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iOS 6 Maps turn-by-turn requires iPhone 4S, iPad 2 or later

post #1 of 176
Thread Starter 
When Apple launches iOS 6 this fall, iPhone 4 users won't be able to use turn-by-turn directions or Flyover in the new Maps application, as that functionality is limited to the iPhone 4S, iPad 2, and third-generation iPad.

Both the iPhone 4 and iPhone 3GS lack the ability to offer turn-by-turn navigation or the new Flyover feature in iOS 6 Maps, despite the fact that both devices will be compatible with iOS 6 when it launches this fall.

The details come from Apple's official page previewing Maps in iOS 6, which reveals in a footnote that "Flyover and turn-by-turn navigation will be available only on iPhone 4S and iPad 2 or later." It also notes that "some features may not be available in all countries or all areas."

Of course, Siri functionality with Apple's new Maps application is also limited to devices that offer Apple's voice-driven personal assistant software. Currently, only the iPhone 4S has Siri, though the third-generation iPad will also gain that functionality this fall with the launch of iOS 6.

Turn-by-turn navigation is one of the biggest features of the new native Maps application in iOS 6, which was built from the ground up by Apple and no longer uses Google Maps. The turn-by-turn feature includes spoken directions, a 3D view, and real-time traffic information.

Turn


"As you approach a turn, Maps speaks directions, so you can keep your eyes on the road," Apple's official description reads. "In addition, the screen turns into a 3D perspective view of the road ahead. Large signs and arrows superimposed over the image show you which way to go and how long it's going to take to get there —?even if your screen is locked."

Only newer hardware will have access to the new Flyover feature as well, which utilizes advanced 3D mapping data. In addition, Flyover will only be available in cities where 3D models have been created, offering detailed recreations rendered in real time.

Flyover


"See major metro areas from the air with photo-realistic, interactive 3D views," Apple's description reads. "Explore cities in high resolution as you zoom, pan, tilt, and rotate around the city and its landmarks."
post #2 of 176

Wow really!?  <sarcasm> Well it must be because there just isn't enough power in an iPhone 4 CPU to handle turn by turn GPS as demonstrated by the lack of turn-by-turn GPS apps in the app store!

post #3 of 176

iPhone 4s and new iPad will both have Siri and advanced mapping features like Flyover and turn-by-turn directions. iPad 2 will NOT have Siri, but will have the other things.

 

So does that mean that there will be Siri lite for iPad 2?  Or no voice guidance?  Hmmm.

post #4 of 176

So, the iPad 2 will have full map functionality whilst the iPhone 4 that runs the same CPU is out, with the iPhone 3GS you could understand as it's getting pretty long in the tooth but this obviously has nothing to do with hardware and everything to do with milking customers dry.

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post #5 of 176
So, does anyone know if we will be loosing the route functions that we currently have with google maps?
post #6 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by appleabuser View Post

iPhone 4s and new iPad will both have Siri and advanced mapping features like Flyover and turn-by-turn directions. iPad 2 will NOT have Siri, but will have the other things.

So does that mean that there will be Siri lite for iPad 2?  Or no voice guidance?  Hmmm.

My question too!

Also I don't see why an iPhone 4 couldn't handle fly over although I understand not having the Siri features (I think ...). I was going to buy an iPad 3 just for Dictation but as I understand it iPad 2 will gain Dictation in iOS 6, but I may have that wrong ... so much to take in!
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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post #7 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by iaeen View Post

So, does anyone know if we will be loosing the route functions that we currently have with google maps?

No, this will still be available.
post #8 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

My question too!
Also I don't see why an iPhone 4 couldn't handle fly over although I understand not having the Siri features (I think ...). I was going to buy an iPad 3 just for Dictation but as I understand it iPad 2 will gain Dictation in iOS 6, but I may have that wrong ... so much to take in!

Nothing mentioned about dictation on the iPad 2. Not as far as I've heard.
post #9 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

So, the iPad 2 will have full map functionality whilst the iPhone 4 that runs the same CPU is out, with the iPhone 3GS you could understand as it's getting pretty long in the tooth but this obviously has nothing to do with hardware and everything to do with milking customers dry.


the iPad 2 has a dual core A5 chip. the iPhone 4 has a single core A4.

post #10 of 176

This just seems like more Apple crap designed to force users to upgrade, They remove Google Maps and replace it with their own partially functional replacement. What a load of crap. Evidence by Siri working on jailbroken iPhone 4.

 

Apple's products may be lightyears ahead of where they were 15 years ago, but their customer service/treatment is lightyears behind. And this is from someone who has been using Apple products for over 27 years.

post #11 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

This just seems like more Apple crap designed to force users to upgrade, They remove Google Maps and replace it with their own partially functional replacement. What a load of crap. Evidence by Siri working on jailbroken iPhone 4.

Apple's products may be lightyears ahead of where they were 15 years ago, but their customer service/treatment is lightyears behind. And this is from someone who has been using Apple products for over 27 years.

Considering Apple are KNOWN for their great customer service, this is your OPINION and NOT a fact like you've worded it.
post #12 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain J View Post

This just seems like more Apple crap designed to force users to upgrade, They remove Google Maps and replace it with their own partially functional replacement. What a load of crap. Evidence by Siri working on jailbroken iPhone 4.

Apple's products may be lightyears ahead of where they were 15 years ago, but their customer service/treatment is lightyears behind. And this is from someone who has been using Apple products for over 27 years.

While I respect your right to have that opinion, as one using Apple products for 34 years I completely disagree with you.
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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post #13 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by virginblue4 View Post

Nothing mentioned about dictation on the iPad 2. Not as far as I've heard.

Oh ok, must have been wishful thinking . Well at least Mountain Lion will add that to my MBPs so next best thing.
Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
nMac Pro 6 Core, MacBookPro i7, MacBookPro i5, iPhones 5 and 5s, iPad Air, 2013 Mac mini, SE30, IIFx, Towers; G4 & G3.
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Been using Apple since Apple ][ - Long on AAPL so biased
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post #14 of 176

Surely the solution would have been turn by turn sans Siri for those phones not listed? It doesn't require a lot of horsepower.

 

I know they are trying to force people onto new hardware but it's the biggest single feature of the update.

post #15 of 176

I don't understand why people are complaining... it's not like anyone with an existing iPhone or iPad is going to have *pay* for the iOS6 upgrade, so your right to whinge about not having a feature that's free is severely curtailed.

post #16 of 176

In all seriousness, how is this not some type of fragmentation and cause customer confusion? 

 

Siri works here, turn by turn works there but not here...come on. Apple is slowly moving away from that unified coherent experience that separates them from the rest. Crap phones from the 3 years ago with half the specs can handle turn by turn, so the guise of technical limitations seems ridiculous. This doesn't change my opinion of Apple and I'm sure they expect everyone with a 4 to move the new iPhone starting in the fall so it's not a huge issue, but it's still a low move. 

I'm not a pessimist. I'm an optimist, with experience.
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I'm not a pessimist. I'm an optimist, with experience.
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post #17 of 176

The new maps are TERRIBLE. out of date map coverage, worse UI, poor POIs, no building names, no transit information, no building outlines, no public footpaths - everything is worse. Look at this comparison photo - what would you rather use?
https://twitter.com/corxo/status/212314131590692864/photo/1/large

post #18 of 176

The turn by turn navigation features in iOS 6 are exaggerated- it's really not that good. The google-powered maps app in iOS 5 has traffic (which actually works in Europe unlike iOS 6), routing, directions, alternate routes - all iOS 6 maps does is have the turn directions in a road sign box at the top and adds voice guidance. 

post #19 of 176

Does anyone know if the new navigation app will use the GPS or data from your carrier?

post #20 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by vman1964 View Post

Does anyone know if the new navigation app will use the GPS or data from your carrier?

It will use GPS AND data from your carrier

post #21 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by vman1964 View Post

Does anyone know if the new navigation app will use the GPS or data from your carrier?

it uses both (just as the iOS 5 Google maps app does) 

post #22 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by kfury77 View Post

The turn by turn navigation features in iOS 6 are exaggerated- it's really not that good. The google-powered maps app in iOS 5 has traffic (which actually works in Europe unlike iOS 6), routing, directions, alternate routes - all iOS 6 maps does is have the turn directions in a road sign box at the top and adds voice guidance. 

 

Keep in mind it's still the just the first beta.

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I'm not a pessimist. I'm an optimist, with experience.
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post #23 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacInsider2 View Post

Wow really!?  <sarcasm> Well it must be because there just isn't enough power in an iPhone 4 CPU to handle turn by turn GPS as demonstrated by the lack of turn-by-turn GPS apps in the app store!

 

You can't simply say turn-by-turn and call it a day. Probably other nav apps from the store use turn by turn but not in the same graphics level or not in the same 3D rendering. Moreover Siri is integrated into turn by turn so there's another resource to call upon and to use (despite the fact that Siri is not available on iPhone 4 and probably will not in the future). 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by saarek View Post

So, the iPad 2 will have full map functionality whilst the iPhone 4 that runs the same CPU is out, with the iPhone 3GS you could understand as it's getting pretty long in the tooth but this obviously has nothing to do with hardware and everything to do with milking customers dry.

They don't have the same CPU. Get your facts right before ranting about like crazy

 

Screen Shot 2012-06-12 at 17.11.52.pngScreen Shot 2012-06-12 at 17.11.50.png

 

 

Moreover, i completely understand Apple is a profit drive company (indisputable truth) and i agree that sometimes they are over-reaching, but the same discussions appeared,  if everyone remember, when Apple introduced multitasking and people with iPhone 3G complained they didn't get the feature. Apple responded by telling everybody that it was not feasible on the 3G and it would ruin the experience due to the lag. Every complain-tee still dismissed that till jail breakers made it available for them but still the experience sucked. So in the end Apple was right about it and the people that bitched a lot and accused Apple of milking customers were silenced. 

post #24 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramanga89 View Post

It [turn by turn] doesn't require a lot of horsepower.

 

And you know that how?

 

I have a couple of full featured nav apps with self contained map files (Navigon, Co-Pilot Live) on my iPhone 4, and I can tell you that the phone gets pretty damn hot in the course of a navigated journey, to the point that its USB car charger can't always keep up. So that little A4 processor is certainly cranking away at something. Now add in the need to concurrently download and decode maps via cellular data service rather than simply reading them locally, and I submit that turn by turn nav may take a bunch more horsepower than you think.

post #25 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post


My question too!
Also I don't see why an iPhone 4 couldn't handle fly over although I understand not having the Siri features (I think ...).

Siri can work on the iPhone 4 as soon as you bypass Apple UDID checks which are preventing you to do so. So it could looks like another disguised yet voluntary device limitation.

post #26 of 176

With the MapQuest app my iphone 4 can handle Turn-by-Turn.  I'm hoping that these limitations are just in the first beta, and the final will come to us as a fully unified package allowing the same features on all devices. 

 

Again - and I've complained about this a number of times.. I want Siri on my 4 - and I'm not willing to upgrade to a 4S for 700 bucks.  I'll wait for the next generation phone before spending the money.  The 4 can handle Siri, it can handle turn-by-turn.. it can handle a lot more than Apple cares to admit.  If I can play intense 1st person shooters on my phone, I surely can use turn-by-turn and something as simple as siri.

post #27 of 176
Anyone know if the new maps works offline?

Also, tomtom app continues working while using phone hands free in the car. I wonder if new maps turn by turn will continue working if you take a call. (Verizon phone.)
post #28 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilM View Post

 

And you know that how?

 

I have a couple of full featured nav apps with self contained map files (Navigon, Co-Pilot Live) on my iPhone 4, and I can tell you that the phone gets pretty damn hot in the course of a navigated journey, to the point that its USB car charger can't always keep up. So that little A4 processor is certainly cranking away at something.

GPS uses a lot of energy.

 

But as the OP said, iPhone 4 is totally capable of doing 3D turn by turn navigation without a problem

post #29 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilM View Post

 

And you know that how?

 

I have a couple of full featured nav apps with self contained map files (Navigon, Co-Pilot Live) on my iPhone 4, and I can tell you that the phone gets pretty damn hot in the course of a navigated journey, to the point that its USB car charger can't always keep up. So that little A4 processor is certainly cranking away at something. Now add in the need to concurrently download and decode maps via cellular data service rather than simply reading them locally, and I submit that turn by turn nav may take a bunch more horsepower than you think.

That's crap. If the original Motorola Droid with a 550Mhz processor and 256MB of RAM running Android 2 in 2009 could handle Google Maps Nav Turn by Turn WITH voice actions, it's far from a stretch to expect Apple to get it right on a device with double the horsepower and specs, 3 years later, on a superior, MORE efficient platform. 

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post #30 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilM View Post

 

And you know that how?

I have a couple of years old anemic nokia doing turn by turn navigation, standalone gps systems doing so aren't high powered machines either, so it doesn't really look like it should be resource intensive.

post #31 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by OllieWallieWhiskers View Post


the iPad 2 has a dual core A5 chip. the iPhone 4 has a single core A4.

Exactly. And while everyone wants to dump on the 3GS, it is in many graphics-intensive cases faster than the iPhone 4. The iPhone 4 is essentially a 3GS with a mild overclock and 4 times as many pixels to push. The iPhone 4 and iPhone 3GS (and the iPad 1) have single core CPUs, the same GPU, and 256MB memory. In the 3GS's favor, is that all that memory isn't tied-up with 4x (5x for iPad 1)  images. Even with the differences in CPU, I'm sure they all have enough horsepower to do turn by turn directions. However, the 3GS is the only one that isn't in a severe hurt for memory pretty much all the time. In the end, if there was actually a technical limitation that prompted Apple to limit availability of turn by turn, it'd probably be the memory overhead of having that code in memory at all times. As for flyover, it runs like a dog on my iPad 2... I wouldn't want to think about it on an earlier device.

post #32 of 176
Remember when Apple introduced a version of iOS to an older iPhone that made it ver slow for a great many number of users? Remember when people said reason Apple added the update was because they were adding features it couldn't feasibly run so users would be forced to upgrade?

But if Apple doesn't offer a feature to any older device with older HW they are doing it for the same reason of "forcing users to upgrade"? Does that really make sense to suggest that the only way Apple doesn't force people to upgrade is if they never update their HW, SW, or services? I certainly don't think so. But if Apple doesn't update all their stuff at break neck speeds then we hear complaints about how Apple doesn't care about this type of product or this type of user anymore.

I don't think there is anything Apple can do to satisfy the infinitely unsatisfiable.

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post #33 of 176

@NeilM

 

No offence, but there's been turn by turn on old school Nokias for years, Windows Phone (Mobile, not 7), underpowered Android phones etc. All have much lesser specs than the 3GS and the iPhone 4.

 

I don't see your point.
 

post #34 of 176

I seem to be timing our upgrades well. iPhone 4 will be swapped for iOS 6 iPhone '5s' this Fall. 

 

Can't wait.

post #35 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by kfury77 View Post

The new maps are TERRIBLE. out of date map coverage, worse UI, poor POIs, no building names, no transit information, no building outlines, no public footpaths - everything is worse. Look at this comparison photo - what would you rather use?
https://twitter.com/corxo/status/212314131590692864/photo/1/large

Except for the small improvements such as:
improved user interface
dynamic routing (mistakenly referred to as turn-by-turn) navigation
voice guided navigation
fully integrated 3D views
Flyover Mode
improved Yelp integration
post #36 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by StigsHero View Post

Exactly. And while everyone wants to dump on the 3GS, it is in many graphics-intensive cases faster than the iPhone 4. The iPhone 4 is essentially a 3GS with a mild overclock and 4 times as many pixels to push. The iPhone 4 and iPhone 3GS (and the iPad 1) have single core CPUs, the same GPU, and 256MB memory. 

 

The iPhone 4 has 512MB of memory unlike the 3GS and iPad with 256. The CPU is more than a mild overclock as well. The A4, while a Cortex A8 is an entirely different design from it's predecessor in the 3GS.  The only common denominator is the SGX535 GPU.

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post #37 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by kfury77 View Post

The new maps are TERRIBLE. out of date map coverage, worse UI, poor POIs, no building names, no transit information, no building outlines, no public footpaths - everything is worse.

It's also not getting released for another 2-3 months. Things will likely have changed by then

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post #38 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by StigsHero View Post

Exactly. And while everyone wants to dump on the 3GS, it is in many graphics-intensive cases faster than the iPhone 4. The iPhone 4 is essentially a 3GS with a mild overclock and 4 times as many pixels to push. The iPhone 4 and iPhone 3GS (and the iPad 1) have single core CPUs, the same GPU, and 256MB memory. In the 3GS's favor, is that all that memory isn't tied-up with 4x (5x for iPad 1)  images. Even with the differences in CPU, I'm sure they all have enough horsepower to do turn by turn directions. However, the 3GS is the only one that isn't in a severe hurt for memory pretty much all the time. In the end, if there was actually a technical limitation that prompted Apple to limit availability of turn by turn, it'd probably be the memory overhead of having that code in memory at all times. As for flyover, it runs like a dog on my iPad 2... I wouldn't want to think about it on an earlier device.

I don't think it is a technical limitation in most of the cases begin discussed here. There are factors such as the user experience to consider along with battery life as well as testing. Given an infinite amount of time and money you could design adequate test cases and optimize code to the point where the user experience would be considered acceptable to nearly every user. However, given that neither time nor money is infinite - decisions need to be made where to place limits. Although it would be nice if it was easier to turn on a feature that Apple has decided not to test or officially support and try it out for yourself and then decide whether to leave it on or not. Consider for a moment, though, given the current landscape of litigation, what the result might be if Apple did officially support (fill in the blank here) on a given device and then got slapped with a class-action-lawsuit because some idiot decided that using Siri to drive Turn by Turn navigation on his 3GS in full 3D mode with live traffic without a car charger and the battery died half way to his destination. Claims of false advertising of expected battery life etc. it would be a mess. 

post #39 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

But if Apple doesn't offer a feature to any older device with older HW they are doing it for the same reason of "forcing users to upgrade"? Does that really make sense to suggest that the only way Apple doesn't force people to upgrade is if they never update their HW, SW, or services? I certainly don't think so. But if Apple doesn't update all their stuff at break neck speeds then we hear complaints about how Apple doesn't care about this type of product or this type of user anymore.
I don't think there is anything Apple can do to satisfy the infinitely unsatisfiable.

 

 

This has nothing to do with that. In this case we are talking about a functionality that we know many other devices (including standalone) with much less specs run well. In this case, it doesn't pass muster and people should hold Apple accountable to that standard. 

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post #40 of 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramanga89 View Post

No offence, but there's been turn by turn on old school Nokias for years, Windows Phone (Mobile, not 7), underpowered Android phones etc. All have much lesser specs than the 3GS and the iPhone 4.

I don't see your point.

 

I'm not sure who you're replying to as you didn't quote anyone in your post but I do wonder how one assumes the inclusion of a feature should be based on a single performance metric like the CPU. Why shouldn't the hit to overall performance instead of just being technically possible be an issue? Why shouldn't the drain on battery life because it has no dedicated HW for specific tasks be an issue? Why is there no consideration that Apple, knowing it was entering this market a couple years prior, also has secretly updated to their A chips to have specific acceleration specifically for their mapping? Finally, why assume that all mapping software is created equally?

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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