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New iPad adopts simple product naming Steve Jobs brought to Apple in 1997 - Page 3

post #81 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

A few people are calling the new name dumb. Well, I'm calling those people dumb and clueless, because the new name is great and it's a very smart move, taking the future into consideration. The name is not the "new iPad", which certain people falsely believe, it's just simply iPad from now on. The new iPad is the iPad (third generation).

No what's dumb is calling your second version iPad 2 and then not numbering the rest. The sensible thing to do is be consistent that way people understand.

I find a few issues with the name. Firstly does the device actually say 3rd generation on it anywhere? Otherwise when you go to sell it how do you actually find out (this is more an issue in a few years when you have no idea how many versions there's been)

Second, what's it going to say in the compatibility list in iTunes on apps? Rather than iPad, iPad 2, iPad 3 etc its now going to list of 3rd Generation, 4th Generation, which also can't be shortened to 3G as that's something completely different.

So its not like they've got rid of the individual names, there just really really long. E.g
the item listed on my order was a iPad with Wi-Fi 16GB - White (3rd generation.
post #82 of 132
Quote:
By centering on a single brand name for each major product category it sells, Apple spends much less on advertising and promoting new brands and customers find it easier to find what they're looking for and ask for it by name.

Thats a false assumption.

Apple is often the company spending the most on advertising.

Hell, even Steves biography states they spent the largest out of all the markets when starting up the ipod brand. On this side of the world, I see constant iphone adverts, ipad adverts, and the occasional macbook air advert. Cant say I really ever see anything out of the competition. When i do, its usually the cell providers advertising android, and occasionally a galaxy SII.
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post #83 of 132
Apple had to change the name sooner or later. Remember those "NOW" music cd's that we all use to buy. What number did you stop at. It just gets ridiculous after some many years and iterations that people just tend to not care about the product anymore. BTW, if you're interested, you can pick up your copy of "NOW 41" here in the US. I also saw that there is a "Now 81" but it appears to be the UK series.
post #84 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by tundraboy View Post

I would say that too if I just said something stupid and ignorant online and was then made to look silly and foolish.

You're the one looking silly and foolish for getting bent out of shape over a harmless comment pointing out the big hole in this naming scheme.
post #85 of 132
I wonder if this new name is a sign that we should expect an iPad mini.

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post #86 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by F1Ferrari View Post

I just wonder if the 'old' iPads will be continually called the 'iPad 2', or if eventually they will become education only models, like the white MacBook was for the last year of its life.

That's probably going to be the biggest problem next year if they continue to sell the old one. That's one thing that distinguishes the other products from iOS products is that Apple doesn't simultaneously sell the old one and new one together outside the refurb store.

On the other hand, I think they have probably reached the pinnacle of the iPad design so every subsequent model will look identical. Hopefully that won't be the case with the iPhone but you never know.
post #87 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

...

Here is a 1933 Duesenberg Model SJ Phaeton ( Year, Make, Supercharged, J Model, Phaeton Body style:

The car could do 100 mph in 2nd gear.

Saw a Duesey a few years ago, on the street. Would love to have made the owner an offer... \
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post #88 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

It's an iPad...

Those who are diffident about owning an iPad, can just buy some other piece of shit!

Dick, please, language!

(You're right though )
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post #89 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I wonder if this new name is a sign that we should expect an iPad mini.

Nooooooo!!!
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post #90 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I wonder if this new name is a sign that we should expect an iPad mini.

iPad Air...
post #91 of 132
I must say that it's a sure sign of how great the product is when the only thing to complain about is the name. I guess the Apple haters are really scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Just like the iPhone 4S. The biggest complaint was simply that it didn't have a new appearance. When that's the only major complaint, it shows what a great product it is.
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post #92 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

I must say that it's a sure sign of how great the product is when the only thing to complain about is the name. I guess the Apple haters are really scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Just like the iPhone 4S. The biggest complaint was simply that it didn't have a new appearance. When that's the only major complaint, it shows what a great product it is.

Don't forget that people are complaining that Apple is erroneously calling HSPA+, DC-HSPA, and LTE '4G'.

Oddly we're not hearing too many complaints about the extra thickness or weight.

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post #93 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

I must say that it's a sure sign of how great the product is when the only thing to complain about is the name. I guess the Apple haters are really scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Just like the iPhone 4S. The biggest complaint was simply that it didn't have a new appearance. When that's the only major complaint, it shows what a great product it is.

Exactly.

And while a couple dozen people on these internet forums complained about the name for the last 4 days... Apple had a couple million pre-orders for this nameless iPad over the last 4 days.

Hmmmm.... the name must not be a big deal, after all.
post #94 of 132
The simplified naming means that people who buy Apple equipment get very different hardware with the same name. So you don't know whether something will work or not just based on the model. When trading used hardware, people have to invent their own names, like a "late 2011 MacBook Air 11''" etc. On the whole, this is typical Apple:make things appear simple when they really aren't, and let someone else deal with the mess.
post #95 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Exactly.

And while a couple dozen people on these internet forums complained about the name for the last 4 days... Apple had a couple million pre-orders for this nameless iPad over the last 4 days.

Hmmmm.... the name must not be a big deal, after all.

It's fun to play iSherlock to deduce the most likely path you think Apple will take given the known information but I think most people just want the device to work well. They could call it the Samsung Zune Eee Pad for all I care. I'd still buy the product they demoed.

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post #96 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by yu11 View Post

The simplified naming means that people who buy Apple equipment get very different hardware with the same name. So you don't know whether something will work or not just based on the model. When trading used hardware, people have to invent their own names, like a "late 2011 MacBook Air 11''" etc. On the whole, this is typical Apple:make things appear simple when they really aren't, and let someone else deal with the mess.

How did Apple ever survive with just MacBook Pro or MacBook or MacBook Air or Mac Pro or Mac mini or iPod or iPod Nano or iPod Shuffle or AirPort Extreme or AirPort Express without having the year, generation, or some other qualifier appended to it. I bought my MacBook Pro in 2010 but without it officially saying MacBook Pro 2010 on the device I'll never really be sure¡ Is that top still spinning?

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post #97 of 132
Quote:
Perspective:

Using 3GPP and 3GPP2 standards backed by the ITU the slowest maximum theoretical speed of a '3G' tech is CDMA2000 1X with

whooping speeds of 153 Kbit/s.

Now lets compare that to the old ITU definition of '3G' you find that HSPA+ with a current maximum speed of 168 Mbit/s (172,032 Kbit/s), as well as LTE with 299.6 Mbit/s (306,790 Kbit/s).

That's a performance increase of 112,439% for HSPA+ and 200,516% for LTE that people want to say all belongs in the same generational category as a marketing term presented to the average consumer. Does that really make sense?

"Generations" doesn't refer to speed, it refers to underlying technology. 3G and 4G use different encodings. Calling a 3G standard a 4G standard just because you think it's fast enough makes about as much sense as calling a PC a Mac because you think it's fast enough.

Those theoretical maxima are also irrelevant. Carrier networks are deployed to deliver a maximum of 21Mbps or 42Mbps, but US carriers manage to deliver maybe 7Mbps, which networks in Europe manage to deliver using simple HSPA. That is, actual HSPA+ speeds in the US are firmly in the range usually delivered by 3G networks around the world.

The only reason for the 4G/3G confusion in the US is because carriers are so overloaded and using such outdated technology that 4G has caught up with them before they ever got around to fully deploying 3G. HSPA+ has been deployed in Europe since 2009, and unlike the US, 3G networks in Europe actually deliver close to full speed in many places.
post #98 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I wonder if this new name is a sign that we should expect an iPad mini.

Ha! I was going to write that! But you beat me too it!

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post #99 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by yu11 View Post

"Generations" doesn't refer to speed, it refers to underlying technology. 3G and 4G use different encodings.

Which is fine for backend engineering but, as I stated, as soon as you make this something you market to the average customer the whole thing falls apart. Do you really think the average customer cares about the air interfaces, channel access methods, etc.? Of course not!

Customers care only about how it affects their end user experience so suggesting to a customer that CDMA2000 1X in some backwoods Verizon network is the same as LTE because they are both '3G' is erroneous and pointless. A measure of performance is the only logical method that can be understood by laymen... and the cardinal number followed by the letter 'G' is exactly what they think it refers.

Try asking some random person what's the difference between 3G and 4G? Chances are they will say 4G is faster. Ask them what the difference between CDMA2000 1X and DC-HSDPA and they will have no idea what you're talking about.

edit: How an 'x' scale rating adopted by carriers. Your device will show the least common factor between your cell tower and handset cellular HW based on a standard definition of '1x'. Let's say that's 10Mbit/s. That means if you are connecting to an HSPA+ node with a device that can handle 21Mbit/s HSPA+ your device will show '2x' which denotes double over the baseline max theoretical. If you are connecting to DC-HSDPA at 42Mbit/s it would show '4x'. A user would easily understand that '4x' is better than '2x' is better than '1x'.

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post #100 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

I wonder if this new name is a sign that we should expect an iPad mini.

Not likely.

They could introduce an iPad mini whether they called this one iPad, iPad 3, or iPad HD. None of those would conflict with an iPad mini.

That's not to say that they might not introduce an iPad mini - I don't know, nor do I care. But I don't think the iPad naming tells you anything one way or the other.
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post #101 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

That's probably going to be the biggest problem next year if they continue to sell the old one. That's one thing that distinguishes the other products from iOS products is that Apple doesn't simultaneously sell the old one and new one together outside the refurb store.

This!!! So right! Apple has been able to get away with generic names for products where the older model is discontinued in favor of the newer model. But in the case of the iDevices the older models is sticking around: The iPhone 3GS and 4 are still being sold new by Apple along with the 4S. Going to fully generic naming with the iPad means that if the previous generation continues to be sold as new by Apple, it's going to be confusing for customers and sales staff:

Joe Customer: "Hi, I'd like to get an iPad."
Apple Salesman: "Great, would you like the new iPad or the iPad?"
Joe Customer: "The iPad or the iPad???"
Apple Salesman: "Yeah, well we give you the choice, you can either get the new iPad with A8Z Processor and Intellitouch technology, or you can get the iPad with A7 Processor and HD+ Graphics. So do you want the new iPad or the iPad?"
Joe Customer: "I don't get the difference. It was easier to understand when they had clearer names."

With the next iPhone, you'll be able to choose the new iPhone, the iPhone 4S or the iPhone 4. Then with the next next iPhone you'll be able to get the new iPhone, the iPhone, the iPhone 4S. . . I understand that the iPhone product iteration numbers/letters are getting long in the tooth and unwieldy, but going ultra-minimalist will also cause problems.

In the car market you have the Ford Mustang as a generic model name, but at least you can figure out what Ford Mustang you're dealing with because the production year information is provided. And cars models are sold first and foremost by model year: 2012 Mustang, 2010 Mustang, etc. The consumer and the seller both can figure out a lot about the car being discussed just by looking at what model year it is. And even then there are different names associated with major features and trim levels (Mustang, Mustang GT, Mustang GT Cobra). I hope Apple considers putting the production year somewhere prominently in the marketing materials for each new iteration if it's going this minimalist naming route. There will have to be a short-hand way to refer to the different iterations going forward, and it seems to me model year is the only sensible way to do so.
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post #102 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post

Going to fully generic naming with the iPad means that if the previous generation continues to be sold as new by Apple, it's going to be confusing for customers and sales staff:

Joe Customer: "Hi, I'd like to get an iPad."
Apple Salesman: "Great, would you like the new iPad or the iPad?"
Joe Customer: "The iPad or the iPad???"
Apple Salesman: "Yeah, well we give you the choice, you can either get the new iPad with A8Z Processor and Intellitouch technology, or you can get the iPad with A7 Processor and HD+ Graphics. So do you want the new iPad or the iPad?"
Joe Customer: "I don't get the difference. It was easier to understand when they had clearer names."

I think you're making it out to be more complex than it is especially with your scenario. Why would they say "The iPad or the iPad???" when they can ask which one they wanted. They can say refer to it as new or the 2012 model or the faster one just as they can refer to it as black or white and WiFI-only or WiFi+4G and 16GB or 32GB or 64GB. These are all ways this device would have to be described in order for a customers to buy the 1 of 18 models even if it was called iPad 3 or iPad HD.

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post #103 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by EmperorsNewClothes View Post

It's a stupid and short-sighted name. What will they call the next one? The even newer iPad?

Everyone will call it the iPad 3. Nobody will call it "the new iPad" other than those paid by Apple to call it that.

What about MacBook Pro and MacBook Air? I don't recall it being called the new MacBook Pro, the new new MacBook Pro or the new new new MacBook Pro.
post #104 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

No... They'll call it the new iPad, again... they're exploiting the brand, not the model...

People who own the best, don't need to specify the model... It's a Ferrari, Beemer, Rolls, "It's a Duesey", iPod, iPad...

Brilliant... everything old is new again!


Edit: 'course the real "Dueseys" had model mumbers and other attributions:

Here is a 1933 Duesenberg Model SJ Phaeton ( Year, Make, Supercharged, J Model, Phaeton Body style:

The car could do 100 mph in 2nd gear.



uber sweet ride!! I'd give up a testicle for a ride around the block in this beauty!!
post #105 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

They could introduce an iPad mini

If they call it an iPad mini, the current one will be nicknamed the MaxiPad, given that maxi is the opposite of mini.

Not likely.
post #106 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

A few people are calling the new name dumb. Well, I'm calling those people dumb and clueless, because the new name is great and it's a very smart move, taking the future into consideration. The name is not the "new iPad", which certain people falsely believe, it's just simply iPad from now on. The new iPad is the iPad (third generation).

Nobody saw it coming. I think that most people were expecting the iPad 3 with some people speculating about an iPad HD while a few other silly and not too bright people speculated about an iPad 2 S.

The iPad will be around for many years to come and each year there will be a new model, just like with cars. Let the Android manufacturers release hundreds of models a year with all sorts of confusing and retarded names, that nobody can keep track of. Apple will simply have the iPad!

It's a brilliant and smart move by Apple!

The iPad is an iconic product, and the name iPad is all that needs to be said.

Amen for that.

You only have to read that article and look at the pictures and see there's a chasm between the start and the 'end.'

Jobs gave Apple one hell of a beating to get it into shape.

That last picture of the entire line up on one tiny picture is an awesome legacy.

I'd call it genius.

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post #107 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

If they call it an iPad mini, the current one will be nicknamed the MaxiPad, given that maxi is the opposite of mini.

Not likely.

Nice job clipping a tiny portion of my post to completely distort what I said.....
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post #108 of 132
Ipad hd? Who the hell thought apple would seriously even consider adding the tired, meaningless and boring hd moniker every dime a dozen manufacturer uses to the ipad (other than solipsismX that is)? Seriously, ipad hd would be the most unapple name I could think of.
post #109 of 132
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Originally Posted by AbsoluteDesignz View Post

I still cannot get over the Sprint Samsung Galaxy S II Epic Touch 4G

or tbf even:

"Sprint Samsung Galaxy S II, Epic Touch 4G (Black) Android Smartphone SPH-D710"

According to Samsung
post #110 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

Ipad hd? Who the hell thought apple would seriously even consider adding the tired, meaningless and boring hd moniker every dime a dozen manufacturer uses to the ipad (other than solipsismX that is)? Seriously, ipad hd would be the most unapple name I could think of.

1) Unlike you who demanded Apple to add all sorts of features simply because you wanted them I merely stated that calling it an iPad HD instead of iPad 3 wouldn't be out of the question as noted by the 2nd gen iPhone acquiring the 3G qualifier to help market added functionality.

2) The more vitriol and puerile emotion you exhibit the more pathetic you will look. My suggestion is for you to dial it back a bit but if you insist on instigating a fight I not hesitate to destroy you.

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post #111 of 132
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Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

Now it's time to kill completely the MacBook Air and MacBook Pro names and product lines.

And release an entirely new simplified notebook product line this year in 11, 13 and 15" sizes named "AirBook"

(no 17" version)

Yay, I can't wait until Apple's entire laptop line is limited to slow low-voltage CPUs, skimpy but expensive SSD storage, two ports and pokey integrated graphics due to space and heat constraints!
post #112 of 132
The brilliance of this naming move:

With it, Apple is saying: "Here is the iPad [and all that entails] -- a solution to some of your wants and needs... Anything else is, just not an iPad!"

Features, year, model don't matter... It's an iPad -- or it isn't.
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post #113 of 132
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Originally Posted by Cory Bauer View Post

Yay, I can't wait until Apple's entire laptop line is limited to slow low-voltage CPUs, skimpy but expensive SSD storage, two ports and pokey integrated graphics due to space and heat constraints!

Err... Did you happen to watch the games demoing the "pokey" graphics on that new iPad retina display?
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post #114 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by myapplelove View Post

Ipad hd? Who the hell thought apple would seriously even consider adding the tired, meaningless and boring hd moniker every dime a dozen manufacturer uses to the ipad (other than solipsismX that is)? Seriously, ipad hd would be the most unapple name I could think of.

Of course they wouldnt. Apple only adds a tired, meaningless and boring moniker to the iphone4s when it connects to at&t network.
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post #115 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

[...] By centering on a single brand name for each major product category it sells, Apple spends much less on advertising and promoting new brands and customers find it easier to find what they're looking for and ask for it by name. [...]

Makes perfect sense. Makes you wonder why Apple called the various iPhones "3G," "3GS," "4," and "4S" at all. (And also makes you wonder why Apple named last year's iPad the "iPad 2" at all.)

My guess is that Apple marketing originally thought it was important to differentiate each year's model. Then, I'd imagine that they did another study recently and found that customers just walked into the store and asked for "the new iPhone," like you'd expect them to do. And I'd guess that shoppers search for "new iPhone" on Apple.com when they order iPhones online.

The customer is always right. Why even bother figuring out a new name for each year's iPhone, when simple is best?

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post #116 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

Makes perfect sense. Makes you wonder why Apple called the various iPhones "3G," "3GS," "4," and "4S" at all. (And also makes you wonder why Apple named last year's iPad the "iPad 2" at all.)

My guess is that Apple marketing originally thought it was important to differentiate each year's model. Then, I'd imagine that they did another study recently and found that customers just walked into the store and asked for "the new iPhone," like you'd expect them to do. And I'd guess that shoppers search for "new iPhone" on Apple.com when they order iPhones online.

The customer is always right. Why even bother figuring out a new name for each year's iPhone, when simple is best?

I'm thinking they felt the 3G connectivity in the 2nd gen iPhone had to be noted and then got stuck. With LTE coming *hopefully with the MDM9615 there really won't any more generational updates for awhile, just higher capacity and faster performance. I hope they keep it simple.

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post #117 of 132
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Originally Posted by cycomiko View Post

Thats a false assumption.

Apple is often the company spending the most on advertising.

Hell, even Steves biography states they spent the largest out of all the markets when starting up the ipod brand. On this side of the world, I see constant iphone adverts, ipad adverts, and the occasional macbook air advert. Cant say I really ever see anything out of the competition. When i do, its usually the cell providers advertising android, and occasionally a galaxy SII.

Interesting-- which side of the world is that? Because I can tell you that in the States, Android advertising sometimes feels like a solid 75% of every ad aired on television. Of course, that includes several different handset makers plus the carriers (particularly Verizon), who love to push big scary Android-as-raygun-from-the-future spots as a way to suggest they're some kind of cybernetic enhancement clinic that gives you superpowers.
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post #118 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

The 2013 iPad announcement is going to be interesting. I can just see Apple's line up now...

The New iPad
The Old iPad
The iPad 2

As the article states this policy only makes sense if you have just one model on sale at any one time as they do with the iMac, MBA, MBP, iPod Touch, etc, etc.

If you have old and new models on sale together it just gets confusing. They only way they could get around that is to add the year or generation number to the product as such:

iPad (4th Generation or 2013)
iPad (3rd Generation or 2012)
etc

Those details would have to appear alongside the pricing information on the inventory system and online checkout.

Frankly I don't care either way but I certainly wouldn't stoop to insulting people who prefer one system over the other as some have done above.

Thanks for saving me keystrokes.

Of course, for the number of pixels - not quite 3.14M (it rounds up to 3.15 alas), I still think...
iPad π ...would have been a great marketing name - except it took me 10 minutes to figure out how to get a decent looking rendition on screen, so hard to "viralize".....

...and so, so much for "Apple Pi".......

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


I don't see any of those things happening. The Mac is an important brand to Apple. Now before you say they dropped Mac from OS X for Mountain Lion note they also dropped iPhone from iPhone OS and made it IOS yet I doubt anyone would say the iPhone isn't important to Apple.

Maybe the great OS convergence will happen right after iOS 9 and OS X Jaguarundi as.....
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post #119 of 132
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpics View Post

Thanks for saving me keystrokes.

Of course, for the number of pixels - not quite 3.14M (it rounds up to 3.15 alas), I still think...
iPad π [...]

How about πPad.

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post #120 of 132
Apple sold the 2nd and 3rd gen iPod touch at the same time and no one batted an eye. Leads me to believe it'll be just fine calling the iPad and iPhone just 'iPad' and 'iPhone' from here on out.
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  • New iPad adopts simple product naming Steve Jobs brought to Apple in 1997
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