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Artist changes Apple, Foxconn monologue after admitting falsehoods [u] - Page 2

post #41 of 82
3/18/12 at 9:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post

So you're saying that Apple's use of cheap labor in China via Foxconn is not a political issue?

While it may be a political target by the people you mentioned Apple does not use Foxconn to manufacturer their products because it's a political issue, they use it because it substantially reduces the cost of their products at a given quality level.

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post #42 of 82
3/18/12 at 9:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

[...] "Daisey lied to me and 'This American Life' producer Brian Reed during the fact checking we did on the story, before it was broadcast," Glass wrote in a statement. "That doesn't excuse the fact that we never should've put this on the air. In the end, it was our mistake." [...]

Lies? No fact-checking? Never should have been put on the air?

Maybe Daisey can get a job at Fox News.

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post #43 of 82
3/18/12 at 9:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

What is nice about this site is that we can all exchange ideas about a culture we all share and enjoy without bringing divisive politics into it.

Your comment appears to be shark chum.

If he had said Rush Limbaugh instead of Michael Moore would you have posted this comment?
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post #44 of 82
3/18/12 at 10:21am
I get where a lot of you are coming from but there is plenty paths to criticize Mike Daisey. Going on about his weight is lazy and uninspired. And it screams of the suggestion that you don't really know the details, nor care to.

C'mon. We're better than that.

I think it's been interesting to see that overlapping segment of the This American Life listener/Apple user Venn diagram become so conflicted. What a relief this outcome must be.
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post #45 of 82
3/18/12 at 10:26am
What a lying douchebag! I'd never even heard of that loser before, and I hope not to hear anything about him in the future either.

I have a great idea for his next act. I suggest that he commits suicide live during his show, in order to bring attention to the alleged workers suicide at Foxconn. I would tune in for that show and that is a worthy cause that I would consider financially supporting.
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post #46 of 82
3/18/12 at 10:28am
It's not "theater" it's lying.

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Please update the AppleInsider app to function in landscape mode.

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post #47 of 82
3/18/12 at 10:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post


Maybe Daisey can get a job at Fox News.

Doubtful. The liar already had the full support of the New York Times, which helped to spread his lies, falsehoods and slander to many ignorant people and readers.
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post #48 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:07am
I listened to the retraction of his show from This American Life. He is not apologetic and infact stands behind his work as is, these are his words not mine, and He refused to say he Lied which he did every time he went on the air with other news services and told them everything in his monologue was true.

When asked on This american life repeatedly if he lied about specific things his answer was always
"well I wouldn't put it that way" Never once did he admit he outright LIED. He even went on to say "all i can tell you is that i stand by what i told you that all of these things happened literally" He is a bald faced liar and should not be given any recognition and any legitimacy in any news outlet or even theater.
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post #49 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post

So you're saying that Apple's use of cheap labor in China via Foxconn is not a political issue? I beg to differ but it seems that many people bashing on Apple 'conveniently' forget that Apple is among among a vast multitude of corporations that use use labor in China and other developing countries. Also, it's not just computer technology; clothes, shoes, food, appliances, and so forth. Apple has indeed a political target for people like Daisey and Michael Moore if you read his website.

Of course it's political, as is spitting on the sidewalk in some places. That's no excuse for using the issue as a political football, as you did.

It's true that some people "conveniently" forget that Apple has to fight on the same turf as its competitors. I'm not one of them.

Again with the Michael Moore false equivalency! Cool it!

You've lost the opportunity to be taken seriously by letting your political bias get in front of the issue. I'm a liberal, and I'm also uncatagorically in Apple's corner on this one. Now, in the interests of fair disclosure, I'm also heavily invested (for my economic strata) in Apple. But there's zero doubt in my mind that Apple is being used as a scapegoat for much larger more systemic problems, and perhaps beyond that I strongly suspect that there are deep pockets egging on this attack behind the scenes. Apple has an enormous number of extremely powerful enemies and frightened competitors.
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post #50 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Can't believe all the priceless publicity this lying lowlife is getting (recognizing that I am contributing to it too).

Very clever on his part.

I don't care what you say about me, just spell my name right.
― P.T. Barnum

Fits this guy to a tee.
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post #51 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

More accurately from right wing fraud James O'Keefe who took down a great organization with a completely fake video then himself committed voter fraud in another video scam.

It must hurt so bad to wish so hard that that was the truth.
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post #52 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SockRolid View Post

Lies? No fact-checking? Never should have been put on the air?

Maybe Daisey can get a job at Fox News.

He's already been head-hunted by the New York Times.
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post #53 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:39am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

If he had said Rush Limbaugh instead of Michael Moore would you have posted this comment?

You have to ask?
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post #54 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

I remember when an "artist" used to be someone who painted stuff.

There are all kinds of artists, and they don't all just paint.

As for Mr Daisey. My issue with his monologue is that he marketed it as truth and not he's saying no, it is 'art' so not all the facts are facts at all. Plus he played games like saying he didn't remember the name of his translator or the person's number (because he didn't want anyone talking to her about what happened). When called out on the lies he pulls this "I'm not a journalist" excuse when he painted this as truth and never once claimed it was merely 'based on truth and recent rumors in the press etc'

And then there's the fact that he was stupid enough to think he would get away with this. That no one would find his translator or that she wouldn't find out what he was saying or would just shrug it off. It's embarrassing that this man, who some were treating as some kind of workers rights messiah, could be that dumb. it's up there with Gizmodo admitting that they paid money for a stolen prototype right on their blog rather than posting the info and claiming a source sent it to them so they could use shield laws.
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post #55 of 82
3/18/12 at 11:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bsginc View Post

hat's probably OK to keep on since Daisey seems to cling to the lies when he says his translator doesn't remember what he does. I guess calling her a liar would be too ironic!

Now we know why he wasn't using filmed moments with the folks he talked to. it would have been a much more powerful moment to see a clip of the man with the mangled hand talking about what happened. And seeing him see that finished iPad.
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post #56 of 82
3/18/12 at 12:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktappe View Post

Sure. Just as soon as all those deriding Michael Moore link to a legitimate news source that he is a liar.

Kinda childish response, but okay...

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_a...nheit_911.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvmQHo8I9TI

And there's this Daisey like denial:
http://www.commentarymagazine.com/20...-piers-morgan/

Your turn.
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post #57 of 82
3/18/12 at 12:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by tortlebow View Post

Yep, it is all about the money... Daisey was making $$$$$$ from this and "This American Life" was making $$$$$$$$$$ from this. (Public Radio and Ira Glass are for PROFIT - maybe not actual dollars for these two but certainly reputation and success in fund raising!!!)

So, profit wins over truth - every time! I listened to the "retraction" this weekend. Ira and company did give Daisey opportunity for retraction and asked "tough" questions AND then spent 20 minutes whining that they had been used. AND THEN spent 20 minutes trying to show how "most" of Daisey's monolog was "substantially correct."

They were squirming like a worm on a hook and like most over-the-hill organizations applying MAJOR spin doctor techniques to make it look "as good as possible." Desperate damage control!!!

The subtext:
"See how honest we are. We were USED and by the way we weren't that dishonest. We found a way to look BIG by attacking the most successful company on the planet. And look how we were able to damage it. Aren't we important?" ??!??!

Case Study: FOX NEWS.
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post #58 of 82
3/18/12 at 12:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacto Joe View Post

Of course it's political, as is spitting on the sidewalk in some places. That's no excuse for using the issue as a political football, as you did.

It's true that some people "conveniently" forget that Apple has to fight on the same turf as its competitors. I'm not one of them.

Again with the Michael Moore false equivalency! Cool it!

You've lost the opportunity to be taken seriously by letting your political bias get in front of the issue. I'm a liberal, and I'm also uncatagorically in Apple's corner on this one. Now, in the interests of fair disclosure, I'm also heavily invested (for my economic strata) in Apple. But there's zero doubt in my mind that Apple is being used as a scapegoat for much larger more systemic problems, and perhaps beyond that I strongly suspect that there are deep pockets egging on this attack behind the scenes. Apple has an enormous number of extremely powerful enemies and frightened competitors.

Why do you keep talking about Michael Moore and politics? The people you reply to aren't mentioning anything about politics.

Saying I think Daisey and Moore have a lot in common and are both insincere, lying idiots is in no way a political statement. As far as I know neither are politicians or claim to represent a political party. Why do you insist on trying to make it political?
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post #59 of 82
3/18/12 at 12:17pm
I knew the Apple store protesters were morons.
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post #60 of 82
3/18/12 at 12:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdkennedy1 View Post

I knew the Apple store protesters were morons.

If they are doing it because of Daisey's words then they were duped fools but I wouldn't lump all protestors into that same pile. I'm sure there are some that are noble in their posture even if you and I don't agree with their message.

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post #61 of 82
3/18/12 at 1:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Case Study: FOX NEWS.

What does FOX NEWS have to do with this story?

It is the New York Times that is directly connected to this story. It was the New York Times that gave the proven liar, Daisy, a platform, helping the liar to spread their lies. It is the New York Times that seems to have an agenda against Apple, with their BS stories. No wonder Apple recently dissed the New York Times by blacklisting them for a certain event. Screw the New York Times. Don't deflect away from the truth by mentioning something that has nothing to do with this topic.

It is the leftist media and liberal douchebag activists who are attacking Apple and spreading lies.
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post #62 of 82
3/18/12 at 1:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GQB View Post

More accurately from right wing fraud James O'Keefe who took down a great organization with a completely fake video then himself committed voter fraud in another video scam.

CRAWL back under your rock with all the rest of your commie ILK !!!!
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post #63 of 82
3/18/12 at 2:04pm
This guy looks more like Rush Lameball every day, now he talks like him to.
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post #64 of 82
3/18/12 at 2:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdriftmeyer View Post

Case Study: FOX NEWS.

Wouldn't you just jump for joy if Fox went away and everything went back to the way it used to be, with all the major networks sucking liberal leftist a-hole and apologizing for the socialists once again?

Get used to disappointment. Hooray Fox.
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post #65 of 82
3/18/12 at 2:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

What does FOX NEWS have to do with this story?

It is the New York Times that is directly connected to this story. It was the New York Times that gave the proven liar, Daisy, a platform, helping the liar to spread their lies. It is the New York Times that seems to have an agenda against Apple, with their BS stories. No wonder Apple recently dissed the New York Times by blacklisting them for a certain event. Screw the New York Times. Don't deflect away from the truth by mentioning something that has nothing to do with this topic.

It is the leftist media and liberal douchebag activists who are attacking Apple and spreading lies.

He mentions Fox News, like its some sort of declaration he should be lauded for, like what, we're in some asshat college lecture room and HE just figured out how to factor PI?

CASE STUDY!! FOX NEWS!!!

You are 100% correct, it IS liberal douchebag activists, like this jackass Daisey, like Greenpeace, The NY Times, et.al., and then some really WELL informed reader like this comes along to trumpet his opinions on Fox News (which has as much to do with this story about Apple as the Pope's Ballsack).
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post #66 of 82
3/18/12 at 2:46pm
America is too lenient with this kind of people. There is no accountability in US's system.
That is what caused the financial cries in 2008.

I would prefer this guy get locked the rest of his life.
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post #67 of 82
3/18/12 at 2:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

If they are doing it because of Daisey's words then they were duped fools but I wouldn't lump all protestors into that same pile. I'm sure there are some that are noble in their posture even if you and I don't agree with their message.

I don't think there is any noble in their posture. Stupid, probably. Noble, no.

I don't see why Apple needs to bow to them. Why Apple needs to do monthly update.
Apple should not bow to these evil people.
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post #68 of 82
3/18/12 at 3:25pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

I remember when an "artist" used to be someone who painted stuff.

I don't think we've seen a clearer case of libel in a long, long time. Purposefully misrepresented information and presented it as fact that has hurt Apple financially. No wonder the people around him are panicking, they know a giant monetary settlement is coming.

Fortunately, The 1st Amendment of the US Constitution protects Daisey, and others like him, even when I don't like it. In the US, to win a libel suit, you need to prove damages. You state "as fact that has hurt Apple financially". So tell us just how Apple is going to prove that. They seem to be doing quite well financially.
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post #69 of 82
3/18/12 at 3:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregInPrague View Post

Why do you keep talking about Michael Moore and politics? The people you reply to aren't mentioning anything about politics.

Saying I think Daisey and Moore have a lot in common and are both insincere, lying idiots is in no way a political statement. As far as I know neither are politicians or claim to represent a political party. Why do you insist on trying to make it political?

I'm the one who's trying to make it political?! ROFLMAO! You DO know how to read, don't you? Then I suggest you follow the conversation back through the various posts to its beginning. If you can't figure it out from there, then I doubt that anything I could say would serve to enlighten you.
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post #70 of 82
3/18/12 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacto Joe View Post

Mike Daisey and Michael Moore are as different as night and day, because Michael Moore is all about seeking out the lies of others while Mike Daisey is all about lying to support his own particular bias.

Well said.
"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
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"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
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post #71 of 82
3/18/12 at 5:59pm
So much chest thumping over this "discovery". Why?

It was obvious from the beginning that Mike Daisey's show was at best disingenuous - for example even when challenged over the suicide figures (below the national average, and inflated for one year because of Foxconn's one-off compensation package to the families of those who suicided), his self-enriching rationalisations were transparent.

And even now that his dishonesty has been revealed for all to see, he still refuses to apologise or acknowledge it, except to say it's entertainment not journalism (patently dishonest - he does present his lies as fact).

How long ago is it that a revelation like this would have meant the instant collapse of a career, and tears and apologies for misleading the American public? Now it's so much the norm in every day news and politics that we hardly blink, and wonder what the fuss is about. How long will it be before Mike Daisey has his own syndicated show out of this? He's fulfilled all of the requirements.
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post #72 of 82
3/18/12 at 6:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Apple has refused to comment on the controversy surrounding the monologue. CEO Tim Cook did, however, dismiss the show last February at an annual shareholder meeting. At the time, Cook reassured investors that Apple has "the highest standards" for worker safety and environmental friendliness.

"I don't need to see a play. I know Steve Jobs," he said.

Also known as not feeding a troll. After all, they live for attention.
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post #73 of 82
3/18/12 at 8:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Doubtful. The liar already had the full support of the New York Times, which helped to spread his lies, falsehoods and slander to many ignorant people and readers.

I'd like to live inside your mind, just for one day.
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post #74 of 82
3/18/12 at 8:16pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by echosonic View Post

He mentions Fox News, like its some sort of declaration he should be lauded for, like what, we're in some asshat college lecture room and HE just figured out how to factor PI?

CASE STUDY!! FOX NEWS!!!

You are 100% correct, it IS liberal douchebag activists, like this jackass Daisey, like Greenpeace, The NY Times, et.al., and then some really WELL informed reader like this comes along to trumpet his opinions on Fox News (which has as much to do with this story about Apple as the Pope's Ballsack).

Lets just agree that there exists bad and good journalism on both sides of the political spectrum. Neither side can really claim the higher ground.
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post #75 of 82
3/19/12 at 2:52am
When people sense they're becoming irrelevant they do irrelevant things. This is not new. A Daisy chain of similar sensational journalism can be traced back to colonial times. Daisy simply traded his perceived credibility for short term notoriety in the hope that it will get him noticed. Attacking Apple is just the slime du jour that comes out of the media.

Credibility is the lifeblood of journalism. When you loose it it's game over. The NYT knows this so I'm surprised they published these allegations without verification.
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post #76 of 82
3/19/12 at 4:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightymike View Post

When people sense they're becoming irrelevant they do irrelevant things. This is not new. A Daisy chain of similar sensational journalism can be traced back to colonial times. Daisy simply traded his perceived credibility for short term notoriety in the hope that it will get him noticed. Attacking Apple is just the slime du jour that comes out of the media.

Credibility is the lifeblood of journalism. When you loose it it's game over. The NYT knows this so I'm surprised they published these allegations without verification.

Partially agreed, as to "it's old as the Pyramids". Partially disagreed, as to "When you loose it it's game over."

Bad journalism sent the USA in a war against Spain in 1898 and then a few decades later in a war against Germany in 1915 (Lusitania, actually, _was_ an armed weaponry-transport...)
As far as I know, journalism hasn't become better. Fox News even makes money.

(Fun irrelevant fact, Lusitania means "Portugal", the closest neighbor to Spain.)

Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

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Social Capitalist, dreamer and wise enough to know I'm never going to grow up anyway... so not trying anymore.

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post #77 of 82
3/19/12 at 4:40am
Thank God! Apple IS perfect after all...
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post #78 of 82
3/19/12 at 4:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode 5 View Post

http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/conte...1/s3334201.htm

October 6th 2011.

"Jobs 'more showman than geek': Daisey"

Well, despite all his flaws, his description of Jobs sounds about right.
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post #79 of 82
3/19/12 at 5:07am
How exactly does their fact checking process work?

Daisey: I saw underage workers at FoxConn.
Fact Checker: Are you sure?
Daisey: Yep, that's what I saw.
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post #80 of 82
3/19/12 at 5:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ochyming View Post

Can Apple shareholders sue this EVIL clown?

Anyone remember that Renault spying brouhaha in France, how heads rolled?.
And How French government went full charge loaded blaming China?

Why you can lie against a comapny like Apple or any other similar in the USA and nothing happens to you?


: Something is wrong.

Why sue him? He's done the company an INCREDIBLE service. Because of this, EVERY criticism of Apple's Chinese manufacturing practices will be suspect and tainted with incredulity. If anything, they should (quietly) thank him for a job well done.

The stock is over $600, The New iPad is selling faster than any Apple product in history, and they're announcing a major financial...something this morning. What damage did this story actually do?
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