Netflix online movie streaming revenue explodes, slices Apple share in half - Page 2

I'm curious... do you have the same bad-experience when playing Netflix through your computer vs. Apple TV??  Most of the time I watch Netflix in a small window while working on my iMac and I've never had a problem with it.  When I watch Netflix through my Apple TV it occasionally stalls as it buffers.  Not often, but I do notice a difference.  My internet connection is provided by Comcast and all my devices are ethernet-connected.  My Apple TV is connected via my 1TB Time Capsule as well via ethernet.
 

That's a bummer you're having this problem.  My only real complaint about Netflix is that the selection of shows is a joke.  If Apple provided a streaming subscription service similar to Netflix, I'd jump ship and go with them if I could.  Netflix is great for older shows though.

 

1.  Apple iTunes has more than 20,000 movies.

2.  Blame HBO's restrictive policies.

3.  Blame the production companies who want to milk customers for SD then charge them for the HD version as well.

4.  Yes, could be better.

5.  I haven't noticed such an issue.

It might not be just a matter of being underpowered... My wife's 2Ghz, Core2duo, white iMac with 2GB RAM might run iTunes more efficiently than a lot of PCs.

As I understand it, there is a key architechtural difference between Windows and OS X that affects Apple software, namely iTunes (since that and Safari is about the only software Apple makes for PCs): on OS X, each process in iTunes can spawn an independent thread to be sent to the processor(s); in Windows, the OS bundles up threads from various software and the system into system threads that get sent together to the processor at regular intervals.

As far as UI inconsistencies, I hadnt really been bothered by it... different types of media benefit from slightly different view options or defaults, and I accept that the Store is a window into Apple's online showroom.

On the other hand, there are a couple of things that really annoy me that i think Apple needs to fix: one big one for me occurs while browsing apps on my iPad: if i am looking in a Category, or I have done a search and several hundred or more apps come up, i start scrolling through the pages... If I want to go into an app that catches my eye to read its description, sometimes i can get back to where i was by hitting the back arrow (eg. page showing 274-282 of 637); BUT, invariably, if i install that app, i get jerked out of the app store, and when i oppen it again, yes I am on the same app, but the back button takes me back to page one of my search! And i have to scroll through the first 300 apps again, to find where i was before i installed that app! Really annoying.

I guess that is pretty good in USA, but it sounds pretty low to me. I am as far out in the sticks as I can be in NL (of course everything is smaller) in a village of 4000, and our service is nothing special, but we get 20Mb/s. My dad in a small town in the middle of the UK gets 35. Many cities in Europe have services providing 50 - 150 Mb.

I have Apple TV and use Netflix mostly for my kids. It works great.

Too bad Netflix doesn't have enough worth while content. Actually some of their licenses have expired and they're not in any financial position to start paying out for good content, at least not now.

Time will tell. Gaining market share is a start.

Apple could definitely compete if they started a monthly subscription service as opposed to 

The whole iTunes and iTunes store and everything iTunes whatever interface and search engine is lousy and pathetic. Even the iTunes player does not have the essential resume playback feature that was available on SoundJam MP from where iTunes was developed 12 years ago!!! That is extremely useful to listen to long playlists from head to tail. So, the player resumes playing the last song played after quitting iTunes, restarting the Mac, etc.

The RIAA was suing people for stealing music. And the complaints about the album was in the 90's, wasn't it? I would hardly call a couple of fandroid on an internet forum so many haters. If they really didn't like iTunes, they just wouldn't use it. Not that they could use it with an Android phone anyway. Come on, it's 2012 and everyone loves the iPhone. Don't you see the lines at the Apple store?

iTunes has become bloatware, even on a Mac.

 

iTunes ap:

 

ver     size

4.2     24.6 mb

4.9     32.8

7.3.1   98

8.2.1  140.1

9        150.3

9.2.1  176.6
 

I have given up upgrading it so no idea how bloated the current versions are.

I signed up to Netflix last month. Seemed like a good deal but the choice is really poor. There are some good quality movies but they're all old or so regularly screened on terrestrial TV that we've seen them several times. Most of these films are available in the bargain bucket for £3 a pop.The rest is made of of TV series and rubbish B movies that never made it to the big screen,

 

Needless to say, my subscription is now cancelled. That £7 a month would be better invested in owning one decent DVD,

Netflix will not survive unless it offers up to date content from all studios.

 

Good one !!

Very surprising. I cancelled my membership last month, as the Netflix selection for streaming movies is horrible. They only have a handful of new titles to stream, and rarely add anything new from week to week. If you like B and C movies, there's plenty to choose from, but be prepared to be scrolling through to cherry pick. It's only $8 per month, but a wasted $8 is a wasted $8.

Consumers want content availability at a fixed price, like Pandora or Spotify or NetFlix.  The al la carte model used by Apple is antiquated and not going to endure.  Presumably, with the rumored Apple TV, we will see a new, less costly to consumer delivery model from them.  I hope so at least.  Since I've been turned onto Spotify, my musical purchases from Apple are virtually nil.  Why would a rational consumer pay for something that is available at virtually no cost?
 

Based on the comments here so far it seems Apple, while losing ground on the content front, is fine on the hardware front. I believe Apple has a bigger revenue stream in hardware. The title of this article is quite alarmist. So is Apple supposed to be shaking in its boots right now? Has Tim Cook called an emergency board meeting to discuss this devastating news? Or is this yet another way for Apple to sell its hardware? Netflix's market cap is $3.5 billion, chump change if Apple should decide to buy it but I think the best route for Apple is to build hardware that takes advantage of this new paradigm. I can't wait for the day when I can choose my content, including traditional TV channels, a la carte for a reasonable monthly fee.

The latest versions of iTunes have more features than 4.x: AirPlay, Genius/Ping/whatever, iTunes Match, iTunes Store expansions, iOS device syncing and management to name a few. (We can debate the utility of some of these 'features' and whether they should all be rolled into one app some other time.)

 

FYI On my 10.6 system, iTunes 10.6.1 weighs in at 239.2MB.

 

About 120MB of that are resource bundles to support 29 different languages (at approximately 4MB each), 17.6MB of help data, 27.6MB of universal resources (icons, etc.), and approximately 76MB for the actual app executable.

 

These numbers don't seem that unreasonable given all the hats iTunes wears these days. 

 

You can remove those language bundles to save disk space if you really need to. But honestly I don't mind their "one version for everyone everywhere" mentality on this. My machine shouldn't need to hit the internet to download resources just because I switched the OS into Spanish or Italian. And it's better from a support perspective too, there is just one version of iTunes for all markets, not 29 different ones.

 

-K

 

Speak for yourself. Consumers don't want that. We want to own our content.

 

 

Because it isn't? Because of ownership? Myriad reasons. Take your pick.

I don't follow what you're getting at. iTunes v4.2 came out in 2003. We're talking nearly a decade ago. Of course the app has gotten larger over time. It's more complex and it does a lot more. How many more localizations does it support? I'm sure if you look at Safari today over IE in System 7 you'll see that Safari is much larger but I don't think anyone would say IE for Mac is better than Safari.

Could iTunes be a smaller app? I'm sure it can. Should it be a smaller app? I don't see why that is important. What I'd like to see is all apps lessen their memory footprint and CPU usage while being faster. I'd also like to see the app not look at complex for the average user which does not mean separating all parts of iTunes in a dozen separate apps.

We use Netflix via a Roku on a crappy Verizon DSL (that I'm always annoyed with for it's sluggishness) and it works great.  Buffers reasonably, plays smoothly.    Totally fine.

 

Which makes this data hugely misleading, and all but useless. Netflix did NOT grow their SVOD revenue 10,000% last year. Nor did they have 0% revenue from it in 2009. They simply made a business decision/accounting change so that they now bill separately for SVOD from their disc business. Before you got SVOD for "free" if you subscribed to their disc business, so they apparently never counted or apportioned any of that revenue towards the online movie market. This should have been made more clear, to put some perspective on the sensationalized 10,000% growth number.

 

If you want to know how they are doing, looks at their overall subscribers statistics, churn, and revenue. Or, just look at their stock price.

Stock price? Not so much.

Subscription statistics tell the story, though. And everything I've seen says that Netflix has been losing customers. So if you include all Netflix customers who sometimes streamed content in previous years, you'd see a very different story than what's presented here. It is absolutely absurd to pretend that no one streamed on Netflix before 2010.

I'm slowing replacing my DVDs with iTunes purchases. Great to finally have the ability from Apple to have my purchases in the cloud. I would think many other people are doing the same thing. Similar situation with all the noise about how people didn't want to own their music so iTunes would fail. See how that worked out.

 

 

Yep, that poster is "one of them". That poster has me on ignore by the way, or so they claim, because I am definitely "not of them", thank goodness for that.

 

That poster also gets upset whenever somebody mentions anything political in any thread. I guess their own rule applies to everybody except themselves.

 

And Fox News is a much better news channel than either CNN or MSNBC, which has their feces drenched noses firmly planted up Obama's butt. It is nauseating to watch those channels. No wonder why their ratings absolutely suck and CNN is currently suffering from their lowest ratings in decades. In North Korean death camps, MSNBC is probably what they have on in the background. 

Edited by Apple ][ - 6/2/12 at 7:54am

 

It kind of is. Many people are thieves and have no problem with stealing.

 

Because it's cheap.  I have a work colleague that subscribes. He's always complaining about the quality of the content but keeps paying "because it's cheap." 

And just why does Apple have to "compete" with this low profit business model?

 

Because everyone knows that their streaming business as set up --subscription price, library size, bandwidth costs - is not sustainable.  And even if they finally succeed in making it profitable i.e. raise subscription prices and expand the library without losing customers, everyone expects that the content providers and/or the pipe owners will just jack up their prices and tax away Netflix's profits.

I cancelled my Netflix account as well. Buffering was not an issue. I just couldn't find anything I wanted to watch that I hadn't already seen. Their AppleTV selection was pretty bad. For awhile I was renting the dvds because they have a better selection in that department, then I was ripping them so I would have something to watch on the plane using my iPad. But that didn't work out too well in many instances due to copy protection, plus it wasn't very convenient so I bailed on the subscription altogether. I'm happy for Netflix. After that failed spin off I thought they were toast. 

I'm not sure why everyone is griping so much about streaming Netfilx?  We love it!  I think it's all in expectations.  We bought into Netflix first when they were just doing the mail-DVD/BD's and were totally happy about it.  Sometimes we even forgot we put stuff in the queue and when it arrived it was a nice surprise!  Then when streaming became available on the Apple TV, I was the first one in line for Gen 2 ATV and we couldn't have been happier.  I think we went in accepting the fact that streaming Netflix only had releases that were older or B/C type films and TV shows.  It actually gave us the opportunity to catch up on shows that we missed many years ago or films and shows that we loved but didn't want to buy on DVD due to the fact that they weren't loved enough to justify the purchase and our precious shelf space.  Actaully our household saves money with streaming Netflix!  Additionally, we save money too just by keeping our favorite shows in the queue for re-viewing.

 

With everything there are shortcomings.  NOTHING IS PERFECT!

Of course there are things we wish Netflix would resolve.  Sometimes shows/movies in our queue won't play (error message or "unavailable at this time")

 

Service:

Sometimes we can't login to the App.  But, it passes and back to normal.  We did have some streaming issues but then went back to our DVR or live cable and waited for the problem to cure itself.  Now let me also state that we had a dying router at the time and our ISP was slower than it is now (we pay for 5mb/s and streamed just fine...my latest speed test claim we getting between 8-13mb/s even though we still pay for 5).  So some of our streaming issues could have been either the router or the ISP...which it might have been both.  But now that we replaced the router with the Airport Extreme and our ISP seems to be on the mend, we've never had a streaming issue.

 

Picture quality:

As stated below, we have the Gen 2 ATV and a 720p Plasma TV.  So, we don't really notice the difference if it's 720p or 1080p.  However, I can say pretty confidently that the picture quality is clearly NOT 720p...so there must be some compression issues as some have stated prior.  Yeah, that would probably be my bigger gripe, but hey, it costs next to nothing for the service monthly so i'm not complaining.  I mean seriously people, the SVOD Netflix cost something like $8-$10/mo!  that's at most $120/year.  In the old days, the Blockbuster days...you had to drive to the store (Gas Money) and they only had what's popular on the shelves and if you don't find anything you could waste your time by leaving or just rent some crap movie you never really wanted to watch for $4 a shot and were fined when you missed the return date.  For the amount of content we watch (and re-watch) on Netflix, I kind of feel like we ripping THEM off.

 

Lack of Current Content:

Yes, SVOD Netflix has no current content.  That is something we already knew so it's was no surprise, and had plenty of options otherwise.  So we didn't expect Netflix to carry current stuff, and Netflix has never stated they DO stream current stuff either.  So really that gripe that many have is just that.  A nice-to-have but not need-to-have, and there are other low-cost options.  Plus, we didn't buy into the streaming service expecting to get it.  If you really look into it, Netflix is 50% of the problem and the Movie/TV Networks are the other 50%.  Netflix has to parley with the Networks and Movie studios for content.  Netflix (undoubtedly) pushes for the most popular and current content they can get for the price they are willing to spend on the distribution rights...and the "industry" pushes for higher distribution cost and fewer popular and current content.  So, I guess the compromise is the "industry" allows what you current see in the streaming and mail-distribution for the price Netflix is willing to spend.  So you can blame Netflix, but the "industry" is equally to blame.  And on one last point, I blame the "industry" slightly higher now that the Mail-distribute no longer offer commercial DVD's and BD's.  They are the "Rental Only" disks with no commentaries and no special features.  That was one the greatest things about the Mail-distribution, you could actually place the special-feature disks in your queue!  But no more >:(  Baaaaad "industry"...so, naturally since they weren't offering that anymore, we cancelled the mail service and went 100% streaming.

 

So there you go, I gripe too, but really, that's just to state the obvious short-comings, and every product has them.  We are 100% satisfied despite it's flaws.

 

Personally, I think both Netflix and iTunes actaully have a nice balance between the two.  We use Netflix to catch-up/re-watch older stuff, and supplement that with either our DVR for current TV.  And, iTunes for new release movies and to catch an episode of a current show that for some reason our DVR did not record.  We're, however, less happy with iTunes than we are Netflix.  And I must say, we go to the theaters pretty regularly so we never really have a need to watch new release films, unless we happened to miss one or two.  Regardless the ATV streams great and has all the current content we desire...but the service does have some rather less-savory points that we wish could be rectified.

 

Content:

Everyone in the "industry" fears/loathes Apple and some give in.  Since we use Netflix for older content and ATV for current, I'll focus on the selection of current content.  I'd say the "industry" is to blame here for not striking a good deal with Apple to allow it.  And, on the flip-side, Apple may be demanding much more than is reasonable.  Apple is so secretive that we'll probably have to wait until another Biography to hear the real story.  However, I'm really pissed off that the Network Exec's decided to cancel the deal for TV Rental episodes.  That made no sense to cancel.  You were getting my 99 cents (so there's some lost Ad revenue...maybe not as much as you wanted but let's not be greedy now).  And, I don't have to muddy up my iTunes library with a million single episodes of a show I may never watch again, but wanted to watch because for some reason I missed it.  So BOOOO Networks for that!  I think in the coming year (now that the Nielsons are proving the live viewership is serious tanking) they might reconsider the iTunes rentals.  I just hope when they bring it back they won't raise the rental costs.  Secondly, I really with HBO would offer current content on iTunes.  That is a mistake I hope they learn quickly so I can keep current on GoT :P

 

So there's my gripe about the iTunes.  It seams less nit-picky but the failings are much greater than Netflix...but frankly i get more upset over Apple failing than Netflix because it's Apple.  And I can't blame them too much (it is probably unfair of me to do so), but perhaps SJ was a bit to rough on the "industry" and perhaps the "industry" was a little too pig-headed.

 

So there is a balance with everything and NOTHING is perfect.  In our household, IMO we have a good balance of our content.  We use Neflix Streaming for old and re-runs, iTunes for New and current, and Cable+DVR for live events and daily TV watching.  It's not perfect, but that's the best balance we could find.  If there was a way to watch live events (i.e. News, sports, special events and Public broadcasting...Sherlock is a great show ;) ) through the ATV in the form of a paid App or minor-fee subscription...we'd drop cable yesterday.  Granted we would have to run the numbers and see how many shows we'd have to buy per year and weight that against our $160/mo. cable bill.  Currently we have over 40 shows in our DVR queue, and not all of those shows are offered on iTunes...BTW, that $160/mo. includes our Internet service as well, but I think we only pay about $40-$50/mo. or so for our ISP.  We, let me also say that for me (not the Mrs.) I would like to see the TV rental back before I really pull the plug on Cable.

 

 

Boilerplate info for reference:

37" Panny Plasma, 720p/1080i (early adopter and couldn't be happier with unit)

Charter cable internet (we pay for 5mb/s even though we get much faster service currently)

Charter Cable Basic/Digital tier, HD channels and MOXI DVR.

Apple TV Gen 2 (720p)

Apple Airport Extreme (previously Belkin wireless router...can't remember model)

Edited by antkm1 - 6/2/12 at 9:17am

The analysis is flawed. The only thing T changed is the billing model. I used to subscribe to Netflix just for th estqreaming, I never actually ordered DVDs. They changed the billing, I changed my subscription. I pay less money but somehow that represents revenue growth for streaming?

I quite like Netflix for what it is. It has to be a PITA for them dealing with so many content owners. We've seen the issues Apple has had with getting content on the AppleTV/iTunes Store.

I personally only purchase it for a month at a time when there is some show I want to finally sit down and watch. For instance, I've only seen a handful of Farscape episodes, I'm still hearing how great that show was, and there is a vacuum in what is on TV right now so I'm thinking of subscribing to Netflix for a month to shotgun the series.

To add to what I just posted, I rent new movies that aren't on Netflix streaming from iTunes. Netflix doesn't offer a way to stream new movies, not by subscription, not by renting them.

This probably is because Apple and iTunes has very few rentals. Everytime I go to rent a movie on Apple TV I find it's ONLY available to purchase. So then I turn to Netflix. I actually used to rent quite a few movies under Apple TV version one when there were lots of rentals. Now not so much. It's Apple's fault that they lost this position by not providing rentable content. I just don't believe in buying a movie. I watch things once and that's plenty for me. Watching it again seems like a waste of time.

 

Netflix UK is indeed pretty bad. You can change your DNS settings on your PS3/Xbox to access Netflix US, but the selection there, while better, is still pretty weak.

 

LoveFilm have a reasonable amount of stuff, but they have very little HD and their PS3 and Xbox apps are awful. Particularly their Xbox effort, which has horrible washed out black levels. A fix is being looked at apparently, but there's no ETA. It could be weeks, months, or years. Who knows.

 

Generally if you want mainstream American imports, move along, there's nothing to see here, but you want interesting cinema instead, and you know how to read, there are things to watch on LoveFilm and occasionally on Netflix. Certainly the selection of Korean cinema (for my money the best stuff around at present) is pretty solid on LoveFilm.

I like NetFlix but I am tired of their limited selections and "new releases" from 20 years ago. l realize this is because content creators are afraid of digital download subscription services, but in reality their practices are costing the residuals from netflix, not driving people to pay for individual movie rentals. I wish copyright holders would step into the 21st century and release their stuff to Netflix, et al. It would make sense for them to delay letting go of new titles long enough to make money on individual movie rentals, then release them to Netflix for download. However, it makes no sense to release movies that have left theaters to Mail order Netflix (as they currently do) but not for streaming. What's the difference?

Netflix's real strength is the vast number of devices that support it (buy a new TV, Bluray player or games console and it will come with Netflix). If Apple bought them and made it an Apple exclusive they would lose this key advantage.

The only difference is that the process of posting out discs to customers and then back again takes time, and so limits how many rentals people can use. Streaming is currently unlimited.

 

I would have thought that some sort of compromise could be reached though, where only a few 'new' films could be streamed each month, while old stuff remained unlimited. They'll get it eventually, it just might take another 5-10 years.

It's all fun and games until Apple enters the TV biz. 

99¢ per episode is a rip off.