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Apple's thinner 13- & 15-inch MacBook Pros expected in April 'at the soonest' - Page 2

post #41 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by foljs View Post

The point is obvious, how came you don't see it?

For one, "Air" already means and evokes "lighter, no mechanical junk, no dvd, thinner".

So, if the make the MBP line have those qualities, it only makes sense to call them Air. So, the people know what this change is all about ...

By this reasoning they would use "MacBook Air" & "MacBook Air Pro," unless they actually merge the lines into one.

I'm not convinced. If they use the "Air" moniker on *all* their laptops it becomes redundant. It would be like putting "laptop" after each name even though they are all laptops. Anything could happen though and it's all speculation at this point.
post #42 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by foljs View Post

The point is obvious, how came you don't see it?

For one, "Air" already means and evokes "lighter, no mechanical junk, no dvd, thinner".

So, if the make the MBP line have those qualities, it only makes sense to call them Air. So, the people know what this change is all about.

Second, "Air" is a highly successful brand in itself, the most selling Apple laptop. Why keep the "Pro" name, when they have a newer one that has huge following?

Air will be used as a differentiator with the old Pro lines. That was MBP 15 Pro, MBP 17 Pro, not we have MBA 15, and MBA 17.

That is a logical fallacy unless you think the last major revision of the MBP that made them unibody (which followed the original MBA's milled unibody chassis), thinner and lighter also meant they should have been called MBAs back in 2008.

As for the ODD that has simply overstayed its welcome though many still think they need it because of something I dubbed Teckholm Syndrome despite most being able to count how many times they've used this 140mmx140mmx12.5mm, power hungry and prone to break component in the last 2 years on one hand.

The future of the MBP will be Pro because they have 35/45W CPUs, not 17W CPUs. They will have an option for dGPUs, not just the iGPU. They will have user-removable RAM, not RAM soldered onto the mobo. They will more ports do to their larger size. They will have more storage capacity, but hopefully still design for fast boot/wake with an SD card plus 2.5" HDD/SSD or a hybrid 2.5" drive Apple patented. On top of that they should be the first candidates for the HiDPI displays although this tech will clearly be able to trickle down to the MBAs.

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #43 of 81
Why not two grades now that MacBooks are out?

11" 13" 15" MacBook Air with ULV processors and probably 5-7-9 hours of battery life

and then

15" 17" MacBook Pro without optical drive but keep the rest (HDD) and double the battery size for a comfortable 10 hour life. Or since you're already top of line, drop the HDD, slim the case a bit (but don't lose too many ports and cooling power and put in a huge SSD. It's already pricey, real pros won't flicnh for 200$ more if they have their 512GB SSD. Anyways most pros have apps on MBP and data on FW800 or eSATA (ExpressCard) / TB drives.

As the market share grows, it is inevitable that the offer will also grow. Macs are no longer a niche product. They are leading the pack and what was once PC-only field is seriously compromised. Having more offer so that someone wanting the screen estate of a 15incher but not the weight of a full blown MBP makes sense and so does the other way around (15" MBP) too.

After all my 13" MBA has the same graphics power and double the CPU power as the late 2007 17" MBP I just sold. I am more than happy!
Life is complex: it's a combination of real and imaginary components.
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Life is complex: it's a combination of real and imaginary components.
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post #44 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Uh, what? Drop the 17"? Drop the 13.
...

The 13" MacBook Pro is by far the most popular choice and the MacBook Pros lead their OS-X sales.

I know a lot of Pros scoff at the 13" but predicting Apple would drop it is like predicting they will drop one of their most polar and best selling products ever.
post #45 of 81
I guess AI missed Intel's clarification on the supposed 8 week delay:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-57...ge-chip-delay/

My $0.02 on the size debate: I went from a 17" MBP to the 13" (with cinema display) and that setup makes much more sense in most scenarios (not all, but most). The 17" is not a big seller compared to the 13/15, and Apple is in no hurry with them. Wouldn't at all be surprised to see it discontinued altogether. I am a developer and there is not much difference between hunching over a 13" or hunching over a 17". Get a real display for serious work and pair it with the smallest and most powerful machine you can get.
post #46 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluevoid View Post

I guess AI missed Intel's clarification on the supposed 8 week delay:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-57...ge-chip-delay/

Also I would imagine all dates Intel has mentioned are for general OEM availability... Apple could well have a special agreement with them to get chips early (as they have in the past). Maybe that's why the new MacBook rumours have also been pushed back - they're suffering the same delay, but will still get the chips before other OEMs. After all Apple has to be Intel's best ULV chip client...
post #47 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by foljs View Post

To get a head-start with the competition, DUH, isn't it obvious?

Especially if your gigantic sales have you in a special status with Intel, and you have done exactly the same thing in the past.

Sorry, not obvious to me.

So Apple is going to get a head-start on the competition without the Ivy Bridge chips? Or are you assuming that somehow Apple will get them in quantity before the rest of the laptop manufacturers? I wouldn't count on that. Especially after Intel dumped so much money and effort into creating that new UltraBook standard. They want PCs to catch up to the MacBook Air. I can't see them giving any advantages to Apple.
post #48 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluevoid View Post

I guess AI missed Intel's clarification on the supposed 8 week delay:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-57...ge-chip-delay/

The clarification seems to state that the mobile chipsets still won't be available until June. Desktop chipsets will be available in May. Neither will be available in April. I don't expect new MacBooks in April.
post #49 of 81
I never thought I'd read "...and PC makers are also struggling with the MacBook Air's low price tag of only $999."

(Mid-2012) 15.4" MacBook Pro w/ IPS Retina Display | Quad Core i7-3720QM 2.6GHz / 3.6GHz Max. Turbo | 16GB DDR3-1600MHz RAM | 256GB Samsung 830 SSD-based NAND Flash ETA 9/5

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(Mid-2012) 15.4" MacBook Pro w/ IPS Retina Display | Quad Core i7-3720QM 2.6GHz / 3.6GHz Max. Turbo | 16GB DDR3-1600MHz RAM | 256GB Samsung 830 SSD-based NAND Flash ETA 9/5

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post #50 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluevoid View Post

I guess AI missed Intel's clarification on the supposed 8 week delay:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-57...ge-chip-delay/

My $0.02 on the size debate: I went from a 17" MBP to the 13" (with cinema display) and that setup makes much more sense in most scenarios (not all, but most). The 17" is not a big seller compared to the 13/15, and Apple is in no hurry with them. Wouldn't at all be surprised to see it discontinued altogether. I am a developer and there is not much difference between hunching over a 13" or hunching over a 17". Get a real display for serious work and pair it with the smallest and most powerful machine you can get.

I work with over 100 developers and that's exactly what we do at work. You need to be mobile in case you have to check something on the fly.
post #51 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post

The clarification seems to state that the mobile chipsets still won't be available until June. Desktop chipsets will be available in May. Neither will be available in April. I don't expect new MacBooks in April.

At least once in the past, Apple had chipsets and CPUs before the rest of the market. It is not impossible for that to happen again.

General availability - June
Apple availability - April

I'm not saying that it WILL happen, but there is some precedent for it.
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Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
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post #52 of 81
I must be getting old. Thought my knowledge of americanisms was pretty good. Evidently not. Only ever heard "at the earliest" which ever side of the pond I've been on. Whatever it is lets hope its quick -my blackbook is struggling but refusing to die despite toddlers trying to destroy it.
post #53 of 81
Is 'soonest' even a word in the English language? It sounds like something my 5 year old would say.
post #54 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by donvreug View Post

Is 'soonest' even a word in the English language? It sounds like something my 5 year old would say.

Of course it is. It's just completely wrong within the context of the title sentence.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

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post #55 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

By this reasoning they would use "MacBook Air" & "MacBook Air Pro," unless they actually merge the lines into one.

I'm not convinced. If they use the "Air" moniker on *all* their laptops it becomes redundant. It would be like putting "laptop" after each name even though they are all laptops. Anything could happen though and it's all speculation at this point.

other rumours have suggested dropping the Mac name from OSX, and with rounding to the nearest integer, it could be called the ... wait for it..


OS Air X 11 (for the 11 inch-er running 10.8)
post #56 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by donvreug View Post

Is 'soonest' even a word in the English language? It sounds like something my 5 year old would say.

Sure. It's a superlative of soon. Being uncommon or sounding weird doesn't affect its correctitude.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #57 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Sure. It's a superlative of soon. Being uncommon or sounding weird doesn't affect its correctitude.

That word is so meta, even the definition is meta.

Originally posted by Relic

...those little naked weirdos are going to get me investigated.
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Originally posted by Relic

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post #58 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

New 13- and 15-inch MacBook Pros with a thinner and lighter design are expected to launch in April "at the soonest," with an initial shipment of just under a million units.

Sources in Apple's upstream supply chain indicated to DigiTimes that Apple will launch upgraded MacBook Pros as early as April, with about 900,000 units expected to be shipped . A redesigned version of the 17-inch MacBook Pro is apparently not expected at launch, as it was not mentioned in Wednesday's report.

That's consistent with what AppleInsider detailed earlier this month, revealing that Apple will launch a larger 17-inch model later than the 15-inch model the company is said to be prioritizing. Apple employed the same approach when it redesigned its MacBook Pro lineup in 2008, as the lower-volume 17-inch model became available a few months later.

Apple's upgraded MacBook Pro lineup along with new MacBook Airs and the forthcoming OS X 10.8 Mountain Lion Mac operating system upgrade are expected in the industry to pose a "significant threat" to notebooks designed to Intel's thin-and-light Ultrabook specification.

"Since Intel is delaying the mass supply of its Ivy Bridge CPUs from April to June, notebook vendors are concerned about... the postponed launch schedules of their ultrabooks, as it may give Apple advantages in terms of time-to-market," the report said.

Earlier this week, an Intel executive indicated that the company's next-generation Ivy Bridge chips are expected to debut eight to 10 weeks later than previously planned. That would push the launch of those chips from April until June.




But it's possible that Apple could still launch new notebooks powered by Ivy Bridge as early as April, if Intel were to give the Mac maker early access to its first run of processors. In the past, Apple has been given early availability of Intel's latest technology before other PC makers.

As Apple gears up to revamp its MacBook Pro lineup and borrow design cues from its successful MacBook Air, PC makers are still hoping to capitalize on the Ultrabook specification being pushed by Intel. Ultrabooks are intended to be less than 21 millimeters thick, weigh no more than 3.1 pounds, use flash-based solid-state drives, and offer 5 to 8 hours of battery life.

But initial Ultrabooks from Windows-based PC makers struggled to compete with Apple on price, as the entry-level 11.6-inch MacBook Air carries a $999 cost. And they also felt the squeeze from Apple on components, as PC makers struggled to obtain unibody metal notebook chassis for their products.

[ View article on AppleInsider ]

I am firmly in the "please don't downsize the macbook pro" camp. Since I purchased my iPad 2, I know longer take it on vacations and never out to starbucks. With iCloud, it allows me to do everything I have to do. What I need at home is a large hard drive and power. As iPads get better and better, there is less need for macbook air computers , because when mobile we will just take our Ipads. I still want a lap though as it takes up less space and there are times I need to move it to another location. I do not want to sacrifice power and storage or lightness. If I can have both fantastic!
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post #59 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Sure. It's a superlative of soon. Being uncommon or sounding weird doesn't affect its correctitude.

Ok. Just to clarify; next time i'm stateside will I be "down with the kids" if I say "at the soonest". Or will I just sound like a cock?
post #60 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by ladybumps View Post

Ok. Just to clarify; next time i'm stateside will I be "down with the kids" if I say "at the soonest". Or will I just sound like a cock?

Probably about the same as saying "down with the kids."

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #61 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBillyGoatGruff View Post

Call it whatever they want.

11" and 13" integrated graphics
15" and 17" discreet graphics
All SSD
No optical drives



And I get sick of those Ultrabook commercials saying the design of the computer was inspired by Intel. BS. Just say it was inspired by the success of the MacBook Air. When the MBA first came out, people laughed because of the price and the niche market. Then the price got better. Then they redesigned and added the 11" model. Then the MBA started selling like hot cakes. The only thing that was sort-of similar in the early days of the MBA that I know of was the VAIO. But nothing saw really big sales until the redesign of the MBA. All I'm saying is give props where props are due. /rant

here, here. thanks to apple others are being forced to make laptops thinner and sleeker. lazy f***wad companies. while i will berate Apple as run by nazis it pisses me off that the other companies just make sh*t till they are forced to copy apple. then they make thinner,lighter sh*t.
post #62 of 81
I want a Macbook Nair. Super light and fast and removes unsightly hair from your lap and surrounding areas. 11, 13, 15 and Yeti.
post #63 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

At least once in the past, Apple had chipsets and CPUs before the rest of the market. It is not impossible for that to happen again.

General availability - June
Apple availability - April

I'm not saying that it WILL happen, but there is some precedent for it.

The only problem here is that I (like I'm sure many of you) just received today, an advertising email from Apple touting the "MacBook Air" - "Still light years ahead" (of the competition).
I have NEVER received an email like this from Apple unless it was for a brand new released product announcement. Never for a last generation laptop. This tells me they are saying "Hey, don't wait around for a new Air anytime in the near future, dude. It's gonna be a little while longer than we expected. So get out there and buy the existing Macbook Air today!!"
Again; I've never gotten an email from Apple advertising an 8 month old product.
post #64 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Probably about the same as saying "down with the kids."

That's cleared that up then. 13" MacCock it is. Unless Proview have nabbed that one too.
post #65 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

here, here.

On the subject of language, this one is a pet peeve of mine: why do people have such difficulty saying "hear, hear"?!
post #66 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

The only problem here is that I (like I'm sure many of you) just received today, an advertising email from Apple touting the "MacBook Air" - "Still light years ahead" (of the competition).
I have NEVER received an email like this from Apple unless it was for a brand new released product announcement. Never for a last generation laptop. This tells me they are saying "Hey, don't wait around for a new Air anytime in the near future, dude. It's gonna be a little while longer than we expected. So get out there and buy the existing Macbook Air today!!"
Again; I've never gotten an email from Apple advertising an 8 month old product.

Or, they're advertising to help clear out the channel inventory.....
post #67 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

On the subject of language, this one is a pet peeve of mine: why do people have such difficulty saying "hear, hear"?!

you got me. i goofed. get over it.
post #68 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Or, they're advertising to help clear out the channel inventory.....

Yeah, maybe... But they've never done this before. This would suggest to me their having an awfully large chunk of excess inventory. On the MacBook Air (?!) I don't think so. I think they, pretty much, sell 'em as fast as they make 'em. We'll see.
post #69 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by screamingfist View Post

you got me. i goofed. get over it.

I have nothing to get over. I am cool. You just happened to be a handy, apropos example. Thanks!
post #70 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by boredumb View Post

How about, "MacPrayer"?

How about MacGyver, mullets optional.
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post #71 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

The iMac is barely holding on.

The iMac is barely holding on? There's not enough head shaking available to express my feelings about the above statement...

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles..._pc_sales.html

We're in a world where EVERYBODY is shifting away from desktops to laptops. AIO's are the only place of strength left in the desktop world... and Apple is destroying everybody else in that market.

All the facts we have in front of us go directly against the things you are saying. I'm not sure where you are getting any facts that back up "the iMac is barely holding on"... because that is a ridiculous statement.

The future of desktop computing is AIO. There is very little need for a "pro" machine without display anymore. Trust me... I'm a power user and wouldn't have even considered anything BUT an iMac.

Apple knows this... I know this. Most of the rest of us know this.
post #72 of 81
I like the Pro machines being Pro, but I also am a bit jealous of the ease with which an Air or iPad user can whip out their device in situations where I wouldn't bother carrying or opening my 15" MBP, and I've been leaning toward getting an iPad 3 for this reason. However, what I really want is a computer that's very portable, and if the 15" MBP attained essentially the form factor of the MBA, that would be my ideal device and I wouldn't need a tablet.

I'm just not convinced that they can make it that small without it being underpowered. They've never been able to do it with the MBA before, but there's always a first time when they wow us with how small they can make things. When the first iPod came out, who could have imagined today's nano being so much more feature-packed in that form factor? I hope we're about to see a similar unprecedented display of miniaturization and power, but until we see it, I'm not getting my hopes up. More likely, I think we'll see them get halfway: it will be more powerful than any other MBA, but not quite as good as a top-of-the-line MBP.
post #73 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Take away the laptops and things would look pretty bleak in Mac land. I really doubt that they sell more than 50,000 PROs a quarter, Mini sales are down also. The iMac is barely holding on. So yeah one could say Apple has shoot itself in the foot with the Mac desktop line up.

Sometimes... when people speak with such knowledge and authority... I guess they think people won't check facts.

http://www.tuaw.com/2012/01/25/lesse...ngs-statement/

Desktops
Unit sales up 16 percent
Revenue up 15 percent

Remember... industry wide, desktop sales are getting crushed. Apple is growing desktop sales fairly significantly even in this environment, despite your "facts." Apple has made the RIGHT move shifting desktop users to the iMac... all the actual facts show it, regardless of your opinion.
post #74 of 81
I think the MBA and MBP are different categories and that Apple will keep both lines going. I had a 15" '08 MBP for years and then replaced it last year with the 13" MBA. Since I travel on business nearly half the time the MBA has been a real back saver.

At home I hook up the MBA to the Thunderbolt Display and it's like working on a whole different desktop workstation with all the connections and peripherals I need. So, personally, I want the laptop as light as possible for the road but a 15" version that doesn't weigh over 3 pounds would be the perfect MBA a few years down the line for me.

Still, I see that a lot of people use the MBP as their only computer without external monitors and they want the 15" or 17" screen, a lot of RAM and storage space, extra connectors and the optical drive. But I do think the MBA is closing the gap and that most people would be fine with it connected to an external monitor like the 27" Thunderbolt Display.

Eventually, I do believe that the MBA and MBP lines will be merged with four different screen sizes.
post #75 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I have nothing to get over. I am cool. You just happened to be a handy, apropos example. Thanks!

Your welcome! and thanks for being a handy, perfect example of the usual Apple douchebag!
post #76 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

The whole point in having a Pro line up is to have features not available in the run of the mill line up. That means a considerable increase in performance, a high performance GPU, ports and at battery life. Apple changing everything over to AIRs would be likened to shooting ones self in the foot.

Both of you seem to want to ruin the laptop line in the same way Apple has borked its desktop lineup. That is to eliminate choice in such a way that people go else where. People make a rational choice to buy the PROs because they offer something they need in a laptop that one can't get from an AIR. That might be a better screen or larger disk storage or maybe a better battery. Whatever it is the frame of the AIRs will never offer it up.

Absolutely. I don't understand this anal-compulsive need by users to eliminate the line they don't necessarily care about. You prefer a small-screen Air with a lesser processor? Fine...buy that. I prefer a fully-featured 15" or 17" pro. And although it's pretty obvious they're going to eliminate the optical drive in the Pro, I think that is a very bad move. I still need and want that drive for a variety of reasons. And I also still need a very high capacity hard disk in my laptop (I just put a 750MB drive in my MBP 2008) that cannot be replicated in a solid state drive for anywhere near the cost.

So I sincerely hope the pundits and posters are wrong and Apple maintains both lines.

Personally, I see the Airs as more of a "consume content" device and the Pros as "working" device. They're both great lines that serve different markets and they both should be maintained. One thing that would make sense to me (although based on this announcement, they don't seem to be doing) is that I could see the 13" only being an Air and not a Pro. It seems to me that anyone who wants the portability of the 13" would want it in the smallest, lightest package available and that would be the Air, not the Pro.

So the 11" and 13.3" would be the Air (small case, solid state drives) and the 15" and 17" would be the Pro (hard drives with solid state option, larger battery, better graphics, more connectivity and IMO, still with optical drive, at least as an option). If Apple eliminates the equivalent of the Pro line, I could see a lot of pro users, people who do intense work in video, Photoshop, Illustrator, Office, etc., reluctantly leaving Apple.
post #77 of 81
What people seem to be missing is that the chips suitable for the AIR have been pushed out even farther. A new AIR rev won't likely come till July or later. The info was clear that the AIR type chips have been pushed out even further.

The problem with Apple ad though is this. People in the know will realize that the AIR will benefit greatly from Ivy Bridge so they will wait. Hell AIR could benefit from Fusion. Sadly their isn't much to bump AIR with unless they adjust SSD size mid cycle. So the current machines could be around another 4 months.

That is one year, sort of makes you wonder if Apple has convinced Intel to deliver chips on their schedule.

Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post

The only problem here is that I (like I'm sure many of you) just received today, an advertising email from Apple touting the "MacBook Air" - "Still light years ahead" (of the competition).
I have NEVER received an email like this from Apple unless it was for a brand new released product announcement. Never for a last generation laptop. This tells me they are saying "Hey, don't wait around for a new Air anytime in the near future, dude. It's gonna be a little while longer than we expected. So get out there and buy the existing Macbook Air today!!"
Again; I've never gotten an email from Apple advertising an 8 month old product.
post #78 of 81
Cherry picking a few cute numbers doesn't support your point upon inspection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobringer View Post

Sometimes... when people speak with such knowledge and authority... I guess they think people won't check facts.

http://www.tuaw.com/2012/01/25/lesse...ngs-statement/

Desktops
Unit sales up 16 percent
Revenue up 15 percent

First; those numbers don't represent US sales, further if you dig deeper you will find that the only positive there is the iMac. My point remains, iMac desktop sales suck.
Quote:
Remember... industry wide, desktop sales are getting crushed. Apple is growing desktop sales fairly significantly even in this environment, despite your "facts."

Did you read that entire article for content. It was stated clearly that Mac desktop sales are flat. In fact the entire coverage was pretty negative. If you dig deeper you will find that the only desktop Mac selling well is the iMac.
Quote:
Apple has made the RIGHT move shifting desktop users to the iMac... all the actual facts show it, regardless of your opinion.

That is garbage, Apple has effectively kept many off the platform due to the lack of a respectable desktop. Likewise it has forced many to leave the platform. If you call that the right move I'd have to say your business sense is off. What you have left is many that are forced to the iMac even if it is a terrible deal for their needs. Again forcing customers into bad deals isn't in your business best interest. Again if you read for content you will find that things isn't going well at all in Apple desktop land.

There are many ways to interpret data but I think you are excessively optimistic about Apples sales.
post #79 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

I think you are excessively optimistic about Apples sales.

Now he's clearly just doing it for the lulz
post #80 of 81
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

The whole point in having a Pro line up is to have features not available in the run of the mill line up. That means a considerable increase in performance, a high performance GPU, ports and at battery life. Apple changing everything over to AIRs would be likened to shooting ones self in the foot.

Both of you seem to want to ruin the laptop line in the same way Apple has borked its desktop lineup. That is to eliminate choice in such a way that people go else where. People make a rational choice to buy the PROs because they offer something they need in a laptop that one can't get from an AIR. That might be a better screen or larger disk storage or maybe a better battery. Whatever it is the frame of the AIRs will never offer it up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobringer View Post

Yeah... screw pro users. All the developers I work with that have 17" MBP's that switched to mac over the last 5 years... who needs 'em!

Whatever any enthusiast thinks or we here wish, Apple's mantra is clearly to move into high volume/rapidly expanding markets - wherever they find or create them (e.g., after beginning as spectacular consumer successes, the iPad and iPhone are also becoming the wedges into the Enterprise market Apple's long hoped for, and reasserting Apple's primacy in education.

That's why they could dump their server hardware (nice stuff from what I know) and made the server OS an add-on to the regular one so that any Mac could be converted to a small-net server. And I remember commentors here and pundits alike bemoaning how this marked Apple's "giving up for good" on big corps. My own reaction was "not so fast!" (not that I foresaw what's happening right now).

They will keep manufacturing a product that's not hurting them for awhile in its middle-age, and operate slightly lower margin businesses to fill out their burgeoning "ecosystem," but while I hope and expect to see a TB-equipped Mac Pro with a burnin' CPU and graphics card, it could be the last. As others have pointed out, a TB-connected maxed out iMac can now do what likely 98% of users need.

But even iMacs - while the case will get a nice re-design or two - are more likely to enter a period marked more by refinement and incremental improvement than revolutionary make-over.

And yes, even notebooks - after the 2012 roll-outs - are not immune to a time when they'll be receiving a lesser proportion of HQ love.

Bottom line, if desktops are "trucks," Pro notebooks are SUV's and Airs are Cross-overs.

While iOS devices are becoming the mass volume cars and bikes.

And next up looks like Apple might well be turning its next big thing resources toward the Living Room.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Thinner 13" MacBook Pros? Air?

I believe they should rebrand the whole lineup with one name, and drop the 17" version entirely.

The best I could come up with with 7 seconds to think about it is:

AirBook

11, 13, 15

I played with this in my my mind for awhile and read the other comments. Not bad, but haven't we taken the Mac name off enough things already this year?

Quote:
Originally Posted by loveandcapture View Post

My humble opinion on this is that the MacBook Air just becomes the MacBook (as it's now Apple's only consumer notebook), while the 13" - 17" MacBook Pros keep their name.

I don't think they'll ditch the 17" MBP. While Apple does kill off features and product lines all the time, I think they still like to have leading-edge hardware, especially in the portable world, and won't kill it off unless they have a fitting replacement. ie, they still sell the iPod classic (probably because it has capacity no other iPod has... yet).

The Mac Pro has more to worry about, as Apple seems to think Thunderbolt's expansion possibilities on MacBook Pros and iMacs renders it unnecessary. God I hope not. Alas, that's another thread, sorry.

What I said. And I fully expect a re-architected 17" notebook - but, while it will be tweakable in later iterations, the form factor it takes could be the last for a good while at least.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cxc273 View Post

I don't know how Apple reconciles the Pro line's larger storage capacity if the company trends everything to the Air's profile.

The first part of your comment is simple to devine: Apple's answer is three-pronged. 1. iCloud, 2. Thunderbolt. 3. The declining price/increasing capacity of SSD's (and follow-on tech) over the next year or three or five.

They're calculating that total notebook local storage on the road will matter less to most users over time, even while the current speed/size benefits of SSD add enough value to the total computing experience to hold onto most of the storage hungry until SSD price/size ratios become more favorable.

People will have any needed files in the Cloud and that big honkin' cost-effective HDD (for now) will be on the other side of their TB connection - that one wire to a set of peripherals for when they need any of these at home, ideally hooked to a 27" TB monitor that will accomplish things for both Apple and users.

For us: We can upgrade the whole motherboard (do they still call them this?) of our 27" systems without buying a new screen (which iterates more slowly and lasts longer), or other new accessories for that matter. So we'll upgrade our notebooks every 1-3 years and have systems that stay leading edge by only replacing one component.

For Apple: They get to sell mega tons of thousand dollar monitors as ADD-ONS to notebooks. Ka-ching!

Quote:
Originally Posted by cxc273 View Post

I doubt that Apple would leave a conventional hard drive in. With the price of SSDs right now, is it feasible for the new Macbooks to top off at 512 GB, or is that still too crazy expensive?

I would love a 13" laptop with the form factor of the MBA but with lots of storage.

If there's still a slimmed down but separate Pro line after this July, it might have a volume proportionally similar to this machine for whatever screen size - except nicer, more tapered and ditching the ODD. I also seem to recall reading about a newish slim form single platter HDD with up to maybe 320-500 GB of storage that might be suitable to a still distinct if Airish Pro line (and pairable with a 64-128 GB SSD, tho' the hybrid route doesn't feel quite Appleish).

But the 13" Pro is endangered for other possible reasons. A pro level processor generates more heat and the slim form leaves less space to dissipate it, and the form factor begins to limit a "pro" port complement (about which Apple, granted, might say (as it has in the past), hey, you got TB, so quit yer bitchin' about FW or GB ENet, etc.). Battery space also becomes an issue at a certain point.

Meanwhile, a 15" Air with an upgraded processor and an overall volume/weight still less than today's 13" MBP could grab some of the sales that go to these machines today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

That is my whole point, how do you stuff these high wattage components into an AIR like chassis? A 45 watt processor still requires the same amount of cooling as does one in today's machines.

Feel free to correct me, but my impression was that Ivy Bridge is going to deliver a notably higher amount of processing power per watt, allowing improved performance with less heat - with the ratio naturally changing as you go from the bottom to the top of the line. So Pros - with the noted possible exception of the 13" - could be quite slim and no hotter than today with still quite a boost. Yes/no??

(I know that the next generation is touted to improve the power/watt equation by a much larger amount, but still have a sense that Ivy Bridge's improvements will still be considerable.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

There is no possibility of a disk drive in any of the AIRs.

But as noted, maybe in a slightly fatter hybrid drive Pro.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

There is no room for a high performance processor nor a GPU.

I don't know what they are doing but the suggestions in this thread would effectively ruin the laptop line up for anybody with high expectations performance wise. It would in effect make the product line like the desktop line where only a few niche users are well served. Apples great success with the laptops comes from being able to sell to a wide array of users. Almost everyone could find a laptop to fit their needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wizard69 View Post

Especially when a users storage needs are only going up. It is a huge problem which the AIR fans refuse to acknowledge. Even if Apple doubled capacity in the AIRs it still wouldn't be enough.

So would , well maybe a 15" variant. Contrary to the opinion of some, I really like the concept of the AIRs but I can't justify one today and most likely not the next rev. SSD's just don't cut it for capacity.

I'll stand by my answer above to all of these points, except, I guess, GPU's. I'm just not conversant enough.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prof. Peabody View Post

The 13" MacBook Pro is by far the most popular choice and the MacBook Pros lead their OS-X sales.

Even if I'm wrong about being skeptical that this is still true (about the MBP 13 in particular) in the last quarter or two, the growth rate of Air sales is far faster than Pro sales, and Pro sales are increasing faster than iMac sales. People just don't seem to give enough weight here to the fact that Apple's eye is never on where the ball has been, rather on where they think it's going to be next.

An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

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An iPhone, a Leatherman and thou...  ...life is complete.

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