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Apple rumored to be in talks to acquire German HDTV maker Loewe - Page 3

post #81 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Because (and I hate to invoke this old bit) Steve Jobs "cracking" the television means a change in the industry on the order of the iTunes Music Store.

It's in the software. We haven't seen that yet, but there is ABSOLUTELY nothing a television can provide that a $99 box cannot.
Well if th $99 box can't give me what I have with DirecTV I have no reason to buy it. TV is not that complicated. My DirecTV box is very easy to use. When I had Dish Networks it was the same (though they didn't have all the content DirecTV does). I'm not sure what Apple is going to perfect or what Jobs thought he cracked.

Now there are those who would prefer to just pay for the shows/ channels they want rather than paying for a package full of channels they never want. If that's what Apple is attempting to crack then it's a whole lot more than perfecting the UI. Then we're talking about content and distribution. And I'm skeptical that Apple will be able to break the cable/satellite control of TV. TV is not the same as music was back in the early 00's when people were using file sharing to illegally acquire music. I can't see TV networks or movie studios bending over for Apple just because, well, it's Apple.
post #82 of 135

"SoundJam was purchased and turned into iTunes in a heartbeat"

 

Wasn't that a drumbeat? :)

post #83 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Well, downward if they're actually making a TV.

The stock is not going to tank just because they releass a TV... Even if it doesnt work, the stock price is based on valuation of all Apple products, and its already pretty cheap right now.
post #84 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

First off, when I make predictions on Apple, I am batting about 85%, sometimes I am 100% balls on.  But the thoughts that I have I don't want to jinx it for Apple, it's too out there, but I want Apple to get into the negotiations without me hinting on it.  Sorry, but I would love to share it with you.  There are probably about 5 or 6 companies that I would target for Apple to acquire over the next 3 years.  but right now, they seem to be focusing on mfg these Apple HDTV boxes and I think they have to split the mfg between China and Germany because TVs are big and costly to ship worldwide.  Buying Loewe, from my point of view, gives them the ability to mfg different sizes and ship the product to various countries.  Plus, they have engineers at Loewe that can help with future products and they have other products that fit nicely with what Apple doesn't have.  But these other companies that I feel Apple should buy, I don't want to say a word right now, because it might be too premature and I don't want certain others to beat Apple to the punch.

Ah, the old; "I know things you don't know, but I can't tell you, so you have to trust that I actually know this stuff, even though I can't prove any of it.", gambit.

Love it!
post #85 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

Given how old of a company this is, is there any chance they have some important patents relating to TV technology?

You don't want old patents. You want new patents. If its older than about 15 years, and you don't already have products based upon it, then it's not very useful.
post #86 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Levy View Post

Is 50% regarded in Acquisition bids as a "slight premium"? Seems pretty substantial to me.

A normal premium is about 30%. If you epwant the company badly enough, and you want to take it out of contention, you offer enough so the board can't think they. Old get more elsewhere. This is what Google did when they bought Motorola. The premium was something like 85%.
post #87 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Well if th $99 box can't give me what I have with DirecTV I have no reason to buy it. TV is not that complicated. My DirecTV box is very easy to use. When I had Dish Networks it was the same (though they didn't have all the content DirecTV does). I'm not sure what Apple is going to perfect or what Jobs thought he cracked.
Now there are those who would prefer to just pay for the shows/ channels they want rather than paying for a package full of channels they never want. If that's what Apple is attempting to crack then it's a whole lot more than perfecting the UI. Then we're talking about content and distribution. And I'm skeptical that Apple will be able to break the cable/satellite control of TV. TV is not the same as music was back in the early 00's when people were using file sharing to illegally acquire music. I can't see TV networks or movie studios bending over for Apple just because, well, it's Apple.

Its near impossible for Apple to compete with cable on content because of vertical integration. Lots of channels are now own by cable companies. In canada its even worst, almost all of the stations and channels are own by Cable or DSL companies.

Btw where I live we have a la carte programming. We dont have to buy the tv packages. This trend may spread so dont give up hope on that.
post #88 of 135

This makes perfect sense. All the rumblings and actions being taken do point to Apple getting into the TV biz. It definitely does remind me of all the hoopla going on before the iPhone was finally released. That being said, I agree with those who say that the only real differentiator will be software and content related. Great industrial design will help and there'll be millions who would buy a dumb panel with the Apple logo slapped on it, but for the long-term viability of an Apple HDTV set, it'll be all about how the interface accesses an expanded iTunes content base integrated with iCloud.

 

I've felt the TV world has been broken for years. I finally got fed up and ditched the normal service after going through standard cable (Cox), satellite (DirecTV), and Verizon's FiOS TV. I just have the Apple TV now with a Netflix account but it's really not much more than an online rental service of which there are many. It's really not a "traditional" TV. But since I find the great majority of TV programming to be trash, I don't mind the limited capabilities. I've never been much of a TV watcher at all. The only thing I really miss is live sports but I'm not the sports fan that I used to be either so it's no big deal.

 

I'm not sure what the ideal TV experience would be. I do like how the Apple TV is integrated with all the iDevices and Macs at home with iTunes and AirPlay but I'm sure there'll be more to it than that in the future. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what Apple has in store. I don't think there's any doubt that Apple will get into it in a big way. We just don't know when. Apple isn't going to sit by idly while everyone else like Google, Samsung, Microsoft, LG, Sony, etc. continue to stake out a piece of the emerging digital (or "smart") TV market.

 

I don't think anyone even knows what they're really going after. They all seem to be flailing and throwing whatever they can at the wall and hope that something sticks and takes off. Apple will have to define what that something is. Even if Apple does, they won't catch everyone off guard like they did with the iPhone in the mobile phone market. It'll  have to be a long and slow climb. I'm all for it and am ready for it. It'll be like the final piece of a puzzle in the home. But I'm in no hurry to complete it.

post #89 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


It's in the software. We haven't seen that yet, but there is ABSOLUTELY nothing a television can provide that a $99 box cannot.

You would be correct until you say $99. Dropping all legacy support you can meet that price point, but a TV needs more I/O than the current apple tv offers-- a tuner at a minimum, a DVR if you are trying to dominate.

I would say the opposite: there is no need for a $99 box if you the right television.

Also, the $99 box doesn't control power, input source selection, or volume for the television, leading to remote control hell.

(I really hope Apple buys Sonos rather than trying to compete.)
post #90 of 135
They are one of TWO TV companies with a awfully-designed TV IMO, aesthetically. Loewe and B&O. I hope if Apple indeed bought this company, they will change their design direction to be much more widely accepted look much like the likes of Panasonic and Toshiba 2012 models or Samsung (ek!) and LG 2011 models. At least maybe Sony HX 2009-10 models. Loewe and B&O, even the unknown Chinese TV models/brands starting to look more prettier the last time I check.
post #91 of 135

Television screens on internet media players?

 

Internet media players in televisions?

 

Think convergence.  What goes?  What arrives?

 

Could long term technological licenses be involved?

post #92 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

Ah, the old; "I know things you don't know, but I can't tell you, so you have to trust that I actually know this stuff, even though I can't prove any of it.", gambit.
Love it!

You left out - "I can tell you, but I'd have to kill you!"

We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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post #93 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Well if th $99 box can't give me what I have with DirecTV I have no reason to buy it. TV is not that complicated. My DirecTV box is very easy to use. When I had Dish Networks it was the same (though they didn't have all the content DirecTV does). I'm not sure what Apple is going to perfect or what Jobs thought he cracked.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but the user interface is the one thing that I hate about satellite tv. I've got cable but use a TiVo box, just because I find the interface better looking and more elegant. Now understand, I don't thick TiVo is perfect, just incrementally better. I hate dealing with Time Warner Cable and would ditch them in a minute if TiVo was fully integrated into a dish receiver. On the other hand, you can have my cable modem when you pry my cold dead fingers off of it, so I can't cut the cable completely.

We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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We've always been at war with Eastasia...

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post #94 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splash-reverse View Post

They are one of TWO TV companies with a awfully-designed TV IMO, aesthetically. Loewe and B&O. I hope if Apple indeed bought this company, they will change their design direction to be much more widely accepted look much like the likes of Panasonic and Toshiba 2012 models or Samsung (ek!) and LG 2011 models. At least maybe Sony HX 2009-10 models. Loewe and B&O, even the unknown Chinese TV models/brands starting to look more prettier the last time I check.

I disagree. Look as an example the Loewe Invisio -model. Almost completely made of glass! I don´t know if there is a commercial product available (yet). I would thin this is a perfect math! Just add the Apple logo.....

Kuvankaappaus 2012-5-13 kello 10.34.40.png

post #95 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


It's far easier to lose money than it is to gain it.

Ummm, not for Apple!
post #96 of 135

If such a deal would take off, it would certainly administer a significant blow to Samsung's TV business (more than a set-top aTV box, which would work WITH Samsung TVs).

 

I still do believe that Apple is just working with major TV suppliers to incorporate (or allow attachment in a recess ) of the appleTV, negociating strict compliance with e.g.,

  • remote controls, or with Apple's iOS remote control strategy (e.g., a smart iPad app, as for Loewe, a far cry from the horrible GUI found in the Samsung SmartTVs; 
  • CEC, where the aTV controls all the inputs to the TV, including the attached devices (instead of vice versa).

The reason why we apparently haven't seen patent applications to this effect may be that Apple wants a head start. There may already be ways in which Apple can prevent straightforward copying/clongig, e.g., using their development ecosystem.

post #97 of 135

Ha ha, that would be a great slogan.

post #98 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

It's in the software. We haven't seen that yet, but there is ABSOLUTELY nothing a television can provide that a $99 box cannot.
No, an Apple TV set can't provide any more software than an Apple TV box.

But a tv set can provide hardware integration. Namely, a flat panel, a tuner, an audio amplifier, a center speaker, and wireless speaker home base for left, right, and rear channels.
post #99 of 135

A quick query in the German patent databases reveals that Loewe Opta AG indeed holds or has applied to some patents that you would consider as necessary for the kind of products Apple is likely to offer when entering the telly market. I'm not at all an expert in patent matters, though.

The stuff is all in German, you might find equivalent applications at the European Patent office in English.

DE102009059281B4 covers the communication between an "entertainment electronics device" and a "communication electronics device", so basically your telly and your iOS device. EED sends EPG data to the CED (apparently via an intermediary device), nicely wrapped in XML; CED with touch control allows you to navigate, browse the program, probably preview (hard to decipher that patent lingo) and control the EED by pushing the symbol for the show you want to see towards the telly (which somehow knows the CED's location). 

DE102010038159A1 covers "displays with adjustable transparency" (as an "Offenlegungsschrift", document of disclosure, it's not a granted patent yet, though). The display is characterised by: transparent liquid crystals; organic diodes (OLEDs); polarizer to control intensity of light going through the transparent display; ability to control transparency for specific light waves lengths (allows adjustment to different environments); and some more stuff.

EP000002249559A3 covers regular expressions for EPGs. 

A three docs were published in 2012. 

post #100 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by diplication View Post

I'm not saying you're wrong, but the user interface is the one thing that I hate about satellite tv. I've got cable but use a TiVo box, just because I find the interface better looking and more elegant. Now understand, I don't thick TiVo is perfect, just incrementally better. I hate dealing with Time Warner Cable and would ditch them in a minute if TiVo was fully integrated into a dish receiver. On the other hand, you can have my cable modem when you pry my cold dead fingers off of it, so I can't cut the cable completely.
Well I wouldn't call DirecTV's UI elegant (though the last upgrade made it better), but I personally don't find it confusing. It's very easy for me to find what I want to watch. I can record things remotely via my iPhone. Their iPad app lets me warch TV anywhere in my house. I now have Nomad service where I can take something on my DVR and transfer it to my iPad to watch away from home. Apple would need all that (or something similar) to pry me away from DirecTV.
post #101 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by bikertwin View Post

No, an Apple TV set can't provide any more software than an Apple TV box.
But a tv set can provide hardware integration. Namely, a flat panel, a tuner, an audio amplifier, a center speaker, and wireless speaker home base for left, right, and rear channels.
I'd love it if Apple came out with a product that neatly integrated all the home audio products people have. For sure if they were ever to come out with a see through TV. My TV is inside an entertainment center and right now no way would I show anyone the mess of cables and cords behind the TV. It's embarrassing. If Apple can clean all that up I'm in (as long as I can keep my DirecTV).
post #102 of 135

A Loewe spokesperson has denied this report.

post #103 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toruk View Post

A Loewe spokesperson has denied this report.
Well it was a nice thought for the 12 hours or so that it lasted. Sigh.
post #104 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toruk View Post

A Loewe spokesperson has denied this report.

ya, and back in the day, around first period of the Retina iPad rumour, John Gruber said that there would NEVER be an Retina iPad... stopping all of the rumours about the Retina iPad. ( for at least a short while...LOL)

meaning... LOEWS is going to denied it, irrespective of the truth... so wait a month... then we'll see if this rumour is correct.
post #105 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taimen View Post

I disagree. Look as an example the Loewe Invisio -model. Almost completely made of glass! I don´t know if there is a commercial product available (yet). I would thin this is a perfect math! Just add the Apple logo.....

Their Connect ID one looks like a big iMac

467

Still, I think they are expensive for what you get:

365

Generally, their bezels are too thick and always have a giant button on the front. If Apple used the technology though, a transparent glass panel with a small bezel at the bottom would be very nice:

"As the first of its kind, the Loewe Invisio introduces technical innovation, combining conventional LCD and the latest TOLED display technology. This allows to create non-transparent / solid moving pictures with rich color reproduction and full contrast range from solid black to pristine white.- Michael Friebe"

They don't have to use it for a TV though. Transparent OLED can be used for a number of things - there are some laptops that use them.
post #106 of 135
1997 Loewe Xelos @media

Everything is obvious

Link http://www.grandproductscompany.com/prod/brands/loewe/prod/xelos_5970_tv_o_details.asp
Edited by cy_starkman - 5/13/12 at 9:46am
you only have freedom in choice when you know you have no choice
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you only have freedom in choice when you know you have no choice
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post #107 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by animatedude View Post

in my holy opinion, and i repeat holy...the Apple Cinema Display design is much better than everything they have on this Loewe's products page....that's why i have ZERO problems with the rumors of the upcoming Apple TV set being exactly like the Apple Cinema Display only bigger...i say bring it on!

 

Well I must admit, I have never seen nor heard Loewe's gears in person but I am giving the benefit of the doubt to Apple engineers and designers.

 

I am impressed however by the pictures of the gears.  If they sound anything like Paradigm Studios or JM Labs speaker gears or Velodyne DD subs and have the picture qualities of the Samsung tv screens, then add Apple advanced TV platform with beautiful and easy to use interface and you have a revolutionized industry on you hands.

 

Note that it's not just the external design but also quality of the patented electronics and software inside.  Not to mention the current organization of the company, the fact that they make a limited set of products that Apple wants instead of being huge like Sony.

 

I look forward to having 100% Apple gear for audio/video.

post #108 of 135

According to a report on The Next Web, "German TV maker Loewe has today officially denied rumours of a $113 million buyout, with a company spokesperson stating that the report has “absolutely nothing to it.”

 

There goes another Apple TV rumor - come on AI, don't become another DigiTimes 

post #109 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post


Well if th $99 box can't give me what I have with DirecTV I have no reason to buy it. TV is not that complicated. My DirecTV box is very easy to use. When I had Dish Networks it was the same (though they didn't have all the content DirecTV does). I'm not sure what Apple is going to perfect or what Jobs thought he cracked.
Now there are those who would prefer to just pay for the shows/ channels they want rather than paying for a package full of channels they never want. If that's what Apple is attempting to crack then it's a whole lot more than perfecting the UI. Then we're talking about content and distribution. And I'm skeptical that Apple will be able to break the cable/satellite control of TV. TV is not the same as music was back in the early 00's when people were using file sharing to illegally acquire music. I can't see TV networks or movie studios bending over for Apple just because, well, it's Apple.

 

I think your summed this debate up best here ...

 

"I'm not sure what Apple is going to perfect or what Jobs thought he cracked."

 

To which I'd say ... "Exactly!"

 

I am sure the exact same comment was made pre iPhone and iPad from those already familiar with the then current phone and tablet markets.

 

My point is it may well be a lot of fun and enlightening when we see it (what ever it is)...  having said that of course even when we see it (assuming there is an it) most won't 'get it' at first just as they didn't with iPhone and iPad and heck I could add GUI to that mix back in 1984 ...  "What use is a mouse?"  

Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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post #110 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toruk View Post
A Loewe spokesperson has denied this report.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
Well it was a nice thought for the 12 hours or so that it lasted. Sigh.

 

Huh, guess I was wrong, then.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post
In other news, small German TV manufacturer's stock price skyrockets for a month or so.

 

Idiot speculators make money.

 

That certainly didn't give them much time at all, did it? lol.gif

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
Well if th $99 box can't give me what I have with DirecTV I have no reason to buy it.

 

You'd rather pay whatever a month for the rest of eternity than $99 once and then only for the shows and news you want?

 

Quote:
My DirecTV box is very easy to use.

 

Then you have a very, very different box than any I've ever seen or used.

 

Quote:
If that's what Apple is attempting to crack then it's a whole lot more than perfecting the UI. Then we're talking about content and distribution. And I'm skeptical that Apple will be able to break the cable/satellite control of TV. 

 

This is something at which they excel.

 

Quote:
TV is not the same as music was back in the early 00's when people were using file sharing to illegally acquire music. 

 

Yeah, no one downloads TV shows without paying for service. That certainly doesn't happen.

 

Quote:
I can't see TV networks or movie studios bending over for Apple just because, well, it's Apple.

 

I can't see them having a choice. They either do it or they're left out, just like every other deal Apple has made for the past decade.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #111 of 135
Loewe obviously doesn't have the manufacturing depth to produce on a scale needed by Apple. Nor would manufacturing costs in Germany be appealing. I think Apple's interest would be in design and engineering expertise in the TV field. That could include Loewe's manufacturing skills which might be beneficial in establishing a contract maufacturer's production line in Asia.

If this report is correct, I won't be expecting an Apple HDTV intro anytime soon. It would take a substantial amount of time to integrate Loewe, finalize designs and ramp up production.

One final thought. It would be great to have Apple's HDTV built right here in the USA. Unlikely, but with more highly automated production than is employed in China, it may be a possibility. Perhap's that is something that Loewe could bring to the table.
post #112 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toruk View Post

A Loewe spokesperson has denied this report.
Well it was a nice thought for the 12 hours or so that it lasted. Sigh.

Maybe the discussions were about a joint venture or licensing agreement of some kind.

Sometimes those work better for both parties than a buyout.

post #113 of 135

Oh yeah..A.I. be trollin.

files_troll_2.jpg?w=545

Crying? No, I am not crying. I am sweating through my eyes.
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Crying? No, I am not crying. I am sweating through my eyes.
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post #114 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post

According to a report on The Next Web, "German TV maker Loewe has today officially denied rumours of a $113 million buyout, with a company spokesperson stating that the report has “absolutely nothing to it.”

 

There goes another Apple TV rumor - come on AI, don't become another DigiTimes 

 

Oh well, so much for that idea.  It would have been a good deal for both companies but competition is also good.  The Apple design and engineering teams must rise to the occasion.

 

Time will tell.

post #115 of 135

Do you remember when iPad was a rumor? And when it was introduced? Many, if not the majority of people who commented couldn't understand why anyone, other than rabid Apple fanboys and girls, would buy it. The question was, why do I need another internet device? I have a smartphone, laptop, etc. 

I seriously doubt that Apple would enter the TV market unless they have a highly compelling product. It will be interesting to see what it's all about when the time comes, assuming it does. Which according to the previous post, it will not.

post #116 of 135

Edit: Deleted and resubmitted -- screwed over by the new AI forum UI


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 5/13/12 at 10:51am
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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post #117 of 135

Edit: Deleted and resubmitted -- screwed over (again) by the new AI forum UI

 

Edited by Dick Applebaum - 5/13/12 at 11:11am
"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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"...The calm is on the water and part of us would linger by the shore, For ships are safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."
- Michael Lille -
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post #118 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Let's put it this way.  If my suspicions are correct as to the direction for Apple, if they buy Loewe.  I would pretty much be scared out of my mind if I were Samsung, Sony, Android phones, and Windows anything.  But I am not say anything because I might be wrong, but if I am right, this could get REAL ugly within the next couple of years.  It would actually be a good thing in general as far as I am concerned.

If you're right about what?
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #119 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by bikertwin View Post

Loewe makes TVs, but also audio systems and speakers. They have all the technology that Apple could put in one total home entertainment device: Apple TV. Maybe with (optional?) external speakers. But wirelessly connected.

Or, maybe, a TV?
Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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Citing unnamed sources with limited but direct knowledge of the rumoured device - Comedy Insider (Feb 2014)
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post #120 of 135

If Apple wants to be a content provider and compete with cable then they would simply buy Dish Network or Direct TV. Dish has valuable spectrum that Apple could use as leverage with the telecoms or use it themselves.

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