Why Android isn't gaining on Apple in the Enterprise - Page 2

Too bad that the data included personal use items...pretty worthless.

Tech media is often very uneducated. This media forms the minds of most tech users.
"Apple is closed. MSFT/Google is open".
"Viruses exist on PC because its the most popular platform".
"Apples antenna gate" "Apple uses slave labour".
"its normal to have a firewall on you phone"

As a security export I would never allow Android phones into my company. Apps are installed as Root on the devices without password.. This means that its impossible to make these devices secure. Unix/Linux have been secured, without spyware/viruses since 1960. It took Google to make it insecure.

Either Google needs to start to approve apps that are installed or the media should start to educate users. Something is fundamentally wrong when users are asked to have firewalls on their phones.

The last surveys done about Android phones are that over 5% are infected by spyware/malware. Over 12.5 million devices!
PC have 70%+ that are infected by Spyware/malware/viruses.

People need to know that is not acceptable or normal. Unix is as near 100% secure there is. In OSX viruses (that does not exist), spyware, malware, scare ware can only be installed with the user actively supplying the Root password. If users are so uneducated that they give programs admin password, there is nothing that can protect them.

Android is totally unsecure + Google is data mining everything since they make money on advertising. Apple/MSFT/Oracle/IBM don't need to data mine since they make their money from OS/hardware.

Facts
"Apple is closed. MSFT/Google is open".
Every single MSFT phone only works with WindowsOS. Every Android only work with Android. Just as open as iOS. Google have many app stores and many hardware vendors. That is not openness since you still are locked to using Android. Then we have every single Android vendor that adds its own customization to the Android device to lock them into that specific brand of Android. I can't switch from a HTC to a Samsung and transfer al my apps without problem = this not open.
No platform is open. Its just smoke and mirrors.

"Viruses exist on PC because its the most popular platform".
No. Viruses exist on PC since Windows is bad. Microsoft make their money on people having to upgrade their OS every 24 month. Since Microsoft have a monopoly on OS for non Apple machines they have no incentive to make a good product. Make to good of a product and people won't upgrade. Add to that the root of almost all viruses: Internet Explorer that let program install without asking the users. That every windows had ISS installed by default and was wide open and that people used Outlook/Exchange. These 3 programs are the reason for almost all virus. Windows is also totally wrong programmed since a user have to be administrator to be able to use all programs/install them. On real computers people SU to administrator during the installation process of a program, but the rest of the time you are an ordinary user.

"Apples antenna gate"
All phones have antennas. If you cover them with your fingers, the signal quality will drop. The problem with Apple was that they marked exactly where the antenna was. BTW. AT&Ts problem in US with their 3G net is because they only use 1/3 of the cell density that they should use. I know, since I worked as security chief non PC for the company that delivered most of the cell towers.

"Apple uses slave labour"
Exact the same factory that Dell, HP and other companies use. Never that you hear that they use slave labour. Media hates Apples success since they don't understand it.

"its normal to have a firewall on you phone"
No. If you are allowing people to install program without password the programs needs to be monitored/approved. Without that, the platform can never technically be secure.

BTW. "Apple is doomed, their stuff is to expensive"
Every week I read many experts and analyst say this. But the same analyst never complains that BMW is more expensive then Skoda. The fact is that Apple last years have done things so cheaply that "PC" have problem to compete on price. Just look at tablets/ultrabooks. Sure. You can sell millions of Tablets with a huge loss, but never at the same price as Apple and actually make money.

"The company appears to be backing out of the Mac OS X Server business ... Steve Jobs, who enjoyed the luxury of being able to develop custom IT solutions at Pixar, NeXT and within Apple as he turned the company around."

This begs the question - In Apple's "custom" IT solution at Cupertino, what do they run in the backend? I'm not thinking of the iCloud servers, but rather servers for their in-house network. I'm presuming it's still Mac OS?

Probably anything and everything. You can see a variety of implementations on the various Apple websites. You will see some jsp which probably isn't running Mac OS X. There was even some Coldfusion running on one. I also saw some that were likely running Rails. Could be Mac or Linux. I don't think they standardized on Mac Servers but likely do have plenty of them. They make Windows software and Exchange compatible apps so Windows server would be required for that. I would be willing to bet there are a fair amount of Oracle/Solaris databases deployed as well.

I think Oracle 10g is available on Mac OS X. But I can see good reasons a more true-blue Unix server or Linux server would be better. You think it'd be Solaris? This is logical after Oracle's acquisition of Sun. But Apple's use of Oracle predated that. What would be a *natural* Linux strain for Apple? And would they have abandoned that for Solaris after the Oracle acquisition because of friendship between Jobs and Ellison?

You think Apple uses Exchange for internal email?

I have no idea because I am not inside Apple... Let's consider their accounting platform first.

Good odds the master financial platform is Oracle. Mas90, SAP, MS not likely. Maybe QuickBooks since Steve was friends with Intuit CEO Being friends doesn't really factor in when you are making business purchasing decisions concerning major computer platforms so being friends with Larry is a very minor consideration IMO. But Oracle is best run on Oracle Solaris hardware and software, again in my opinion.

LOL on the Linux *strain* It is not a virus. Maybe distro, flavor, version. Probably RedHat since Apple usually goes first class, professional all the way. Not that the others aren't great too but RH has the infrastructure and is not IBM.

If Google cared that Android had sub-par enterprise-level security and management tools, they would have worked hard to fix it ASAP. They obviously haven't, after 4 major versions of Android. It's obvious that the enterprise market isn't important enough for them to do the work.

And why isn't the enterprise market important to Google? Because Google only cares how many eyeballs see ads on Android. 96% of Google's revenue comes from ads, and it doesn't matter whether their mobile ads are served up on personal devices or employer-provided devices. The ad metrics are all Google cares about.

I wouldn't be surprised if corporate IT managers told Google that a "kill all ads" setting was mandatory, along with IPSec, Exchange Server support etc. before they could consider deploying Android devices in their companies. And of course, Google wouldn't want that. They'd expend all that effort on designing, coding, testing, and supporting security, VPN, and Exchange and get no ad revenue from it. A lose-lose proposition for them.

So instead they're just punting. They don't care about corporate customers, so corporate customers are ignoring them.

Google does care about corporate customers which is why they have put a lot of effort into their office compatible Google docs and GMail projects. The amount of email that corporate users send is huge and Google wants that email to go through them. Maybe they are holding out for the bring your own device to take root, hoping IT managers will relax their standards about personal phones in the workplace.

As I stated in another thread the other day I work for USB in Switzerland. We currently made a large purchase of Android tablets over the last two months. We found the Android platform to be more compatible to our infrastructure and programming languages. Not to mention mounting network drives is a breeze, plus a file manager is a must.

Since the Android programming language is very similar to Java we were able to export many of our trading tools and trade monitors very quickly. The Bloomberg terminal also has many api's available for it that we can use with Android that are just not available for iOS. We got the idea from our American offices as the NYSE, CBOE, NASDAQ and many others use custom software on Android tablets.

Android is also open giving us the ability to rewrite the start page with a LDAP Oracle login. Something that was impossible with the iOS. The open OS also allows us to lock down or remove functions in the settings panel, such as only allowing our intranet network to be used.

I'm sure their are apps that can do some of the things we need but USB prefers to use custom software. Android is just the better platform for companies wanting to make custom solutions in house. Which is mostly every large corporation in the world including governments.

We also deploy iPads as well, the sales division and our executives prefer them. All though we do have a large request for those Asus Sliders, the tablets with the built in keyboard. They are becoming very popular in every division.

Not only do they care but they have been so helpful in customizing Android 3.2 for our infrastructure. They have awesome corporate service as long as you are willing to pay. I think Android will be the tablet OS of choice for many large companies and governments in the future.

I love my using my iPad for music creation and games and I would never replace it as my home tablet. As far as work goes tbough I prefer using my Android hybrid tablet its more like a PC and most of my co-workers feel the same. So why cant both platforms exist, Apple for the consumer side and Android for the corporate. Why does the Apple iPad have to do everything well.

For the majority of businesses that allow iOS within their walls it is done either out of a need for the iPad or pressure from management to allow.

My company (think top 50 global) allowed iphone only to connect to a webserver and is bringing in iPad2 for marketing (good fit). It is not allowed inside the main firewall. That is currently allowed only to RIM and corporate pc's.

That was a push from 2010 and 2011.
However, due to the prolific expansion into use by management and business professionals, they are bring Android devices (2.3.5+ phones, 4.0+ tablets) into the fold this year.

The big driver appears to be time.
Apple has had about a year longer to integrate into the business mind than Android.
With the wealth of great devices and LTE it is surpassing iOS in this arena for personal devices.
Win8 - will likely be a game changer but notnlikely till 2014 - most corporate IT plans a year in advance.
The big unkown: what will the next gen iphone bring if the design change is revolutionary, not evolutionary.

Will be interesting

This is an extreme example. Not everyone who steals a phone is a jail breaker, considering there are few out there in comparison to the everyday user and thief.

I know for a fact the guy who stole my iPhone used it to watch "UP" on Netflix. After that I finally got to the Apple Store to have it wiped. He said it was just an iPod Touch now, without anything but the basic apps.

We're doing the same, their was a huge exodus from RIM in November and December. Everyone now has either the Samsung Galaxy SII or the Samsung Galaxy Note as their smart phone. We tested the iPhone and WP7 before coming to that conclusion. The iPhone was to exspensive and to depended on iTunes for updates so that was a no brainer but the WP7 devices were defiantly on top of our list. We came to the same conclusion you guys did not ready till 2013 or 2014. So we all got Android phones which I have to say wasn't a bad idea. I really like my new Galaxy Note. So much so I also replaced my Apple iPhone 4 when my contract was up but I only got a one year so i can get a iPhone 5 when that's released.

A lot of your comments don't add up so please clarify.

1) You say "everyone" so this is something you tested internally for work?

2) You tested all this but were unaware about upgrading iOS from the device sans iTunes.

3) You think the iPhone is too expensive but are claiming the Galaxy Note is not too expensive despite costing more?

4) You did no testing or assessment of costs and effort to prevent security issues, rogue app updates, installs, etc.?

Good points. I was also wondering how his iPhone 4 contract was already up. Maybe they offered a one year in Switzerland. I don't know I guess it is possible. in the US the two year contracts begin expiring this coming June.

Yes internally at work.

Yes the IT department knew of the iTunes limitation but the upper brass still requested the iPhone to be added in the testing lot. We obliged of course.

The Galaxy Note costs 480 chf per unit, the iPhone unlocked costs 720 chf. That was with discounts you can pick up the Galaxy Note at any shop here for 550 chf, 200 less then the iPhone. Check out this site www.digitec.ch, its a very computer shop. Apple iPhones are the most expensive phones.

We are aware of most security flaws but since Samsung has released the source code for their phones we were able to remove the market app and the function to install any foreign apps. There is a list of pre- approved apps that can be installed and if you want an additional app all you have to do is make a request and the IT department will install it for you. This platform is new to us and we will learn as we go. We are also working closely with Google to assure we have the best security solution possible, this includes virus checkers. The exchange server is also not on the internal network.

At the end of the day we loved the open OS and the ease at which we were able to adapt current network.

We have one year contacts for all phones its the law. Check it out for yourself go to www.orange.ch or www.swisscom.ch or www.sunrise.ch. The sites can be changed to English. We also have unlimited internet as a feature. You guys have LTE though but who cares if the iPhone can't use it right.

Go to this link to check out the one year contract.
shop.swisscom.ch/onlineshop/Pages/ProductConfig/ProductConfig.aspx?cat=OS_iphone4s&lang=EN&int-campID=BI_OS_IP4S__IP4SVORBE_SON&id=00000000001005 0234

I've not heard of your company, what does it do?
Do you have a web link?

You can choose to ignore emerging technology (like many fanboys) or you can be in the thick of it and realize there's more to the world than Apple. It is attitudes like yours (and Apple's) that allowed Android to take over the iPhone market share almost overnight. On second thought, keep it up!

That's ironic coming from somebody who posts only about Android with no mention of other systems like Windows Phone and Blackberry OS.

There's more to the world than just Android!

In most countries, the opposit is true. In the UK, an unlocked 8GB iPhone 4 will cost you £429, a 16 GB 4S will cost £499. An unlocked Galaxy Note will cost you £610 (Source: CNET UK).

I have checked in many other countries (USA, Singapore, India) and found Galaxy Note to be more expensive than iPhones. In fact iPhones are more expensive than only the cheap crapdroids, not the better Androids from Samsung.

Lovely. What an efficient way to increase cost and bottlenecks. You dedicate so much resource and effort into something which you do not need spending. Wondering how long can this mess up with shareholder's money will be tolerated. A little awareness about this costly solutions to non-existent problems destroyed RIM.


So, I as a user, need to go to my IT for installing Apps which are not "Pre Approved". Excellent "Open" system. Keep your doors open 24/7 so users can flood in.



Do you realize these two points contradict? An open system should not force you to consult with the creator.

You already have the same Enterprise solutions with Apple. May not be in Switzerland but in most important countries.

You guys hate Apple for being Control Freak? Do you hear the old English proverb - Pot calling kettle black?

lol... don't bother.

obviously apple is doomed. that guy provided more "evidence". hilarious... he is trolling right?

I actually hope some Corporate Executives see what these IT experts are doing - messing up with resources. I mean, things might improve they do not exist. All they care about is keeping users in the dark ages. No wonder Dark and Black is synonimous. That's why Blackberry was their favorit tool.

Can anybody answer why a corporate IT team needs to work closely with Samsung and Google (read waste resources) to ensure a virus/malware free environment where users can download and install Apps without fear when Apple already creted this for them?

Oh stop Im not trolling I'v been on this site for more then 11 years I have been a loyal fan of Apple products ever since my Powerbook 100. I am simply stating that our company has chosen Android as our platform of choice. We did this because of the open architecture the deals we get on bulk purchases and the ease of administration. We are not the only company either that's going in this direction this thread was about Apple not having to wory about Android in the corporate arena and I beleive they do have something to worry about. Just talking Switzerland now please show me a large company that has chosen the iPhone as their phone of choice. Its still Blackberry and now Android.

http://www.ubs.com/ch/en.html its the largest bank in Switzerland and ranks number 15 in the world.

The obsession of IT speaks to working around its own prospect of doom.

And that may imply buying time through a partnership with like-minded, and just as ill-fated through IP litigation and loosely knitted approach, ...deleterious Google. ITs may find security in kindred spirits, just as you matter-of-factly and defiantly do, but there are no excuses for decision-makers, unless they look for quick fixes for their own job security's sake, to push the obvious 'future-proof' option aside.

Your contemptuous disregard for your employer's honest interest is a testament to your instinct for self-preservation. So kudos to your immediate job security if not to your Corporative idealism... nor to your respect for factual integrity; indeed iOS no longer requires tethering to iTunes for upgrades ...since October 2011 actually.

No corporation in its right mind should, by definition, mingle with a systemic hoarder of data and organic core non-believer in privacy ...unless of course privacy let them access even more privileged data for some future shameless trade opportunity. How very Swiss indeed! Swap tax haven with information haven, money with data, and there you go, ...a marriage threesome Google/Switzerland/USB made in 'havenly' heaven.

No wonder Apple's prospects in the Swiss market aren't what they should normally be; the 'closed system' is too impervious to trading in ...hushed out data manipulation.

It would be interesting to see a graph showing fortune 500 companies phone of choice. I wonder if Blackberry is still top dog.

Als I said, "pretty impossible", not impossibly.
I believe you have three tries before you get a timeout or another hampering measure.

J.

And one day I might win the lotto. :-) Yes innovative ideas can come from anywhere but putting them into effective use gets harder and harder as things get bigger. Danger was bought by MS and crushed. Siri was bought by Apple and is now a core feature. Innovation is a lot like developing the greatest lug nut for a car.... but if no automakers will use threads on their wheels that fit your lug nuts, you are out of luck.

Just a thought,
en

I know UBS very well.


You failed to properly spell the name of the company you claim to work for in your posts, three letters you will see day in, day out, yet seem to cope fine with NASDAQ, NYSE.

It's this very basic error which inclines me to doubt the veracity of your posts.

Unfortunately, if you truly work for UBS, then we readers have to wonder what else you are getting wrong there,
when you can't get the three letter company name right?

>> I can guess here is that the Appeal of Android is the same that Windows used to enjoy; it's NOT user-centric. That means the IT department has permanent job security and has the company by the balls.

It sounds like he has done his homework, however, and they have something that WORKS FOR THEM. But if the cannot keep up intensive development -- their CUSTOM PHONE is essentially going to force them to buy OLD hardware because they will be stuck on ONE VERSION of the Android OS -- making such a custom phone seems to me a recipe for staying PUT.

>> It's just a corporate culture that doesn't want the staff to do ANYTHING but pre-approved, IT smothered, and draconian security policies. I've worked at a financial services company like this and it took a year for us to get a half backed videoconference going. There was no joy or creativity you might possibly have on a computer, or even walking down the halls. Fine for office drones but I was in Multimedia/Marketing -- trying to give people the impression that our company was "cutting edge". They've since downsized most of the company (they gobble up smaller ones) so it's just as well that everything runs off their server in another state. Seriously, Word and Excel are moving data over a few thousand miles and actually running off a server and your computer is a glorious encrypted "cache" -- though why would anyone want to steal our IP?

Did they HEAR about dumb terminals and perhaps a VAX? Why have desktop computers and laptops if all you are doing is a glorified web service? Save money and run everything off of Google's servers and just hire one guy to create Widgets in Google+ -- you've saved millions and nobody need worry about losing their business secrets -- there are none.

I'm sure a company like this would run the Phone off a Virtual Server. They used to drive people insane with a super slow VPN to get email, which likely cost a large fortune to pay the per minute costs -- all this so they could use the "low cost hardware."

Companies are installing iPads and iPhones based on superficial "it's cool" syndrome from the Executives -- let's not deny that. RARELY are business decisions like this REALLY about technology as the geeks are relegated to a closet, and the CEO hires people who like Football.

ON the other hand, companies that are making CUSTOM ANDROID PHONES, are likely anal, security intense, joy-less black holes of monitored work that will suck the life out of you in two years or less.

Out of all the companies to work for that could be much more impressive I chose a bank. Get over it I switched two letters around once at 03:00 am on a Monday morning. You know what you win the iPhone is the best option for all the companies in the world. Gosh your petty your almost as bad as those who post about mistakes in peoples grammer. You knew what I meant don't be such a d**k about it. I can't tell you how many internal emails I've read in the last 4 years with UBS being spelled as USB. It's a common mistake. One finger is faster then the other when typing big woop. Man you pissed me off, I have better things to do then make up fantasy jobs and if I did I would have chosen something more intersting then a bank. Ooooh congratulations you found me out I'm really a fry girl at a local McDonalds.

if you knew what I meant in the first place why did you have to say anything. Anytime someone says anything negative about Apple or recommend a product outside of the Apple line up their is always a person like you who studies that persons post and looks for the dumbest reason to discredit him. Congrats man you found me out I'm a horrible speller you know it's hard enough for me to even type in this language let alone express my true feelings towards people like you so I'm just going to say. If you don't have something constructive to say please keep it to your self.

Wow, you're so rattled by my post, I hope you're not in a position where you meet people from outside the company, you'll leave them with a poor impression of the bank and potentially lose clients and money.

We in this forum now know there's somebody who works for UBS in Switzerland who's quick to become abusive merely because his post is challenged and not taken at face value.

As for bad spelling and grammar, it's a barrier to effective communication, which can have severe consequences.

If you type "I work for USB in Switzerland" how is the reader meant to work out that you actually work for UBS?
After all, you could be working for the Universitätsspital Basel (University Hospital in Basel), which is known as the USB:
www.usb.ch

Going back to topic, I can't help but wonder if a lot of software is buggy as a result of coders' poor spelling of the languages used to create applications. Yes, most coding tools can auto-correct spelling and syntax, but it's not perfect and can even introduce errors.

Actually, if you go through the article you will realize that now companies are NOT choosing the devices (Android or Blackberry or iOS) their employees will use, they allow employees to make that decision.

Users no longer willing to tolerate the craps you IT guys fed them.

Wait are saying that users are throwing back their free business phones from the company that pays their salary's because their upset at the lack of free choice. Look I personally don't care which smart phone my company chose for our company as far as I'm concern they all get the job done. Receive emails, check, answer email, check. I just cant believe a user would get so upset over the free phone they got. Yes their are rules that go with that new phone like you cant install all the software that suits you but that's to expected. You can play Angry Birds on your private phone.

The unfortunate thing about corporate IT is that a lot of time and resource is spent by the rest of the organisation adapting to how the IT people want them to use the equipment and software, rather than as it should be, the IT people adapting the systems to how people work within the organisation.

Yes, all the different smartphones can retrieve email, but each have their own little characteristics, surely an employee will be most productive with the system they're most familiar and content with?

Any car in good working order gets you from A to B safely, yet we have many manufacturers, each offering many different models.

Messing around with making custom ROMs for sending and receiving email is akin to building a custom car from scratch merely for travelling from A to B.
It's a waste of time and resource when there are so many suitable solutions available ready made "off the shelf".

Man I hate car analogies but using one for the spirit of your response. What if you car requires the ability to be amphibious or be able to cross the hard and tedious terrain of Antarctica. There is no Ford dealership in which you can walk in and purchase said vehicle you have to build it yourself our find a private organization that can build it for you. I don't know of any fortune 500 company's that use 100 percent out of the box solutions. They either build the solutions they need that aren't available on a shelf at Best Buy themselves or go with a firm to do it for them.

Plus I never said we were creating a custom email solution but a custom login for our Android tablets to securely log into our trading network. Currently there are no out of the box solutions out there for what needs to be done as this is a custom piece of software and server ware to begin with.

So its not a waste of time to develop this . Please never assume you know what your talking about unless you have all the facts. Guessing isn't really helpful for anyone.

Enterprise customers create custom apps for their ipads all of the time. And no, you don't need itunes in any way.

Oh I'm sure they do but Android offers more choice in programming languages. We are using Ruby, Python, PHP, Java, and soon Pearl. Plus you have full control over your data with filemanagers and terminals in which you can use traditional cli commands like cp, mv, awk, rm and so on. In fact we were able to compile and install pretty much every cli command we use on our Oracle/Solaris servers and workstations onto the tablets. Which is imortant when you have a script that get's data from a mounted drive which can be done on the OS level, appends to the data, then saves it.

The coolest thing was when we got X11 working, we can now display every tool we have that is on our Unix system. Plus with Citrix you also get a Windows enviroment when needed, yes their is also a iPad version but it is not as feature rich. Plus you are limited when you need data from your local drive. The iPad only had access to one directory, the Citrix diretory it makes. Android on the other hand has full access to the entire drive.

The iTunes thing is farely new and we made our descision before this fix. You still need iTunes for some tasks though. We really went with Android due to other banks and exchanges using it. We contacted quite a few firms who also went threw the same ordeal. Our traders are now using them on the trading floor replacing Windows tablets we had there.

The iPad's are great but for the consumer. Yes they do offer functionality that can be benificial to companys but not all of them. Why can't people just except that Apple can't do everything with just one device. iOS is a great phone OS but it needs to be more like OSX for the tablet version. The iPad has already cannibalized the entire Mac line so there is no excuse for not making the iPad OS more powerfull.