CNN investigates Foxconn iPad factory conditions, Apple responds - Page 4

It would be nice to have the jobs in he USA but that won't happen.

It was said that she was making a dollar an hour. So how much more would the same product cost if made here in the USA? Being very conservative say 5 times as much. Who would buy the higher priced products?

I assume you have first hand knowledge and proof of your allegations of course?

If you're going to work 60 hours per week, would you rather do it on salary or hourly? I know when I worked as hourly, I'd have LOVED 60 hours per week.

Furthermore, you're completely ignoring the fact that Apple does a better job of policing suppliers than anyone else in the industry.


Why are you making a joke of it?

Please show us evidence that other companies make fewer demands on FC than Apple.


Sorry, the NYTimes stopped being responsible journalism about 3 decades ago.

Aside from that, I've read dozens of articles on the subject. Furthermore, I've traveled extensively in China. I've also purchased and sold items to China. I guarantee that I know more about the subject than you.


In a heartbeat. If I lived in China and there were no opportunities for my kids but backbreaking farm labor at $.20 per hour or a Foxconn factory job for $.80 per hour, I'd absolutely be encouraging them to take the factory job.

The problem is that you're incapable of understanding local conditions. Try traveling in China some time and see what a plum these jobs really are. That's why they have thousands of people lined up trying to get them - and even complainers like 'miss chen' don't quit and go somewhere else.


And, yet, suicide for Foxconn workers is lower than the national average. If you want to use suicide as your metric, then Foxconn employees must be pretty happy.


Evidence? Oh, yeah. You're just making things up.


I believe it's called 'delusion'. On your part.

I'm sure Apple is a demanding customer, but I haven't seen anything that suggests that they're any different than anyone else. In fact, it has been established that Apple will pay for things that others will not. Apple also pays in advance - which lessens the pressure on suppliers.


First, I don't believe you're a business owner. But let's say you are. Should we take 50% of your profits and give it to your suppliers? If not, why should Apple give a portion of its profits to suppliers?

slightly or lowering profit margins
Are you 10 years old or are you just totally clueless when it comes to economics and finance?

Just watched the CNN video. "Miss Chan" is a college student slumming with the working folks. Used to see a couple like that - whining on the shop floor every summer. Usually, daddy found them a tidier place to work.

Yep, but it wasn't really Nikes responsibility to make sure their sneakers weren't made by child labor either, but I'm glad they put a stop to it, and if Apple end up forcing Chinese suppliers to give their workers a better deal, I'll be happy about that too (nb: I'll happily pay more for my Apple products if that is needed to make it happen).

Apples ability to change working practices in other countries is huge. If they tell Foxconn to change a practice or they will take their business to someone else who will follow Apples guidance, Foxconn will change.

Governments don't always need to legislate good behavior - everyone can take part in it.

Keep the educated people away from the workers who don't know better. And while we're at it, make sure to filter out internet content relating to human rights and labour laws. Ignorance is what greases the machine.

Eggs Ackley! (© R. Crumb)

That's the point--IF there is no legal consequence to it, FOXCONN will NOT do anything at all--that is why laws exist to DETER crimes...laws are made to CHANGE negative behaviours--and even if Apple tells FOXCONN to shape up, IF Foxconn knows there is no existing Chinese LABOR LAW violations for it...do you think they will BOTHER TO CHANGE??? NOT AT ALL!!!

Gee, you missed the point, homeboy. I did feel bad after saying that, because it's an insult to animals, so my apologies to them.

I was referring to your usual scurrilous tone and contempt for civil discourse, which I know is meant to reflect badly on those who use this forum. What bothers me most is that international readers who don't get the cynicism of your program just conclude that Americans are pigs. Oops, there I did it again. Sorry, pigs.

If Apple tells them to do it, yes, I guarantee they will change. If it's change or lose the contract, they will unquestionably change. I think you underestimate how much power a company the size of Apple has over it's suppliers.

And her 83c per hour @ 6 days per week seems to be just above the national average for similar jobs in the entire country. They aren't being underpaid or overworked compared to others in their country.

You'd make Norma Rae proud.

But it's not gonna happen.

You show a complete lack of understanding of the supply chain in the electronics business, as well as overhead costs for infrastructure. Since Apple uses outside contractors, it would be up to those same type of contractors to determine that the US was an economically viable place to open up shop and that just is not the case. Period.

Before moving o/s and working for CNN Stan Grant was the presenter on an evening tabloid "news" program here in Australia. He has done some decent journalism on public broadcasters like SBS and the ABC, but it's not unusual to see him doing this kind of story, unfortunately.

It seems there are alot of things that you don't know.

To be honest, I'd rather be an intelligent and informed pig wallowing in 5 feet of mud as opposed to a liberal. My apologies to all cockroaches out there.

Have you read Tim Cook's email and Apple's commitment regarding 'suppliers' responsibility'--well APPLE has been doing EVERYTHING POSSIBLE FOR A COMPANY TO DO--and yet FOXCONN IS STILL guilty of exploitation--it will continue to do so, UNLESS THERE IS a genuine LEGAL CONSEQUENCE FOR FOXCONN from the CHINESE government!

Foxconn knows that Apple totally relies on them for manufacturing--so Foxconn has power over Apple right now...ONLY when Apple has an ALTERNATIVE way of manufacturing their products, that Foxconn can be controlled by Apple...right now the upper hand is Foxconn. and only the Chinese government can straighten Foxconn out!

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. Good points though.

Agree 6000%. Many people in the US don't even understand the meaning of quality of life.

This could be an interesting debate. Do we define our purpose to make for a more enjoyable life for ourselves or are we working as whole for something greater for the species. Surely there are some who would say that 35 hours a week is excessive and it's easy to argue that the closer you get to not working (when you are capable) the more egocentric you are.

Still, we need to define working. Can you not have a paying job and still be working? Do we consider Van Gogh as working on his art/passion/insanity in his later life when he was painting or is that his entertainment? Are aspiring writing working or playing? I think it's hard to say but I do think it's wrong to say that one culture is better or worse than another because they are different. Saying Americans addicted to money seems to be fall into that category simply because the normal work day is 7 hours instead of 8. In any case it can't be determined by that one metric.

Not making light of any of the problems with chinese workers, But where is Foxconns culpability and the China's responcibiliy in all of this? Its pile on Apple time, it seems to be the fashion nowadays!!

Why dont we point the finger at the others MAJOR COMPANIES THAT HAVE PRODUCTS MANUFACTURED AT FOXCONN?

LIKE THESE WELL KNOWN CORPORATIONS:

Foxconn manufactures products for companies including:
(country of headquarters in parentheses)
Acer Inc. (Taiwan)[27]
Amazon.com (United States)[28]
Apple Inc. (United States)[29]
ASRock (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Asus (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Barnes & Noble (United States)[citation needed]
Cisco (United States)[30]
Dell (United States)[31]
EVGA Corporation (United States)
Hewlett-Packard (United States)[32]
Intel (United States)[33]
IBM (United States)[citation needed]
Lenovo (China)[citation needed]
Microsoft (United States)[34]
MSI (Taiwan)[citation needed]
Motorola (United States)[31]
Netgear (United States)[citation needed]
Nintendo (Japan)[35]
Nokia (Finland)[29]
Panasonic (Japan)[citation needed]
Samsung (South Korea)[36]
Sharp (Japan)[citation needed]
Sony (Japan)[37]
Sony Ericsson (Japan/Sweden)[38]
Vizio (United States)[39]


One of foxconn's plants to have problems with suicide attempts was a factory making X Boxes. Where is microsoft in this. Where are the articles denegrating microsoft?

Look at the above list and you will find that there are a ton of asian companies also using foxconn.
Why arent they being publicly maligned?

Im so sick of this one-sided myopic view of a problem.

The fact is that not one of the major corporations listed above EXCEPT Apple do anything about this.
Apple has done more to help and at least try than all of the rest of the above companies combined.

Quite right too that Apple should lead the way, since Apple is the richest and best run company on the list. What we don't need is a bunch of pious prannies from the media putting them down for it.

I can guarantee that in any workplace, anywhere on Earth, that you'd find a "Miss Chen" who'd whine about conditions.

Now what will 80c buy in China?

How much does food cost there?

University fees, textbooks, houses and land, clothing, electricity, etc, etc, ad infinintum.

$1 in America is not the same as $1 in China.

Apple deserves the scrutiny.

They have 100% of their production in China and a majority of their production done by one company, Foxconn.

Not only that, they had the most profits out of all the tech companies by taking advantage of the situation in China. They deserve to get scrutinized.


You dont know that. Apple likes to publically boast about their situation.

This will be fun. Defend this implication that other tech companies make less money because they choose to hire more expensive laborers in other countries.

We can compare the cost of Apple products:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/c...-pay-70pc.html

Wages at Foxconn were 900 renmibi per month and changed to 2,000 renmibi per month.

An iPad in China costs 3,688 renmibi.

US minimum wage is around $7 per hour so for a 60 hour week would amount to $1680 per month.

An iPad in the US costs $499.

So an iPad in China costs 1.5x their monthly salary and an iPad in the US costs about 0.3x their monthly salary.

Say that each puts away 10% per month to save up for an iPad, the Chinese worker has to save up for 18 months and the US worker has to save up for 3 months.

Some other salary figures are noted here, some lower than RMB 2,000/m:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...&postcount=119

The lowest salary appears to be in Chongqing at RMB 710-850 per month:

http://understand-china.com/?manufac...ng-labor-costs

The lowest US salary is probably around $5/hour.

Now let's say that Apple gives each employee that works on their products a 100% bonus. Not all 500k workers will work on Apple products but say 100k. 100k x RMB 2000 ($317) x 12 months = $380m per year. This allows their own workers to save up for an iPad in 9 months, which is at least within the yearly product cycle. Give them a similar discount to US employees and it's even sooner.

In leading by example (which I have no doubt they are already doing), this will encourage other manufacturers to offer the same incentives.

And I bet my cost of living is far higher than hers. How much her income translates to in American currency is a non sequitur unless you can also produce figures showing the cost of living in her local economy.