or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › Rumor: Apple may charge $80 more for 'iPad 3' with Retina Display
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Rumor: Apple may charge $80 more for 'iPad 3' with Retina Display - Page 5

post #161 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Yes, but that doesn't seem to really be the case with the iPad/iPhone pricing. They use the same processor. I don't see huge differences in their motherboards. The case and screen would be more expensive for the iPad.

Sure, the SoC/PoP is the same but the logic board in the iPad is spread out compared to the iPhone. Apple really stepped up their game with the iPhone 4 design.

Quote:
The technology has improved, but I don't think it's a technology issue. At current prices (which are NOT controlled by Moore's Law), it just costs to much to double capacity.

Moore's original statement included "complexity for minimum component costs" which does imply that the cost per year (as originally stated, then later stated to be 2 years, but never 18 months) would be the same with the doubling.

Moore was not talking about NAND flash, he never even dreamed of nanometer sizes we use today, and even he stated it as a measure of just the next ten years or so not a progression that would last forever.

As we've seen with NAND flash there is are reliably and performance hits with going to denser NAND that make it less than ideal for many needs. As I've asked before: should Apple use chips that won't last as long and be slower or use double the number of chips?

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #162 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagromme View Post

Just give me a 128GB model at the top end, please!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerMach View Post

I would expect 128GB to be offered in the high end model based on several manufacturing reprts last year.

http://www.pcworld.com/businesscente...gb_tablet.html

http://betanews.com/2011/05/31/sandi...tablet-module/

I want that too. But with only 15% buying 64GB iPads, it's unlikely.

Hope I'm wrong. I would gladly pay whatever Apple deems fair for a top of the line 128GB model.

Six x 3.5GHz '14 MP, 64GB, 1TB PCIe, 16TB HDs
2.6GHz 6GB 17"HD LED MBP, Sony 52XBR6 HDTV
EyeTV 500, Hybrid 2G, EyeTV 3 HDTV Recorder
64 ATT iPhone 5S, 128 ATT iPad Air, 128 ATT iPad miniRetina, 16...

Reply

Six x 3.5GHz '14 MP, 64GB, 1TB PCIe, 16TB HDs
2.6GHz 6GB 17"HD LED MBP, Sony 52XBR6 HDTV
EyeTV 500, Hybrid 2G, EyeTV 3 HDTV Recorder
64 ATT iPhone 5S, 128 ATT iPad Air, 128 ATT iPad miniRetina, 16...

Reply
post #163 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Multimedia View Post

I want that too. But with only 15% buying 64GB iPads, it's unlikely.

I think it's unlikely for technical reasons (note that the links supplied to upcoming NAND don't list anything in-depth that would lead us to believe this would be right for Apple) but I do think that the people that are buying the best iPads are likely to buy the best iPad even if it was more expensive.

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #164 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm135 View Post

wow. SO many apple apologists...

Apple already makes a hefty margin on these. Considering the Android onslaught, they should accept a reduced profit in exchange for getting more of their product out there.

I completely agree.
post #165 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by majjo View Post

What about it makes no sense to you?

True, there are other effects on pricing, but they've been steadily falling as well--
Take a look at SSDs, which, from a high level, is just a bunch of NAND with a controller:

back in 2008, an 80GB SSD would run you $400 to 600
in 2009/2010, you could get an 80GB SSD for $200 to 300
today, you can get 80GBs for about $150

Based on that, I think it's completely possible for Apple to double memory every 2 years without raising the price.

You're saying Apple can double the NAND flash in the same space according to Moore's Law which means without incurring any loss to the user for this advancement. That simply isn't true with NAND and you didn't even specify what kind of technological advance you are talking about.

If you mean moving from MLC to TLC there are issues with that, not to mention it's only a 50% increase in storage not a double. If you mean by reducing the lithography there are issues with that well.

This isn't CPU transistors and this the 1960s. This recent AnandTech article touches on the issues : http://www.anandtech.com/show/5067/u...ing-tlc-nand/2

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #166 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by majjo View Post

What about it makes no sense to you?


Start with the fact that Moore was discussing transistor density, and NAND contains no transistors.
post #167 of 192
I was under the impression that the unit in the middle has poor sales and that sales where strong at either end. Obviously the baseline IPad sells the strongest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Multimedia View Post

I want that too. But with only 15% buying 64GB iPads, it's unlikely.

Hope I'm wrong. I would gladly pay whatever Apple deems fair for a top of the line 128GB model.
post #168 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by majjo View Post

I was speaking primarily of lithography. You mentioned there are issues with that, what are they? I was not aware of any major issues beyond the standard low early yields.

As for the cost portion, if you look at the $/GB for SSDs over the past few years, they have fallen pretty much in line with what moore's law predicts (double the capacity for the same $, or half the $ for the same capacity every 18 months), so I'm not understanding why you don't believe it holds true for NAND.

You keep making that claim, but it's not true:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/storage..._Analysts.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/news/...08-19_NAND.jpg
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #169 of 192
The commenters who are saying Apple can raise the price and people will just pay it need to live in the real world. Apple fell victim to this kind of thinking with the first Mac Book Air, and it was relegated to a niche toy, until Apple essentially reintroduced it at a lower price point. $579 is not an attractive price (especially when that is the lowest priced model), and if Apple makes that mistake, they will find themselves undercut just when competition is beginning to heat up.
post #170 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha10711 View Post

The commenters who are saying Apple can raise the price and people will just pay it need to live in the real world. Apple fell victim to this kind of thinking with the first Mac Book Air, and it was relegated to a niche toy, until Apple essentially reintroduced it at a lower price point. $579 is not an attractive price (especially when that is the lowest priced model), and if Apple makes that mistake, they will find themselves undercut just when competition is beginning to heat up.

The MBA is not comparable here. The first MBA (starting at $1,799) was niche compared to the current MBA because the tech back then was considerably more expensive without offering any performance gain over cheaper products. It's only advantage were thinness and weight but that can only take CE so far before a price jump because too excessive for most people.

Is today's 13" MBA still less of a performer than the original 13" MBA? Yes, but now it's only $100 more than the 13' MBP and the performance difference is greatly reduced because of the SSD card is actually better than the 5400RPM HDD in the 13" MBP.

What I don't understand is why people think Apple would take a hit a huge hit on the profit yes, $80 from net profit is excessive when there is no evidence that Apple can't sell all the units they have? And why is no considering that this $80 is a compromise in order to corner the tablet market like they did with the PMP market? What if it's really onver $100 more to produce due to increased Foxconn wages, this lawsuit with ProView, the display resolution, the display panel tech, the backlight tech, the GPU, the amount of RAM, and other considerations? IOW, why is assumed that every increase would come with everything being better -and- cheaper than it was the year prior? Tech doesn't work that way and surely has had no problem raising prices when they felt it was needed. Do you really think they won't sell all their iPads if they make them a lot better and have to charge for it?

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #171 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha10711 View Post

The commenters who are saying Apple can raise the price and people will just pay it need to live in the real world.

The real world is not a bunch of people claiming stuff and showing their biases on an internet forum of course.

In a few weeks, out there in the real world when the iPad 3 goes on sale, if it indeed has a price that's higher than the previous model, then mark my words, it will be a record selling product regardless. I will have been proven right and all of the people who are claiming that it's too highly priced will have been proven wrong. That's the real world.
post #172 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm135 View Post

wow. SO many apple apologists...

Apple already makes a hefty margin on these. Considering the Android onslaught, they should accept a reduced profit in exchange for getting more of their product out there.

Why? I mean, doesn't the market dictate price and if the market will be OK with a modest price increase Apple is obligated to go there. They have shareholders to make happy and of course lots of people working for the company who are supposed to make as much money as possible.

By the way, there is no Android onslaught. I think that's really the point.
post #173 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm135 View Post

wow. SO many apple apologists...

Apple already makes a hefty margin on these. Considering the Android onslaught, they should accept a reduced profit in exchange for getting more of their product out there.

An ipad really isn't an essential device. For the most part, people buy one because they want it. Given the infrastructure built up around the Apple ecosystem and the extra cash on hand, it's not feasible to think they will fade back to their prior position when the company was near bankruptcy. Even if this did happen, it would take much longer along with a lot of bad management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

This is actually a wise move on Apples part as it will allow them to cover the incremental increase in the cost of a few parts but actually sell more features cheaper. People have to remember that if all the rumors prove true (or even part of them) iPad 3 will be skuffed with a number of more expensive parts. Everyone has focused on the screen which is an issue but let's not forget the other rumors like a vastly improved camera, 4G, more RAM and other goodies. Of those offered only RAM would be cheaper today and that only if Apple can use the same number of dies.

So while we need to wait and see, I'm not convinced that feature parity wise iPad 3 will be more expensive. We might actually be getting more.

Ram is one thing that would really help the ipad. It doesn't really have the virtual memory paging options of a typical computer, or at least I don't believe it pages to the storage system meaning that everything would need to be handled within ram.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Misa View Post

Why do I always hear this kind of comment from people who don't like the price. Apple products are a premium luxury product. You don't see Louis Vuitton reducing it's price to compete with other designer brands or chinese mass-produced plastic stuff they sell at Walmart. This is the same with Apple. People want Apple because it's the Apple product, not the cheap knockoff.

While I agree with you that they don't need to reduce the price, your analogy is quite far off. This is a piece of consumer electronics. It is not a luxury item. It does not cost thousands of dollars. They are still mass market items. Apple just doesn't address the low end of the market, not that I blame them. Apple creates a lot of hype, and they've somehow retained a coolness factor in spite of their size, but they do make devices aimed at the masses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggin View Post

Or a scenario could be that Apple doesn't want to cut the price of the iPad 2 by too much. If the component prices haven't dropped, then they may not have the room to lower the retail price by a lot without sacrificing their near-legendary margins. But they need to keep some sort of price differential between the models. So perhaps they drop the 2 by $20 and increase the 3 by $80 to achieve a $100 differential.

Given that it's been out for a bit, I would expect to see them drop the price on the older model more than that. I don't care as it'll probably be a couple more generations before I see a point in owning one.
post #174 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

A document that has surfaced out of the Far East claims that Apple's third-generation iPad will cost $80 more, starting at $579 instead of $499.

I'm wondering why this document with US pricing would be coming from the Far East?
"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
post #175 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

I'm wondering why this document with US pricing would be coming from the Far East?

From CA going to the Far West is much faster.

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #176 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by KT Walrus View Post

Seems to me the iPad 3 has to be the same price or lower than the previous model. And, the 1 year old model should be $70 or so cheaper than the new model (and $100 cheaper would really boost sales more than $70 off).

It would be a mistake to raise prices, in the light of the Samsung competition (which is starting to attract my attention).

you will be one less person in my line I won't have to wait for when ordering my OUT OF STOCK iPAD3 when they do go on sale.

Don't let the door hit u on the a$$ when u leave... SAMESUNG will be happy to have your $$$
post #177 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha10711 View Post

The commenters who are saying Apple can raise the price and people will just pay it need to live in the real world. Apple fell victim to this kind of thinking with the first Mac Book Air, and it was relegated to a niche toy, until Apple essentially reintroduced it at a lower price point. $579 is not an attractive price (especially when that is the lowest priced model), and if Apple makes that mistake, they will find themselves undercut just when competition is beginning to heat up.


Yes. It will deter new users for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

The real world is not a bunch of people claiming stuff and showing their biases on an internet forum of course.

In a few weeks, out there in the real world when the iPad 3 goes on sale, if it indeed has a price that's higher than the previous model, then mark my words, it will be a record selling product regardless. I will have been proven right and all of the people who are claiming that it's too highly priced will have been proven wrong. That's the real world.


Upgrading to the iPad is easy - the cost is merely the cost of the depreciation on your old iPad plus this $90 premium. ( Without the premium it would be just the depreciation) So someone with an iPad 2 can move on for about $300 or so. ( Without the premium, $200, or so). this means the existing established base will indeed move on up, and it will sell like hot cakes. The idea that this "proves you right" is nonsense. New customers will be deferred - however they may get old iPads on ebay. The iPad 3 is an inevitable success given the installed base upgrade path, the question is whether it will be as big a success if it were selling at $399. The answer is no, since that is the way economics works.

Apple may be right to not care at this particular moment, and a cheap iPad 3 which has to handle the upgrades of millions of existing customers, might be supply contained for half the year if they sold it cheap, however they will need to get back to the old pricing sometime. I am sure they will, once the initial supply seems less constrained. That could be the holiday trick - a price drop on all models, including the iPad 2 ( if still selling).
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #178 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitzandbitez View Post

Don't let the door hit u on the a$$ when u leave... SAMESUNG will be happy to have your $$$

Well, yes, that is what he is saying. Him and others.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #179 of 192
we're talking about resolution that nearly matches what was on my 30" cinema display, squeezed into a 9.7" display just wow

I have a thought. That pricing chart definitely implies two distinct tiers of product lines if Apple remains consistent with other product naming conventions, then instead of "iPad 2" and "iPad 3" we might see a break to "iPad" and "iPad Pro"?

e.g. the current "iPad 2" gets an incremental speed bump, and remains named just "iPad" the retina-display/quad-core iPad gets the "Pro" moniker added

Having to keep adding numbers to the name is a pain like the iPod Touch, iMac, MacBook Pro and now MacBook Air, leaving off the 'version number' is pretty convenient

I think it's a very likely possibility Apple will keep multiple tiers of iPad, like they do with the iPhone now but as it's more a mobile computer than a 'smart phone', I think it may eventually join the computer device naming scheme

But then again, it's iOS, not OS X, so who knows...
post #180 of 192
I think they will change the iPhone's naming convention too.
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
I wanted dsadsa bit it was taken.
Reply
post #181 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandd View Post

Who's got 2Q 2013 in the office pool as the date by which the IOS version which is required for all Apple services no longer supports the 2?

I reckon somewhere between Q2 2013 and Q2 2014. Probably supported until Q2 2014 but from Q2 2013 iPad 2 will start to seem slow, particularly if you bought it early when it came out.
post #182 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

Start with the fact that Moore was discussing transistor density, and NAND contains no transistors.

WTF do you think they contain??
post #183 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunks View Post

Too many models. More likely to be:

iPad 2 16GB Wi-Fi - US$499 (as is)

iPad 3 16GB Wi-Fi - US$579 (A5X chip, retina display) + 3G option
iPad 3 32GB Wi-Fi - US$649 (A5X chip, retina display) + 3G option
iPad 3 64GB Wi-Fi - US$729 (A5X chip, retina display) + 3G option

I think LTE will debut in the next iPhone.

We'll know in just over a week. Have you started on your iPad 4 rumors yet?
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #184 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitzandbitez View Post

you will be one less person in my line I won't have to wait for when ordering my OUT OF STOCK iPAD3 when they do go on sale.

Don't let the door hit u on the a$$ when u leave... SAMESUNG will be happy to have your $$$

[insult removed] I have a pile dog crap with a apple logo on it, why don't you have some left overs. I have been in the IT community prior to the Macintosh, and if it was up to apple you would still be paying over 3k for a pc , closed hardware closed OS. Do they have a good product yes, and yes they will eat their own young for dollar. It is up to the consumer to push back, 580 for a IPAD, hell no.
post #185 of 192
How can you believe this document is legit if they still have the iPad 2 price starting at $499? Can someone explain?

After an entire year Apple wouldn't sell an old model for the same price it was last year. I feel like this year will be the same as any other. They will knock the price of the iPad 2 a little bit and introduce the iPad 3 at $499 for 16GB+Wifi.

I have not purchased in iPad in the past because it seemed like every time I convinced myself I could afford one, it was Christmas time and I knew a new model would be right around the corner.

My gut just tells me that Apple will not raise the price of the base model because they always seem to highlight how all their products are "affordable" by highlighting the base price. And I agree with a couple people on here that $499 is a mental barrier, for me at least.

I have waited so long to get an iPad that I will get it whether it is $499 or $579 and just hope that next year's model doesn't blow it out of the water.
post #186 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHecta View Post

How can you believe this document is legit if they still have the iPad 2 price starting at $499? Can someone explain?

Because it's possible the iPad 3 will only come in cellular telephony models. The price for the iPad 3 will start at $549, leaving the iPad 2 at $499.

Originally Posted by asdasd

This is Appleinsider. It's all there for you but we can't do it for you.
Reply

Originally Posted by asdasd

This is Appleinsider. It's all there for you but we can't do it for you.
Reply
post #187 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Because it's possible the iPad 3 will only come in cellular telephony models. The price for the iPad 3 will start at $549, leaving the iPad 2 at $499.

I don't think it would be a good business move to only have cellular telephony models. Don't most people buy the Wifi only model?

I am saying pretty low chances on discontinuing the Wifi only model, right?
post #188 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Nope, I'm genuinely worried. Apple needs to keep "This Year's Model" at the same price regardless of keeping around an old model.


I agree. Apple should keep the newest model at the present price point.

If Apple has to use some of its 100B to keep the price down that seems to be a great strategic use of those funds. If the margin has to suffer, no problem to this apple stock holder.

keep the lead and lengthen it.

Who could match an iPad 3 with a retina screen and other features at $499.

No one!!!


(they probably can't match it at $579 either but why not just blow everyone away>)
post #189 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by juanm105 View Post

I agree. Apple should keep the newest model at the present price point.

If Apple has to use some of its 100B to keep the price down that seems to be a great strategic use of those funds. If the margin has to suffer, no problem to this apple stock holder.

keep the lead and lengthen it.

Who could match an iPad 3 with a retina screen and other features at $499.

No one!!!


(they probably can't match it at $579 either but why not just blow everyone away>)

I don't agree that Apple should waste its money when it doesn't need but if they can release a 2048x1536 iPad for the same price points this year then I think we can effectively say the iPad has natural monopoly for the foreseeable future.

Also, The Verge released this article yesterday stating the price points will stay the same:

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
post #190 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by juanm105 View Post

I agree. Apple should keep the newest model at the present price point.

If Apple has to use some of its 100B to keep the price down that seems to be a great strategic use of those funds. If the margin has to suffer, no problem to this apple stock holder.

keep the lead and lengthen it.

Who could match an iPad 3 with a retina screen and other features at $499.

No one!!!


(they probably can't match it at $579 either but why not just blow everyone away>)

I would prefer that Apple take the margin hit on the iPad2 and keep it in the product line at the lowest price possible. That would help keep competitors still struggling to compete and allow for more separation / differentiation between the iPad2 and the iPad3 products. If the two products are priced too close together I would be concerned that the iPad2 just wouldn't sell well in comparison to the iPad3.

I trust Apple will do the right thing and that they don't need my input..
Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity.

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools."
Reply
Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity.

"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools."
Reply
post #191 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Also, The Verge released this article yesterday stating the price points will stay the same:

Indeed, and Mr. X from 9to5 says they'll be the same, so my fears were unfounded.

Originally Posted by asdasd

This is Appleinsider. It's all there for you but we can't do it for you.
Reply

Originally Posted by asdasd

This is Appleinsider. It's all there for you but we can't do it for you.
Reply
post #192 of 192
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Indeed, and Mr. X from 9to5 says they'll be the same, so my fears were unfounded.

Always good to consider all angles.

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

 

Goodbyeee jragosta :: http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/160864/jragosta-joseph-michael-ragosta

Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: iPad
  • Rumor: Apple may charge $80 more for 'iPad 3' with Retina Display
AppleInsider › Forums › Mobile › iPad › Rumor: Apple may charge $80 more for 'iPad 3' with Retina Display