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Nokia credit now labeled junk by all three major credit-rating agencies - Page 2

post #41 of 129
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Originally Posted by VisualZone View Post

Me, I'd rather take a BB Bold. Really!! 

You'd better hurry up then...
post #42 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by tasslehawf View Post

 

This can't bode well for Microsoft and WP7.

 

I'm betting that Microsoft will either bailout Nokia or buy them outright for Nokia's capacity to make new Windows phones in the future.

post #43 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by iVlad View Post

Hmmm, RIM, NOKIA, Microsoft all laughed at Apple back in 2007. Wow, tables have turned. 360! That's karma for you, betch!

 

Tables have turned 360? I LOL'd. 

 

In other news, we Americans still collectively suck at math.

 

On a tangent, this reminds me of how Bill Gates wrote that being able to factor large prime numbers would be a huge advance in mathematics in his book "The Road Ahead". Think about that statement for a minute. I'm fairly sure he was serious. :) Hopefully someone fixed it in subsequent printings.

post #44 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

Tables have turned 360? I LOL'd. 

In other news, we Americans still collectively suck at math.

On a tangent, this reminds me of how Bill Gates wrote that being able to factor large prime numbers would be a huge advance in mathematics in his book "The Road Ahead". Think about that statement for a minute. I'm fairly sure he was serious. 1smile.gif Hopefully someone fixed it in subsequent printings.

It's a cruel joke that the worst you are at math the larger your comparative value is.

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #45 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

 

Tables have turned 360? I LOL'd. 

 

In other news, we Americans still collectively suck at math.

 

On a tangent, this reminds me of .....

LOL. Your own post proves your point.

 

Explain what a 'tangency' has to do with the point you're making?

 

Add: /s

post #46 of 129
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Originally Posted by xmiku View Post

This can happen to anyone, even to Apple. And I'm sure Apple won't dominate forever. It is only matter of time.

True.... but Apple also has a habit of re-inventing themselves and entering new markets. I just don't think companies like Nokia are able to do that.

Remember when Apple only sold computers? Then they jumped in the MP3 player market and eventually ended up changing the music industry in the process.

Then they said "let's make a phone" and we're still seeing the effects of that. Same with tablets.

As long as Apple keeps making high margin devices.... and people keep buying them... they will be fine.

Only 1 out of 10 phones sold across the entire world is made by Apple... yet they make more money than the rest of the industry combined. Something is obviously working...

If people stopped buying iPhones... then yes... we might see an article like this saying Apple's credit is in the toilet. Then again... Apple has $100 billion in the bank in case of an emergency.

But I really don't think people will stop buying Apple products any time soon.
post #47 of 129
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Originally Posted by kpluck View Post

Then you are just a silly fanboy. It is a nice phone that by all accounts performs quite well.

-kpluck

Thank you for saying that, you know there was once upon a time that Apple was in the same boat. Nokia is a company that deserves more then what has been served lately. I hope by this time next year things are going to look better, I'm tired of Android and iOS being the only two success stories for mobile, especially when their not very good. Android, though open and free has no direction and iOS is closed tighter then a dolphins ass, I'm tired of a company dictating what I can do with my device. I want more and Nokia takes risks, my new 808 is fantastic, I have never seen such photos. I just hope they won't go away, it will be a sad day.
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #48 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post

True.... but Apple also has a habit of re-inventing themselves and entering new markets. I just don't think companies like Nokia are able to do that.
Remember when Apple only sold computers? Then they jumped in the MP3 player market and eventually ended up changing the music industry in the process.
Then they said "let's make a phone" and we're still seeing the effects of that. Same with tablets.
As long as Apple keeps making high margin devices.... and people keep buying them... they will be fine.
Only 1 out of 10 phones sold across the entire world is made by Apple... yet they make more money than the rest of the industry combined. Something is obviously working...
If people stopped buying iPhones... then yes... we might see an article like this saying Apple's credit is in the toilet. Then again... Apple has $100 billion in the bank in case of an emergency.
But I really don't think people will stop buying Apple products any time soon.

Yes but they had a lot of help from a genius. It's already starting to show, iOS 6 would have never flown with Steve. Apple is starting to become complacent. Updates are now starting to be anemic and far between. OSX, iOS, hardware design hasn't changed much in the last 5 years, just updates. Their nice, don't get me wrong but things are slowing waaaay down at Apple. Their riding a wave now, a big one yes but it will recede, no company can keep up this momentum, history has shown. Take Kodak, one of the largest companies in the world back in the 80's early 90's, Apple could only dream of the market cap they had , then poof. Yes, being able to adopt to the moving technologies has a big thing to do with it but Apple's success was really brought upon by a dreamer, a genius. It only comes once in a blue moon and now that Mr. Jobs is gone, it's just a wave their riding, nothing more.
Edited by Relic - 6/17/12 at 12:18am
When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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When I looked up "Ninjas" in Thesaurus.com, it said "Ninja's can't be found" Well played Ninjas, well played.
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post #49 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Yes but they had a lot of help from a genius. Apple's success was really brought upon by a dreamer, a genius. It only comes once in a blue moon and now that Mr. Jobs is gone, it's just a wave their riding, nothing more.

A great leader inspires his team. Let's hope Steve's lessons are ingrained in the fabric of Apple for years to come.

So what about the companies who never had a leader like Steve Jobs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Take Kodak, one of the largest companies in the world back in the 80's early 90's, Apple could only dream of the market cap they had, then poof.

Kodak made most of their money from film. Then people stopped using film.

Yes... the mighty can fall... but only if they're oblivious to what's happening around them.

Clearly Kodak was unable to adapt to its own changing market... while Apple has a knack for blazing new trails in new markets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Updates are now starting to be anemic and far between. OSX, iOS, hardware design hasn't changed much in the last 5 years, just updates.

So what amazing things are coming out of the secret labs at HP and Dell?

I just saw HP's new line of DV6 series laptops. They look just like last year's line... but with Ivy Bridge instead of Sandy Bridge.

Sounds familiar. Apple did exactly the same thing... but you'd say they're losing their edge. The iMac has looked the same for years... so have Apple's laptops. Maybe when they find a design they like... they stick with it.

The iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S also look virtually identical. But they've sold over 150 million of them combined. Why is Apple so profitable and thus less likely to go bankrupt? They're not wasting time with a dozen different phones.... spending money on needless tooling and manufacturing. Apple is the model of efficiency... you can thank Tim Cook for that.

As for iOS... most of its recent improvements and new features are under the hood. If you just look at surface appearances... the other guys don't seems to change much either:

398

I know, I know... Android is more customizable. I guess that's Apple's Achilles' heel.
post #50 of 129
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Originally Posted by tasslehawf View Post

 

This can't bode well for Microsoft and WP7.

WP7 is not a bad OS. I have a Lumia 800 as a backup to my iPhone. If I were not already heavily invested in iOS (apps, accessories, etc...) I would consider using WP7 as my main phone. The OS is pretty fast and different enough to garner some attention. In short, I like it. The problem with Nokia is not innovation because had it not been for them, there would most likely not have been an iPhone (my opinion), as Nokia invented the first consolidated smartphone. Go look up the Nokia N95. It was the first phone with everything inside, but Nokia didn't keep up... and they kept around management that should have been fired years ago...

post #51 of 129

Too bad for Nokia. From a high in 2007 to nothing in 2012, suffering in 2010, they bring in Dr. Kevorkian clone from MS Stephen Elop, without telling the patient and staff, who proceeds to execute the well-respected process of bloodletting, laying off staff, selling their IP, terminating their own smartphone OS Symbian in favor of his old (really current employer?) Windows smartphone OS Windows 7, to be followed by selling to MS the Nokia smartphone unit, so rumors have it. Dr. Kevorkian never sold off a patients body parts in the guise of helping the patient. It all seems transparent to me that the fix to destroy Nokia was in when Elop was hired. The Nokia Board had to know it, or is the most incompetent Board in the history of major corporations (US financial institutions excepted). 

post #52 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by sapporobabyrtrns View Post

The problem with Nokia is not innovation because had it not been for them, there would most likely not have been an iPhone (my opinion), as Nokia invented the first consolidated smartphone. Go look up the Nokia N95. It was the first phone with everything inside, but Nokia didn't keep up... and they kept around management that should have been fired years ago...

I remember people raving about the Nokia N95... though I never saw the appeal.

It was branded as a smartphone... but didn't have a QWERTY keyboard or a touchscreen.

Yes... I realize it was released way back in 2007... but there were plenty of other phones that did have QWERTY keyboards and touchscreens (with a stylus)

Was the Nokia N95 a hit in the enterprise? Or was it popular because of its camera and multimedia capabilities?

Again... I never saw its appeal... even in its day. Back then I was using a Blackberry... yikes!
post #53 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

 

Tables have turned 360? I LOL'd. 

 

In other news, we Americans still collectively suck at math.

 

On a tangent, this reminds me of how Bill Gates wrote that being able to factor large prime numbers would be a huge advance in mathematics in his book "The Road Ahead". Think about that statement for a minute. I'm fairly sure he was serious. :) Hopefully someone fixed it in subsequent printings.

Jaw drop!!! What is wrong with Bill Gates' comments on factoring large prime numbers?  That is a big problem and it would be a huge advance in mathematics to do so, but of course, at the cost of emasculating security using cryptology. DRM would not work, but neither would HTTPS, FTPS, WIFI security, digital signatures, RSA public key cryptography, etc. What am I missing?

post #54 of 129
Nokia used to be the gold standard in cellphones. Highly respected for its products' durability, excellent reception and highly regarded for its consistency in making high quality devices.

Now? Not so much.

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post #55 of 129

It's hardly been competition. Other companies seem to think resting on one's laurels and collecting paycheck until retirement is still a viable way to run a company.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpamSandwich View Post

 

Competition has weeded out another one. Good for Apple.

Originally Posted by Granmastak: Labor unions managed to kill manufacturing a long time ago with their unreasonable demands. Now the people they were trying to protect, are out of a job.
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Originally Posted by Granmastak: Labor unions managed to kill manufacturing a long time ago with their unreasonable demands. Now the people they were trying to protect, are out of a job.
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post #56 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by kpluck View Post

 

Then you are just a silly fanboy. It is a nice phone that by all accounts performs quite well.

 

-kpluck


You've got to be kidding.

 

It's more M$ crapware, the user interface is absolutely horrific.  Nokia may have improved the hardware from what they used to build (they had some of the worst phones back when phones just made phone calls, cheap build quality and horrible voice quality, after using a Nokia phone 10 years or so ago I swore I'd never own their garbage).  But given that their Symbian mess was at a dead end, they should have gone with the only non-Apple OS with a future, Android.

 

Nokia committed suicide when they got in bed with M$.

post #57 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Jaw drop!!! What is wrong with Bill Gates' comments on factoring large prime numbers?  That is a big problem and it would be a huge advance in mathematics to do so, but of course, at the cost of emasculating security using cryptology. DRM would not work, but neither would HTTPS, FTPS, WIFI security, digital signatures, RSA public key cryptography, etc. What am I missing?


The definition of a prime number?

post #58 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post

Yes but they had a lot of help from a genius. It's already starting to show, iOS 6 would have never flown with Steve. Apple is starting to become complacent. Updates are now starting to be anemic and far between. OSX, iOS, hardware design hasn't changed much in the last 5 years, just updates.
Fucking hell! At least you're consistent in your ability to make stupid comments.
Quote:
Their nice, don't get me wrong but things are slowing waaaay down at Apple.
They just released a Retina Display MBP right on the heels of a Retina Display iPad They updated most of their Macs, too, and have ML coming out next month in less than a year after Lion. Then they iOS 6 in a couple months right when the new iPhone, new iPod and other products are releases. It's a big year for Apple.

Let's not forget that Apple is doing all this at once when jus a couple years ago under Steve Jobs rule they had to postpone the Mac OS X update by nearly a year because they were working on iOS.

Face it, you are an Apple hating troll grasping for every strawman no matter how false or absurd.

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #59 of 129
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Originally Posted by fly75 View Post


The definition of a prime number?

Okay. Duh! But, I got what he meant, rather than what he said.

post #60 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post


398
I know, I know... Android is more customizable. I guess that's Apple's Achilles' heel.

 

 

It is both a blessing and a curse for Apple.  It depends on the customer.

 

Apple seems (to me) to be going after the customers who prefer one  simple way to do relatively simple things, like acquire new apps and locate them on the device.  Apple seems to figure that there is a huge market for this sort of style of device.  So far, they seem to be correct.  And so far, there is still a HUGE untapped market consisting of this type of customer.

 

That being said, for a variety of reasons, many more people buy an Android phone than buy an iPhone.  With tablets, for some reason, the proportions are reversed.  Some feel that is due  to pricing considerations, but I'm not convinced that anybody really understands all of the reasons for the phenomenon.

 

I think that if Apple continues to offer devices which are easy to use, they will attract and retain many, many customers in the medium run.  I have no idea what will happen in the long run,. I don't think that anybody can predict the long run, given the increasing pace of technological innovation.

post #61 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Jaw drop!!! What is wrong with Bill Gates' comments on factoring large prime numbers?  That is a big problem and it would be a huge advance in mathematics to do so, but of course, at the cost of emasculating security using cryptology. DRM would not work, but neither would HTTPS, FTPS, WIFI security, digital signatures, RSA public key cryptography, etc. What am I missing?

 

The difference is that you know what you are talking about, and therefore, you don't see the reason for the OP's misunderstanding.

 

Realize that it is impossible to factor a prime number given that it has none (sort of).  If you find factors, it is not prime :)  You know that.

 

As you know, Gates was talking about something else.  He was talking about cryptography, where one finds prime factors for a large number.  He was saying that it was difficult and time consuming now, and that advances in that endeavor were important.

post #62 of 129
Factoring prime numbers is easy as it's just itself and 1. The difficultly comes with locating them.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #63 of 129

Anyone here posting that they want to see the end of Nokia have no idea of their history of innovation, or are too blinkered to see it. I'm not a huge fan of WP7, or any mobile OS in particular, I use Macs at home and work bit I'm pretty mobile platform agnostic, and to dismiss Nokia in that manner is like saying you were glad the Beatles broke up, as they had nothing more to offer.

 

Nokia used to make phones that they KNEW would bomb, simply because they could and should be made, to test boundaries, to promote innovation. Their R&D accounts for the majority of the technology we currently use in our phones and tablets. They promoted and funded open source in Symbian, Maemo, Meego. They have advanced mobile phone camera technology further than any other company by a country mile, and continue to do so with Pureview. That in my book should be applauded. The N900 is still the best phone/tablet I have ever used, or will I believe. (relative to its power and size).

 

I like the iPhone, and have owned all models but the 4s, I use a new iPad at home, but I could never imagine Apple or MS now releasing a product that was built simply because they knew they could, certain in the knowledge it wouldn't be enormously successful. They are too much about the bottom line. It's incremental updates, tie people in to your platform, milk milk milk. I know it's good business practice, and it's made them both a mint, but to dismiss Nokia's history of innovation and support for (genuine) open source software shows a total lack of historical knowledge. I would love to see Nokia survive and thrive, but I fear even if they do, the Nokia I grew up with and admired is gone. They could do what they did due in part to their position as the No.1 phone manufacturer by a huge margin - I acknowledge that, but there are others in the space now who fall short, there was also a culture of risk taking and openness within the company that I fear has been excised with these cuts and restructuring.

 

A sad end, even if they do survive. I genuinely hope I am wrong.


Edited by Scaramanga89 - 6/17/12 at 9:47am
post #64 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramanga89 View Post

Anyone here posting that they want to see the end of Nokia have no idea of their history of innovation, or are too blinkered to see it. [...] to dismiss Nokia in that manner is like saying you were glad the Beatles broke up, as they had nothing more to offer.
I have no idea who you are responding to but there are a couple perspectives one can reasonably take.

I personally want Nokia (and RiM) to come back because those stories are exciting. However, I don't want them to come back just for the sake of coming back. They have to bring something to the table that attracts buyers. You can't survive on pity purchases.

Imagine if I showed you two futures. The one we're in where The Beatles while they were in their prime, and another where they stayed together but ended up adding nothing to music and hurt their band's legacy by continuing to put out poor music (consider McCrtney's solo portfolio).

Going out when you're on top can solidify interest and appeal. We have this with relationships before they get soured over time. I certainly would have preferred if there were no Matrix sequels or Star Wars special editions or prequels. I wanted these, but in retrospect it didn't help their legacy.

Of course, in business this isn't a possibility so back to the original point: Do you want them to continue on if they can't compete in the modern smartphone age?

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #65 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


I have no idea who you are responding to but there are a couple perspectives one can reasonably take.
I personally want Nokia (and RiM) to come back because those stories are exciting. However, I don't want them to come back just for the sake of coming back. They have to bring something to the table that attracts buyers. You can't survive on pity purchases.
Imagine if I showed you two futures. The one we're in where The Beatles while they were in their prime, and another where they stayed together but ended up adding nothing to music and hurt their band's legacy by continuing to put out poor music (consider McCrtney's solo portfolio).
Going out when you're on top can solidify interest and appeal. We have this with relationships before they get soured over time. I certainly would have preferred if there were no Matrix sequels or Star Wars special editions or prequels. I wanted these, but in retrospect it didn't help their legacy.
Of course, in business this isn't a possibility so back to the original point: Do you want them to continue on if they can't compete in the modern smartphone age?

 

I'm not sure why every time I post you feel the need to enquire as to whom I am responding - that's two in a row -  surely a post in a discussion can exist on its own merit?

 

I see your point however, mine was more of a lament than a wish for Nokia to return to form - I don't think they can exist in their old state, no company could to be fair.  Is it worthwhile for them to exist as a pale imitation of their former selves? Did you still not want to see whether Zion would fall or not? Neo's (and the others') final fate?  Yes there was Jar Jar, but there was Maul.

 

If they have to survive using WP7 (which I don't mind, I just think it's more of the same), in order to produce an occasional gem then yes, I would prefer they continued, if only as an echo of past glories, or a salutary lesson for others.

 

p.s. Good point about McCartney - but he did produce both The Frog Chorus and Live and Let Die - another example.

post #66 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post


blah blah... company that deserves more then what has been served lately. ....especially when their not very good...... blah blah
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relic View Post


blah blah ........Their nice..... Their riding a wave now..... now that Mr. Jobs is gone, it's just a wave their riding, nothing more. blah blah

I realize that English may not be your first language, but please learn the difference between "they're" and "their." Also, if you please, "than" and then," while you're at it.

 

You're welcome.

post #67 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

I realize that English may not be your first language, but please learn the difference between "they're" and "their." Also, if you please, "than" and then," while you're at it.

You're barking up the wrong deaf ears.

Anyway, back to the talk about prime numbers. At least they have a future!

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

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Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

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post #68 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramanga89 View Post

 

 

p.s. Good point about McCartney - but he did produce both The Frog Chorus and Live and Let Die - another example.

 

 

Venus and Mars was great.  The original solo McCartney album was followed by Ram, and both are very good and both were very popular.  Band on the Run is another classic.

 

His guitar player in Wings, Denny Laine, was both innovative and precise.  He got a great tone.

 

Maybe the OP just didn't like the genre?

post #69 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scaramanga89 View Post

I'm not sure why every time I post you feel the need to enquire as to whom I am responding - that's two in a row -  surely a post in a discussion can exist on its own merit?
It seemed like you had specific posts in mind but I don't recall any such posts suggesting Nokia should die simply because they are Nokia. Therefore, I qualified my post to show that I'm not protecting any such nonsense that I may have overlooked or have forgotten.

This new forum design has made it easier for posters to think they are posting to a specific person when in fact they are not. That Reply button in every...single...post has to go as it does cause a lot of threads to become confusing and disjointed.

I'm just trying to make sure I understand the flow as much as possible so I can comprehend what I'm reading as much as possible. I have few goals on this thread but one is to comprehend the posts I respond to and another is to write in a way that is comprehendible.
Quote:
Did you still not want to see whether Zion would fall or not? Neo's (and the others') final fate?
There is word of two more films. I'm hopeful they will restore the interest of the first movie.
Quote:
If they have to survive using WP7 (which I don't mind, I just think it's more of the same), in order to produce an occasional gem then yes, I would prefer they continued, if only as an echo of past glories, or a salutary lesson for others.
People are blaming MS for the downfall of Nokia but that first domino publicly fell the day Apple introduced the iPhone. WP7 was Hail Mary to regain some relevancy. I commend them for swallowing their pride and taking the only reasonable course of action that made sense at the time. I hope they have building out their own mobile OS — much in the same way Samsung is banking off Android right now while developing Bada/Tizen — but it's not looking good.

Even if they and it's a great OS it won't be enough. There has to be a strong development community because you need a strong app store. I'm a huge fan of WinPh7 from a technical and usability standpoint but it's simply not good enough. MS is (again) shooting themselves in the foot with making WP7 incompatible with WP8 as it moves to the NT kernel. I can see the long term benefit of that but they are giving a big FU to all the developers who have supported WP7. That doesn't bode well for its future success.

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #70 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

 

 

Venus and Mars was great.  The original solo McCartney album was followed by Ram, and both are very good and both were very popular.  Band on the Run is another classic.

 

His guitar player in Wings, Denny Laine, was both innovative and precise.  He got a great tone.

 

Maybe the OP just didn't like the genre?

 

What about his last six albums? I think the point is that for every gem, there were ten loads of balls.

post #71 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

Maybe the OP just didn't like the genre?

Not overwhelmingly, but I do like the mentions you and Scaramanga89 made. But would those tracks have been great Beatles tracks had they been written by McCartney for the The Beatles or are they only great McCartney tracks? One might ask "Does it make a difference?" to which I would respond "Yes!"

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"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #72 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


People are blaming MS for the downfall of Nokia but that first domino publicly fell the day Apple introduced the iPhone. WP7 was Hail Mary to regain some relevancy. I commend them for swallowing their pride and taking the only reasonable course of action that made sense at the time. I hope they have building out their own mobile OS — much in the same way Samsung is banking off Android right now while developing Bada/Tizen — but it's not looking good.
Even if they and it's a great OS it won't be enough. There has to be a strong development community because you need a strong app store. I'm a huge fan of WinPh7 from a technical and usability standpoint but it's simply not good enough. MS is (again) shooting themselves in the foot with making WP7 incompatible with WP8 as it moves to the NT kernel. I can see the long term benefit of that but they are giving a big FU to all the developers who have supported WP7. That doesn't bode well for its future success.


I agree about the reply button, needs work. I was just posting on the subject itself, and the general vibe from some posters.

 

If they make another two movies I hope they do a Batman and just ignore the second two. Hard to see how it can all tie in though.

 

I don't blame MS at all, I think its the only shot Nokia had. I think Elop's burning platform memo was a disaster, Symbian would have kept them afloat for a lot longer if that had never seen the light of day, but he's not the trojan horse some claim. All the people clamouring for Nokia to adopt Android must have no idea how small the margins on an Android phone must be.

 

I like WP7 too, best mail client going, I have gone back and forth to it from webOS/iOS/Android and currently am back using an E7 running Belle - which is revelation compared to what it shipped with. If Nokia could have released Belle with the N8 then perhaps they would have bought more time, but they always needed a new OS.

 

I've owned an N9 (Meego) since sale, and will keep it because it's just so unique, but it's miles away from prime time as well. Maemo 5 on the N900 wasn't far off, but they got sidetracked by infighting and the Intel deal, so I hope something good can be made of it through Tizen with Samsung.

post #73 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by iVlad View Post

Hmmm, RIM, NOKIA, Microsoft all laughed at Apple back in 2007. Wow, tables have turned. 360!...

Shouldn't that be 180 degrees?

Turning the tables over 360 degrees isn't really a big change lol.gif

post #74 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

On a tangent, this reminds me of how Bill Gates wrote that being able to factor large prime numbers would be a huge advance in mathematics in his book "The Road Ahead". Think about that statement for a minute. I'm fairly sure he was serious. :) Hopefully someone fixed it in subsequent printings.

 
Quote:
Originally Posted by waldobushman View Post

Jaw drop!!! What is wrong with Bill Gates' comments on factoring large prime numbers?  

 

Factoring a prime number is a trivial operation. Despite what Bill Gates thinks, I don't think factoring large prime numbers would be a big advance in mathematics.

 

OTOH, computing a prime number is harder. An efficient way to do that would be a big advance.

post #75 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

On a tangent, this reminds me of how Bill Gates wrote that being able to factor large prime numbers would be a huge advance in mathematics in his book "The Road Ahead". 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by anantksundaram View Post

LOL. Your own post proves your point.

 

Explain what a 'tangency' has to do with the point you're making?

 

Add: /s

 

 

tangent |ˈtanjənt|
noun
2 a completely different line of thought or action: he quickly went off on a tangent about wrestling.

Edited by ShinySteelRobot - 6/17/12 at 11:28am
post #76 of 129

"Despite being a major player in Microsoft's new Windows Phone platform initiative, which some analysts believe will hold more market share than Apple's iPhone by 2016,"........

 

So who are these analysts and what makes them believe this is going to happen? 

 

Oh wait I know,,,,,

 

The fact that MShit does have a real phone available in the middle of 2012 is a big clue that they are going to beat Apple by 2016. 

 

Wow - who but a bunch of Wall Street Morons could have come up with that one. 

 

I love analysts - the word starts with "anal" - need I say more?

 

Ass....es

 

 

post #77 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

It is both a blessing and a curse for Apple.  It depends on the customer.

Apple seems (to me) to be going after the customers who prefer one simple way to do relatively simple things, like acquire new apps and locate them on the device.  Apple seems to figure that there is a huge market for this sort of style of device.  So far, they seem to be correct.  And so far, there is still a HUGE untapped market consisting of this type of customer.

That being said, for a variety of reasons, many more people buy an Android phone than buy an iPhone.  With tablets, for some reason, the proportions are reversed.  Some feel that is due  to pricing considerations, but I'm not convinced that anybody really understands all of the reasons for the phenomenon.

I think that if Apple continues to offer devices which are easy to use, they will attract and retain many, many customers in the medium run.  I have no idea what will happen in the long run,. I don't think that anybody can predict the long run, given the increasing pace of technological innovation.

And that's perfectly fine! Apple is currently losing in the "who sells the most phones" race.... but they're picking up steam in the "maximizing profit and sustainability" race. One of those might actually be more important than the other :-)

If we're talking about unit sales... Apple has certainly dominated in MP3 players and tablets. The same can't be said for their efforts in the phone and computer markets.... but I don't think they're in any kind of danger. Samsung sold more phones than Apple last quarter... but I don't think Apple will be waving a white flag anytime soon.

Apple has really only had one philosophy for what a phone should be... it must be easy to use. And they only make computers in the $1000+ category... another daring choice.

But you're right... there is a market for that kind of stuff. Apple will have an audience for quite some time.
post #78 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Scrip View Post
Samsung sold more phones than Apple last quarter... 

 

...and all the quarters that Apple has been selling iPhones.

 

So what?

 

Apple still make more cold, hard cash out of phones than Samsung does,

Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
Reply
Better than my Bose, better than my Skullcandy's, listening to Mozart through my LeBron James limited edition PowerBeats by Dre is almost as good as my Sennheisers.
Reply
post #79 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

...and all the quarters that Apple has been selling iPhones.

So what?

Apple still make more cold, hard cash out of phones than Samsung does,

Ummmm... I know.

Read the rest of my comments...

I'm the first person to trumpet profit over unit sales.
post #80 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinySteelRobot View Post

 

 

 

 

tangent |ˈtanjənt|
noun
2 a completely different line of thought or action: he quickly went off on a tangent about wrestling.

Uh uh. It would appear you missed the point of my post. If you really wanted to be math-y about "a completely different line of thought or action" the word you would be searching for is "orthogonal" to, not "tangent" to. 

 

Be that as it may, I was simply suggesting that the original poster who said "doing a 360" was using a colloquial reference that just about anyone -- except, apparently, the snarky guy who took off on him about his and America's math knowledge, and to whom I was responding -- reading his post understood.

 

Many such colloquial references use lousy math concepts (including the one you cite, which you obviously did not realize).

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