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Samsung value drops $10B as investors fear it being cut out of Apple supply chain

post #1 of 55
Thread Starter 
Concern that Samsung could lose orders for dynamic random access memory from Apple caused the company's stock to drop 6 percent on Wednesday.

Rumors from DigiTimes, the Taiwanese technology publication, suggested that Apple has placed huge orders with Elpida, a chipmaker in Japan. That caused concern that Apple was moving its DRAM business away from Samsung, and Samsung's market value fell by $10 billion, according to Reuters.

Industry watchers have speculated that Apple placed the orders with Elpida in an effort to keep the company running and ensure competition in the market. The Japanese chipmaker has struggled of late, and U.S.-based Micron Technology Corp is currently in talks to acquire the business.

Samsung's stock troubles on Wednesday also came as a pair of reports from The Wall Street Journal and Reuters said that Apple had tapped a trio of suppliers to supply larger 4-inch screens for its sixth-generation iPhone. Noticeably absent among those three companies was Samsung, which is one of Apple's chief suppliers of LCD displays.

In fact, Samsung was the sole supplier of Retina displays for Apple's new iPad when it launched in March. Samsung also builds the custom A5X chip that powers the new iPad, along with other key components.

A5X RAM
Discrete DDR2 RAM modules, in this case Samsung-sourced. | Source: Chipworks


Reports have suggested for some time that Apple wants to reduce its reliance on Samsung for components, as in addition to being a parts supplier, the company is also one of Apple's fiercest rivals. In addition to competing in a number of markets, the two companies are also involved in a series of lawsuits accusing one another of patent infringement.
post #2 of 55

Hopefully this will spark an Internet-wide boycott of DigiTimes.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #3 of 55
Where are the posters that said Samsung doesn't need Apple and should stop manufactuing Apple's chip designs to teach Apple a lesson?

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #4 of 55

DIGITIMES!!

 

lol.giflol.gif lol.gif lol.gif lol.gif lol.gif

 

I thought Investors knew better....

I'm not a pessimist. I'm an optimist, with experience.
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I'm not a pessimist. I'm an optimist, with experience.
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post #5 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
Where are the posters that said Samsung doesn't need Apple and should stop manufactuing Apple's chip designs to teach Apple a lesson?

 

There were people who said that? I only remember the opposite…

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
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post #6 of 55

Cutting Samsung out of their supply chain (as much as possible) would be a much better tact that the lawsuits, IMO. Lawsuits drag on and are creating a negative public perception. Moving to alternative suppliers is just a business decision and will hit Samsung harder. Without overtly making it an issue in their supplier relationships, they could certainly use this to encourage more ethical behavior from Samsung with regard to aping Apple products.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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post #7 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

There were people who said that? I only remember the opposite…

There were. I don't recall it here but have seen it quite frequently on other boards. Mostly from kids too ignorant to realize that Apple is, in many ways, the most important customer Samsung has and that not supplying Apple would hurt them more than it would hurt Apple. Apple can fund other suppliers to ramp up if needed to replace Samsung. Samsung can't make other companies buy from them at the same levels that Apple does.

"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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"My 8th grade math teacher once said: "You can't help it if you're dumb, you are born that way. But stupid is self inflicted."" -Hiro. 

...sometimes it's both
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post #8 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Where are the posters that said Samsung doesn't need Apple and should stop manufactuing Apple's chip designs to teach Apple a lesson?

Sorry, was too busy at work doing productive things than doing a lighting fast response on AI.

My presence is known. Happy?

To believe a rudimentary "publication" like dignities says a lot about the character of those who fall for its "facts" and "insider knowledge".

"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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"Like I said before, share price will dip into the $400."  - 11/21/12 by Galbi

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post #9 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

There were people who said that? I only remember the opposite…

Are you kidding? Fandroids say that all of the time. You have to realize that in the demented and corrupted mind of a Fandroid, Apple is not an innovator and it is thanks to Samsung that Apple is able to make the products that they do. 

 

As for Samsung's value dropping, well, shit happens. I've said it before, but anybody who believes in rumors coming from Digitimes can't be all that bright, and there are apparently a lot of really dumb people out there.

post #10 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Where are the posters that said Samsung doesn't need Apple and should stop manufactuing Apple's chip designs to teach Apple a lesson?

 

Seriously!  If a rumor from a source known to be unreliable can cause a 6% drop, investors don't have much confidence at all.  Hard to make that argument now.  I'm sure some will, though.

post #11 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBillyGoatGruff View Post

 

Seriously!  If a rumor from a source known to be unreliable can cause a 6% drop, investors don't have much confidence at all.  Hard to make that argument now.  I'm sure some will, though.

I have this theory that some investors are taking money from various stocks (even Apple), to get money for friday and FB.

post #12 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Hopefully this will spark an Internet-wide boycott of DigiTimes.
I don't even care about what's happening with Samsung's stock. It will come back up. What I'm concerned about is why Apple's stock is dropping so much, with another almost $12 today. There's no good reason for this to be happening.
post #13 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

There were. I don't recall it here but have seen it quite frequently on other boards. Mostly from kids too ignorant to realize that Apple is, in many ways, the most important customer Samsung has and that not supplying Apple would hurt them more than it would hurt Apple. Apple can fund other suppliers to ramp up if needed to replace Samsung. Samsung can't make other companies buy from them at the same levels that Apple does.

 

Considering the billions Samsung have poured into manufacturing capacity for Apple (I've spent many months working in Samsung factories that are producing chips only for Apple), it's more likely they would stop making phones themselves, than stop making devices for Apple.

post #14 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


I don't even care about what's happening with Samsung's stock. It will come back up. What I'm concerned about is why Apple's stock is dropping so much, with another almost $12 today. There's no good reason for this to be happening.

 

The economy generally is in a shaky patch, so all stocks are down.  Until Greece gets kicked out of the Euro, and the Eurozone sort themselves out, the markets aren't going to be doing much for a reason.......

post #15 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

Cutting Samsung out of their supply chain (as much as possible) would be a much better tact that the lawsuits, IMO. Lawsuits drag on and are creating a negative public perception. Moving to alternative suppliers is just a business decision and will hit Samsung harder. Without overtly making it an issue in their supplier relationships, they could certainly use this to encourage more ethical behavior from Samsung with regard to aping Apple products.
Samsung makes significantly more profit from their mobile phone business than chips. If losing Apple's chip business messes with the economics, then maybe the strategy would work... But it is a stretch.
post #16 of 55

can't Samsung sue Digitimes? 6% drop because of a rumor that's terrible.

post #17 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

 

The economy generally is in a shaky patch, so all stocks are down.  Until Greece gets kicked out of the Euro, and the Eurozone sort themselves out, the markets aren't going to be doing much for a reason.......

Not true for all stocks. While Apple was declining today, GOOG shot up almost 3 freaking percent.

post #18 of 55
Elpida is going bankrupt, and it was up on the auction block and there are a number of buyers and Micron was one of them. It make sense for Apple to keep them a float because if they fail that leaves only 3 supplier of mobile DRAM with Samsung being the Largest of them all so pricing could go up because of that. Also, Apple have has about 1/2 of elpida's manufacturing production already booked for the balance of the year, so does that mean they will take on more capacity since many company jumped ship when they found out Elpida was on the skids.
post #19 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Not true for all stocks. While Apple was declining today, GOOG shot up almost 3 freaking percent.

 

I wonder how much GM saying they aren't going to advertise on Facebook impacted that?

 

Effectively, in the absence of specific news for Apple, they will follow the general market at the moment.

post #20 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

There were people who said that? I only remember the opposite…

He should know because it was one of his iterations that said it lol
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
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post #21 of 55

WhooooHoooo YEAH!!!! 

post #22 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulkas View Post

Cutting Samsung out of their supply chain (as much as possible) would be a much better tact that the lawsuits, IMO. Lawsuits drag on and are creating a negative public perception. Moving to alternative suppliers is just a business decision and will hit Samsung harder.

 

Negative public perception for who?  A few geeks on the internet?  Seriously, most Americans have no idea that Apple is suing Samsung (and vice versa), nor do they care.  Greenpeace has been railing at Apple for years (usually for invalid reasons) and that hasn't done anything to Apple either.

post #23 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by animatedude View Post
can't Samsung sue Digitimes? 6% drop because of a rumor that's terrible.

 

Apple recently suffered an even worse drop due to an even more unverified rumor (that turned out to be a lie, if I remember correctly) and did nothing about it. I don't think anything legal can be done.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post
He should know because it was one of his iterations that said it lol


Sorry, you've lost me? 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by docjrey View Post
WhooooHoooo YEAH!!!! 

 

This isn't something to be cheering about. It shows the power that absolute liars have over things about which they know nothing.

 

It doesn't matter that it's Samsung to whom this happened, because it happened to Apple earlier and it can happen to any company.

 

Time for cheering will be if the rumor reported turns out to be true, but then only as an Apple fan. 

 

Stock manipulation through blatant lies is never worth praise.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #24 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMJohnson View Post

 

I wonder how much GM saying they aren't going to advertise on Facebook impacted that?

 

 

...I guess I'll be sticking with Ford, then.

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
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post #25 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

I have this theory that some investors are taking money from various stocks (even Apple), to get money for friday and FB.

 

That's a very interesting observation. Could be true. At the same time, all stocks are dropping because of global instability.

post #26 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


I don't even care about what's happening with Samsung's stock. It will come back up. What I'm concerned about is why Apple's stock is dropping so much, with another almost $12 today. There's no good reason for this to be happening.

It's called "profit taking" (and it's also, perhaps, a buying opportunity for the "risk takers". .... and while we're at it, why are you so sure that Samsung will "come back up " while not expressing the same level of confidence for Apple?

See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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See, in the record business, you can show someone your song, and they don’t copy it. In the tech business, you show somebody your idea, and they steal it. (Jimmy Iovine)
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post #27 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by "Apple 
[" url="/t/150127/samsung-value-drops-10b-as-investors-fear-it-being-cut-out-of-apple-supply-chain#post_2111301"]I have this theory that some investors are taking money from various stocks (even Apple), to get money for friday and FB.

1) Institutional buyers will account for a lion's share of FB purchases -- my guess is, close to 80%.

2) They're sitting around with a lot of cash.

I don't think that people have to sell AAPL to buy FB.
post #28 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post


I don't even care about what's happening with Samsung's stock. It will come back up. What I'm concerned about is why Apple's stock is dropping so much, with another almost $12 today. There's no good reason for this to be happening.

 

It was in the charts.

 

From what I've read it could get close to $500.

 

This drop was to be expected.

 

[volume has been relatively light for a while]

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post #29 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by melgross View Post

I don't even care about what's happening with Samsung's stock. It will come back up. What I'm concerned about is why Apple's stock is dropping so much, with another almost $12 today. There's no good reason for this to be happening.

Yes, the recent price moves are strange.

I think it presents a fabulous buying opportunity, probably one of the last few to present itself at this level before it gets out of reach..... The next big bump up will be China Mobile, I am guessing.
post #30 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

It was in the charts.

From what I've read it could get close to $500.

... but this drop was to be expected.

What "charts"? What did they say?
post #31 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


What "charts"? What did they say?

 

I thought it might happen after the quarterly, that's why I got out... and then some chart readers confirmed my suspicions.

 

I mentioned it about 3 weeks back... predictions were for $510... something intersects something else etc. etc.  lol.gif

 

I'll see if I can find the articles.

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post #32 of 55

deleted


Edited by kellya74u - 7/24/13 at 9:52am
post #33 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by island hermit View Post

I thought it might happen after the quarterly, that's why I got out... and then some chart readers confirmed my suspicions.

I mentioned it about 3 weeks back... predictions were for $510... something intersects something else etc. etc.  lol.gif

I'll see if I can find the articles.

Oh, don't bother.

I happen to think that technical analysis is a bit of bunk, anyway. :-)
post #34 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post


Oh, don't bother.
I happen to think that technical analysis is a bit of bunk, anyway. :-)

 

I knew that... hence the way I described it. lol.gif

 

... but it seems to be coming true... wouldn't you say?

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post #35 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


Sorry, you've lost me? 

Its a play on his user name solipsism, sol·ip·sism 1. the theory that only the self exists, or can be proved to exist. All conversations a solipsist has are with himself.
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
"Few things are harder to put up with than the annoyance of a good example" Mark Twain
"Just because something is deemed the law doesn't make it just" - SolipsismX
Reply
post #36 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post
Its a play on his user name solipsism, sol·ip·sism 1. the theory that only the self exists, or can be proved to exist. All conversations a solipsist has are with himself.

 

That's a thinker. Props for that one.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone] exists, it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #37 of 55

I am just awaiting the day that Apple announces that they are contracting with TSMC for their processors. That would be a big chunk of money that Samsung will lose and it will take time to replace. I don't expect this to happen soon, but the sooner, the better. Unless Intel convinces Apple to go with their new low-power chips, but would Intel be willing to manufacture custom chips for Apple?

post #38 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellya74u View Post

Even though Apple is getting other vendors to manufacture their components, their lawsuits against Samsung should still proceed. On the surface, Apple may seem somewhat harsh & be perceived badly, but in looking at the details, the suit seem well founded, & so far, a judge has agreed. If Apple was having Samsung make tee shirts in a certain design, color scheme that lit up with led lights, & Samsung made a very similar clone & sold it cheaper, using the same wiring, battery location, reflective paint, same fonts, etc., it would undercut Apple's business. To have another company make the tee shirts yet let Samsung continue selling their clones unchallenged, is not good business, & rewards bad ethics & bad behavior. The fact that entire cargo containers of Samsung's product can be held up & not offloaded, shows the value & weight of a judge's careful consideration of the facts. There are many who feel its ok to copy someone else's work because they look at their own interests, they want the ship unloaded so they can get their own cheaper phone. To me, that's like buying tools at a swapmeet that were stolen from your neighbors garage....but you got a great deal (sucks to be my neighbor).

 

In the long run, the lawsuits can be good for all, as it will force Samsung to really invest in R & D & come up with original ideas, rather than tasking their whole team to sit around & wait for Apple to once again, invent something new. Samsung though, probably doesn't sit around, & they probably do everything they can short of (?) industrial espionage, to find out what Apple is making next, so they can tell & R & D to quickly, "make this & patent it if you can," to try & come out first, thereby making Apple possibly looking like it copied Samsung. Many criticizes Apple for being so secretive. Let's see if Samsung comes out with the 'Apple TV' clone  before Apple  releases their invention....or maybe not. Samsung has really produced some excellent quality items, some of their own design. I think they need to have more confidence in their own abilities to be creative, & come up with their own ideas about what people want.

Unfortunately, Samsung tried to come up with their own Operating System, but that failed.    Samsung should be split up whereby the component fabrication companies are not part of the same company.  As much as Apple does in business, they could buy up their own mfg companies.   IBM has their own chip fab to produce chips for a long time.  They, as far as I know, are still making chips for AMD.  I think they still might be making their own X86 Intel chips.  At least they used to do that.

 

The biggest problem with running your own chip fabrication plants is keeping up with the latest and greatest advancements in order to bring down the size of the transistors, or the when they come with a larger wafers.  It's something Apple could do, if they needed to, but they have to buy the right companies, and probably invest money to keep them up to date, and maybe sell some of their standard components to other companies if they have more yield than they use in their own products.  At least, they'll be able to have more control over their component supply.

post #39 of 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post


Sorry, was too busy at work doing productive things than doing a lighting fast response on AI.
My presence is known. Happy?
To believe a rudimentary "publication" like dignities says a lot about the character of those who fall for its "facts" and "insider knowledge".

Boycott dignities!

post #40 of 55

It's a plot. Another 10 billion drop in Samsung's value, and Apple can BUY the whole company, eliminating one of their fiercest competitors, and gaining the ability to manufacture their own processors and displays. 

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