or Connect
AppleInsider › Forums › General › Genius Bar › Samsung argues 4G Galaxy Tab not in direct competition with Apple's 3G iPad 2
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Samsung argues 4G Galaxy Tab not in direct competition with Apple's 3G iPad 2 - Page 3

post #81 of 121

EDIT: Posted wrong thread...


Edited by Gatorguy - 5/28/12 at 10:54am
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #82 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Even if you accept those numbers (which I am very skeptical of), that's well under 1% of iPhones - hardly a very impressive number.

Considering that the jailbreak has only been available for a few days, I'd say it's quite impressive.

 

My real point was to challenge the stereotype I see constantly on here - that most Android users are borderline autistic anti-social nerds who just hack their phones all day, while iOS users aren't interested in any of that. It's just not supported by evidence.

post #83 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

I have used Android, hence the reason I know its crap although arguing with you seems a bit pointless.

Luckily for Google your opinion doesn't mean a lot since Android has a market share of 59% of the smartphone market but hey it's "crap" though, right? You have used every version of Android or just one phone now can label them all "crap"?

 

By the way, it's "spiel" not "spill".

post #84 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredaroony View Post
…Android has a market share of 59% of the smartphone market but hey it's "crap" though, right?

 

McDonald's has stores everywhere. Must be the best restaurant in the world.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #85 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

That is not a selling point for the bulk of the market. This is precisely why Apple with at most 3 devices, and all under one roof, can round up around 30% of the market, while Samsung needs to sell everything they've got, from the good, the bad, to the downright ugly, to achieve barely more than ownership of half the market. Never mind the other Android vendors.

For Joe Average, "customization", "boot loaders", ROMS, and all that other nonsense is completely trumped by ease of use, and breadth and depth of the Apple ecosystem. Given *choice*, *ability* (to pay) and *availability*, consumers are looking for Apple gear. All the customization and "freedom" and openness in the world can't cover up an interface that looks and works like garbage. Google *does not* have the basics of a touch interface mastered. This is and has always been the major embarrassment when it comes to Android. They didn't bother to perfect the basics. So even the highest-end Android smartphone looks and feels and performs like a science fair project. There's no polish. This is also why it just fails epically in the tablet space. All those problems that Android users force themselves to live with in the name of "freedom" become magnified and intensified on a tablet to the point that it just becomes unbearable. 

If you don't build your house on a solid foundation it'll start falling apart. 


Like I said before it comes down to ones preference, there is no such thing as the better OS. I personally really like the way Anroid looks like, well the vanilla look not much of a fan of all those skins, however the beauty about having an open system is that I can completely change it to something I do like. There are countles number of great shells that will completely change the way the phone looks and operates. It doesn't matter though, you will most defiantly come back with Android is garbage because of this and that, please remember though not everyone believes what you do. I guess I'm just really getting tired of hearing from both camps that their OS is superior then the other when their not. Each has it weaknesses and strengths, which one makes you happy is all that matters.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
Reply
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
Reply
post #86 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post


Like I said before it comes down to ones preference, there is no such thing as the better OS. Each has it weaknesses and strengths, which one makes you happy is all that matters.

 

Anecdotally, you can claim anything you like, and at the same time do away with any measure we have for anything. You can be a perpetual fence-sitter. 

 

But piecemeal anecdotes don't matter. Your personal preference is not a reflection of either the desirability, performance, and quality of a product. The industry requires measures. These measures in turn set standards. These standards in turn light the way forward.

 

You can prefer whatever you like. Even an old Moto Star-Tac from 15 years ago. 

 

But multiply your anecdote by thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, and we have a measure that can be used for forecasting, comparison, and to determine who has what amount of market influence.

 

THIS is all that matters. Consumer satisfaction reports, year after year. This is where the rubber meets the road. This is where market-share is placed into the correct context and perspective:

 

http://www.engadget.com/2012/05/16/iphone-waltzes-into-top-spot-of-us-phone-satisfaction-index/

 

http://mashable.com/2011/09/09/apple-customer-satisfaction-survey/

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/briancaulfield/2011/03/18/apples-iphone-tops-jd-power-customer-satisfaction-survey-again/

 

http://www.macrumors.com/2011/09/08/apple-again-tops-j-d-power-rankings-of-smartphone-consumer-satisfaction/

 

ScreenShot2012-05-28at75101PM.jpg

 

 

 

Apple has consistenly topped rankings of this kind since the first or second year into the iPhone's release. 

post #87 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredaroony View Post

Luckily for Google your opinion doesn't mean a lot since Android has a market share of 59% of the smartphone market but hey it's "crap" though, right? You have used every version of Android or just one phone now can label them all "crap"?

 

By the way, it's "spiel" not "spill".

 

why use every version? what the point? Google have or are releasing version 5 while 85% of fandroids are still using <v4. On top of that its not like a new version gets released and anyone can install it, you need to wait for the phone/tablet manufacturer or phone company to released their modified version.

post #88 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

 

why use every version? what the point? Google have or are releasing version 5 while 85% of fandroids are still using <v4. On top of that its not like a new version gets released and anyone can install it, you need to wait for the phone/tablet manufacturer or phone company to released their modified version.

Just as I thought...you have no idea what you are on about lol.

post #89 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

I have used Android, hence the reason I know its crap although arguing with you seems a bit pointless.

So your use qualifies you to speak on behalf of all other Windows users and Android users? Good to know.
post #90 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

Provide actuals facts, by way of a cite/evidence (and not for "shipped units" or some bogus estimates put out by consulting firms, please). Otherwise, zip it.

It's called Google. Forgot many need to be spoon fed, should I provide your opinion for you as well?
post #91 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

What data are you referring to?
Do people buy smartphones for a variety of reasons?
I'm pretty sure people don't buy Android phones for the vast Android app ecosystem. So that must mean they buy Android phones to handle the normal tasks of phone calls, text messages and Facebook.
And as for Windows... when someone buys "a computer" chances are it's a Windows machine. And a lot of people use a computer for nothing more that email and Facebook.
Oh and you haven't provided any data either...

"I'm pretty sure" and "chances are" ? Really, these are your goto argument terms? Do you have any idea what "fact" means? You have no idea what others motivations are. Your opinion is not fact no matter how much you wish it was.
post #92 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

McDonald's has stores everywhere. Must be the best restaurant in the world.

I love the rational:

When referring to iPad it is all about numbers, how many sold and market share, when referring to Mac and iPhone it's not about the numbers or market share. Hypocrisy at its finest.
post #93 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

why use every version? what the point? Google have or are releasing version 5 while 85% of fandroids are still using

You should stop. Every new post of yours digs your ignorant hole deeper and deeper. You may want to stick to opinions and knowing what everyone else in the world thinks, facts and data are wasted on you.
post #94 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


So your use qualifies you to speak on behalf of all other Windows users and Android users? Good to know.

 

lol where did I say Im speaking on behalf of all other Windows and Android users? I said my opinion, and by choice, I choose to be neither a windows or android user. I chose to be a sheep with the other 41% of the smartphone market share... hang on that doesn't sound right?

You and fred have obviously joined this forum to to start arguments. Go join another forum with like minded people who think Android is good.

post #95 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post
I love the rational:
When referring to iPad it is all about numbers, how many sold and market share, when referring to Mac and iPhone it's not about the numbers or market share. Hypocrisy at its finest.

 

It's about ratings, reviews, popularity, and customer service. Also about profit. Apple happens to be first in all.

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply

Originally Posted by helia

I can break your arm if I apply enough force, but in normal handshaking this won't happen ever.
Reply
post #96 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


You should stop. Every new post of yours digs your ignorant hole deeper and deeper. You may want to stick to opinions and knowing what everyone else in the world thinks, facts and data are wasted on you.

 

haha you have given no facts

 

http://www.androidauthority.com/android-marketshare-gingerbread-froyo-ice-cream-sandwich-60474/

 

this is a couple months old but I doubt much has changed

post #97 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

It's about ratings, reviews, popularity, and customer service. Also about profit. Apple happens to be first in all.

I guess being behind in market share both in desktop computing and smartphones means winning in popularity then yes you are right. But when you make comments about McDonalds being everywhere and yet not the best your hypocrisy shows. As I stated, iPad all about the numbers, Mac, iPhone and pretty much anything else Apple it's about everything but numbers. Makes me chuckle.
post #98 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

lol where did I say Im speaking on behalf of all other Windows and Android users? I said my opinion, and by choice, I choose to be neither a windows or android user. I chose to be a sheep with the other 41% of the smartphone market share... hang on that doesn't sound right?
You and fred have obviously joined this forum to to start arguments. Go join another forum with like minded people who think Android is good.

It's ok if you can not form your own opinions, can't have a line without followers.

PS,

When your opinion suggests why others buy anything, it is you freely speaking on their behalf and greatly dumbs down your responses.
post #99 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

haha you have given no facts

http://www.androidauthority.com/android-marketshare-gingerbread-froyo-ice-cream-sandwich-60474/

this is a couple months old but I doubt much has changed

You really have no idea how Android works? I thought it was a joke but I was wrong. Keep trying, you may learn something, something not spoon fed to you by others. I would explain it bu I enjoy watching this train wreck. The best part is you have no idea what I'm talking about.
post #100 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

"I'm pretty sure" and "chances are" ? Really, these are your goto argument terms? Do you have any idea what "fact" means? You have no idea what others motivations are. Your opinion is not fact no matter how much you wish it was.

Geez... I thought this was an internet forum... not a scientific study.

Why don't you provide some facts to prove my opinions wrong?

Then again... after reading your last few comments... all you seem to do is point out how other people are wrong.

Have fun...
post #101 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

Geez... I thought this was an internet forum... not a scientific study.
Why don't you provide some facts to prove my opinions wrong?
Then again... after reading your last few comments... all you seem to do is point out how other people are wrong.
Have fun...

That's the whole point. Since I can not speak factual about why everyone buys Windows or Android or Apple or anything I can not provide facts and my opinion does not qualify as fact. All I can do is shake my head and chuckle to myself because you honestly feel you have a valid argument soley based on your opinion, one that has zero merit if your opinion is wrong which no one can actually prove since the whole world has never been polled on their purchase motivations but somehow you know what those are. Well if that is how it works, all Apple users buy Apple products because they are afraid to try new things and unable to form their own opinions on products and too stupid to realize Apple keeps selling them the same products over and over, in my opinion of course. so now it is so based on your rational.
Edited by Hellacool - 5/28/12 at 7:36pm
post #102 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


It's called Google. Forgot many need to be spoon fed, should I provide your opinion for you as well?

Zip it, buddy. You've just shown that you're full of hot air, like the rest of your pals: couldn't find an actual link to 'sales' from one of the companies that actually sells these things (instead of nonsense like 'shipments', 'consulting firm', 'survey', etc) could you?

 

Ever wonder why they don't put out those numbers? LOL.

 

I am still waiting for the day that one of you will deal with the world of facts.

post #103 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

That's the whole point. Since I can not speak factual about why everyone buys Windows or Android or Apple or anything I can not provide facts and my opinion does not qualify as fact. All I can do is shake my head and chuckle to myself because you honestly feel you have a valid argument soley based on your opinion, one hat has zero merit if your opinion is wrong which no one can actually prove since the whole world has never been polled on their purchase motivations.

But I never once slammed my fist on the keyboard and declared my comment as fact, did I? It was just an internet comment... a comment that wasn't even directed at you. I was replying to geoadm, if I remember correctly.

You obviously had a problem with my comment... but dozens of other people didn't... including the person I replied to initially.

So what gives? No one else challenged my comment... but you jumped right in! I'm flattered!

I think you need to realize what you're dealing with here. AppleInsider forums are very opinion based. All forums are. That's a given.

But looking back at my comments... I don't think I said anything out of line:

- People buy Android phones because they do what they need them to do... they make phone calls, can send and receive text messages, take pictures, and Facebook. And maybe the odd app or game.

I just described reasons why people use Android. Can you argue with that?

- Most people just boot into Windows and open a browser for Facebook

Even if I can't scientifically verify that... it's common knowledge that web-based services rule the roost these days. There shouldn't be any argument there either.

- People just use it for the bare minimum of tasks

Most people aren't techy power users. Again... there's no scientific measurement of that... but you know there are tons of people who are tech-clueless about anything that's not their email or Facebook.

- I'm pretty sure people don't buy Android phones for the vast Android app ecosystem. So that must mean they buy Android phones to handle the normal tasks of phone calls, text messages and Facebook.

I've never once heard of someone who bought an Android phone because of the apps. Maybe you can fill me in on that. But the 2nd part of that comment describes, once again, the common tasks people can do with Android phones. The fact that you can get an Android phone with a keyboard means they are great for texting.

So maybe these are just my opinions... but I'm not far off. I've dealt with teaching and training people on computers and tech for over 15 years. Technology really is a mystery to most people! They buy an $800 computer and only use it for Facebook :-)

I'm sorry my comment riled you up so much... but you were the only person who had an issue with it. That might tell you something...
post #104 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


I love the rational:
When referring to iPad it is all about numbers, how many sold and market share, when referring to Mac and iPhone it's not about the numbers or market share. Hypocrisy at its finest.

In the final analysis, it's not about market share in either instance. It's about profits.

 

Oh, the word you're looking for, for future reference, is 'rationale.'

post #105 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post


You really have no idea how Android works? I thought it was a joke but I was wrong. Keep trying, you may learn something, something not spoon fed to you by others. I would explain it bu I enjoy watching this train wreck. The best part is you have no idea what I'm talking about.

 

wow you proved me wrong. Guess I'll just continue to be a sheep and follow in your footsteps by saying others are wrong but providing no reason or proof.

post #106 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

You should stop. Every new post of yours digs your ignorant hole deeper and deeper. You may want to stick to opinions and knowing what everyone else in the world thinks, facts and data are wasted on you.

Actually, his 'opinion' (that the vast majority of Android users are using older versions) is supported by facts - as he has shown. Heck, a surprising number of Android phones NEVER get an upgrade - most commonly because the carrier never offers it. My family has owned 3 or 4 Android phones and I only recall one of them ever having an upgrade available - and that was a relatively small step (something like 1.6 to 1.7, IIRC).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellacool View Post

You really have no idea how Android works? I thought it was a joke but I was wrong. Keep trying, you may learn something, something not spoon fed to you by others. I would explain it bu I enjoy watching this train wreck. The best part is you have no idea what I'm talking about.

I see that you couldn't refute his facts. Where's your evidence proving him wrong? Or, more precisely, proving that the source he cited was wrong?
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #107 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by geoadm View Post

 

haha you have given no facts

 

http://www.androidauthority.com/android-marketshare-gingerbread-froyo-ice-cream-sandwich-60474/

 

this is a couple months old but I doubt much has changed

Google publishes platform stats each month. The link is here:

http://developer.android.com/resources/dashboard/platform-versions.html

 

They're really very transparent with Android IMHO. No need to hunt around the net for some secret "someone said" statistic on screen sizes, platform versions, even full code releases for the most recent Android versions. Most anything important to a developer, or if you're simply curious, is publicly available. 

http://developer.android.com/index.html


Edited by Gatorguy - 5/29/12 at 7:01am
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #108 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google publishes platform stats each month. The link is here:
http://developer.android.com/resources/dashboard/platform-versions.html

And your chart simply confirms that geoadm was right and hellacool was wrong. Less than 5% of Android users are on ICS - even using Google's figures.

Note, however, that Google's figures are not accurate, either. They can not determine the number of phones using each OS. Instead, the link you cited is the percentage of people accessing Google Play from each OS version. Since people with newer phones are more likely to access Google Play, they are overestimating the percentage on ICS.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #109 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


And your chart simply confirms that geoadm was right and hellacool was wrong. Less than 5% of Android users are on ICS - even using Google's figures.
Note, however, that Google's figures are not accurate, either. They can not determine the number of phones using each OS. Instead, the link you cited is the percentage of people accessing Google Play from each OS version. Since people with newer phones are more likely to access Google Play, they are overestimating the percentage on ICS.

Correct.

melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #110 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Note, however, that Google's figures are not accurate, either. They can not determine the number of phones using each OS. Instead, the link you cited is the percentage of people accessing Google Play from each OS version. Since people with newer phones are more likely to access Google Play, they are overestimating the percentage on ICS.

I think Google certainly knows how many devices query the Play Store every month, they just choose not to report that number.

What is your basis for saying that ICS users are more likely to use Play?
post #111 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by derekmorr View Post

I think Google certainly knows how many devices query the Play Store every month, they just choose not to report that number.
What is your basis for saying that ICS users are more likely to use Play?

Because some very old, slow Android devices are useless on Google Play, so using Google Play to estimate OS distribution is going to underrepresent older, slower devices - which run Android versions before ICS.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #112 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Because some very old, slow Android devices are useless on Google Play

I don't think this is the case. Play is the old Android Market which is usable on all Google Android devices. If a user checks for app updates, they use Play, which queries Google's servers which updates the platform version stats. I really don't understand what you mean by saying it's not usable on older devices.
post #113 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by derekmorr View Post

I don't think this is the case. Play is the old Android Market which is usable on all Google Android devices. If a user checks for app updates, they use Play, which queries Google's servers which updates the platform version stats. I really don't understand what you mean by saying it's not usable on older devices.

You don't think that someone with a newer device is going to buy more apps than someone with an older phone?

And you don't think that some of the apps in the Android Market will work only on newer phones?
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #114 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


You don't think that someone with a newer device is going to buy more apps than someone with an older phone?
And you don't think that some of the apps in the Android Market will work only on newer phones?

Not sure about older phones but all the apps certainly do not work on all devices. The HTC Wildfire is a good example of this where some apps come up as not compatible.

 

When try to install a app from Play it lists your devices and which ones are compatible.

post #115 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredaroony View Post

Not sure about older phones but all the apps certainly do not work on all devices. The HTC Wildfire is a good example of this where some apps come up as not compatible.

 

When try to install a app from Play it lists your devices and which ones are compatible.

Does Google Play even return results for apps that aren't compatible with your particular device, assuming you're signed in with your account? I had understood it did not.

melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #116 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Does Google Play even return results for apps that aren't compatible with your particular device, assuming you're signed in with your account? I had understood it did not.

You get a drop down list of your devices and the ones it can't be installed on are greyed out.

post #117 of 121

OK. that makes sense. Much appreciated for the clarification.

melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
melior diabolus quem scies
Reply
post #118 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

You don't think that someone with a newer device is going to buy more apps than someone with an older phone?
And you don't think that some of the apps in the Android Market will work only on newer phones?

None of that has anything to do with how often a device or user will query Google's servers to check for app updates, which is enough for a device to get counted in Google's Android distribution statistics. You claimed that ICS devices were over represented in the stats. I haven't heard an argument to support that claim.
post #119 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by derekmorr View Post

None of that has anything to do with how often a device or user will query Google's servers to check for app updates, which is enough for a device to get counted in Google's Android distribution statistics. You claimed that ICS devices were over represented in the stats. I haven't heard an argument to support that claim.

Yes you have - just just keep ignoring it.

There have been surveys and most people buy far more apps for a new device than for a device that they've owned for years.
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
"I'm way over my head when it comes to technical issues like this"
Gatorguy 5/31/13
Reply
post #120 of 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Yes you have - just just keep ignoring it.
There have been surveys and most people buy far more apps for a new device than for a device that they've owned for years.

 

I think there's some confusion regarding what the statistics are measuring. They're not just counting the total number of checkins. They're grouped by device. So, if I check the Play Store 50 times during a month from my Galaxy Nexus running ICS, it's counted as one hit for ICS, not 50. So it doesn't matter if users with newer devices checkin more often. As long as they checkin even once, they're counted.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Genius Bar
AppleInsider › Forums › General › Genius Bar › Samsung argues 4G Galaxy Tab not in direct competition with Apple's 3G iPad 2