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83-year-old woman sues Apple after walking into glass retail store door - Page 4

post #121 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post

She was sextexting at the time or she'd have seen the door. Women do this all the time.

That makes me wonder if anyone ever sexted using a telegraph.

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post #122 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macky the Macky View Post

You forgot to end your list with:
Do cartwheels down glass staircase: Priceless

For everything else there's Mastercard!
post #123 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Apple should just print a menu for payouts for injuries:
Broken nose: $1 million
Stubbed toe: $650,000
Nosebleed: $450,000
Trip on stairs: $350,000
Static electric discharge: $250,000
Mild discomfort of any kind: free iPod Touch
Mild embarrassment: free $50 iTunes Gift Card

you seriously made me lol
post #124 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by ewiz77 View Post

this is a joke.

Why not, our court system will award someone for doing something as stupid as taking the lid off their coffee, putting it in their lap, then driving off. Why wouldn't they give someone money for this? Personal responsibility has left this country, it's been replaced by the gimme culture. Everyone get your handout!
post #125 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by nkhm View Post

There are very obvious labels on the glass. This woman is just stupid and should be embarrassed rather than angry.

A sure sign of immaturity is not being able to laugh at yourself. 80 years old & still not grown up.
post #126 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

Just when I think Americans can't get any dumber. We are so lazy in this country and nothing is ever our fault. How fast could she have possibly been walking and how forward was she leaning to have hit her nose on the door first and to have broken it? I hope she doesn't get a dollar out of this. Or maybe, it would be even better to pay her one dollar less than whatever fees she is having to pay for legal representation.

All I have to say is.... don't believe everything you read on the internet. Also at that age it's possible that her vision and depth perception are pretty bad.
post #127 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by haar View Post

appleinsider really should have posted the picture of the store front. (macrumours)
yes the glass is clear... but there are four rows of grey balls on the floor where the display window section is... i would guess four feet worth... and i would assume that they are there to prevent or make it very hard for a smash-and-grab. thus, even if the glass was not there, if woulf be very difficult to walk over those balls. thus it is common sense that you should use the door, and not wall over the balls.

I think apple should change the white lines on the glass to hollow apple icons...

i wonder if this lady has problems with the sliding glass door in her house... i've walked into those. (a note to the family of that granny... make sure to supervise her entry/exit to/from the patio... she has a history of crashing into glass)

Good point, if it wasn't for the glass she would have flipped over the bars & busted her face open. There isn't any real way to look at this without realizing these people are opportunists just look looking to make easy money.
post #128 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

No not case and point. Read the facts of the Hot Coffee case. I even posted a nice link for it earlier. 180-190 degree coffee caused burns over 22% of her body in 2-3 seconds, including 3rd degree to 6% of her body. The boiling point for water is 212. Sit down on something that will trap the water and pour near boiling water in your crotch and see what happens. Spilling it was her fault (which was why McDonald's was viewed as only 70% at fault), but it was significantly over the temperature it should have been served at, which was all their fault.

And there is a lot more to this story. The woman was not driving, she was in the passenger seat. She spilled the coffee just taking the lid off to add milk and sugar. The coffee was hot enough that her clothes adhered to her body. Originally, she was only trying to get McDonalds to help out by paying her medical bills, but they refused to do so offering only $800. Prior to the lawsuit, they tried to settle again, primarily to pay for the medical bills, but McDonalds refused to settle. A mediator tried to get McDonalds to settle for $225,000 (the hospital bills were in the $130-150k range), but they refused. Once it went to trial, the jury found out that McDonalds had had a number of complaints and lawsuits before without taking any action, so they awarded 2 days worth of coffee sales (2.7M) in punitive damages because of the callousness in their dealings with the lady. In the end, the settlement was reduced to punitive damages of less than half a million.

That said, the McDonalds case and treatment for 3rd degree burns running more than $100k is a far cry from a broken nose ... In this case, the lawyer does not question that there are markings on the doors, but he claims that his defendant sees well and still did not see them. Personally, I think the point is that even if she sees well, that does not mean that she was paying attention to where she was walking. This case could just as easily be a lawsuit against a city for uneven pavement ....
post #129 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSquirrel View Post

No not case and point. Read the facts of the Hot Coffee case. I even posted a nice link for it earlier. 180-190 degree coffee caused burns over 22% of her body in 2-3 seconds, including 3rd degree to 6% of her body. The boiling point for water is 212. Sit down on something that will trap the water and pour near boiling water in your crotch and see what happens. Spilling it was her fault (which was why McDonald's was viewed as only 70% at fault), but it was significantly over the temperature it should have been served at, which was all their fault.

I'm plenty aware of the case. Some other points never mentioned are:

-she was ony awarded $160k- her out of pocket medical
-she was awarded $2.7 million in punitive damages (a rare judgement that sends a message to the corporation)
That $2.8 million total the judge lowered to $640k

"$2.8 million for spilled coffee? What an outrage!" you might say. What if I told the doubters that there were 700 cases the prior 10 years that received a settlement and McDonald's knew and actually told their franchises that regardless of the complaints and settlements, they still wanted the holding temperature to be 180 degrees- even the you would suffer at the least a severe 2nd degree burn and possible 3rd degree burns.
Now flip the script- its your 20 something wife who spilled the coffee in her lap. It ruins her reproductive organs and you can't bear children. Then you find out all McDonald's had to do was lower the temperature 10 degrees and it wouldn't have done that. Well guess what- that $2.7 million (reduced to $650k) made McDonald's end up changing their holding temperature to 170 degrees. Case solved. Law suits are a great thing in a lot of cases and put us on the same playing field as billion dollar companies. Don't let the money (corporations) blind you with misinformation and part-truths. Educate yourself and keep your rights as an American. Tort reform blows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Reread his comment. He's agreeing with you.

This

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post #130 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by elehcdn View Post

And there is a lot more to this story. The woman was not driving, she was in the passenger seat. She spilled the coffee just taking the lid off to add milk and sugar. The coffee was hot enough that her clothes adhered to her body. Originally, she was only trying to get McDonalds to help out by paying her medical bills, but they refused to do so offering only $800. Prior to the lawsuit, they tried to settle again, primarily to pay for the medical bills, but McDonalds refused to settle. A mediator tried to get McDonalds to settle for $225,000 (the hospital bills were in the $130-150k range), but they refused. Once it went to trial, the jury found out that McDonalds had had a number of complaints and lawsuits before without taking any action, so they awarded 2 days worth of coffee sales (2.7M) in punitive damages because of the callousness in their dealings with the lady. In the end, the settlement was reduced to punitive damages of less than half a million.

That said, the McDonalds case and treatment for 3rd degree burns running more than $100k is a far cry from a broken nose ... In this case, the lawyer does not question that there are markings on the doors, but he claims that his defendant sees well and still did not see them. Personally, I think the point is that even if she sees well, that does not mean that she was paying attention to where she was walking. This case could just as easily be a lawsuit against a city for uneven pavement ....

I typed mine before I read yours.

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post #131 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daekwan View Post



Yeah I gotta call bullshyt.

How do you not see the window, nor the actual DOOR HANDLES on the glass door?

Based on that picture it wasnt initially clear to me whether the balls were inside or outside of the shop and I have better than 20/20 vision.
post #132 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by ewiz77 View Post

this is a joke.

How so? It is common knowledge that you should place visual cues on large expanses of glass that someone might otherwise mistake for open passage.
post #133 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Naboozle View Post

How so? It is common knowledge that you should place visual cues on large expanses of glass that someone might otherwise mistake for open passage.

For birds, perhaps.
post #134 of 160
This angers me to no end. So some old bag walks her greedy self into a glass door.

So if she was walking out the of store, what did she think would protect the entrance? A magic door of hopes and dreams?

Then to make matters worse, not only is she stupid, but she's greedy. Or should I say maybe her wretched kids who are putting her up to this are greedy little idiots.

I mean, does anyone every take any personal responsibility for anything in the USA? Then a million dollars for a crusty, old, chewed-up, can't smell, purple nose? Give me a break.

Stankin' old greed bag!

-Alex
post #135 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by z3r0 View Post

Is it also hard to believe that a store has a door? In all her 83 years has she never entered a store or seen a glass door?

I"m curious about whether the door was closed. Every Apple store I have been to has either sliding doors or they have the doors locked in an open position all the time when the store is open (unless it is raining or snowing)

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post #136 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Look at the pictures on Macrumors:
http://www.macrumors.com/

Now explain how she has a reasonable claim. There are several feet of silver balls on the floor.

Moot since that is part of a display and might not have been present at the time of her incident or in the area where she was walking.

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post #137 of 160
Yes...it could have been prevented. If only she was watching where she was going.
Any Apple store I have been to has always had something just on the other side of those glass walls. What...was she planing on navigating he agile little old self between all those cables and hanging displays, and kicking her way through the silver balls on the floor?

Old or not, if she "sees well", she obviously wasn't paying attention.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CogitoDexter View Post

Actually, I don't think this claim is entirely without merit.

A clean plate-glass window that has no visible frame and goes from ground to ceiling is, essentially, invisible. I've walked into such things before, albeit with no after effects beyond bruised pride, and I'm no dunce about modern architecture (it was my first choice of career).

In the UK, such plate-glass 'walls' generally have patterns or lines etched into them at approximately eye-level so that there is, at close quarters, a visual barrier which prevents most if not all people colliding with them.

Apple undoubtedly has third-party liability insurance for this sort of event and it will almost certainly settle long before the case comes to a formal hearing. That doesn't mean that the 'little old lady' is taking them for a ride though. She was injured and the injury was something that could have been foreseen and prevented with a small amount of care and forethought.

It's not a joke, and it's not an 'only in America' thing either. I'm one of Apple's biggest fans (I've spent ungodly amounts of money on Apple kit!) and I'm still capable of seeing that she has genuine cause here. The $1m is a lawyer's starting-pistol it's not her ultimate game plan, I'm sure. I dare say she'll settle for a fraction of that. After all, broken noses cost money to fix! I'd say it will probably be settled for the cost of her treatment, plus a reasonable sum for inconvenience, pain and distress, so probably treatment plus $25k maybe. And we'll probably never know, since it'll be tidied up nicely in a confidentiality agreement!
post #138 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by djsherly View Post

Based on that picture it wasnt initially clear to me whether the balls were inside or outside of the shop and I have better than 20/20 vision.

THat the doors just to the top of the balls are locked in an open position would have been your clue if you were actually there

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post #139 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by j1h15233 View Post

Just when I think Americans can't get any dumber. We are so lazy in this country and nothing is ever our fault. How fast could she have possibly been walking and how forward was she leaning to have hit her nose on the door first and to have broken it? I hope she doesn't get a dollar out of this. Or maybe, it would be even better to pay her one dollar less than whatever fees she is having to pay for legal representation.

There's an episode of Justice League Unlimited where John Stewart is standing trial on an alien world and the judges say that they solved their lawyer problem by forcing the lawyers to adhere to the same penalty of their clients if they lost. In some cases, this would be one of the best things that could ever happened to this country.

Apple should offer to settle with an iTunes Gift Card

Edit: @msantti beat me to it!


Quote:
Originally Posted by msantti View Post

1 million dollar iTunes gift card!

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post #140 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Apple should offer to settle with an iTunes Gift Card

A custom gift card, just for her. Something like this.

post #141 of 160
I say go for it old lady. Those greedy bastards at Apple have more money than they know what to do with, so screw them for all you can get. I hope you enjoy the payout.
post #142 of 160
My own sister crashed through a glass door as a kid. And I saw a guy walk into a bus shelter that was made of glass. Neither broke anything however. Stuff always happens like that went you are not paying attention to where you are going or what's in front of you. This reminds me of the woman who sued a mall because she fell into a fountain.
post #143 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzzz View Post

This reminds me of the woman who sued a mall because she fell into a fountain.

It wasn't this woman, was it?

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post #144 of 160
I'm sorry, but I find this whole thing hilarious.
post #145 of 160
Yep that's her. LOL
post #146 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by hmm View Post

All I have to say is.... don't believe everything you read on the internet. Also at that age it's possible that her vision and depth perception are pretty bad.

But then if her vision is not what it once was, and neither is her depth perception
Maybe walking alone is no longer an option for her
I don't think it's fair to sue apple because her eyesight has gone bad
To the average human being, this glass door is not an issue
post #147 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

It wasn't this woman, was it?

In the good old days
You could point at that lady and say "dumbass!"
But now, it's our fault for putting a fountain in a shopping mall
maybe we should have mall helpers, that hold our hand and take us from store to store
Warning us of glass doors, fountains, stairs etc
post #148 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garamond View Post

*Knock-knock*

Who's there?

Little old lady.

Little old lady who?

I didn't know you could yodel.

not bad!! not bad at all!!!!
post #149 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suddenly Newton View Post

Apple should just print a menu for payouts for injuries:
Broken nose: $1 million
Stubbed toe: $650,000
Nosebleed: $450,000
Trip on stairs: $350,000
Static electric discharge: $250,000
Mild discomfort of any kind: free iPod Touch
Mild embarrassment: free $50 iTunes Gift Card

little old lady doing a face plant on a glass door.....Priceless!!
post #150 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedromartins View Post

she broke her nose and she asks 1 million?
1 million????
1 million???
really? 1 million???

even 1000 dollars would be too much!

1 million? lol

In the McDonald's coffee case, the jury awarded Stella Liebeck, the 79-year-old coffee victim, $160,000 to cover medical expenses and compensatory damages and $2.7 million in punitive damages. In the end after several appeals, she ended up settling out of court and received around $600,000. I wonder how must this lady will get from Apple.
post #151 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by capoeira4u View Post

In the McDonald's coffee case, the jury awarded Stella Liebeck, the 79-year-old coffee victim, $160,000 to cover medical expenses and compensatory damages and $2.7 million in punitive damages. In the end after several appeals, she ended up settling out of court and received around $600,000. I wonder how must this lady will get from Apple.

The cases are different enough that the McDonald's case isn't much guidance.

While I would never have voted with the jury in the McDonald's case, the fact is that there were hundreds of previous complaints over the same issue. McDonald's was clearly aware that there was an issue and chose to continue to serve coffee at the same temperature (either that, or the local store ignored company policy - which amounts to almost the same thing). Because of that, almost the entire award was punitive.

In this case, there is no history of people walking into glass doors and breaking their nose. That makes it simple negligence (even if the lady wins) and punitive damages are very unlikely to be awarded. So at most, she could recover her medical and legal expenses. But even that is unlikely - since so many millions of people use the store without difficulty.
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post #152 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

The cases are different enough that the McDonald's case isn't much guidance.

While I would never have voted with the jury in the McDonald's case, the fact is that there were hundreds of previous complaints over the same issue. McDonald's was clearly aware that there was an issue and chose to continue to serve coffee at the same temperature (either that, or the local store ignored company policy - which amounts to almost the same thing). Because of that, almost the entire award was punitive.

In this case, there is no history of people walking into glass doors and breaking their nose. That makes it simple negligence (even if the lady wins) and punitive damages are very unlikely to be awarded. So at most, she could recover her medical and legal expenses. But even that is unlikely - since so many millions of people use the store without difficulty.

You don't know that. Those complaints wouldnt be public until a hearing. While if I were betting, I would also guess it wasn't prevalent. But the truth remains- that we don't know. It might come out there are a thousand a year.

The saddest part is depending on the state, the punitive damages are now likely capped. I believe in Texas it's $150k- definately not enough to make them change any policies (or whatever company is found liable for whatever and given punitive damages). Said it once- ill say it again. Tort reform sucks.

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post #153 of 160
It's Manhasset.


"I have some great news and some horrible news"

"What?"

"I got an Apple Store job!"

"Fanstastic! What's the bad news?"

"It's in Manhasset."



She's not upset that she broke her nose. She's upset that it smudged her $25,000 nose job.
post #154 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andysol View Post

You don't know that. Those complaints wouldnt be public until a hearing. While if I were betting, I would also guess it wasn't prevalent. But the truth remains- that we don't know. It might come out there are a thousand a year.

The saddest part is depending on the state, the punitive damages are now likely capped. I believe in Texas it's $150k- definately not enough to make them change any policies (or whatever company is found liable for whatever and given punitive damages). Said it once- ill say it again. Tort reform sucks.

What does Texas have to do with this complaint?

Furthermore, if there were people walking into Apple stores left and right and breaking their noses, do you really think that you wouldn't have heard anything? For that matter, Apple's not the only store that uses glass windows in the front. Where are all these stories about people walking into windows and breaking their noses?

Clearly, it's not happening often.
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post #155 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Clearly, it's not happening often.


Now it will be!!! : )
post #156 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlandd View Post

Now it will be!!! : )

What we will see now is a spike in the incidence of Android users walking into the doors/walls/etc at Microsoft Stores (do they still have those?) and then Apple suing Samsung for copying their legal defense - and the blogosphere lit up with reports of how Android users are able to collide with stationary objects while using the device without damage - unlike the iOS device users who cannot walk and operate their device at the same time.

(that likely sounded better in my head that it came across in text).
post #157 of 160
Sorry but i can't picture it:

Walk into glass door, break nose...

Get payed for breaking your nose...

Maybe i otta go break my nose on an apple store.
post #158 of 160

So I stumbled across this forum after, guess what: breaking my nose on a storefront's glass.  The path to exit the store led right to it (you had to sidestep to the left for the door).  There were no markings on the glass whatsoever, and it looked just like an open frame leading to the vestibule (there was another door to the outside).  And you guys know what?  I wish they would have had some f*ing markings so I could have seen it.  If it takes a couple small lawsuits to implement injury and/or life saving design in business, I'm all for it, and my ugly, bloody, and swollen broken nose would have appreciated it too.  Pretty soon, this stuff gets integrated into building code, and we all win.  No, I don't plan to sue, but only because I don't have the time.  But I'm willing to bet this happens all the time. 

 

Also, I'm glad to see that a few people here correctly understand Liebeck v. McDonalds.  That lady had third degree burns on her vagina --the water was practically boiling-- and McDonald's wrote a real nasty letter when she asked for them to pay her medical bills from all the skin grafts.  2.6M = 2 days worth of coffee revenue, what's the big f'n deal?  Are you really so protective of the corporation?  It's always the same hyperjudgmental, but probably fat, ugly, and stupid middle aged Missourian in the f'ing service industry who feels so self-righteous that indignation is his kneejerk response.  Let us protect ourselves, including you, you dumb jerks.
 

p.s. Apple blows, get a real machine and go Linux. 

post #159 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by grant View Post

p.s. Apple blows, get a real machine and go Linux. 

Hi, troll. Bye, troll.
post #160 of 160

was only a joke, career forum dude.  Mac away.
 

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