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Apple releases Flashback removal tool - Page 2

post #41 of 53
4/14/12 at 8:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hypercommunist View Post

I followed the Terminal instructions that were posted (here or ars.technica, can't remember). They ran no prob, system clean. Oh, but when I got the (3rd) Java update from Apple, it said: malware detected, removed.

Great. It's like we have PCs in the 90s.

So what led you to one of the infected sites?

Did you open any unusual email attachments, follow any strange links from social sites?

I've had Adobe Flash updates pop up, which I've closed and ignored then gone to Adobe's site to cross check the version available there and download if necessary.

The latest bunch of scam emails I've been getting aside from the usual "verify bank details" ones have been purpurtedly from Apple offering the bargain of $9 for a $100 iTunes card:-

a) They don't know my name

b) since when did Apple start using Hotmail?

I delete them without opening the attachment, a bit of common sense goes a long way with things like this.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #42 of 53
4/14/12 at 8:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by techno View Post

It would have to be modified in some way because as it is, the "learning phase" would drive most people crazy. It can be annoying to get those popups every few minutes for the fist couple of weeks. Plus, most people would not use it properly as it is designed now. Most would just click allow without reading.

Once you allow things you trust "Forever" you never see the pop ups again, unless something new like a trojan comes along.

The only annoying thing with the free demo version is the nag screen which pops up every three hours asking for a restart in demo mode, paying for it gets rid of this.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #43 of 53
4/15/12 at 3:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

Will Apple need to release a new fix like this every time a new virus/trojan/worm is discovered? That doesn't seem scaleable.

It seems like there must be a better way to do it, and if these things show up frequently, it would be complicated for users.

I think you know the answer to that.
But to make sure: this is one of the measures Apple takes to protect its users.
The other measures consist of making the platform secure via applications running in sandboxes, address randomization of library functions, access rights per application, application signing, reducing the dependency on web plugins by pushing HTML5, using an very secure - and open - version of (BSD) unix, an easy to use (or completely automatic) update mechanism, an App store and a plethora of others measures.
Note that this makes sure that viruses are practically impossible and that almost no other hazards have plagued Mac OS X (and it's users) for all these years, so your phrasing of 'every time a new ...' is misleading and clearly wrong.
It's nice to see that Apple takes responsibility for the security of its users and acts in a way no other company does by taking the extra step to eradicate and block criminals acting via the Internet.

J.
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post #44 of 53
4/15/12 at 8:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am a Zither Zather Zuzz View Post

Will Apple need to release a new fix like this every time a new virus/trojan/worm is discovered? That doesn't seem scaleable.

It seems like there must be a better way to do it, and if these things show up frequently, it would be complicated for users.

The message is: don't install Java and don't install Flash.

No-one seems to have twigged that by allowing this trojan to reach the level of general public consciousness, Apple has undermined two ageing and unnecessary technologies it wishes would die.
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post #45 of 53
4/15/12 at 8:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by enzos View Post

The message is: don't install Java and don't install Flash.

No-one seems to have twigged that by allowing this trojan to reach the level of general public consciousness, Apple has undermined two ageing and unnecessary technologies it wishes would die.


I doubt that the public consciousness even rises to the level of "Macs have a virus". While the story was picked up by the general media, the vast majority of people don't know or care, and so they skipped by it.

Vanishingly small numbers of people take away "Don't install Java".
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post #46 of 53
4/15/12 at 8:48am
For those of you with unsupported (older) OSes, I've posted the source code of an AppleScript that detects the Flashback trojan in the system or in Safari. I didn't account for other browsers.

macresource forum
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post #47 of 53
4/15/12 at 9:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacBook Pro View Post

Exactly. The existing firewall is already fairly robust. NoobProof is much better for the average user than Little Snitch.

Apple's Firewall is an incoming Firewall. This really is designed to prevent people from remotely causing damage. Little Snitch is an outgoing Firewall, which Apple's Firewall doesn't do.

In my view Little Snitch is pretty Noobproof. You install it and when an app tries to call outwards a window pops up and you tell it what you want to do.
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post #48 of 53
4/15/12 at 9:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

In my view Little Snitch is pretty Noobproof. You install it and when an app tries to call outwards a window pops up and you tell it what you want to do.

Telling it what to do means it's not noobproof. Then consider that it's for every service that comes up. It's not intelligent; it expects you understand what each port, app service does.

It looks like there are 24 different options which 3 setting categories for EACH pop up. That is not a novice system, IMO.

We already people that will click on phishing emails so how do we get users to know to deny or allow apps and services to what addresses on which ports are acceptable and if they should be acceptable for any connection, just the port in question, for any access to that site, or both, as well as if it should be allowed once, until quite, or forever?

"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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post #49 of 53
4/15/12 at 12:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Telling it what to do means it's not noobproof. Then consider that it's for every service that comes up. It's not intelligent; it expects you understand what each port, app service does.[INDENT]

It looks like there are 24 different options which 3 setting categories for EACH pop up. That is not a novice system, IMO.

We already people that will click on phishing emails so how do we get users to know to deny or allow apps and services to what addresses on which ports are acceptable and if they should be acceptable for any connection, just the port in question, for any access to that site, or both, as well as if it should be allowed once, until quite, or forever?

Hmmm...

Do I have a widget called Meteorologist Yes

Does it need to connect to get updated data Yes

do I want to see this again No

allow forever

The other protection in this particular instance is that if the trojan detected little snitch it deleted itself before doing anything.

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #50 of 53
4/15/12 at 1:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

Hmmm...

Do I have a widget called Meteorologist Yes

Does it need to connect to get updated data Yes

do I want to see this again No

allow forever

The other protection in this particular instance is that if the trojan detected little snitch it deleted itself before doing anything.

That's a fallacy of accident. if the user knows everything about the service needing internet access and what it's doing then the solution is simple but that is not the typical pop up for LS and it's certainly not the typical set of questions that go through the mind of a someone who is computer illiterate.

Just look at the what happened with Vista and it's excessive level of easily answerable yet annoying popups. It hurt the Windows brand... and we made fun of it.

If you've ever done tech support you should have an understanding of the level of ignorance that people have when it comes to computers and the internet. I use ignorant in its literal form, not an indication of such users being stupid. If anything is stupid it's too think that Apple would incorporate a complex system that requires the user to understand no less than 4 key components to every pop up with 24 different options, and not have the user be throughly annoyed and confused by this poor user experience.

"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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post #51 of 53
4/15/12 at 3:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

That's a fallacy of accident. if the user knows everything about the service needing internet access and what it's doing then the solution is simple but that is not the typical pop up for LS and it's certainly not the typical set of questions that go through the mind of a someone who is computer illiterate.

Just look at the what happened with Vista and it's excessive level of easily answerable yet annoying popups. It hurt the Windows brand... and we made fun of it.

If you've ever done tech support you should have an understanding of the level of ignorance that people have when it comes to computers and the internet. I use ignorant in its literal form, not an indication of such users being stupid. If anything is stupid it's too think that Apple would incorporate a complex system that requires the user to understand no less than 4 key components to every pop up with 24 different options, and not have the user be throughly annoyed and confused by this poor user experience.

You want me to click "Start" to make it stop?

"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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"The cobbler's children have no shoes", is a saying that applies a lot to companies who provide products and services. -KDarling on Google Search.

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post #52 of 53
4/15/12 at 3:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

You want me to click "Start" to make it stop?

"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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"Blank! BLANK! You're not looking at the big picture!"

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post #53 of 53
4/16/12 at 2:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post

Apple's Firewall is an incoming Firewall. This really is designed to prevent people from remotely causing damage. Little Snitch is an outgoing Firewall, which Apple's Firewall doesn't do.

In my view Little Snitch is pretty Noobproof. You install it and when an app tries to call outwards a window pops up and you tell it what you want to do.

Little Snitch is just a GUI for the built in OSX firewall.
The OSX firewall handles both outgoing as well as incoming connections...
It wouldn't be much of a firewall without that functionality...
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