or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › Mac Pro petition gains traction as pro users seek information
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Mac Pro petition gains traction as pro users seek information

post #1 of 203
Thread Starter 
With Apple's Mac Pro line growing long in the tooth after not having received an update for almost two years, a Facebook petition calling for information from the Mac maker on the fate of its professional-level desktops is steadily gaining traction.

The "We Want a New Macpro" group page on the social networking site had garnered over 4,000 likes as of late Thursday and a number of comments from group members calling for either a Mac Pro update or concrete information from Apple about its plans for the high-end machine.

According to the page, the petition was started by Lou Borella, a self-described "professional editor and graphic animator" in the New York City area, earlier in May.

On May 9, Borella posted an open letter to Apple asking for "a little clarity" about the Mac Pro.

"Its been neglected for far too long. We realize all the success of the iPad and iPhone and we're really happy with our new toys," he wrote. "But unfortunately many of us need to make decisions on hardware for professional uses that allow us to make a living."

The letter went on to say that professional software applications, such as Adobe Creative Suite 6, AVID, Protools and Smoke, require "the most powerful hardware available." In addition, creative professionals need configurable systems for their business.

"The iMac is not the answer for these situations," he said.

Borella is seeking for a "timeframe" for a new Mac Pro update or official confirmation as to whether the line is "dead."

"It's not too much to ask. We cannot wait any longer and it's really not fair to string us along like this," Borella concluded, also signing the letter on behalf of the "Creative Community."

Mac Pro


According to an informal poll posted to the page last week, 267 people are willing to wait until "shortly after" the Worldwide Developers Conference in mid-June, while 47 people said they would wait until the end of this year. 143 respondents said they would wait until the Mac Pro was "officially discontinued" before taking the next step.

A second poll found that 197 people are willing to wait because their "current computer still works fine." 131 others said they would build a "Hackintosh," a custom-built computer running an unauthorized copy of OS X. Finally, 47 people said they would switch back to Microsoft Windows.

Apple did not immediately respond to a request for comment on both the petition and its plans for the Mac Pro.

AppleInsider reported last year that, according to people familiar with the matter, Apple's management had been undecided about the long-term future of the Mac Pro. Sales executives reportedly believed that the machine's days are numbered because sales of the workstations have dwindled in recent years.

Apple's neglect of the Mac Pro was especially felt last year as all of the other Mac models received upgrades adding Thunderbolt and Sandy Bridge processors. Some have even suggested that Thunderbolt is Apple's alternative to high-end workstations.

Customers have reported repeated delays of build-to-order models of the Mac Pro recently. Late last month, an AppleInsider reader reporter that his order from March had yet to ship and was still in processing.

The Mac Pro's important to Apple's bottom line has diminished as the company's profits have increasingly skewed toward mobile devices and the iPhone has come to account for the bulk of its revenue. Apple sold 1.2 million desktops in the second quarter of fiscal 2012, compared to 2.82 million notebooks during the period. Mac revenue for the quarter amounted to $5.1 billion, much less than the $22.7 billion in revenue from the iPhone and related products.

Though Apple has in the past been known as a niche hardware and software maker catering to creative professionals, the company has shown a willingness to adapt to better serve its mainstream customers. For instance, it announced plans to discontinue its Xserve server in 2010. Though the company redirected customers to its Mac Pro as a Mac-based server alternative, it has curiously not updated the Mac Pro since July 2010.

The Cupertino, Calif., company upset a number of professional video editors last year with the release of Final Cut Pro X. Power users complained that the new release more closely resembled iMovie, Apple's entry-level video editing software, than previous versions of Final Cut Pro. AppleInsider exclusively reported in May 2010 that Apple was planning to make Final Cut more of a "prosumer" product, but the company promised at the time that its pro customers would "love" it.
post #2 of 203

1. Facebook.

2. Absolutely. No. Weight. in the real world.

3. I don't want it discontinued, either. But Apple will talk to its users thereof directly, not some… petition. Remember pre-FCPX? They gave software to people early to test it and to make it better. And they listened to the people after launch and made changes.

 

I still trust Apple to count on its pro users. Is six years ago too far back to cite? The first 15" MacBook Pro. Lack of FireWire 800. Threw a fit, brought it back. Apple will either ignore pros completely and discontinue it or build a breakthrough new machine designed to take the best advantage of Thunderbolt possible.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #3 of 203

CS6 runs fine on Snow Leopard. If I could build my own dual xeon Hacintosh I would be fine. Trouble is that it is not that easy. The MBs that are somewhat compatible are just not up to spec, especially the audio, and of course no TB which is going to be pretty important for video applications. So unless there are some breakthroughs on the Hackintosh front we are apparently stuck with iMac as an upgrade path. I have nothing against iMacs. I have a couple at home but I really need slots for my Intensity pro card and more memory, fast internal HDs, etc. for professional work at the office.


Edited by mstone - 5/24/12 at 9:34pm

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply

Life is too short to drink bad coffee.

Reply
post #4 of 203
Apple speaks when they are ready to speak. They release when they are ready to release. They don't owe anyone information etc.

They are not going to change tactics because of some petition etc.

If these folks don't wait to wait then they are welcome to go buy a windows system etc. it isn't going to bother Apple if they lose those sales.

Yeah we all know how the creative pros stood by Apple blah blah. But that time is done. It died way before Steve did. The writing has been on the walls for years. Either you embrace the change or you move on.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

Reply
post #5 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

I still trust Apple to count on its pro users. Is six years ago too far back to cite? The first 15" MacBook Pro. Lack of FireWire 800. Threw a fit, brought it back. Apple will either ignore pros completely and discontinue it or build a breakthrough new machine designed to take the best advantage of Thunderbolt possible.

Post hoc, ergo propter hoc. There is no evidence that shows that Apple had no intention of including FW800 from the PB to the MBP transition when it was feasible for them to do so.

That transition also dropped the 8x SuperDrive with DVD+R DL in favour of a 4x SuperDrive with no DVD±DL. I don't recall any assumption that Apple was going to always use the lower performance and worse feature SuperDrive. It was unwelcome for those that needed the PB's SuperDrive but those that wanted a better one in a MBP knew it would arrive when it was feasible.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #6 of 203

And they were doing so well up until the "Macpro" part. They did get the first four words correct, though.

 

Great Job!

post #7 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post
There is no evidence that shows that Apple had no intention of including FW800 from the PB to the MBP transition when it was feasible for them to do so.
That transition also dropped the 8x SuperDrive with DVD+R DL in favour of a 4x SuperDrive with no DVD±DL.

 

Therefore the question becomes why this port and part were removed when Apple knew they worked previously.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #8 of 203
Are those Apps not running well on the latest and fastest iMac? The Top End Consumer Grade iMac has gotten so fast it doesn't make a difference.
post #9 of 203

Slots are sooooo 1987. mstone, you most likely will not need slots at all. Many manufacturers are developing external boxes in which to install your existing cards, which attaches via Thunderbolt. For those who do not offer a card recycling solution, or in lieu of upgrades, they will be building Thunderbolt interfaces for boxes which implement the same functionality as cards. Yes it means the purchase of additional hardware, but what else is new?

post #10 of 203

Well i can tell you what we do. We have i7 iMacs in places where we had Mac Pros and we use Xgrid to distribute tasks over a fast network. Works very well and is cheaper. Of course an all-in-one design has its disadvantages, but it's not like we live in a perfect world.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #11 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksec View Post

Are those Apps not running well on the latest and fastest iMac? The Top End Consumer Grade iMac has gotten so fast it doesn't make a difference.

The Pros need slots and more processing power.

post #12 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


Post hoc, ergo propter hoc. There is no evidence that shows that Apple had no intention of including FW800 from the PB to the MBP transition when it was feasible for them to do so.
That transition also dropped the 8x SuperDrive with DVD+R DL in favour of a 4x SuperDrive with no DVD±DL. I don't recall any assumption that Apple was going to always use the lower performance and worse feature SuperDrive. It was unwelcome for those that needed the PB's SuperDrive but those that wanted a better one in a MBP knew it would arrive when it was feasible.

Really? Even my plastic Macbook from 2006 had DVDDL superdrive.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #13 of 203

If the Mac Pro is a money-losing product for Apple, then it's as good as gone.  What's the point of Apple holding onto a financial boat anchor?  For Apple, it's all about profits and I guess that's the proper way to run the company.  I could see if consumers or enterprise users were knocking the door down for Mac Pros, but they probably aren't.  A handful of consumers petitioning isn't going to change anything.  It looks like the whole world of computing is changing and the Mac Pro is almost like a dinosaur.  Too bad.  They're wonderfully designed machines but I guess their time has passed.  I think that Apple should build a heavy-duty iMac Pro and call it a day.  There's no way a Mac Pro will gain any traction with all those specialized Wintel desktop boxes available for such low prices.  When a company refuses to update a product for a couple of years and the company is practically bursting with excess cash, then they've just plain lost interest in the product and those target customers.

post #14 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac_128 View Post

Slots are sooooo 1987. mstone, you most likely will not need slots at all. Many manufacturers are developing external boxes in which to install your existing cards, which attaches via Thunderbolt. For those who do not offer a card recycling solution, or in lieu of upgrades, they will be building Thunderbolt interfaces for boxes which implement the same functionality as cards. Yes it means the purchase of additional hardware, but what else is new?

Protools still uses PCIe cards.  UAD still uses PCIe cards.  They still need lots of storage, lots of option choices in one cabinet rather than a lot of external devices whenever possible.

 

When is the last time you have been in a Professional audio/video studio?  a Quad Core chip isn't enough.  They want multiple 6 or 8 core chips.  Some of these places would take whatever you could give them in additional processing power.  People working with 4K video?  They need TONS of processing power.

post #15 of 203

Apple doesn't care, and for good reason. They can completely scrap the Mac Pro, and it won't make a shred of a blip on their financial statements. 

 

Also, can someone explain to me who exactly needs a Mac Pro, apart from those extreme niche cases like studios who do professional 3D rendering, etc? What exactly can't a high end iMac do these days? Short of Avatar, it can even handle HD video editing, 3D rendering, etc. 

 

3 things can happen:

a. It will be silently updated, but may not even make it to Apple's front page

b. They will leave the Mac Pro hanging like the iPod classic with no more updates. 

c. It will be removed from the store and completely discontinued. 

 

I see all these as having a near equal chance of happening. 

 

Oh, and 4000 signatures isn't called 'gaining traction' for a company that sells 60-70 million products a quarter. It's called a drop in a very big ocean. 


Edited by Slurpy - 5/24/12 at 10:13pm
post #16 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

The Pros need slots and more processing power.

Old farts you mean. Today a 16 year old kid can do stuff with an iMac and when shown you won't even be able to tell that 16 year old kid did it until someone tells you. That's how things are going to be now.

 

We have to draw a line between Avatar type Pro (huge films, many effects and so on) and editing some TV Show episode Pro which can be done using a MacBook Pro while on train to Utah.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #17 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Povilas View Post

Really? Even my plastic Macbook from 2006 had DVDDL superdrive.
The 2nd generation MB, released in November 2006, received the option for the 6x SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW) drive. A month earlier the 3rd generation 15" MBP also received that same drive. Note that it still wasn't DVD±R DL with the 6x drives.

It wasn't for 1.5 years after the 15" MBP was first introduced, in June 2007, that they finally were able to add an 8x SuperDrive with DVD±DL like what had been available in the PowerBooks.

I'd say it's because of thinness of the new casings but the 17" MBPs started with the 8x Slot-loading SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW) right away and it was also 1" thick so there is clearly at least one other factor I haven't considered.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #18 of 203
The Mac Pro is for companies doing film post production, animation, hi def audio production, hi end 3D etc. it's for the top part of the professional line. I'm currently on my way to working with more and more professional animation, and I'm getting ready to purchase a new computer that can handle as much as possible.
And as they're saying: the iMac is not the answer. Uncompromised power is.
post #19 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Povilas View Post


We have to draw a line between Avatar type Pro (huge films, many effects and so on) and editing some TV Show episode Pro which can be done using a MacBook Pro while on train to Utah.

I knew Amtrak was slow but damn!

iPod nano 5th Gen 8GB Orange, iPad 3rd Gen WiFi 32GB White
MacBook Pro 15" Core i7 2.66GHz 8GB RAM 120GB Intel 320M
Mac mini Core 2 Duo 2.4GHz 8GB RAM, iPhone 5 32GB Black

Reply

iPod nano 5th Gen 8GB Orange, iPad 3rd Gen WiFi 32GB White
MacBook Pro 15" Core i7 2.66GHz 8GB RAM 120GB Intel 320M
Mac mini Core 2 Duo 2.4GHz 8GB RAM, iPhone 5 32GB Black

Reply
post #20 of 203

It's clear Apple needs an entry-level tower. People shouldn't have to build Hackintoshes just to fill that need, or to be able to switch to a more powerful graphics card a couple of years down the road.

post #21 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aizmov View Post


I knew Amtrak was slow but damn!

 

:) depends.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #22 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldenclaw View Post

It's clear Apple needs an entry-level tower. People shouldn't have to build Hackintoshes just to fill that need, or to be able to switch to a more powerful graphics card a couple of years down the road.

People can do whatever they want and Apple or any other company for that matter is not binded to fill that every crazy need. This is not how business works.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #23 of 203

The facebook group is weak, but i have sent tcook@apple.com formal and polite letters twice in the last year, on my concerns of apples future commitment to pro users in general. As someone who needs a powerful tower both professionally and recreationally. an imac is not an option, certainly a macbook pro isn't one. sure this years imac may run this years stuff, but they are severely lacking in expansion and customability. as for their vid cards, they aren't the highest quality either, they are mid ranged mobility chips that get the job done, THIS year. But 1-2 years down the line and your imac isn't worth a crap. My 2008 mac pro is only JUST NOW starting to struggling with certain modern stuff, yet it still gets the job done, i'm do for an upgrade. It's kind of funny, my 2008 mac pro runs circles around even some 2011 and 2010 imacs with ease. Goes to show you something.

 

In any case, i see the facebook group as sort of a weak endevour. what they need is more organizing. a LOT more formal emails to tim cook maybe. More coverage on sites like this, ones that catch apple's media attention.

post #24 of 203

There are still a lot of tasks that are CPU intensive and lend themselves to parallel processing.

For example, video compression benefits from multi core systems.  In 3D computer graphics rendering: raytracing, photo mapping, image processing, light mapping can also take a very long time to do on a computer without a lot of cores.  I use both mac and pc, and its way easier to procure a pc workstation with a ton of cores and these tasks can run so much faster on them.  The first mackintosh machines that I had seen were not able to utilize all of the cores in the OSX operating system so they ran faster with windows.

 

Long FB, AMZN
Schlong AAPL

Reply

Long FB, AMZN
Schlong AAPL

Reply
post #25 of 203

"With Apple's Mac Pro line growing long in the tooth after not having received an update for almost two years"

 

This is basically the same amount of time that we have not seen any update from HP and Dell for their workstations. HP just released their new workstations with the new Sandy Bridge Xeons a few weeks ago and Dell has announced their new line of workstations also based on Sandy bridge Xeons a few days ago but they are not shipping yet. For HP and Dell, the time between the new offering and the previous one has been long, in fact as long as for the Mac Pro. I have already said many times here, but it seems that the AppleInsider editorial is all about sensationalism. The reason is the delay Intel took before they could ship the new Xeons. Like everyone else, Intel is putting more priority to the mobile market and the Xeon development cycle has slowed down significantly. The Xeon is a more complex chip, Intel is clearly not driving the development of the chip faster than a new generation every one and a half or two years. On top of that, the Sandy Bridge Xeons had a bug which delayed their market introduction by half a year.

 

Now, Apple does not talk about unreleased products but I don't believe that Apple is about to kill the Mac Pro. The Mac Pro is profitable, small profits but profitable. Apple recognizes the need of the Mac Pro for its pro users, Apple employees themselves need this sort of machine. I guess it is a matter of days before we get some news about all the renewal of the Macs including the iMacs which are also pending for new release. 

 

"The Cupertino, Calif., company upset a number of professional video editors last year with the release of Final Cut Pro X. Power users complained that the new release more closely resembled iMovie, Apple's entry-level video editing software, than previous versions of Final Cut Pro. AppleInsider exclusively reported in May 2010 that Apple was planning to make Final Cut more of a "prosumer" product, but the company promised at the time that its pro customers would "love" it."

 

I am sorry but your report was basically wrong. You can't argue that the new Final Cut was am iMovie like, this is just ridiculous. From the first release, it was already way more powerful. I don't believe that Apple intended to arm Final Cut users but the pain was necessary to transition from the old Final Cut that everyone in the market was asking to be replaced with something more modern. When Apple did, people cried scandal because some features were missing but this was necessary as Apple could not possibly introduce the product with just all previous features built-in somehow but it has to completely rethink the product by first introducing what they felt was new to the market. Since then, Apple has largely committed to satisfy pro users by pushing forward the product and they did it by bringing updates with powerful new features. And now, I don't think there is someone out there who can still argue that Final Cut Pro X is not for pro when in the same time the product offers multi cam editing up to 64 angles!!!!

post #26 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Protools still uses PCIe cards.  UAD still uses PCIe cards.  They still need lots of storage, lots of option choices in one cabinet rather than a lot of external devices whenever possible.

 

When is the last time you have been in a Professional audio/video studio?  a Quad Core chip isn't enough.  They want multiple 6 or 8 core chips.  Some of these places would take whatever you could give them in additional processing power.  People working with 4K video?  They need TONS of processing power.


Great post. Some people here are oblivious to the needs of anyone except themselves. I work in a small post-house with fifteen Macs, 5 of which are MacPros that are desperately in need of upgrading for running AE and DaVinci etc. FCS is struggling with HD, 2K and 4K files. We've already upgraded RAM and GPUs. This is a real need. However ineffectual a petition on FB may be, I can understand the concerns of those who started and 'signed' it.

"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
post #27 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Povilas View Post

Old farts you mean. Today a 16 year old kid can do stuff with an iMac and when shown you won't even be able to tell that 16 year old kid did it until someone tells you. That's how things are going to be now.

 

We have to draw a line between Avatar type Pro (huge films, many effects and so on) and editing some TV Show episode Pro which can be done using a MacBook Pro while on train to Utah.

 

You obviously have no idea of the hardware requirements of the professional design/production industry.

"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
"We're Apple. We don't wear suits. We don't even own suits."
Reply
post #28 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakime View Post

"With Apple's Mac Pro line growing long in the tooth after not having received an update for almost two years"

 

This is basically the same amount of time that we have not seen any update from HP and Dell for their workstations. HP just released their new workstations with the new Sandy Bridge Xeons a few weeks ago and Dell has announced their new line of workstations also based on Sandy bridge Xeons a few days ago but they are not shipping yet. For HP and Dell, the time between the new offering and the previous one has been long, in fact as long as for the Mac Pro. I have already said many times here, but it seems that the AppleInsider editorial is all about sensationalism. The reason is the delay Intel took before they could ship the new Xeons. Like everyone else, Intel is putting more priority to the mobile market and the Xeon development cycle has slowed down significantly. The Xeon is a more complex chip, Intel is clearly not driving the development of the chip faster than a new generation every one and a half or two years. On top of that, the Sandy Bridge Xeons had a bug which delayed their market introduction by half a year.

 

Now, Apple does not talk about unreleased products but I don't believe that Apple is about to kill the Mac Pro. The Mac Pro is profitable, small profits but profitable. Apple recognizes the need of the Mac Pro for its pro users, Apple employees themselves need this sort of machine. I guess it is a matter of days before we get some news about all the renewal of the Macs including the iMacs which are also pending for new release. 

 

"The Cupertino, Calif., company upset a number of professional video editors last year with the release of Final Cut Pro X. Power users complained that the new release more closely resembled iMovie, Apple's entry-level video editing software, than previous versions of Final Cut Pro. AppleInsider exclusively reported in May 2010 that Apple was planning to make Final Cut more of a "prosumer" product, but the company promised at the time that its pro customers would "love" it."

 

I am sorry but your report was basically wrong. You can't argue that the new Final Cut was am iMovie like, this is just ridiculous. From the first release, it was already way more powerful. I don't believe that Apple intended to arm Final Cut users but the pain was necessary to transition from the old Final Cut that everyone in the market was asking to be replaced with something more modern. When Apple did, people cried scandal because some features were missing but this was necessary as Apple could not possibly introduce the product with just all previous features built-in somehow but it has to completely rethink the product by first introducing what they felt was new to the market. Since then, Apple has largely committed to satisfy pro users by pushing forward the product and they did it by bringing updates with powerful new features. And now, I don't think there is someone out there who can still argue that Final Cut Pro X is not for pro when in the same time the product offers multi cam editing up to 64 angles!!!!

Agreed.  Apple isn't going to ditch the Mac Pro.  I'm sure we will see an upgrade in the next month or so.

post #29 of 203

43 will do this, 36 will do that 197 will twiddle thumbs....

 

These are not numbers significant enough to register on the Appleometer.

post #30 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by sennen View Post

 

You obviously have no idea of the hardware requirements of the professional design/production industry.

You obviously haven't heard about professional bias have you? You are not as important as you might think you are. Current day so called professionals remind me of big city dwellers, when you put them in the wild they don't even know how to make fire. OMG where's my super duper crzy high tech laser fire maker.

 

If doesn't start my post with "I WORK FOR" or "I'VE BEEN WORKING" or "I HAD PRETTY MUCH EVERY MAC SINCE ..." doesn't mean i don't know anything. It however means that it's internet and no one gives a shit about what you do.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #31 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


The 2nd generation MB, released in November 2006, received the option for the 6x SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW) drive. A month earlier the 3rd generation 15" MBP also received that same drive. Note that it still wasn't DVD±R DL with the 6x drives.
It wasn't for 1.5 years after the 15" MBP was first introduced, in June 2007, that they finally were able to add an 8x SuperDrive with DVD±DL like what had been available in the PowerBooks.
I'd say it's because of thinness of the new casings but the 17" MBPs started with the 8x Slot-loading SuperDrive (DVD+R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW) right away and it was also 1" thick so there is clearly at least one other factor I haven't considered.

If I remember correctly, this was exactly the reason why they had to put a slower drive in the MBP to start out with. They were able to get the laptop so much thinner with the cooler chips they didn't have a superdrive that was thin enough to fit at the 8x speed. 

 

As far as the MacPro goes...well Apple will release one when they're ready to release it. To be honest, they really haven't any much to work with up until now. I don't see the current line up as a stale product. I hope they keep the MacPro as well. I think its a viable product and while it may not be a big seller to them, I think its an important one. iMacs, while they do offer Core i7 processors, may be to fine for Photoshop and things like that are dogs when it comes to professional video editing. I'm no video editing expert, but I do know that this does require a tremendous amount of processing power to get anything done in a timely fashion, or at all. When you have 3D and 4K video, these requirements only get higher and higher. 

Mac Mini (Mid 2011) 2.5 GHz Core i5

120 GB SSD/500 GB HD/8 GB RAM

AMD Radeon HD 6630M 256 MB

Reply

Mac Mini (Mid 2011) 2.5 GHz Core i5

120 GB SSD/500 GB HD/8 GB RAM

AMD Radeon HD 6630M 256 MB

Reply
post #32 of 203

I just want to comment on another typical usage of the Mac Pro besides video production, 3D production or CAD oriented workflow. I am talking about science and engineering.

 

For for those who believe that there is no need of a Mac Pro, I should give them an example of a real workflow:

 

- I work on geophysics, dealing with high performance computing involving the simulation of complex problems. 

 

- Method used: finite element

 

- Language: C, Objective C , OpenCL and Fortran, 

 

- Platform:

     - Several Mac Pros with dual Xeons, 12 cores total.

     - Memory on board: 64 GB of memory

     - Storage on board: 4 TB

 

- Workflow: The simulations are run with a custom finite element code written in Fortran (a next generation code base written in Objective C/C is currently under development). The parallelization of the code is done with OpenMPI (as it allows to dispatch work on all machines on the network) so EVERY SINGLE core is being used. The simulation itself eat up above 50 GB of RAM. Yes, only one simulation!!!

 

- The post processing of the data are done with a custom code written in C and OpenCL which takes advantage of the Radeon HD 5870 to speed up the calculation. So by definition we need to have access to better and more powerful GPUs than what is available on iMacs and are only available on a Mac Pro.

 

- One simulation generates hundred of gigabytes of data. As a result terabytes of data are produced by successive simulations, data which are stored in large disks connected via firewire 800 to the Mac Pros for backing up the data if the results are acceptable.

 

Here you have it, this is my workflow. And as we keep studying bigger and more complex problems, we need again and again more powerful Mac Pros with higher processing power and better technology. This allows us to do things that would only be possible with much more expensive hardware, typically a supercomputer of a small size.

 

Anyone still saying that no one needs a Mac Pro?


Edited by Hakime - 5/25/12 at 12:50am
post #33 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakime View Post

Now, Apple does not talk about unreleased products but I don't believe that Apple is about to kill the Mac Pro. The Mac Pro is profitable, small profits but profitable. Apple recognizes the need of the Mac Pro for its pro users, Apple employees themselves need this sort of machine. I guess it is a matter of days before we get some news about all the renewal of the Macs including the iMacs which are also pending for new release.

The problem with "small profits" is companies won't really miss them if they decide to kill off the product.

Are there pros who need thie extra power and capabilities of a MacPro? Absolutely. However, sales of Mac Pros are smaller than a rounding error in comparison to Apple's main products.
Edited by Orlando - 5/24/12 at 11:58pm
post #34 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post


The problem with "small profits" is companies won't really miss them if they decide to kill off the product.

 

This is somewhat true but in the same time they take the risk of killing a complete ecosystem of pro apps that do make significant profits.

post #35 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakime View Post

I just want to comment on another typical usage of the Mac Pro besides video production, 3D production or CAD oriented workflow. I am talking about science and engineering.

 

For for those who believe that there is no need of a Mac Pro, I should give them an example of a real workflow:

 

- I work on geophycics, dealing with high performance computing involving the simulation of complex problems. 

 

- Method used: finite element

 

- Language: C, Objective C , OpenCL and Fortran, 

 

- Platform:

     - Several Mac Pros with dual Xeons, 12 cores total.

     - Memory on board: 64 GB of memory

     - Storage on board: 4 TB

 

- Workflow: The simulations are run with a custom finite element code written in Fortran (a next generation code base written in Objective C/C is currently under development). The parallelization of the code is done with OpenMPI (as it allows to dispatch work on all machines on the network) so EVERY SINGLE core is being used. The simulation itself east up above 50 GB of RAM. Yes, only one simulation!!!

 

- The post processing of the data are done with a custom code written in C and OpenCL which takes advantage of the Radeon HD 5870 to speed up the calculation. So by definition we need to have access to better and more powerful GPUs than what is available on iMacs and are only available on a Mac Pro.

 

- The simulations generates hundred of gigabytes of data. As a result terabytes of data are produced by successive simulations, data which are stored in large disks connected via firewire 800 to the Mac Pros for backing up the data if the results are acceptable.

 

Here you have it, this is my workflow. And as we keep studying bigger and more complex problems, we need again and again more powerful Mac Pros with higher processing power and better technology. This allows us to do things that would only be possible with much more expensive hardware, typically a supercomputer of a small size.

 

Anyone still saying that no one needs a Mac Pro?

No one is saying there is no need for such machine, some however are saying that many of the tasks can be done on other machines as well if you really think about it.

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply

Which of us is the fisherman and which the trout?

Reply
post #36 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Povilas View Post

No one is saying there is no need for such machine, some however are saying that many of the tasks can be done on other machines as well if you really think about it.

 

Oh yes, I have seen not only in AppleInsider forums but somewhere else like in MacWorld, people arguing that the Mac Pro is not needed anymore therefore implying that no one needs it anymore.

 

And when it comes to people saying that many of the tasks can be done on other machines, I am sorry but usually people don't really understand what is the matter here, referring to "many of the tasks" as a dummy argument rather than a real argument. Simply because they have no idea on what tasks really is the Mac Pro used for.

post #37 of 203

Dumbest post in the world....

post #38 of 203

And I hope you agree with me that I can think about it as well as I can, I can't avoid but to conclude that there is no way I can do my daily work on another machine than the Mac Pro. No way, Right?

post #39 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hakime View Post

I just want to comment on another typical usage of the Mac Pro besides video production, 3D production or CAD oriented workflow. I am talking about science and engineering.

For for those who believe that there is no need of a Mac Pro, I should give them an example of a real workflow:

- I work on geophycics, dealing with high performance computing involving the simulation of complex problems. 

- Method used: finite element

- Language: C, Objective C , OpenCL and Fortran, 

- Platform:
     - Several Mac Pros with dual Xeons, 12 cores total.
     - Memory on board: 64 GB of memory
     - Storage on board: 4 TB

- Workflow: The simulations are run with a custom finite element code written in Fortran (a next generation code base written in Objective C/C is currently under development). The parallelization of the code is done with OpenMPI (as it allows to dispatch work on all machines on the network) so EVERY SINGLE core is being used. The simulation itself east up above 50 GB of RAM. Yes, only one simulation!!!

- The post processing of the data are done with a custom code written in C and OpenCL which takes advantage of the Radeon HD 5870 to speed up the calculation. So by definition we need to have access to better and more powerful GPUs than what is available on iMacs and are only available on a Mac Pro.

- The simulations generates hundred of gigabytes of data. As a result terabytes of data are produced by successive simulations, data which are stored in large disks connected via firewire 800 to the Mac Pros for backing up the data if the results are acceptable.

Here you have it, this is my workflow. And as we keep studying bigger and more complex problems, we need again and again more powerful Mac Pros with higher processing power and better technology. This allows us to do things that would only be possible with much more expensive hardware, typically a supercomputer of a small size.

Anyone still saying that no one needs a Mac Pro?

I agree. We use Mac clusters for problems of comparable complexity, especially 1D, 2D and the occasional 3D simulation. Quicker and cheaper than running on the massively parallel machines if we don't have to. I'd be sorry to lose that option.
post #40 of 203

5,022 as of 12:12 am Friday.

An Apple man since 1977
Reply
An Apple man since 1977
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Future Apple Hardware
AppleInsider › Forums › Mac Hardware › Future Apple Hardware › Mac Pro petition gains traction as pro users seek information