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Former Apple employee claims Steve Jobs would have 'lost his mind' over Siri - Page 3

post #81 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post


When previously has Apple ever released something still in beta? I could easily imagine Steve Jobs being upset by that.

Umm . . . Many times?

off the top of my head do you remember

OS X?

FaceTime?

Messages?

 

I'm pretty sure of these but can think of more that I'm less sure about.

post #82 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

I disagree. Google understands my speech better in both Spanish and English. Siri of course does not speak Spanish. Problem is neither of them understand me when I mix the two languages which is quite often necessary when living in California with all the Spanish names of places and things. Also in Spanish, quite frequently there is no Spanish word for many modern English nouns so you use the English word instead which is usually spoken without an accent. Both technologies fail miserably in this context. Voice recognition has advanced about 1% from where it was 10 years ago and is miles from where it needs to be to actually be useful. Who wants to repeat themselves twenty times before giving up when the whole point of voice recognition is to simplify common tasks.

 

Yeah... Spanish is hard for  Siri.  For example asking Siri to play:

 

-- el rancho grande --- nothing

-- rancho grande -- got it

-- los coconitos -- returned cocaine blues

-- zacatecas -- got it 2 out of 3

-- y andale -- returned jan and dean

-- las mañitas -- 1 out of 3

-- hay unos ojos -- returned Alan Sherman's Camp Granada

-- estrellita -- 1 out of 3

-- svi za ljubav * -- waiting for the robert e lee

 

The last was Croatian -- so there you go... nice to hear Al Jolson, though  :)

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post #83 of 181
Here's what I don't get.
The story isn't that Steve didn't approve of Siri, or that he lost his mind over it.
The story is apparently some former employee's PERSONAL OPINION about what he/she *THINKS* Steve would do. Well, I've got opinions about what Steve *would* do too. So does everyone else. Apparently, Adam Lahsinsky quoting you makes your opinion newsworthy.

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post #84 of 181

Still not much use in the UK. Turned it off after the first two weeks of owning my iPhone 4S.

 

Maybe Siri will be out of Beta for iOS 6....

post #85 of 181
Do any of the TV spots mention the "beta" status of this feature? I only checked two, but I only saw "sequences shortened".
post #86 of 181

I bet when Siri comes out of beta it will be much better,

 

but I don't think it will be this June...

post #87 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

This would make a fun poll. Invariably for me, Siri flubs this particular line, whether speaking slowly (with or without clear breaks between words) or normally. Some of its more common misinterpretations are:

 

"Remind me to put the guess Bacho on ice in an hour"

"Remind me to put the dispatch on Icenhower"

"Remind me to put the guest spot show on ice in an hour"

 

I don't know about you, but I'm scheduled to kill the dispatcher in about 59 minutes  :)

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post #88 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

 

Indeed. I find these 'Steve Jobs would have..' ...just down-right wrong. 

...

Siri is definitely not 'embarrassing', as in my experience its ahead of anything else out there in the consumer space, as well as the implementation.

 

For the people saying its not 'ready for prime time'- when would have it been ready? Now? In a year? 2 years? I guarantee in 5 years it will still **** up and will not be perfect, as there will still be an infinite number of dialects, accents, and contexts out there. There comes a point where it needs to be released so you can get the data and feedback of millions of users. 

 

I totally agree!

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post #89 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyram Gestan View Post

Siri is still in Beta.    Given that it is just beta software, it works very well.  Nobody should expect that beta software will be 100%

This is what drives me crazy. If it truly is Beta, then it should not be touted as a feature and used to sell the device. To me it seems more like they are trying to play both sides of the fence. 

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post #90 of 181

Interesting that Siri has so much difficulty with "gazpacho" for others, because it worked first try for me. I'm guessing that people are pronouncing it differently than expected - the word is gaz-PAH-cho, with a short first and second "A" vowel sound.

post #91 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

 

User: "How bout' dem Yankees?"  

Siri: "Fugetaboutit!"

 

or

 

User:  "hey Siri"

 

Siri:  "youtakintame?"

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post #92 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by parksgm View Post
Interesting that Siri has so much difficulty with "gazpacho" for others, because it worked first try for me. I'm guessing that people are pronouncing it differently than expected - the word is gaz-PAH-cho, with a short first and second "A" vowel sound.

 

I've heard it pronounced GEH-spa-cho often, which is probably where some of the error originates.

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post #93 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cpsro View Post

This would make a fun poll. Invariably for me, Siri flubs this particular line, whether speaking slowly (with or without clear breaks between words) or normally. Some of its more common misinterpretations are:

 

"Remind me to put the guess Bacho on ice in an hour"

"Remind me to put the dispatch on Icenhower"

"Remind me to put the guest spot show on ice in an hour"

As evidenced by the words chosen in the mis-transcribed attempts, you're pronouncing gazpacho incorrectly. It's gaz-PAH-cho, with a hard z (not an s) sound, and short "a" sounds.

post #94 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Do any of the TV spots mention the "beta" status of this feature? I only checked two, but I only saw "sequences shortened".

I don't think they do - and even if they did, many people (including friends who I have converted to Apple), aren't going to take notice of such messages. They will just focus on how cool and easy-to-use Siri is...and then get disappointed when it doesn't work as expected.

 

I actually queued up on for the iPhone 4S on launch day and so many of my friends/work colleagues were eager to give Siri a try lol.gif

 

I'm not trying to bash Apple by any means - I love their products.

 

Again, I'm not in the US so it may be better over there...

post #95 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

I've heard it pronounced GEH-spa-cho often, which is probably where some of the error originates.

 

Yep, looks like that's the case, as my previous post illustrates.

post #96 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Apple might say Siri is beta, but so far, only in very fine print. I had to do a Ctrl-F / Cmd-F to find the word beta in this page:
http://www.apple.com/iphone/features/siri.html
In short, they only say it's beta in the last sentence at the very bottom of the page.
It's mentioned in the last sentence of the top entry of the FAQ.
I never noticed a disclaimer in the TV ads.
I think that could be done better, because the disclaimers are done as if they're hoping you don't notice it. It seems inappropriate to make a beta feature also your headline feature, and advertise it so heavily without making it clearer.

 

Or, you know, instead of all that garbage you could have looked at the SECOND word on that page, right after 'Siri'. emblazoned in an impossible to miss, bright orange badge, the only word on that page in such a badge.  Did you honestly not see it, or did you pretend to as as to give your narrative weight and? No Cmd-F needed.  Here, let me help you out..

 

Screen%20Shot%202012-05-25%20at%2012.50.24%20PM.png

 

For people with eyes, I think this is clear enough. No need to go digging through FAQS, disclaimers, etc.

post #97 of 181

Normally I'd agree but Apple is not known for releasing things that are in beta.  While it appears that it is what google normally does, I can't recall Apple doing that.  It seems to me to just be an excuse for something that is wrong, whether or not it really is a problem.

post #98 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDoppio View Post

I bet when Siri comes out of beta it will be much better,

 

but I don't think it will be this June...

 

This is just conjecture, but it may be that more robust hardware is required on the iDevice for Siri to take the next step -- could be more robust, CPU, GPU, RAM or a special DSP.

 

Anyway, it is interesting that the new iPad and new AppleTV both use the A5x chip that addresses the CPU/GPU/RAM issues -- don't know about a special DSP.

 

Could be when the next iPhone is released, they will remove the shackles from Siri.

 

The way they are advertising Siri, makes me think that something's afoot!

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post #99 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by duncanator View Post
Normally I'd agree but Apple is not known for releasing things that are in beta.

 

OS X.

iWork.com.

FaceTime.

Messages.

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post #100 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay-t View Post

I don't know about others but "my" Siri understands me perfectly well almost all the time. Putting the gazpacho on ice was not a problem. :-)

 

 

I also use Siri often, to send text messages, reminders, timers, restaurants, locations, directions, and querying factual information. To me it works rather well, most of the time.

I've noticed that when I'm speeding down the highway at high speed, the ambient noise in my car prevents Siri from processing my inquiries, and so she responds with an error message. But I can understand, for my auto is very noisy.

I'm a native Spanish speaker, so I speak English with an accent, and I find Siri superb in her understanding.

-dZ.
post #101 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Or, you know, instead of all that garbage you could have looked at the SECOND word on that page, right after 'Siri'. emblazoned in an impossible to miss, bright orange badge, the only word on that page in such a badge.  Did you honestly not see it, or did you pretend to as as to give your narrative weight and? No Cmd-F needed.  Here, let me help you out..

LL

For people with eyes, I think this is clear enough. No need to go digging through FAQS, disclaimers, etc.

Excuse me. This error was already pointed out an hour ago already, only two posts after mine, sheesh. How many times should I have to apologize for a mistake?

Also, as yet, no one has pointed out the term beta appearing in the TV ads, not even in the fine print.
Edited by JeffDM - 5/25/12 at 11:27am
post #102 of 181

I tried the gazpato reminder verbatim, also.

 

Siri worked perfectly, understood the request, and offered to set up a reminder.

 

W\Siri usually works for me. On the other hand my GF f's it up 80% of the time. I think it is because she angles the phone and speaks directly into the base. Who knows...

post #103 of 181

I have mixed feelings about Siri.  I don't want to write either one of them first because doing so places emphasis and they both weigh the same for me.  I think Siri works incredibly well, especially for a Beta product, however, I think Apple has shot themselves in the foot by making it their primary push in advertising.  Is it a cool feature?  Definitely.  I use it rarely, however.  I've occasionally spoken text messages while in the car...but rarely.  If I take a power nap I use it.  If I'm cooking something I use it.  I use it for these things because I can avoid a lot of button pressing.  But I honestly don't use it in the city (NY) because I feel terribly conspicuous and just feel silly (personal experience). 

 

Aside from that, while I don't mean to sound like a jerk, Siri understands me quite well - if you speak English and are pronouncing words correctly, you will have no problem.  Sorry.  No argument, here.  I know people at work and elsewhere who occasionally complain that Siri can't understand them, but it's my experience (writer, BA in English) that many people are simply not cognizant of just how stilted or fractured their speaking voice is...it's usually something people notice when they begin taking classes on how to give speeches.  Frankly, every English speaking person I've met who can't get Siri to understand him/her is a dialectic train wreck...but it's not the kind of thing even well-speaking peers are going to be cognizant of, let alone tell you about.  Someone might beg to differ, but that'll have to be where we part ways. 

 

My own personal experiment (because I like to verify claims) is my one and only attempt to ask Siri for a reminder.  I think I even slightly mispronounced gazpacho.  Frankly, if it doesn't work for you, "You're saying it wrong."  Siri has trouble perfectly dictating entire paragraphs that I speak...but that's because human beings have difficulty speaking perfectly formed sentences on the fly without stuttering, elongating a word here and there, etc.  I think most people are simply not used to having their speech errors pointed out to them.  Attend toast masters...you'll find out what Siri has already been telling you. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

photo.PNG

post #104 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoxMacCary View Post
Of course Steve would've lost his mind over the gimmicky DREK that is Siri ....

 

He personally approved it. Don't dare think you can say what he would or would not do.

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post #105 of 181

I got 'put the despot shop on ice in an hour. Like I know what the hell gezpacho is. Sometimes Siri get it wrong but I use it a lot anyway. It works for me, even if occasionally I have to put the despot show on ice...

 
 
post #106 of 181

SIRI remind me to wake up in an hour!

 

Zagger and Evans song "in the year 2525" from the 60's is getting to be to real for me, and WAY to early.

 

Folks, if you need to be reminded to do anything in an hour, maybe you need medication, or a note pad.

 

- You live in the neighborhood, you should and better know where in hell you get mushrooms!

- SIRI take the night off? Come on folks, what in hell is this all about.

 

I know these are just commercials, but are they based on what we expect from our toys (phones), and if so, get ready for 

our FAT people numbers to grow.

 

Skip

post #107 of 181

To any Windows/Android aficionado, I'd be considered an "Apple Fan Boy," and I actually love Siri, but, come on, applying the "Beta" label doesn't let Apple off the hook — if they had instead called it "Alpha" would you now be gushing about how other-worldly outstanding it is for an alpha product?  Or, what if they decided to call it a prototype, or a weekend hack?  A clever marketing label of feigned bashfulness doesn't change the fact that this is the major feature of the most major product of one of the most major tech companies to ever exist.  It doesn't become immune to criticism simply because they attached a well chosen word to its description — it's smoke and mirrors for the biased and gullible. When Apple bought Siri for $200mil, the Siri app was already in the App Store, and Apple strictly prohibits beta applications in the App Store.

 

Now, to play my own devil's advocate, I actually see "Beta" as an admission that the product didn't measure up to Steve's full expectations, but that it was still cool enough, even given it's limitations, to share with the world.  I think that's right.  And it is arguably much better, and certainly more convenient than any mainstream technology of it's sort to come before it.

 

The reasons I'm forgiving of Apple falling short of perfection is that 1) their offerings are nearly always better for the majority of people, in measurable ways, (simpler, designed to be powerful and still instantly understood) than the majority of what's otherwise widely deployed, and 2) over time they actively address the most disappointing limitations. Apple's almost never at the bleeding-edge, but when they introduce something, they 3) make it core, default and automatic.  It's way too easy for us to overlook the power of "default."  It's "default" that revolutionizes landscapes, and pulls things out of the mere fringe of possibility.  You only really change the world when you get a billion people to take something for granted.  Possibility emerges at the edges of the bell curve, but meaningful change only happens in the center.

post #108 of 181

Why the heck is SLJ making gazpacho anyway? I would have thought he'd be all BBQ ribs and what not.

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post #109 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

SIRI remind me to wake up in an hour!

 

Zagger and Evans song "in the year 2525" from the 60's is getting to be to real for me, and WAY to early.

 

Folks, if you need to be reminded to do anything in an hour, maybe you need medication, or a note pad.

 

- You live in the neighborhood, you should and better know where in hell you get mushrooms!

- SIRI take the night off? Come on folks, what in hell is this all about.

 

I know these are just commercials, but are they based on what we expect from our toys (phones), and if so, get ready for 

our FAT people numbers to grow.

 

Skip

 

No offense, but if you think human beings don't need help remembering a task that needs to be done later (be it an hour or a day later), you haven't spent much time in the professional world, or simply don't have many responsibilities.  A younger person might try to argue with that, but it'd be like a kid who likes film lecturing Scorsese on movies.  Normal people who need to be productive use reminders of all kinds, not to mention having their calenders filled with tasks and todo's.  There is an entire industry that helps people organize their to-do lists and activities.  Okay, if you're in college and the only thing you need to remember to do is study for a test and drink with the buddies, sure...but you sure as hell better be giving seminars on productivity and memory if you are living a productive adult life and need absolutely no reminders of any kind...I'll be the first to buy a ticket to listen to you.  I'd bet money you're either single and grown up, or under 25 (nothing wrong with either, and nothing wrong with having few responsibilities...I'm not criticizing...enjoy it).  And in my experience, people who have enough responsibilities to not only require reminders and calendar documentation, but USE it, are highly productive...and are generally NOT fat.  It's people who's ambition extends no further than whatever they happen to be able to remember to do when it comes to them who are more likely to be sedentary. 

 

On the other hand, I don't really use Siri for my own reminders...I use lists and calender notes.

post #110 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayrodo View Post

Just make it so it doesn't have to communicate with apple servers for requests that don't need an internet connection. Why do you need to communicate with the server to call a contact that the old voice service was able to do before without a connection?

Because Siri is learning as she goes from how people speak, and what types of information is most helpful. It is also looking at things like syntax and context, whereas Voice Command could only use very specific words and phrases to work.

post #111 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

 You live in the neighborhood, you should and better know where in hell you get mushrooms!

 

 

The whole ad is just ridiculous. Where is Siri getting the information about organic mushrooms? I tried a search on those terms in the center of Los Angeles and got one commercial food industry wholesale supply house. Normal small grocery stores do not advertise the type of produce they carry. Now if he had said "Find me an organic grocery store." there are dozens of hits but that isn't quite as cute for a TV ad.

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post #112 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncee View Post

SIRI remind me to wake up in an hour!

Zagger and Evans song "in the year 2525" from the 60's is getting to be to real for me, and WAY to early.

Folks, if you need to be reminded to do anything in an hour, maybe you need medication, or a note pad.

I would suggest that smart phones have or can replace paper notepads, has been for many years now. There's little sense in buying such a device and not taking advantage of its capabilities, such as setting alerts, reminders, timers and such. My life has a lot of interruptions, sometimes ten an hour, so I do take advantage of my iPhone's reminder capabilities, otherwise I just get interrupted out of what I intended to do for the day.

Quote:
- You live in the neighborhood, you should and better know where in hell you get mushrooms!
- SIRI take the night off? Come on folks, what in hell is this all about.

I think they're trying to be cute, or give the ad a sense of mirth.
Edited by JeffDM - 5/25/12 at 12:44pm
post #113 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Any article I see that quotes someone saying "Steve Jobs would.." I call BS on.

Indeed. Almost everything folks are saying he wouldn't have done was started in the thick of his time at Apple. Things they said he'd freak about were his pet projects.

Steve started the whole Siri thing. And probably oversaw every step because when he trusted MobileMe to the tem, they failed. He understood that you can't train a voice recognition system without billions of samples of all kinds of voices. That's why they need users. But on the flipside that also means issues with overloaded servers etc. same as you can be standing basically under a cell tower with five glowing bars but if that tower can only handle 1000 calls at a time nd you are 1001, you won't be able to make a call. As the man once said, you can't change the laws of gravity, even if you are Apple? But unlike these naysayers Apple and Steve understand such things
Edited by charlituna - 5/25/12 at 12:51pm
post #114 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orlando View Post

When previously has Apple ever released something still in beta? I could easily imagine Steve Jobs being upset by that.

iWork.com was released in beta and two years later canned in beta
post #115 of 181

I hope that Tim isn't letting standards slip. A human being, when talking to another, interprets a delay in response as... not meaningless. I wonder if this carries over to electronic devices. I would have delayed the release of Siri until it could run purely client side. It can still send logs and what not to Apple in order to aid with improving it, but this can be done in the background, when the device is not busy. Relying on the server for every single request is not an acceptable user experience.

post #116 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by ascii View Post
I would have delayed the release of Siri until it could run purely client side.

 

You'd have had them hold off until 2018?

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post #117 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by tikiman View Post

I guess there's little point in mentioning that 95% of the time Siri works just fine for me...

For you.

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post #118 of 181

So for those who have stopped using Siri, the reason for the 4S is?

post #119 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

You'd have had them hold off until 2018?

I believe it already does the speech recog on the client side, that is surely the most CPU intensive part? Extracting the meaning from the words would be more data intensive, but would that DB be more than a few gigs? I am not so sure client side would be 4 years away.

 

Of course if the specific query requires network access to answer (e.g. weather or map server) then there's no way to avoid the network, and perhaps that was Apple's thinking, that most queries would be like that, so might as well shift some of the processing to server side too. Or perhaps with such a new technology they wanted the freedom to make quick changes for the early versions, and once the kinks are ironed out they will go full client side. But that doesn't change the fact that delays are more noticeable with speech interfaces than GUIs. Then again they did call it a beta.

post #120 of 181
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ireland View Post

For you.

And for lots of people.

Why don't you show the percentage of people who are having problems with Siri?

No one said it was perfect. But all the people whining that it's 'defective' need to show that it fails a very large percentage of the time - and no one has done that.
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