iPad sales" within the document.

Heck, it's audited too!

Why are your Android people so hesitant to provide actual data? What do you think they are hiding?

Holy hell.... Apple's revenue from the iPhone in 2011 was... $47 billion



Which puts iPhone profit at roughly $28 billion for the year.


From a cell phone!!!
post #31 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfanning View Post


Maybe they are following Apples lead, Apple doesn't split their sales numbers either.

Apple doesn't split the numbers in a line of products... but at least they give the total number!

To my knowledge... Amazon has never given sales numbers.
post #32 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeRange View Post

So basically, Amazon hasn't even broken even with your purchase as they probably lost much more than $100 between the two devices when factoring in opportunity costs (costs of money), general overhead, sales marketing, distribution, shipping, warranty, returns, etc. etc. etc. Now factor in that the $100 you spent on top of the devices only returns a 2-3% margin and they have a long way to go. Also, basically what you are indirectly implying is that it's a good device for kids.

Its a great device for kids, not sure why that is funny. It is cheap, does what they want and simple to use???? I am not a big fan of little fingers on my expensive iPad. As for everything else you mention, pure speculation on your part.
post #33 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


Does not list this Decmeber numbers, the ones this article is talking about. PS - Fire is Android based but is not an Android device. Figured you would know that.

You should get Apple's December numbers in January at their quarterly earnings call.
post #34 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

To my knowledge... Amazon has never given sales numbers.

Which is why I wonder how this is a suprise with the Fire? They never post but yet seem to be doing ok.
post #35 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

You should get Apple's December numbers in January at their quarterly earnings call.

Great, doesnt help with this article.
post #36 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

Which is why I wonder how this is a suprise with the Fire? They never post but yet seem to be doing ok.

Of course they are doing OK. I'd just love to know what kind of data Amazon has to give the SEC.

I mean... if Amazon did get in trouble with something... they'd have to report it, right?

Apple breaks down their form with all their different product lines and services... it's very specific.

Because Amazon is primarily a retailer... is their form simpler?

*searches for Amazon 10-K form*

No mention of Kindle sales or revenue numbers... the only time Kindle is mentioned is in the notes.
post #37 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


Great, doesnt help with this article.

Well... I don't have a f****** time machine... or else I'd help you.

I guess you're SOL
post #38 of 43
Bu-huu, why won't Amazon tells us how many Kindles Fires they sold, so that we can troll, whaaa...

I am also curious, but I don't care about the exact number. It seems that they are doing all right. The number of reviews on amazon is steadily growing, the score has gone up a notch (3.9 average), and the 1 star reviews continue to be submitted by nitwits who didn't read the product description.

Apparently the recent software update addressed most of the previous complaints about usability.

Also, a bit off-topic, there is a VERY simple way to prevent kids from buying stuff with the Kindle Fire, just remove the stored credit card number from your Amazon account. How hard can it be to type in the number again when you want to buy something?
post #39 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Apple doesn't split the numbers in a line of products... but at least they give the total number!

To my knowledge... Amazon has never given sales numbers.

Which is exactly the same thing since the product range varies so greatly in price (especially the iPods)
post #40 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Well... I don't have a f****** time machine... or else I'd help you.

I guess you're SOL

I do
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