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More alleged third-gen iPad parts suggest just minor changes to design - Page 2

post #41 of 109
3/4/12 at 5:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TailsToo View Post

I think that I have it right - A tablet is something that you need to be motivated to buy. An iPhone is a phone - hundreds of millions of people have them. Apple is still the most hip brand, so people will buy an iPhone without really even understanding why it's different than Android.

An iPad might be cool, but the market is no where near what the phone market is. And subsidized pricing makes it even cheaper (up front) for someone to own an iPhone.

What you say and what you conclude don't match up.
  • Needing a phone and needing a smartphone are not synonymous.
  • Android-based handsets are besting the iPhone in unit sales.
  • Apple doesn't have to best the iPhone in sales for the iPad to be a success as we've seen for two years now.
  • The PC market is shrinking even faster than before. It's hard to argue that the iPad is not directly responsible.
IOW, your ideas that the iPad needs an SD card, LTE, 128GB, and a quad-core processor with no consideration for using a dual-core processor that has higher performance and uses less power shows that you are out of touch if you think without these things it will be an "also ran". Remember, the iPad started off as having considerably less performance, less HW features, and a curtailed OS compared to every other tablet on the market yet it's the only tablet worth talking about today. Bottom line: user experience not the ability to spank it to a spec sheet is most important.

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post #42 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:01pm
The report is wrong.

LTE isn't that big of a deal at the chip level now. I really have reason to doubt everything they've said here seeing as how it feels pretty made up.
He's a mod so he has a few extra vBulletin privileges. That doesn't mean he should stop posting or should start acting like Digital Jesus.
- SolipsismX
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He's a mod so he has a few extra vBulletin privileges. That doesn't mean he should stop posting or should start acting like Digital Jesus.
- SolipsismX
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post #43 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:08pm
I can live without everything except a Retina display AND 128GB version. Otherwise it's really not worth upgrading.
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post #44 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:43pm
No LTE would be a huge disappointment.

Oh well, I guess Galaxy Note it is.
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post #45 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellott124 View Post

No LTE would be a huge disappointment.

Oh well, I guess Galaxy Note it is.

So you'd forgo a product because it lacks a barely-used feature for a completely different product in a completely different market segment?
PhilBoogie
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post #46 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you'd forgo a product because it lacks a barely-used feature for a completely different product in a completely different market segment?

The more probably explanation is that he never planned to buy one in the first place and that statement was just a weak attempt at a troll.
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post #47 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you'd forgo a product because it lacks a barely-used feature for a completely different product in a completely different market segment?

Where is the geostationary tower plaza? Theoretically it needs to be at the equator. Are you in Africa? Here in the US we have lots of LTE and in the next year or two it will be pervasive. Why would a consumer not want to future proof their purchase as much as possible?

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post #48 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Where is the geostationary tower plaza? Theoretically it needs to be at the equator.



Theoretically, yes.

Quote:
Why would a consumer not want to future proof their purchase as much as possible?

I'm just saying. And that's not even the main point I was making. If you're in the market for an iPad and think the Note is anything like it at all in terms of anything, you're not in the market for an iPad.
PhilBoogie
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post #49 of 109
3/4/12 at 6:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TailsToo View Post

The more information that comes out, the more I'm tempted to hold off.

A high Res display and Siri are great, but Apple should keep pushing the envelope. "Good enough" is how you go from market leader to an also ran. They have the lead in tablet computing - padding their pockets for year by making a device that isn't cutting edge will harm the company.

LTE is pretty common in the Android world, the iPad really needs to have it. It's fine that Apple doesn't want to include an SD slot, but make a 128GB model available then. I know processor speed isn't everything, but if Android makers are using quad cores, then make sure that the processor and graphics are powerful enough to drive the Retina display. The rumors are saying that the cameras are better, but they should at least be to the iPhone 4 level.

Hopefully we'll all be pleasantly surprised on Wednesday.

Just like the 4S 'really needed to have' LTE or would have been a sales disaster, right? Thats what I kept hearing on tech blogs and message boards anyway. So no, the iPad 3 won't be in trouble if it doesn't have LTE, and will end up smashing sales record in any case and outselling every model of every android tablet combined, and then some. Also, strange how the rumoured resolution isn't considered 'pushing the envelope' to you, but just 'good enough'. Thats the very definition of pushing the envelope, since nothing even close to that exists in any kind of mass market device with that screen size. Also, not sure why you doubt Apple will throw in hardware thats sufficient to power the display. Apple stands out by having excellent real world performance on all their products, and there's no reason to expect they would change that now.
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post #50 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post



I'm just saying. And that's not even the main point I was making. If you're in the market for an iPad and think the Note is anything like it at all in terms of anything, you're not in the market for an iPad.

Yeah the 'Oh, the iPad doesn't have LTE so might as well buy a Galaxy Note' doesn't sounds like a realistic, rational scenario for most people. The 2 devices are not interchangeable in any way.
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post #51 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

I'm just curious why the design would drive the naming convention of the device?

I think it's related to accessory compatibility. The new iPad will not fit most ipad 2 cases because of the slightly thicker back panel. They will probably avoid calling it iPad 2S for this reason.
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post #52 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post



Theoretically, yes.



I'm just saying. And that's not even the main point I was making. If you're in the market for an iPad and think the Note is anything like it at all in terms of anything, you're not in the market for an iPad.

Ok good one just ignore the barely used feature of your argument. LTE time has come. IPad without is Fail with a capital F. Unless of course you choose the Wifi. I am already using LTE on my iPad and I don't think those who dismiss it as irrelevant have ever used it. LTE rocks

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post #53 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Just like the 4S 'really needed to have' LTE or would have been a sales disaster, right? Thats what I kept hearing on tech blogs and message boards anyway.

2007 — The iPhone needs 3G (and a physical keyboard et al.) or it will fail.
2010 — The iPhone 4 needs LTE or it will fail.
2011 — The iPhone 4S needs LTE or it will fail.

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post #54 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

LTE time has come. IPad without is Fail with a capital F.

I would not have expected that reply from you. I would have expected something more along the lines of "The LTE chips are now 28nm and plenty power efficient. They are shipping in quantity and could very easily be in the upcoming iPad. I will be surprised if that is not an option."

PS: You can tether an LTE phone to an iPad with WiFi. Perhaps even save some money that way.

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post #55 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


PS: You can tether an LTE phone to an iPad with WiFi. Perhaps even save some money that way.

In case you did not get that from my earlier posts that is exactly what I am doing with Sierra Wireless AT&T 4g LTE device.

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post #56 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Only $200 and 10MBps¡ They won't add an SD card. Heck, even on-board NAND needs to be faster. Don't expect 128Gb until the price comes down and the double density chips have good enough speed and write cycles. So far I haven't seen any of that.

Isn't Apple one of the biggest purchasers of flash on the planet? I thought that they pretty much had the market cornered and get preferential pricing?

With that said, I believe that the iPad uses two NAND modules while the iPhone uses just one. The 64GB iPhone 4S used a single 64GB module, meaning that it should be pretty trivial to add two 64GB modules to an iPad 3.

The question is whether Apple had the stomach to make such a move or if it will continue for the third strait year with the same capacities.
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post #57 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

LTE time has come. IPad without is Fail with a capital F.

Now you're sounding like one-a-dem doom and gloom guys that whined about Apple not putting LTE on the iPhone 3GS.

Quote:
and I don't think those who dismiss it as irrelevant have ever used it. LTE rocks

Haven't used it anywhere, you're right. I don't live or go anywhere it's even available. And when I already have Wi-Fi anywhere I'd go, I see no reason to waste $30 a month on something I'll never need or use.
PhilBoogie
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post #58 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post

With that said, I believe that the iPad uses two NAND modules while the iPhone uses just one. The 64GB iPhone 4S used a single 64GB module, meaning that it should be pretty trivial to add two 64GB modules to an iPad 3.

Good point. So why hasn't Apple added a 128GB option if they could do so with that kind of ease? I'd think enough people would opt for the 128GB model for $100 more. They don't want more than 3 capacity differences at a time?

Click for larger image
Quote:
Isn't Apple one of the biggest purchasers of flash on the planet? I thought that they pretty much had the market cornered and get preferential pricing?

That's already accounted for with their current products. It's not like Apple will get substantially better saving on more NAND flash. Economy of scale only takes you so far. In fact, one could argue that their excessive need for NAND flash has prevented them (and the industry at large) from being able to increase capacity at lower prices due to their product's popularity hurting availability.

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post #59 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Now you're sounding like one-a-dem doom and gloom guys that whined about Apple not putting LTE on the iPhone 3GS.



Haven't used it anywhere, you're right. I don't live or go anywhere it's even available. And when I already have Wi-Fi anywhere I'd go, I see no reason to waste $30 a month on something I'll never need or use.

Not sure where you get your wireless but I personally don't trust any free wifi. I never use any wifi except my house and my office. I bought the 3G iPad but now I use 4G through my LTE device. If the new iPad does not have LTE I would recommend getting the Wifi only version and buy the 4G tether device.

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post #60 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Good point. So why hasn't Apple added a 128GB option if they could do so with that kind of ease? I'd think enough people would opt for the 128GB model for $100 more. They don't want more than 3 capacity differences at a time?

Click for larger image

I guess it all comes down to cost/maintaining profit margins. I honestly think that 16GB is too little with an iPad 3 with double the resolution. Not to mention Apple wanting to get into the textbook market with these huge 1 to 3GB textbooks. And then you'll have apps with larger textures, etc.

I honestly would like to see 32/64/128. If Apple goes this route, I'd buy the 64GB WiFi model for $600. If Apple punks out and gives us 16/32/64GB again, I'll buy the 32GB model for $600.

I think they should leave a single iPad 2 16GB WiFi SKU at $399 for the low-end.
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post #61 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

It's good that we still have some mystery inserted. It has been too clear-cut for the past, well, five months or so.

So, LTE or 3G?
Quad-core A6 or dual-core A5X?

And if the latter, does this just become the iPad 2X?

Your's are all valid points and probably right on the money with an iPad 2X on the 7th. I expect that will frustrate and annoy many here. Not me though. My guess is that: If Apple isn't changing the outside design significantly, then significant changes will be on the inside, but no LTE because that may require external changes, although the new iPad may get the A6 to support Siri and still be considered a 2X release. I'm guessing that Apple will use the A6 and/or Siri to placate the naysayers and people who will want to wait it out for the 4th gen.
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post #62 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:53pm
I wish Apple would at least include 4G for future-proofing purposes. I mean, Apple's doing that with Thunderbolt. I have ZERO thunderbolt devices, yet I have a port on my computer just in case. Does a 4G compatible device still suck a ton of power even when it can only find a 3G network?

Also, I think the "4G eats up too much battery-life" argument is getting a little old. There are some pretty nice 4G phones out there that have overcome the battery-life hurdle.
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post #63 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Ok good one just ignore the barely used feature of your argument. LTE time has come. IPad without is Fail with a capital F. Unless of course you choose the Wifi. I am already using LTE on my iPad and I don't think those who dismiss it as irrelevant have ever used it. LTE rocks

There's no LTE in my city (of 700,000 people), so no, obviously the time has not come, not for a lot of people. If they do decide to include it, great. If they don't, I honestly don't think it will be a deal breaker for most people and they will be able to get away with it.

Some of you people really over-estimate the technical knowledge most people who have an iPad. Reality isn't a tech blog. I think if you ask 9/10 people what LTE is they'll look at you funny.
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post #64 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazda 3s View Post

I guess it all comes down to cost/maintaining profit margins

Of course, but that doesn't factor in why Apple why they don't offer a 128GB model at a higher price point. As you astutely point out they can put 2x64GB chips without having to use a smaller lithography.

Note that the $999 MBA has a 64GB SSD.

Quote:
I honestly think that 16GB is too little with an iPad 3 with double the resolution. No to mention Apple wanting to get into the textbook market with these huge 1 to 3GB textbooks. And then you'll have apps with larger textures, etc.

There is certainly an argument there but I think 16GB for education will be fine for a couple years. We still need to see if Books Author takes off for textbooks.

Quote:
I honestly would like to see 32/64/128. If Apple goes this route, I'd buy the 64GB WiFi model for $600. If Apple punks out and gives us 16/32/64GB again, I'll buy the 32GB model for $600.

I hope they can maintain the same price points with the HiDPI display and all it's needed components but I wouldn't be overly surprised to see it go up. This tech doesn't seem cheap or easy in any regard. Adding the Retina Display and doubling the NAND flash at the same price point... that would shock me.

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post #65 of 109
3/4/12 at 7:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I don't know why tipsters have to give so little info. They could have at least said where they found it so we have some context. Ah well, roll on Wednesday.

Probably because Apple will track them down too easily and have them prosecuted.
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post #66 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

So you'd forgo a product because it lacks a barely-used feature for a completely different product in a completely different market segment?

You're assuming barely used. Maybe for you.

Also, it's not a completely different product no matter how you spin it. They're both part of the tablet market. One just happens to have a phone in it as well.

Don't kid your self people.
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post #67 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Santoanderson View Post

Also, I think the "4G eats up too much battery-life" argument is getting a little old. There are some pretty nice 4G phones out there that have overcome the battery-life hurdle.

The argument is certainly becoming less true but LTE certainly used more than '3G'. That said, were on 3rd gen LTE chips at the 28nm process now (which is why I won't be surprised if the iPad gets that option). What that means is that LTE is now more power efficient than the original '3G' in the iPhone 3G (at least that is how I'd describe it though there are other factors at play).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Some of you people really over-estimate the technical knowledge most people who have an iPad. Reality isn't a tech blog. I think if you ask 9/10 people what LTE is they'll look at you funny.

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post #68 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TailsToo View Post

"Good enough" is how you go from market leader to an also ran. They have the lead in tablet computing - padding their pockets for year by making a device that isn't cutting edge will harm the company.

Not if the competition hasn't even competed with the iPad 1st generation yet.
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post #69 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

There's no LTE in my city (of 700,000 people), so no, obviously the time has not come, not for a lot of people. If they do decide to include it, great. If they don't, I honestly don't think it will be a deal breaker for most people and they will be able to get away with it.

Some of you people really over-estimate the technical knowledge most people who have an iPad. Reality isn't a tech blog. I think if you ask 9/10 people what LTE is they'll look at you funny.

People have heard about 3G for years so if Apple omits 4G from the iPad they will hear non stop criticism on the evening news. I think that 4G is something they can understand even if they have no clue what LTE is

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post #70 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mellott124 View Post

Also, it's not a completely different product no matter how you spin it.

5" device, stylus.

10" device, no stylus.

Different devices. Put an iPad in your pocket.

Don't kid yourself.
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post #71 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

People have heard about 3G for years so if Apple omits 4G from the iPad they will hear non stop criticism on the evening news. I think that 4G is something they can understand even if they have no clue what LTE is

Agreed. But then again, those who rely on TV news for tech advice are the same people who will buy the popular product, which is, at this point, the Apple product.

Many people will buy the new iPad no matter what the specs are. That is just the way it goes. For now.

In 5 years? Who knows?

If normal people's friends razz them because their Apple stuff has perceptible limitations, they will think twice about buying Apple again. As of now, buying Apple makes them...normal.
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post #72 of 109
3/4/12 at 8:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

Agreed. But then again, those who rely on TV news for tech advice are the same people who will buy the popular product, which is, at this point, the Apple product.

Many people will buy the new iPad no matter what the specs are. That is just the way it goes. For now.

In 5 years? Who knows?

If normal people's friends razz them because their Apple stuff has perceptible limitations, they will think twice about buying Apple again. As of now, buying Apple makes them...normal.

Modern consumers are so brainwashed they will buy whatever they are told to buy. Personally I think iPad has many limitations but that doesn't stop my clients from asking for iPad apps for their businesses when actually they should be more concerned with removing the stupid Flash banners from their website. As stated, I don't care one way or the other since I'm already covered with my tethering solution, but I think Apple will include LTE in the next iPad or they are risking a backlash from the press.

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post #73 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:02pm
A minor change in design? Not at all: https://twitter.com/#!/ankleskater/s...32874873405440
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post #74 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Apple will include LTE in the next iPad or they are risking a backlash from the press.

Except none of that matters. The press can whine all they want. The Android crowd can whine all they want. The device is good and it does what people want.

Could Apple put hardware in there that caps speeds to 5kbps? No. But 3G is still fine for people's needs, particularly when they're already capped to 3GB and LTE would just get them there faster.

I dunno, I think they actually might put LTE in it. But you'll see more backlash from putting LTE in and people hitting their quotas a halfway through the month than if they didn't put it in.
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post #75 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TailsToo View Post

Apple does seem to change the device name with major exterior changes (3G-3GS, 4->4S).

What was the "major change" from the iPad to the iPad 2? It was nothing like the iPhone changes between name changes. The 2G-->3G iPhone looked very different. The 3GS-->4 looked VERY different and was a good reason for a name change.

Maybe they don't have the same theory for the iPads because honestly I do not see much of a difference between the form factor/material of the iPad vs the iPad 2.

Therefore I think the third-gen iPad will be the iPad 3.
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post #76 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

but I think Apple will include LTE in the next iPad or they are risking a backlash from the press.

I believe the ground-breaking retina display will keep the press busy. Of course they always find something to complain about (antennagate) but it never phased the iPhone, which is similar to numerous other examples people have pointed out.

Does anyone have a reliable breakdown of the iPads purchased comparing Wifi to 3G?
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post #77 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

A minor change in design? Not at all: https://twitter.com/#!/ankleskater/s...32874873405440

Yeah, not sure what the hell would be defined as a major design change. Triangular? Octagonal? Damned if I know.
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post #78 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ankleskater View Post

A minor change in design? Not at all: https://twitter.com/#!/ankleskater/s...32874873405440

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Yeah, not sure what the hell would be defined as a major design change. Triangular? Octagonal? Damned if I know.

Methinks they are judging it as minor based on the look of the product when turned off. It's like someone who had surgery to change their eye color. With their eyes closed, one might say "meh, I don't see anything worth paying $10000 for".

Ok, not the best analogy. But you get my pt
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post #79 of 109
3/4/12 at 9:42pm
Why in the hell would I buy and LTE iPad when I can use any LTE smartphone to connect my iPad to in order to get internet?
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post #80 of 109
3/4/12 at 10:10pm
I love the fact that some people are disappointed in the next iPad before it even gets announced. Blathering on about how they won't get one because it won't have (insert something they will rarely use) and then say they'll get a (insert an already released disappointment).

Here's an idea, wait until its announce first. If you still don't want one, don't buy one. Don't come crying to us when you are disappointed in it.
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