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Apple attacks Motorola's efforts to block iPhone 4S using standards patents, asks for huge damages - Page 3

post #81 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

They supposedly need to get Google's blessing for new legal actions and probably any new pledges or contracts that might materially affect Motorola's liabilities or assets prior to the closing of the sale, which would be logical.

The suit against Apple is not a new action. There would be no reason to assume that Google could order Moto to stop their legal actions that were committed to prior to Google purchase offer.

Does that make sense?

It might make sense, but it doesn't mean that is true, or that your interpretation of new action is as narrow as you want to make it. Complaints and responses are in constant change prior to trial, which can substantially alter the substance a case which a potential suitor would want to protect against, as can court rulings which may strengthen or weaken a case.
post #82 of 213
Apple to Google: "You can either give us $12 billion or you can give us Motorola in exchange. Oh, and one more thing... If you give us the $12 billion then we'll use it to sue your ass into history but if you give us Motorola in exchange then Android is history. Y'all have a good night now."
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post #83 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

It might make sense, but it doesn't mean that is true, or that your interpretation of new action is as narrow as you want to make it. Complaints and responses are in constant change prior to trial, which can substantially alter the substance a case which a potential suitor would want to protect against, as can court rulings which may strengthen or weaken a case.

Why would they be allowed to meddle with old business or management of everyday business decisions at Moto when there's realistic chances the purchase won't even happen, needing approval from a lot of different authorities including those in China, Israel, Taiwan, the US and the EU? Think of the possible ramifications from Moto stockholders if Google were to order an end to any actions against Apple but never follows thru with purchasing the company? Or worse, they order Moto to ramp up the lawsuits, then say adios and back out of the deal if the heat from Apple gets too hot. It makes no sense and therefor probably isn't true that Google's calling all the shots.

But if you want to hold on to the teeny tiny possibility that this is all Google's doing, Moto's shareholders are being deceived by the evil Google who is secretly in control and use it to cloud your thinking it's your choice of course.
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post #84 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

In the back room at Google:

Okay... if you carry the two and subtract 5 and then multiple it by 7 and then add 4... hmmm... "Hello, Motorola, we've just been crunching the numbers and we've decided that it will cost us less if we just pay you the $2.5 billion and back out of the deal. Oh... and good luck with that thing you have going with Apple. Bye."

... and that wouldn't shock me at all.
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post #85 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Oddly silent indeed since the last quarterly earnings report.

He'll be back when Apple "doesn't meet expectations" next quarter or if Samsung overtakes Apple in yearly "sales" again.

Yeah, Google miss and Apple got a huge earning. Poor Slappy. So much for Android having 98% market shares by the end of 2012.
post #86 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rmb0037 View Post

I love how honest Qualcomm is

Motorola sent a letter to Qualcomm stating their intentions. In the letter was a note which stated that a copy of this letter was also being sent to Apple Inc. The phrase "copying Apple" should be expanded as "copy of this letter sent to Apple".

If Motorola was in fact copying Apple, the company would be producing superior products resulting in high profits at substantial margins. If the Motorola product under examination was as essential and superior as Motorola wishes, Apple would have paid the requisite fees to use it.

Cheers
post #87 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Your will fit right in with communism and socialism. Listening, preaching and practicing only the words and life styles of those from above. Never questioning and raising issues.

This board need people like myself to help generate the clicks and posts to help generate ad revenues.

Gayest. Justification. Ever.

You're not here because we need you.

You're here because you need us.
post #88 of 213
After reading the various responses to my early post, I have no choice but to conclude this is the biggest group of elite assholes I have ever met. After 18 years of Internet flamefests, that's an achievement.

And we honestly wonder why there are people who want Apple & its supporters to fail.
post #89 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Fueller is talking crap like he always does.

He fluffed about the Oracle case in how it will severely damage Googles case.

90+% of the suit brought by Oracle was dismissed.

Fueller is all talk, no walk.


To Apple: The FRAND issue is in Germany, not in California.

This is just Apple's attempt to get something in the door in its home town as all the others have failed.

If this case shows that Apple did in fact have a license then Motorola has committed perjury by stating that they didn't in order to mislead the German courts and committed fraud by obtaining a benefit by deception i.e. having Apple products banned from sale.

Mueller REPORTING on cases is easily separated from his opinion.

In the words of Jobs, regarding the case in California, "This changes everything".
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post #90 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

In the back room at Google:

Okay... if you carry the two and subtract 5 and then multiple it by 7 and then add 4... hmmm... "Hello, Motorola, we've just been crunching the numbers and we've decided that it will cost us less if we just pay you the $2.5 billion and back out of the deal. Oh... and good luck with that thing you have going with Apple. Bye."

It is actually $12.5 billion. Looks like this lawsuit settlement will cost them at least that much more to settle. Moto deal is going to drain $25 billion with nothing to show for. Music to my ears.
post #91 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caccamucca View Post

It is actually $12.5 billion. Looks like this lawsuit settlement will cost them at least that much more to settle. Moto deal is going to drain $25 billion with nothing to show for. Music to my ears.

Not true.

Google now owns that awesome 'Hel-lo Mo-to' ringtone.

If that isn't value for money then I don't know what is.
post #92 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by sippincider View Post

After reading the various responses to my early post, I have no choice but to conclude this is the biggest group of elite assholes I have ever met. After 18 years of Internet flamefests, that's an achievement.

And we honestly wonder why there are people who want Apple & its supporters to fail.

Here's your original remark and every response:


Quote:
Originally Posted by sippincider View Post

Why is Apple filing in California over problems in Germany? Makes as much sense as filing in Spain over problems in China.

I'm no legal expert, but I kinda doubt CA courts have the jurisdiction.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grouty2 View Post

If I understand this correctly this is about contracts between American companies (Motorola, Qualcomm and Apple) where one company (Motorola) is trying to rescind parts of a contract it signed with a second company (Qualcomm) as it applies to a third party (Apple).

Of course you are correct that a Californian court would have no jurisdiction over legal processes in another country. I think they can tell an American company that it is breaching a contract signed in America. Like you I'm no expert though. Perhaps there are real lawyers on here that might offer an opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Realistic View Post

I agree you are not a legal expert and are clueless in general as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

The lawsuit involves three US companies over matters that have implications both in the US and abroad. Further the contract at issue was likely signed in the US. As such, jurisdiction is proper in any US Court. Apple picked the one in California, as that is the jurisdiction most favorable to it. If Apple wins a judgement, foreign courts through reciprocity agreements will have to honor the judgement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

"I'm no legal expert ...." How true! So, now, why do you have an opinion?

See paragraphs 4, 5, and 6 of Apple's complaint.

The next time you comment on legal matters, please certify that you have completed a law degree and have expertise in the issues of Federal jurisdiction law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galeforce View Post

The contract between Motorola and Qualcomm is probably in California law

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

This is a separate lawsuit from the one in Germany.

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post

Because they aren't so much filing the suit over the suits in Germany as combatting the underlying game. Which Motorola likely intended to file in other countries but just hadn't done yet.

Add to this that patent suits aren't as restricted when it comes to jurisdiction and the fact that all 3 players are companies that are doing business in the US (plus Cali is Apple's home state) and it's not that illogical.

So out of 7 responses, exactly two were snippy in a pretty typically internet way, while 5 were level-headed thoughts on the nature of the case.

And from this you conclude "this is the biggest group of elite assholes I have ever met. After 18 years of Internet flamefests, that's an achievement.

And we honestly wonder why there are people who want Apple & its supporters to fail."

I don't think you can hide behind your (pathetic) "everybody hates you so there" nonsense. You're just a lunatic, and thin skinned one at that.
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post #93 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by sippincider View Post

After reading the various responses to my early post, I have no choice but to conclude this is the biggest group of elite assholes I have ever met. After 18 years of Internet flamefests, that's an achievement.

And we honestly wonder why there are people who want Apple & its supporters to fail.

Hmmm...

...after reading this I can only reach the conclusion that the firewalls are pretty effective in the convent you must live in...

...now hurry along, Mother Superior is calling you to prayer.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #94 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

But if you want to hold on to the teeny tiny possibility that this is all Google's doing, Moto's shareholders are being deceived by the evil Google who is secretly in control and use it to cloud your thinking it's your choice of course.

Who knows who's pulling whose strings.

It's interesting that this letter terminating all licensing with respects to Apple arrives January 11th 2011, just seven days after Motorola split into two companies on January 4th 2011. It looks a lot like Motorola was setting up an exit strategy from its' mobile business. A cynic might conclude this was a strategy aimed at duping a particular prospective buyer into believing Motorola Mobility had concealed worth far grater than it's quarterly losses suggests. Had Motorola considered this a legit and profitable action, why split the company in two?

Regardless of when Google's involvement begins, both the $12.5 billion purchase price for MMI and the (6 x normal) $2.5 billion reverse break-up fee would seem to suggest Google bought into this legal action holus-bolus.
post #95 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by some internet dude View Post

It may be a profitable company, but recent FBI files tell a story that Apple will lie steal and cheat to get there way. Plus they don't give a crap about the way there OEM factories are run. So a few people committed suicide, that's ok as long as we get our products made that's all that matters. They almost went under once it will happen again.

Bet you didn't know that the suicide rate at Foxcon is almost identical with the Chinese national average. I know that won't change your attitude but still...
post #96 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

I'm reminded of a poem.

I hope Motorola enjoyed stepping into Apple's web, fraudulently preventing the sale of Apple products, even if it was only for a few hours is not likely to go down too well with the courts.

That's appropriate!.

It is odd, that I was reminded of another poem:


The Duel

The gingham dog and the calico cat
Side by side on the table sat;
‘Twas half past twelve, and (what do you think!)
Nor one nor t’other had slept a wink!
** The old Dutch clock and the Chinese plate
** Appeared to know as sure as fate
There was going to be a terrible spat,*
***** (I wasn’t there; I simply state
***** What was told to me by the Chinese plate!)

The gingham dog went “Bow-wow-wow!”
And the calico cat replied “Mee-ow!”
The air was littered, an hour or so,
With bits of gingham and calico,
** While the old Dutch clock in the chimney place
* *Up with its hands before its face,
For it always dreaded a family row!
***** (Now mind: I’m only telling you
***** What the old Dutch clock declares is true!)

The Chinese plate looked very blue,
And wailed, “Oh, dear! What shall we do!”
But the gingham dog and the calico cat
Wallowed this way and tumbled that,
** Employing every tooth and claw
** In the awfullest way you ever saw –
And, oh! Ho the gingham and calico flew!
***** (Don’t fancy I exaggerate –
***** I got my news from the Chinese plate!)

Next morning where the two had sat
They found no trace of dog or cat:
And some folks think unto this day
That burglars stole that pair away!
** But the truth about the cat and pup
** Is this: they ate each other up!
Now what do you really think of that!
***** (The old Dutch clock it told me so,
***** And that is how I came to know.)
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post #97 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

We only allow Slappy to troll here. You're not welcome.

Where is Slappy btw?

AI declared Slapppy as a 2-3% dividend.
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post #98 of 213
Android seems to be an illiterate product, as they only have numbers to show for.
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Android seems to be an illiterate product, as they only have numbers to show for.
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post #99 of 213
Or...

The sons of the Prophet are brave men and bold
and quite unaccustomed to fear,
But the bravest by far in the ranks of the shah,
Was Abdul Abulbul Amir.

If you wanted a man to encourage the van,
Or harass the foe from the rear,
Storm fort or redoubt, you had only to shout
for Abdul Abulbul Amir.

Now the heroes were plenty and well known to fame
in the troops that were led by the Czar,
And the bravest of these was a man by the name
of Ivan Skavinsky Skavar.

One day this bold Russian, had shouldered his gun
and donned his most truculent sneer,
Downtown he did go where he trod on the toe
of Abdul Abulbul Amir.

"Young man," quoth Abdul,"has your life grown so dull
That you're anxious to end your career?
Vile infidel know, you have trod on the toe
Of Abdul Abulbul Amir.

So take your last look at the sunshine and brook
And send your regrets to the Czar
For by this I imply, you are going to die,
Count Ivan Skavinsky Skavar."

Said Ivan: "My friend, your remarks in the end
Will avail you but little I fear...
For you ne'er will survive to repeat them alive...
Mr. Abdul Abulbul Amir."

Then this bold Mameluke drew his trusty skibouk,
Singing, "Allah! Il Allah! Al-lah!"
And with murderous intent he ferociously went
for Ivan Skavinsky Skavar.

They parried and thrust, they side-stepped and cussed,
Of blood they spilled a great part;
The philologist blokes, who seldom crack jokes,
Say that hash was first made on the spot.

They fought all that night neath the pale yellow moon;
The din, it was heard from afar,
And huge multitudes came, so great was the fame,
of Abdul and Ivan Skavar.

As Abdul's long knife was extracting the life,
In fact he was shouting, "Huzzah!"
He felt himself struck by that wily Calmuck,
Count Ivan Skavinsky Skavar.

The Sultan drove by in his red-breasted fly,
Expecting the victor to cheer,
But he only drew nigh to hear the last sigh,
Of Abdul Abulbul Amir.

There's a tomb rises up where the Blue Danube flows,
And 'graved there in characters clear,
Is, "Stranger, when passing, oh pray for the soul
Of Abdul Abulbul Amir."

A splash in the Black Sea one dark moonless night
Caused ripples to spread wide and far,
It was made by a sack fitting close to the back,
of Ivan Skavinsky Skavar.

A Muscovite maiden her lone vigil keeps,
Neath the light of the cold northern star,
And the name that she murmurs in vain as she weeps,
is Ivan Skavinsky Skavar.
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #100 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

4. Rectum scan using FaceTime (supposedly far more accurate than a retinal scan).

That would actually be AssTime - "our new amazing rectal scan technology with asshole recognition" (said in my best Phil Schiller imitation)
post #101 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katsudon View Post

That would actually be AssTime - "our new amazing rectal scan technology with asshole recognition" (said in my best Phil Schiller imitation)

You must be careful when calling tha parents
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post #102 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacTel View Post

Everyone just needs a hug. If we did more hugging in business we wouldn't have these problems. Come to reasonable cross licensing agreements and move on please.

The technical term for hugs is FRAND -- Fair, Reasonable and NonDiscriminatory -- which is what Motorola agreed to and Apple is suing for.
post #103 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by leeeh2 View Post

And best line ever, "Say hello to my little FRAND".

Yep.

Concerning the damages, I imagine they could only ask for damages caused as a result of the product removal from the stores:

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/03/...la-patent-win/

I don't think it lasted long but could still amount to hundreds of millions given how many products they sell. I wonder why the 4S wasn't taken down, it is a 3G device too. Maybe Apple modified the 4S so that it doesn't violate the patents in question.

Apple seems to be making around $1b/week profit so any long term banning that Motorola succeeds with and is ruled unfair could cost them a good amount of money, although Apple's profits are from worldwide sales so damages will be ruled against German sales.
post #104 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode 5 View Post

Who knows who's pulling whose strings.

It's interesting that this letter terminating all licensing with respects to Apple arrives January 11th 2011, just seven days after Motorola split into two companies on January 4th 2011. It looks a lot like Motorola was setting up an exit strategy from its' mobile business. A cynic might conclude this was a strategy aimed at duping a particular prospective buyer into believing Motorola Mobility had concealed worth far grater than it's quarterly losses suggests. Had Motorola considered this a legit and profitable action, why split the company in two?

Regardless of when Google's involvement begins, both the $12.5 billion purchase price for MMI and the (6 x normal) $2.5 billion reverse break-up fee would seem to suggest Google bought into this legal action holus-bolus.

Ahh yes, I see your point. It would be more logical to assume that the least reasonable explanation is most likely the true one.
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post #105 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

Yep.

Concerning the damages, I imagine they could only ask for damages caused as a result of the product removal from the stores:

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/03/...la-patent-win/

I don't think it lasted long but could still amount to hundreds of millions given how many products they sell. I wonder why the 4S wasn't taken down, it is a 3G device too. Maybe Apple modified the 4S so that it doesn't violate the patents in question.

IIRC, it wasn't removed because it used the newer Qualcomm chip which included licensing that extended to the third party, Apple in this case. Therefor the 4S was excluded from the list of infringing devices.

I know, that doesn't seem to make sense in light of Apple's suit to claim the patent is exhausted on the Qualcomm chip after the German court already agreed the patent claim was exhausted. I think it's probably just to make sure another court somewhere else in some other country doesn't see it differently.
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post #106 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caccamucca View Post

It is actually $12.5 billion. Looks like this lawsuit settlement will cost them at least that much more to settle. Moto deal is going to drain $25 billion with nothing to show for. Music to my ears.

$2.5 billion is the back out fee.
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post #107 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

If it were up to me, any anti-Apple trolls would not be allowed on this forum and any violators would be banned for life (one strike and you're out!). Hell, if it were up to me, people would not be allowed to access this forum, unless they were on a Mac or iOS device. I don't come here for discussions with anti-Apple people, as I am not interested in anything that these people have to say. I am only interested in speaking with fellow Apple users. But that of course is not up to me, so all I can do as a user is to forcibly knock down any ignorant comments which anti-Apple people spew from their mouths. As opposed to what some other people might believe, I don't believe that ignoring ignorance is the best method for dealing with trolls. I believe that they should be confronted head on and killed as quickly as possible

If it were up to me, anyone who uses the term "troll" would be banned for life from all Internet forums.
post #108 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by some internet dude View Post

It may be a profitable company, but recent FBI files tell a story that Apple will lie steal and cheat to get there way. Plus they don't give a crap about the way there OEM factories are run. So a few people committed suicide, that's ok as long as we get our products made that's all that matters. They almost went under once it will happen again.

Apple DOES care about their OEM factories are run. Most of the other manufacturers who use the same OEM care even less and won't even entertain meeting with the China Labour Union, unlike Apple who does ACTUALLY care.
post #109 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiser_soze View Post

If it were up to me, anyone who uses the term "troll" would be banned for life from all Internet forums.

Oh, so like South Korea where you're forced to use your real information and identity to post online. Ban one place, you'd be automatically banned from the rest.



I hate it.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #110 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Realistic View Post

Another clueless troll in training.

The singular value of the word "troll" is with delivery insults. The practice amounts to old-fashioned name calling, pure and simple. Name-calling ought not be permitted, and that is why the instant that anyone uses the word "troll", they ought to be banned from a forum such as this.

This in fact is one of my gripes with the bozos who run this forum. They allow people who worship Apple to call other people names with impunity. When someone gets fed up with it and fights back in like manner, that person then gets banned. The people who run this forum have zero credibility as far as I am concerned until they adopt and adhere to a practice of treating Apple-worshipers and Apple-haters the same, and in particular bans people the instant they use the word "troll".

If you have a problem with something that someone else wrote, you should be able to repudiate what that person wrote, on the merits, rationally, and should not need to resort to name calling.
post #111 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaiser_soze View Post

This in fact is one of my gripes with the bozos who run this forum.

Bozos, eh?

Quote:
The people who run this forum have zero credibility as far as I am concerned until they adopt and adhere to a practice of treating Apple-worshipers and Apple-haters the same

We do. They're both allowed here.

Quote:
If you have a problem with something that someone else wrote, you should be able to repudiate what that person wrote, on the merits, rationally, and should not need to resort to name calling.

Exactly. So you shouldn't NEED to "fight back in like manner" since it's perfectly possible to disprove a lie with calm, rational truths.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #112 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rmb0037 View Post

I love how honest Qualcomm is

It's in Qualcomm's best interest, why would they want to lose such a big SINGLE customer as Apple?
post #113 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lochias View Post

The technical term for hugs is FRAND -- Fair, Reasonable and NonDiscriminatory -- which is what Motorola agreed to and Apple is suing for.

More than likely Moto is asking for MORE from Apple than they asked of others (so not non-discriminatory), or they want access to some of Apple's patents, something which is NOT allowed under FRAND terms.
post #114 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by herbapou View Post

Yeah, Google miss and Apple got a huge earning. Poor Slappy. So much for Android having 98% market shares by the end of 2012.

Slappy? LOLOLOL!


He'll come back here and tell us that Android phones outsell iOS phones, but he'll ignore that Apple only sells ONE phone!


/Slappy
post #115 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you shouldn't NEED to "fight back in like manner" since it's perfectly possible to disprove a lie with calm, rational truths.

That's what most us us do, at least the reputable ones. The handful that are quick to resort to name-calling, false claims of shill or distracting claims of troll are easy to pick up on. Just ignore them. They're just an unfortunate part of many forums and no mod here encourages that kind of behavior.

For the most part if you treat other members here respectfully you'll get the same in return. Those that don't aren't deserving of attention anyway so don't give them any. Make sense?
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post #116 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by sippincider View Post

After reading the various responses to my early post, I have no choice but to conclude this is the biggest group of elite assholes I have ever met. After 18 years of Internet flamefests, that's an achievement.

And we honestly wonder why there are people who want Apple & its supporters to fail.



I have never seen any online discussion forum as entertaining as this one. And to echo your point, that's really saying something. Christian and political forums do not have posters as dedicated to a position as this one has. Not nearly.
post #117 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Bozos, eh?

We do. They're both allowed here.

Exactly. So you shouldn't NEED to "fight back in like manner" since it's perfectly possible to disprove a lie with calm, rational truths.

Pay no attention to that guy... he's a troll.
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post #118 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

I have never seen any online discussion forum as entertaining as this one. And to echo your point, that's really saying something. Christian and political forums do not have posters as dedicated to a position as this one has. Not nearly.

Obviously neither of you have been to enough christian and political forums.
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post #119 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

Pay no attention to that guy... he's a troll.

You're quick. . .
melior diabolus quem scies
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melior diabolus quem scies
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post #120 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

He'll come back here and tell us that Android phones outsell iOS phones, but he'll ignore that Apple only sells ONE phone!

I'm actually beginning to doubt that Android phones outsell iOS phones.
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