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Societal Atrocity Vol 1: 33 preventable 9/11s per year, yet we do nothing

post #1 of 39
Thread Starter 
http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/...65165020080108

So much for having the "best healthcare system in the world." Who ranks first in having the fewest number of preventable deaths? France. Who ranks last amongst the 19 leading industrialized nations? Us. The United States. We do. Wonderful.

Quote:
If the U.S. health care system performed as well as those of those top three countries, there would be 101,000 fewer deaths in the United States per year, according to researchers writing in the journal Health Affairs.

We sank over a trillion dollars in this misguided War on Terror. Yet, here we have 33 ANNUAL 9/11s that we choose not to prevent that would not come close to the economic cost of the wars launched over 3000 deaths.

Quote:
Nolte said the large number of Americans who lack any type of health insurance -- about 47 million people in a country of about 300 million, according to U.S. government estimates -- probably was a key factor in the poor showing of the United States compared to other industrialized nations in the study.

"I wouldn't say it (the last-place ranking) is a condemnation, because I think health care in the U.S. is pretty good if you have access. But if you don't, I think that's the main problem, isn't it?" Nolte said in a telephone interview.

Access. That's the key. Currently we have a convoluted system with a myriad of insurance providers and payment systems, making the costs of any individual procedure completely opaque. Not only that, doctors keep jumping in and out of networks--my doctor left my network so if I want to continue that relationship which I have built up over the years, I need to switch insurance providers somehow (good luck with getting the same rate) or pay out the ass independently. Access. Single-payer would streamline all of that.

Well, it's not all bad news. We are improving. Since the last study, we've reduced the preventable deaths by 4%. That's kinda nice.

Quote:
All the countries made progress in reducing preventable deaths from these earlier rankings, the researchers said. These types of deaths dropped by an average of 16 percent for the nations in the study, but the U.S. decline was only 4 percent.

Oops. That's WAY below average compared to the other industrialized nations. Now that looks rather pathetic. Fine, but that's the only other bad news, right?

Quote:
"The fact that other countries are reducing these preventable deaths more rapidly, yet spending far less, indicates that policy, goals and efforts to improve health systems make a difference," Schoen added in a statement.

We spend more for worse results? Fuck.

By the way, where's the private charity in all of this that the local libertarian front likes to say will step in and save lives? THIRTY-THREE ANNUAL 9/11s. Where's the compassion? Where's the charity? Where's your love for your fellow countryman?

We are an embarrassment to the world until we establish healthcare as a human right and have single-payer.



Carrying the torch for tonton in this thread here. I'll miss ya around here, buddy.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
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post #2 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

We are an embarrassment to the world until we establish healthcare as a human right and have single-payer.

Healthcare is not a right if it has to be "established".

Human rights are inalienable and exist independent of governments, which can only protect them, at best, and infringe upon them, at worst.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #3 of 39
Thread Starter 
Semantics. How can we have the right to life and liberty without the healthcare to maintain the former to allow for the latter?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #4 of 39
You do not have a natural human right to other peoples' property.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #5 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Semantics.

Wrong.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

How can we have the right to life and liberty without the healthcare to maintain the former to allow for the latter?

How can you provide a "right" to healthcare services without infringing on the rights of life and liberty of some?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #6 of 39
Thread Starter 
You so callously ignore 100,000 annual preventable deaths. That's a terrible society with backwards priorities.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #7 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You so callously ignore 100,000 annual preventable deaths. That's a terrible society with backwards priorities.

If you're not going to answer the question and simply make false accusations then just say so.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #8 of 39
Thread Starter 
How is that a false accusation? You clearly have established that you are not in favor of a system that is similar to other industrialized nations that have better outcomes for less money. You very narrowly define liberty and put it on a pedestal, above 100,000 human lives lost every year. I will call that callous.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #9 of 39
BR, the ends do not justify the means.

It is wrong to forcefully deprive a minority of their rights for the benefit of the majority.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #10 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

How is that a false accusation?

Because it is. I do not ignore (callously or otherwise) the plight of those having difficult getting access to adequate medical services.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You clearly have established that you are not in favor of a system that is similar to other industrialized nations that have better outcomes for less money.

You question begging aside, I'll simply address the non sequitur: Simply because I oppose the socialist approach to health care that advocate does not mean that I "callously ignore 100,000 annual preventable deaths."


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You very narrowly define liberty and put it on a pedestal, above 100,000 human lives lost every year.

Of course not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

I will call that callous.

You can call whatever you want whatever you want. That doesn't make it so.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #11 of 39
Thread Starter 
Where's your private charity filling in the gaps? If they can't fill in these gaps while we DO have some services for the poor, what happens when you take those services away? Your track record shows that you live in a fantasy land.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #12 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Where's your private charity filling in the gaps?

Most likely being crowded out by government taxes and spending.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Your track record shows that you live in a fantasy land.

Thanks for sharing your opinion about me.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #13 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Most likely being crowded out by government taxes and spending.

Those with most of Americas wealth have become dramatically wealthier but they're giving as a percentage of their annual income has remained static at around 3%.

Americans already spend 16% plus of GDP on healthcare. The government pays over half the cost of the nations healthcare bill. There's no way, especially as Libertarians want to get government out of healthcare, that charity could ever meaningfully fill the void.
"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #14 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Those with most of Americas wealth have become dramatically wealthier but they're giving as a percentage of their annual income has remained static at around 3%.

Have their incomes gone up significantly?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Americans already spend 16% plus of GDP on healthcare. The government pays over half the cost of the nations healthcare bill. There's no way, especially as Libertarians want to get government out of healthcare, that charity could ever meaningfully fill the void.

Thanks for sharing your opinion.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #15 of 39
If I get a private foundation to fund two researchers to come up with a study in an area of my interest. BR will support altering 1/6th of the entire U.S. economy towards whatever actions I have the study determine.

Too bad BR wields about as much power in real life as a kindergartener. If he had more ability to influence anything I'd fund that study. Also if you go read the actual study (I did) you'd see that many of the variables are completely arbitrary. Why pick 75 as the upper age limit? Good question.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #16 of 39
Quote:
Have their incomes gone up significantly?

Yes, in varying amounts. At the top end the wealthiest 400 Americans income have quadrupled since 1995 whilst the percentage they pay in taxes on their income has fallen from 30% in 1995 to 18% today. Did they give a bigger share of their income to charity...nope.
"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #17 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Yes, in varying amounts. At the top end the wealthiest 400 Americans income have quadrupled since 1995 whilst the percentage they pay in taxes on their income has fallen from 30% in 1995 to 18% today. Did they give a bigger share of their income to charity...nope.

So, they're giving more. Got it.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #18 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

So, they're giving more. Got it.

They're not even doing that in reality, because part of the way they've gained so much more wealth is because they and their cohorts have stagnated hundreds of trillions of dollars of wages below them.
"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #19 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

They're not even doing that in reality, because part of the way they've gained so much more wealth is because they and their cohorts have stagnated hundreds of trillions of dollars of wages below them.

No, they are giving more. You showed us yourself. This is a simple math problem.

Let's say that a rich person was making $500,000 and giving 3% of their income (which is what you've said is the average). They were giving about $15,000 a year.

Then their income grew significantly. Let's say it doubled to $1M and they are still giving about 3% (which is what you said)...which means they're now giving around $30,000 a year.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #20 of 39
Thread Starter 
At the expense of causing a depression for the rest of the nation. That's what Hands is talking about. Point is, the rich are wealthier than ever before in the last 100 years and yet somehow that extraordinary concentration of wealth at the top has not provided for everyone in need. Taxes are the lowest they have been for a century and yet private charity has not closed that gap.

What happens when you yank the Medicare rug out from everyone? You REALLY think private charity can close THAT GAP? Are you completely out of your gourd?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #21 of 39
Hey, nice posting. Calories in salad!
post #22 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/...65165020080108

So much for having the "best healthcare system in the world." Who ranks first in having the fewest number of preventable deaths? France. Who ranks last amongst the 19 leading industrialized nations? Us. The United States. We do. Wonderful.



We sank over a trillion dollars in this misguided War on Terror. Yet, here we have 33 ANNUAL 9/11s that we choose not to prevent that would not come close to the economic cost of the wars launched over 3000 deaths.



Access. That's the key. Currently we have a convoluted system with a myriad of insurance providers and payment systems, making the costs of any individual procedure completely opaque. Not only that, doctors keep jumping in and out of networks--my doctor left my network so if I want to continue that relationship which I have built up over the years, I need to switch insurance providers somehow (good luck with getting the same rate) or pay out the ass independently. Access. Single-payer would streamline all of that.

Well, it's not all bad news. We are improving. Since the last study, we've reduced the preventable deaths by 4%. That's kinda nice.



Oops. That's WAY below average compared to the other industrialized nations. Now that looks rather pathetic. Fine, but that's the only other bad news, right?



We spend more for worse results? Fuck.

By the way, where's the private charity in all of this that the local libertarian front likes to say will step in and save lives? THIRTY-THREE ANNUAL 9/11s. Where's the compassion? Where's the charity? Where's your love for your fellow countryman?

We are an embarrassment to the world until we establish healthcare as a human right and have single-payer.



Carrying the torch for tonton in this thread here. I'll miss ya around here, buddy.

.Health care is a right every citizen should have in the U.S. like they do in Canada when I lived there years ago.This Government is rich enough for us to have single-payer system.We waste millions of dollars on nonsense instead of a decent health care system.
post #23 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

At the expense of causing a depression for the rest of the nation.

Well you (and Hands) are making broad and sweeping statements about "the rich" then. It isn't "the rich" that caused this depression. If anything there were handful of well-connected crony "capitalists" in cahoots with the government and The Fed that caused this depression.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Point is, the rich are wealthier than ever before in the last 100 years and yet somehow that extraordinary concentration of wealth at the top has not provided for everyone in need. Taxes are the lowest they have been for a century and yet private charity has not closed that gap.

But the point is incomplete. You need to study a bit more of history when there wasn't this massive government welfare apparatus. Private charitable giving was meeting most if not all needs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

What happens when you yank the Medicare rug out from everyone? You REALLY think private charity can close THAT GAP?

Yes. However I will qualify this to say that the "gap" that may need to be filled isn't the same size as the current funding level. In fact it would likely be much, much less.

Now, granted, there would need to be a gradual draw down on many of these programs. While we have the chance, before the country goes bankrupt and has no choice but shock treatment, we can gradually move away from government-run programs to privately operated programs. This won't happen of course, so we will continue along this course until the whole thing goes bankrupt. Then we get to thank folks like you for the disaster and destruction that your socialism and Marxism has wrought on society...again.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Are you completely out of your gourd?

No, but thanks for asking.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #24 of 39
The sense of priorities displayed here is breathtaking.

Some folk here are getting bent out of shape by the act of questioning a system which rewards corporate parasites and is responsible for the needless deaths of 100,000 people each year, yetin the next breath, they glorify spending $hundreds of billions each year to slaughter innocent people overseas.

Stop trying to defend the indefensible. It doesn't work any more. Anyone can see through this shit.
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #25 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

The sense of priorities displayed here is breathtaking.

Some folk here are getting bent out of shape by the act of questioning a system which rewards corporate parasites and is responsible for the needless deaths of 100,000 people each year, yetin the next breath, they glorify spending $hundreds of billions each year to slaughter innocent people overseas.



Huh? Who in this thread is "glorify spending $hundreds of billions each year to slaughter innocent people overseas"? Or are you speaking more generally and broadly of the forum?

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #26 of 39
We're all questioning the system, are we not? We just disagree as to the origin of the problems with the system.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

Reply
post #27 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

The sense of priorities displayed here is breathtaking.

Is it really breathtaking? Did you read the study? Do you and BR even try to justify your continual outrage?

Quote:
Some folk here are getting bent out of shape by the act of questioning a system which rewards corporate parasites and is responsible for the needless deaths of 100,000 people each year, yetin the next breath, they glorify spending $hundreds of billions each year to slaughter innocent people overseas.

So it really is an OR question. One can only support one or the other. There are no other possible options. If anyone disagrees with you, they are a warmonger who might as well be putting a pistol to the temple of some innocent kid and pulling the trigger themselves.

That is pure nonsense. It is 100% pure bullshit. It is crap.

The left is the filthy enabler of big government crony capitalism. It is much harder for the rich to exploit the poor when they have to render services and good to receive money. It is much easier when the government rewrites the rules and declares they simply have no choice and thus must hand their money over to the rich.

So see Sammi, that is what you support. The great messiah, Obama and anyone else who lies through their teeth proclaiming and pursuing this fair and just life where everyone is their brother's keeper supports and enables it as well. When someone claims they will alter the nature of reality, of the world, and of human nature, all they do is open an opportunity for exploitation and theft.

Quote:
Stop trying to defend the indefensible. It doesn't work any more. Anyone can see through this shit.

You name for me someone who actually has supported the causes you claim, has made a difference and has altered the outcomes of people's live. Show me how if they weren't a martyr, that they didn't later become just as corrupt themselves or use the same old tired tropes to keep bringing in ever more money to do nothing but enrich themselves and exploit others. Name some names and point that finger in the mirror.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #28 of 39
So let me get this straight, BR. You see two possible systems. One is exactly what we have now (which cannot be fixed or improved) and 2) Universal, socialized medicine. Correct?
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post #29 of 39
Thread Starter 
Do those 18 other countries all have identical systems? You really think that, SDW?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #30 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Do those 18 other countries all have identical systems? You really think that, SDW?

By all means, explain the intricacies. Explain how you're not arguing for single-payer care in the U.S.
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post #31 of 39
Lawmakers in Congress enjoy taxpayer/government sponsored health care (in the FEHB, the government pays for 66%), on both sides of the aisle. How often do we hear these government sponsored health care beneficiaries complaining? Not much... just 16 out of all the GOP congressional lawmakers opted out in early 2011.. was this for PR purposes, and because they could afford to?

Most willingly accept, or even get pissy when the coverage doesn't kick in instantly... for example, a newly elected Republican congressman, who stood on an anti-Obama care platform, was outraged that his government subsidized health plan didn't start until he had been in office for 4 weeks!

Incidentally, former VP Cheney's recent heart transplant operation was paid for by the the taxpayer, under the same program that Obama is entitled to...

Whatever....
"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #32 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

Lawmakers in Congress enjoy taxpayer/government sponsored health care (in the FEHB, the government pays for 66%), on both sides of the aisle. How often do we hear these government sponsored health care beneficiaries complaining? Not much... just 16 out of all the GOP congressional lawmakers opted out in early 2011.. was this for PR purposes, and because they could afford to?

Most willingly accept, or even get pissy when the coverage doesn't kick in instantly... for example, a newly elected Republican congressman, who stood on an anti-Obama care platform, was outraged that his government subsidized health plan didn't start until he had been in office for 4 weeks!

Incidentally, former VP Cheney's recent heart transplant operation was paid for by the the taxpayer, under the same program that Obama is entitled to...

Whatever....

You obviously don't understand conservative thinking. They pay much more in taxes than most people therefore they are merely recouperating
"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #33 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

Lawmakers in Congress enjoy taxpayer/government sponsored health care (in the FEHB, the government pays for 66%), on both sides of the aisle. How often do we hear these government sponsored health care beneficiaries complaining? Not much... just 16 out of all the GOP congressional lawmakers opted out in early 2011.. was this for PR purposes, and because they could afford to?

Most willingly accept, or even get pissy when the coverage doesn't kick in instantly... for example, a newly elected Republican congressman, who stood on an anti-Obama care platform, was outraged that his government subsidized health plan didn't start until he had been in office for 4 weeks!

Incidentally, former VP Cheney's recent heart transplant operation was paid for by the the taxpayer, under the same program that Obama is entitled to...

Whatever....

You obviously don't understand conservative thinking. They pay much more in taxes than most people therefore they are merely recuperating some of what has already been stolen from them, effectively therefore making things fairer.
"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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"Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog"~ Sir Winston Churchill. We are nurturing a nightmare that will haunt our children, and kill theirs.
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post #34 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

You obviously don't understand conservative thinking. They pay much more in taxes than most people therefore they are merely recuperating some of what has already been stolen from them, effectively therefore making things fairer.

There is some truth to that, actually. The issue is that those who pay the bills don't really get many of the benefits.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #35 of 39
Thread Starter 
Those poor, downtrodden rich people. The only chunk of society to see gains during the depression we are just getting out of. Poor them.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #36 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Those poor, downtrodden rich people. The only chunk of society to see gains during the depression we are just getting out of. Poor them.

Your intellectual dishonesty knows no bounds.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #37 of 39
Thread Starter 
I feel terrible for the folks that actually have access to good healthcare. Just terrible.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #38 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Your intellectual dishonesty knows no bounds.

You're looking in the mirror when you say that right?
Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #39 of 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

You're looking in the mirror when you say that right?

Give me examples of me being intellectually dishonest.
I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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AppleInsider › Forums › Other Discussion › AppleOutsider › PoliticalOutsider › Societal Atrocity Vol 1: 33 preventable 9/11s per year, yet we do nothing