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post #81 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

...

 

It isn't that PC makers couldn't make that same laptop. It is that their thinking just isn't the same. ...

 

Clearly, you have not been paying attention. It is obvious that Wintel OEMs do not think like Apple, but thinking differently is just the start of Apple's advantage. An essential element of Apple's advantage is its massive cash horde. It uses the money to build factories for its contractors that no combination of competitors can emulate. Apple cornered the market on the machine tools used to fabricate the aluminum bodies of its laptops. Everything goes under the microscope--from the raw aluminum for its laptop bodies to the last mile delivery to the customer. Part of this process is a complete study of every cost to produce everything. In that, Apple squeezes all identifiable costs to the bone.

 

You may fantasize about the ability of the Dells, the HPs, and the Lenovos to compete on production costs with Apple. In a drug-induced state, you may even fantasize about the white box OEMs competing with Apple. But in the real world, Apple has production advantages that are secure for the foreseeable future.

post #82 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Me View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

...

 

It isn't that PC makers couldn't make that same laptop. It is that their thinking just isn't the same. ...

 

Clearly, you have not been paying attention. It is obvious that Wintel OEMs do not think like Apple, but thinking differently is just the start of Apple's advantage. An essential element of Apple's advantage is its massive cash horde. It uses the money to build factories for its contractors that no combination of competitors can emulate. Apple cornered the market on the machine tools used to fabricate the aluminum bodies of its laptops. Everything goes under the microscope--from the raw aluminum for its laptop bodies to the last mile delivery to the customer. Part of this process is a complete study of every cost to produce everything. In that, Apple squeezes all identifiable costs to the bone.

 

You may fantasize about the ability of the Dells, the HPs, and the Lenovos to compete on production costs with Apple. In a drug-induced state, you may even fantasize about the white box OEMs competing with Apple. But in the real world, Apple has production advantages that are secure for the foreseeable future.

 

Please don't assume that because someone disagrees with you that they are ignorant or not paying attention. It is bad reasoning and rude. I'm fully aware of how Apple has been operating and I've been following them since I sold my Amiga 500 to purchase a Mac Classic II back in 1990 or thereabouts.

 

Dell at one time had lower production costs than almost anyone out there. A lot of good that does them now. PC's in general had Mac's beat on cost but ask almost anyone with smartphone how much they care about Windows or Microsoft Word. In most cases these sudden and radical changes have helped Apple but people make it sound like some part of a large plan that was all foreordained. That simply isn't so. Apple for example wasn't even going to open the iPhone to apps. Like a lot of success it has good dashes of timing, and luck tossed in.

 

No one is saying that is ending this second. The discussion is simply whether Apple can continue to sit back and offer the same product when PC makers are beginning to offer 90-95% of the same solution for close to half the cost. I don't think they can. I think it is May and we are still waiting for that exciting 2012 and given the increasing number of threads wondering the same across multiple product areas, I know I'm not alone.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #83 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

No one is saying that is ending this second. The discussion is simply whether Apple can continue to sit back and offer the same product when PC makers are beginning to offer 90-95% of the same solution for close to half the cost. I don't think they can. I think it is May and we are still waiting for that exciting 2012 and given the increasing number of threads wondering the same across multiple product areas, I know I'm not alone.

How many Apple products can you buy for half the cost from a PC vendor? There are few (if any) Apple products that cost twice what an equivalent product costs from someone else. When you do find an Apple product that's twice as expensive, it's because you're comparing it to a POS that's not even close to the same product.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
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post #84 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumptman View Post

No one is saying that is ending this second. The discussion is simply whether Apple can continue to sit back and offer the same product when PC makers are beginning to offer 90-95% of the same solution for close to half the cost. I don't think they can. I think it is May and we are still waiting for that exciting 2012 and given the increasing number of threads wondering the same across multiple product areas, I know I'm not alone.

How many Apple products can you buy for half the cost from a PC vendor? There are few (if any) Apple products that cost twice what an equivalent product costs from someone else. When you do find an Apple product that's twice as expensive, it's because you're comparing it to a POS that's not even close to the same product.

 

I understand you can claim this but the sale figures in items like Android phones don't bare this out. Does Apple still make the best phone? Yes in my opinion and I own two iPhone and my kids own two iPods. Does this mean that a whole slew of 4+ inch Android phones haven't moved at the same or lower prices just because someone labels them as junky, or plasticy or whatever. It doesn't stop those sales.

 

One of the reasons Apple's stock price has taken a hit is concern that carriers will balk at paying the same subsidy when they can offer Android phones for a lower subsidy. We all know they aren't as good but the point is an enthusiastic sales for can explain away the trade offs.

 

That can happen with these HP laptops as well. Anyone with half a brain can say sure they weigh a whole 4 lbs but you are getting a 15 inch screen in trade and they are $599-799 instead of $999.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #85 of 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


How many Apple products can you buy for half the cost from a PC vendor? There are few (if any) Apple products that cost twice what an equivalent product costs from someone else. When you do find an Apple product that's twice as expensive, it's because you're comparing it to a POS that's not even close to the same product.

At least you get it. Pricing goes all over the place. There's always this tendency to compare Macs to $400 laptops (which are obviously designed carefully around a price point) even though other options exist. Since it's an Apple forum, they assume that if cost is a non- issue the Mac is the clear choice. This means they never consider models which would make for a reasonably fair comparison. 

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