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Apple highlights creation of 514,000 jobs in America - Page 2

post #41 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Ah, before we get all "outsourcing of jobs-blamey" here, I'd like to point out that it's possible he meant "jobs killed" as in "jobs based on archaic tech that have been obsoleted by Apple innovations over the past fifteen years".

Oh in that case...

Double crap.

Nature of competition.

We good now?
post #42 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Ah, before we get all "outsourcing of jobs-blamey" here, I'd like to point out that it's possible he meant "jobs killed" as in "jobs based on archaic tech that have been obsoleted by Apple innovations over the past fifteen years".

Damn, replied too soon. And you're right - he could have meant that, but I would think that killing off archaic tech fits right in with the "adapt or die" model. Apple shouldn't quit growing because archaic tech companies or businesses based on their products can't adapt to a modern basis.
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post #43 of 165
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Originally Posted by piot View Post

Yeh! And don't forget the kittens. Bet Apple has killed lots of kittens.

...and babies. Don't forget babies.
post #44 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

I'd like to know how many jobs has Apple killed? I'm sure that number is greater than 514,000.

If the job wasn't created here to start with you can't claim the job as being killed. So I'd bet very few by comparison..

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post #45 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by lkrupp View Post

Judging from the ignorant posts in this thread so far I'm guessing this information won't make it to the tech media at large anytime soon. After all Apple has been dragged through the mud and convicted of evil by the haters and click baiters so any positive PR move by the company will be snickered at. See posts above.

But Apple is big enough to take the blows from clueless idiots who infest tech sites like AI.

who the hell is being offensive to this news here? This is great news period the only bickering I see are different perspectives on whether or not a publically traded company owes the country it was founded in anything at all.

Which is debatable with good points on both sides.
post #46 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

Crap. Sorry.

If Apple manufactured the iPhone and iPad in the US it would have to price them so much higher that they would have never sold as many or they would not have sold them at all. This would mean either far fewer app jobs or no app jobs at all.

If you don't believe me, fine. It is pretty much basic economics and so is this:

Apple is an actual example of free trade in action and open markets working the way they should.

You obviously have no idea what I meant and still decided to write a rant.

I'm talking about the industries that Apple has consumed, will continue to consume.

Brick and mortar stores were on their decline but Apple and iTunes sped up that process.

What's next? Publishing? TV?
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #47 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Liberal nonsense.

Neither.
post #48 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

I'd like to know how many jobs has Apple killed? I'm sure that number is greater than 514,000.

And I spoke to soon...an obselete job, or a job unwilling to be done at the desired pay by an American is not a job lost.

Does Apple even have overseas tech support?

Apple is wholeheartedly an American company and does a lot of good for the country...

could they do more? of course...we all could...you can argue that Apple may be bad for progress of tech as a whole with their litigious nature and I may agree with some of your points there, but to argue they are bad for America overall? No.

Not even close.
post #49 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Liberal nonsense.

why is giving a fuck such a negative thing to you?
post #50 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple on Friday updated its website with a new section touting the company's role in directly creating or supporting more than a half-million jobs in the U.S.

The "Job Creation" page highlights the 514,000 total people Apple says are employed in 50 states because of Apple. Of those, 304,000 are related to engineering, manufacturing and transportation, while 210,000 alone are a result of the App Store and development of applications for the iOS platform.

"Throughout our history, Apple has created entirely new products and entirely new industries by focusing on innovation," the site reads. "As a result, we've created or supported more than 500,000 jobs for U.S. workers: from the engineer who helped invent the iPad to the delivery person who brings it to your door."

The page cites a study by Analysis Group which found that Apple has directly or indirectly created 304,000 U.S. jobs. Those include 47,000 jobs at Apple, and 257,000 jobs at other companies.

"For example, this figure also includes workers in Texas who manufacture processors for iOS products, Corning employees in Kentucky and Nw York who create the majority of the glass for iPhone, and FedEx and UPS employees," the site states.

As for jobs related to the App Store, Apple cites a 2012 study by TechNet that found that 466,000 total jobs have been added to the U.S. economy related to mobile application development. Apple found that 45 percent of the job postings in the "app economy" are specifically tied to the iPhone and iOS.




Apple's decision to begin promoting its creation of jobs in the U.S. comes as the company has been under fire for its alignment with Foxconn and other China-based suppliers for its products. A story in January from The New York Times noted that Apple's reliance on overseas workers also gives the company greater flexibility, diligence and skilled labor availability.

When late Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs met with President Barack Obama last February, Obama reportedly asked Jobs why Apple is unable to bring its manufacturing operations back to the U.S. Jobs reportedly told the president, "Those jobs aren't coming back."

[ View article on AppleInsider ]

Apple can do more, bring "some" of it's manufacturing back to the USA. Apple may not have to do it, but it is the right thing to do.
post #51 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackzig View Post

Apple can do more, bring "some" of it's manufacturing back to the USA. Apple may not have to do it, but it is the right thing to do.

This is the kind of nonsensical thinking that comes from the release of these figures. Apple is not an employment agency.

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post #52 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackzig View Post

Apple can do more, bring "some" of it's manufacturing back to the USA. Apple may not have to do it, but it is the right thing to do.

everyone can do more...but as long as profits > humanity that'll never happen.

Such is the way of things.

Singling out one corporation isn't the right way to go about changing things.
post #53 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I know exactly what you mean. Capitalism and the fundamental idea of free markets have been under relentless attack by the president, the public and certain socialistic special interests who believe all that is good or "fair" can only come from government. All of this political pandering is fed by the fuel of disgruntled Americans trying to make their way through a lousy economy. It's a shame that desperate people would rather destroy this country than enable open competition, no protected markets, no subsidization of housing, cars, and what have you...

What free market? What competition? Whenever there's a worthy competitor it gets bought. We used to have Exxon and Mobil competing and what do we have now? ExxonMobil and gas prices through the roof. The problem with capitalism is that the vast majority of us aren't capitalists we're consumers. ATT was broken up because it was a monopoly and its slowly gone back to where it was.
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post #54 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

If the jobs of UPS and FEDEX are being counted because of shipments of Apple products then I can only imagine how many jobs Amazon has created? Or Newegg or any of the other thousands of companies that ship things each day. Seems like a stretch.

Amazon has probably killed quite a few jobs too, competing with brick & mortar shops that are at a disadvantage because they don't help people with sales tax evasion the way Amazon does. Not to mention the jobs lost when state governments had to make cuts due to the budget shortfalls exacerbated by the tax evasion.

But Apple is also responsible for creating a few jobs right here at AppleInsider! I don't think MicrosoftInsider would have the same appeal to this crowd.
post #55 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AgNuke1707 View Post

Killed in what way? If you mean by moving manufacturing outside of the US, I highly doubt it's anywhere CLOSE to 514K. I fail to see any other way Apple has "killed" jobs in this country.

Think of all of the apps on the app store. Now think about how many of them, in conjunction with iPhones and iPads, have replaced special purpose devices for a lot of people: Electronic pocket dictionaries. Translators. Calculators. GPS devices. Watches. Pocket radios. Walkmans. Digital recorders. Gameboys. Dedicated game devices (chess). Filofax and day planners. P&S cameras. Video cameras. Pocket flashlights. Photo albums.

Heck, take printers and paper. I just read how Vancouver replaced tons (literally) of reports and papers distributed to government officials with documents sent and shared via iPads. How much paper is being replaced? Ink? Copiers? Printers?
post #56 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post

Think of all of the apps on the app store. Now think about how many of them, in conjunction with iPhones and iPads, have replaced special purpose devices for a lot of people: Electronic pocket dictionaries. Translators. Calculators. GPS devices. Watches. Pocket radios. Walkmans. Digital recorders. Gameboys. Dedicated game devices (chess). Filofax and day planners. P&S cameras. Video cameras. Pocket flashlights. Photo albums.

Heck, take printers and paper. I just read how Vancouver replaced tons (literally) of reports and papers distributed to government officials with documents sent and shared via iPads. How much paper is being replaced? Ink? Copiers? Printers?

Yes, it's convenient for us, not so for them in those industries. Kodak anyone?
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #57 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahmlco View Post

Think of all of the apps on the app store. Now think about how many of them, in conjunction with iPhones and iPads, have replaced special purpose devices for a lot of people: Electronic pocket dictionaries. Translators. Calculators. GPS devices. Watches. Pocket radios. Walkmans. Digital recorders. Gameboys. Dedicated game devices (chess). Filofax and day planners. P&S cameras. Video cameras. Pocket flashlights. Photo albums.

Heck, take printers and paper. I just read how Vancouver replaced tons (literally) of reports and papers distributed to government officials with documents sent and shared via iPads. How much paper is being replaced? Ink? Copiers? Printers?

Whats your point since most of the products you mention aren't made in the USA to start with? Saving trees is a bad thing?

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post #58 of 165
Apple doesn't exist and we all just develop for Windows instead.
post #59 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Realistic View Post

For the purpose of this article any company or corporation, including Apple, that doesn't depend on money from the government to exist would be considered a private company.

That's not the definition of a private/public corporation, so no we won't ``for the purpose of this article'' change the definition of what is a private or public corporation.

They have very different requirements.
post #60 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

What free market? What competition? Whenever there's a worthy competitor it gets bought. We used to have Exxon and Mobil competing and what do we have now? ExxonMobil and gas prices through the roof. The problem with capitalism is that the vast majority of us aren't capitalists we're consumers. ATT was broken up because it was a monopoly and its slowly gone back to where it was.

Agreed. We have never had a Free Market mainly because we fight against Regulation which would layout a level playing field for players to fight for our dollars.

We have Oligopolies. We had them with the Rails, Steel, Sugar, and other commodities in the forms of Trusts and TR broke them up.

He'd be considered a disgrace in today's GOP. He gave us the National Forests and Parks.

He was not a Conservative, but a Conservationist.

AT&T was broken up and only created 12 regional monopolies changing nothing.

Exxon losing their subsidies to sink or swim on their own should be welcomed by the GOP fans as a case in competition.

All burgeoning national interest markets have had subsidies/tax incentives to get them off the ground.

Move the damn tax subsidies for Old Energy to New Energy.

If Exxon were smart they'd be spearheading their own Green Initiative with BioAlgae and more since they have the refinement infrastructure but their too dense to see the forrest for the trees.
post #61 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

everyone can do more...but as long as profits > humanity that'll never happen.

Such is the way of things.

Singling out one corporation isn't the right way to go about changing things.

Profits are essential to business. If you don't make a profit, you are a charity.

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post #62 of 165
This announcement is an embarrassment for Tim Cook's apple, no more no less, anyone who isn't an apologist and who has a modicum of wit is well aware of it. Jobs may have been a ... in some of his business dealings but he d also done acid, he also had a flair for the aesthetic and the craziness and disruptiveness to drive apple forward. The operations guy better fire a few people off his pr machine because to address people with this level of arguments as if they were morons isn't doing apple any good.
post #63 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

everyone can do more...but as long as profits > humanity that'll never happen.

Such is the way of things.

Singling out one corporation isn't the right way to go about changing things.

I m with you, but they shouldn't insult our intelligence either
post #64 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

This announcement is an embarrassment for Tim Cook's apple, no more no less, anyone who isn't an apologist and who has a modicum of wit is well aware of it. Jobs may have been a ... in some of his business dealings but he d also done acid, he also had a flair for the aesthetic and the craziness and disruptiveness to drive apple forward. The operations guy better fire a few people off his pr machine because to address people with this level of arguments as if they were morons isn't doing apple any good.

I agree this is a completely unnecessary announcement and looks (on the face of it) like someone is trying to make political points. Jobs would not be happy with this level of attempting to appease critics.

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post #65 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

everyone can do more...but as long as profits > humanity that'll never happen.

That all depends on how narrow-minded and bigoted your definition of humanity is. Obviously, you only consider white, Anglo-Saxon Americans as part of humanity.

For most of the employees in China who are working indirectly for Apple, that job is a matter of life or death for them and their families. Or, at the very least, it's the difference between a nice office job that hundreds of thousands of people want or a backbreaking job in the fields that everyone is trying to get away from.

If you get off your high horse, Apple's doing a great deal for humanity in China.
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post #66 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I agree this is a completely unnecessary announcement and looks (on the face of it) like someone is trying to make political points. Jobs would not be happy with this level of sucking up to critics.

Apple has a job to do - to sell as many systems and make as much money as they can. The latest nonsense about working conditions in China and exporting jobs to China could have an impact on their sales.

Presenting facts and independent audits hasn't helped. So the only option left is to fight FUD with more FUD - which is what Apple's doing here. If it convinces some of the complainers to stop complaining, it's worth every penny - and certainly not 'completely unnecessary' as you allege.
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post #67 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tune View Post

Dayam, that's pretty sweet. I wonder just exactly how many of them were counted.

Did they also count the salespeople at ATT, Verizon, Sprint, Best Buy, Target and Walmart.

I hope that they did. They are relevant. It makes good sense to support American companies for a lot of reasons, and jobs of all sorts are one of them.
post #68 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

If the jobs of UPS and FEDEX are being counted because of shipments of Apple products then I can only imagine how many jobs Amazon has created? Or Newegg or any of the other thousands of companies that ship things each day. Seems like a stretch.

All of them create jobs.

The problem is the changing landscape. We may be going through as big a shift these days as when the agricultural jobs dried up due to mechanization. In the long run, these sorts of transitions are good, but huge dislocations are created in the short run.
post #69 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

For the record, I am not saying Apple is the new Microsoft. Google is the new Microsoft.

Don't kid yourself. Every huge megacorporation is like Microsoft in many, many respects. Apple is not some kind of a saint. They exist to funnel profits to Wall Street. Just like every other huge corporation.
post #70 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

If you get off your high horse, Apple's doing a great deal for humanity in China.

I can't help thinking that if I was Chinese I'd want you to get off your high horse
post #71 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Liberal nonsense.

It most certainly is nonsense.

Tim Cook may or may not feel social responsibility. Apple is a corporation, and as such feels nothing. They are not a charitable foundation. They have no responsibility except to Wall Street.

That may be bad, or it may be OK. But it is true.
post #72 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

250,000 people are paying apple to to be their developers. But how many are making a profit?

In house apps? Companies give away apps as part of their service. They don't spring up out of the ground ready to install.

Could also be LLCs set up to protect individual developer's assets.

There are all kinds of ways.
post #73 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreadSnuggles View Post

Hmmmm...I'm not a fan of nationalism, but...you owe nothing to the community that made you who you are? Well, at least you use Apple products!

People may owe something to the community. Corporations do not. They need heavy government regulation to keep them from doing harm.

People are at the base of all - but some institutions like government have responsibilities to them, and others, like corporations, do not.

Like it or hate it, that is the way of the world.

We need to strike a balance between the various institutions we people create. Some have the purpose of creating wealth, others have the purpose of maintaining the public good.

You an vote with your time and with your ballots and with your money.

You can argue about various economic and legal and political structures. But to say that corporations have responsibility to anyone except their shareholders is a losing argument. We have various other institutions to do that.
post #74 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

You obviously have no idea what I meant and still decided to write a rant.

I'm talking about the industries that Apple has consumed, will continue to consume.

Brick and mortar stores were on their decline but Apple and iTunes sped up that process.

What's next? Publishing? TV?

First off I can show you ranting if you want.

Second, still don't agree with you. Apple is successful and therefore evil? You said so yourself that stores were on the decline. Apple filled a void. Nature of competition.

And the way I see it Apple creates industries to replace ones that are dying already. If it hastens the death of something, so be it.
post #75 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

I'd like to know how many jobs has Apple killed? I'm sure that number is greater than 514,000.

I'm not so sure that they have killed so man jobs, but it is a relevant question. I'm not so sure that the dead jobs, like the guys in the pre-computer age who used quill pens to fill in ledger books, should still be around.

Efficiency is the enemy of the working man, but as a whole, it is better than, for example, outlawing steam shovels and hiring armies of men with picks and shovels.
post #76 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by DreadSnuggles View Post

Hmmmm...I'm not a fan of nationalism, but...you owe nothing to the community that made you who you are? Well, at least you use Apple products!

They are a business.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #77 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

why is giving a fuck such a negative thing to you?

Giving a fuck can be done many ways.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #78 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

Don't kid yourself. Every huge megacorporation is like Microsoft in many, many respects. Apple is not some kind of a saint. They exist to funnel profits to Wall Street. Just like every other huge corporation.

First you assume I dislike profitable companies. I love companies that make money and funnel money to Wall Street. Usually they keep me employed directly or indirectly.

Second, Apple is different for Microsoft because of the way they are perceived. Google is the company many people hate but still use daily. Apple is a company that if people hate them, they avoid their products.

So, Google is the new Microsoft. You dislike them but stick with them because the alternatives are not attractive.
post #79 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

What free market? What competition? Whenever there's a worthy competitor it gets bought. We used to have Exxon and Mobil competing and what do we have now? ExxonMobil and gas prices through the roof.

That's more to do with a weak dollar. If you're currency was backed by silver or gold you're dollar would buy all the gas you need. The problem is your country (who runs it) is more interesting in blowing up the world than addressing its own economic nightmare. And the fact that your country no longer has actual news means that isn't changing anytime soon.
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #80 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

I agree this is a completely unnecessary announcement and looks (on the face of it) like someone is trying to make political points. Jobs would not be happy with this level of attempting to appease critics.

Agree. But I suspect this is just the beginnings of a sinister plan to seek political independence and declare Apple as a new nation. Obviously this is where the 100 pr so billion dollars will be spent. Tim will be president and the Unified State of Apple will wage war on the Fragmented State of Samsung, who are in the process of seceding from South Korea. Apple announcement will increasingly contain political overtones and then turn into overt political proclamations as they work the public into a frenzy.
Phew, I need another toke...
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