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PC makers hope Apple's iPad is delaying, not replacing notebook purchases - Page 2

post #41 of 152

I dont know about others but in my case I am moving away from desktop computers to mobile devices, consisting of an ipad, an iphone and a laptop.  For the laptop, when at home I used it with an external 24" monitor, external USB blue ray drive and external keyboard and mouse. 

 

When we go somewhere or on vacation, we just grap the macbook air and the ipad.  I still have a 27" imac that I intend to keep for a while and replace with a laptop/monitor setup in 1 or 2 years. I think an ipad, a Macbook Air and an Apple TV is a great combo to have in the house.

post #42 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmallon View Post

Name 2 crappy OS that microsoft wishes they never released. 

 

 

 

 

Best version of windows ever released

 

 

 

 

which was the longest used windows OS and still holds almost half of all running installes

 

 

 

 

 

What is the install base of OSX

ME, Vista

 

XP

 

XP   August 24, 2001  more the 10 years old

 

 

Snow Leopard 43 percent, Lion 40 percent,

post #43 of 152

When did 'hope' become a business strategy? ;)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

PC Makers Grasping At Straws, live in fantasy world.
post #44 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

If we're only talking about consumers and not office workers, I agree. Most consumers only want to check their email, surf the web and update their facebook and twitter. If an iPad is doing all this with great portability, the PC makers may have to get down on their knees and pray.

People talk about consumers and office workers as if they are two different types of people. Most consumers are office workers or college students who use computers. At home they may only buy a new computer every 10 years, but at work they still need a computer every couple years. Even though they may have an iPad they probably need a computer at home too for the kids to do their homework. Although you can use an iPad without a computer it works better if you sync it up. Depends on how much media content you have, but the point is, I see most iPad owners as still needing a computer. Many are choosing Mac at home even if they use Windows at work.

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post #45 of 152
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post #46 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmallon View Post

Name 2 crappy OS that microsoft wishes they never released. 

 

     any first release of Windows (3, 95, 98, Millenium, NT.

anything after NT is just NT plus fixes.

 

 

Best version of windows ever released

 

Windows 7

 

 

which was the longest used windows OS and still holds almost half of all running installes

 

XP

 

 

 

What is the install base of OSX

its not the quantity, its the quality. but, the install base is growing....

post #47 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldMacGuy View Post

Within 3 months of getting an iPad, I sold my almost-new MBP. I will probably always have an iMac, but just have less and less need for it. Of course, my opinion is worthless, but I do see iPads (and maybe other tablets) replacing home PCs in the coming years.

 

I will always have a desktop because I don't see them making a 30 inch iPad or laptop and I'm a video editor. Half my business is done at home. 

 

But that and acting as a media server is all that desktop is used for now. After sitting at the computer for as much as 6 hours at a time I'm more likely to grab my iPad and go kick back on the couch to surf the web and read my email while watching a little tv or perhaps a movie off Netflix (via my Apple TV). 

 

My family is even more without need for a computer, especially my parents/step-parents and aunts/uncles. But they all have iPhones or iPads. My 93 year old grandfather even has an iPad. 

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #48 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher126 View Post

Man oh Man...is that ever a case of wishful thinking. Reminds me of the RIM engineers at the intro of the first iPhone! :(

To your point, the title of the article is "PC makers hope Apple's iPad is delaying, not replacing notebook purchases"

 

Quite right.

 

As the saying goes, "Hope springs eternal." But notebooks are destined to play a much less significant role in computing over the coming years.

 

Reality bites.

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post #49 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

People talk about consumers and office workers as if they are two different types of people. Most consumers are office workers or college students who use computers. At home they may only buy a new computer every 10 years, but at work they still need a computer every couple years. Even though they may have an iPad they probably need a computer at home too for the kids to do their homework. Although you can use an iPad without a computer it works better if you sync it up. Depends on how much media content you have, but the point is, I see most iPad owners as still needing a computer. Many are choosing Mac at home even if they use Windows at work.

 

 

lol, not where I work. I work for a canadian bank and I have been using the same Dell pentium D for 8 years now. I have changed my home computers 3 times since I got that machine at work. the OS at work is still windows XP and office 2003. From my experience in IT, big companies are very very slow to update there Pc's and OS considering the huge cost each time they do it.

post #50 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by cvaldes1831 View Post

 

Curiously, Apple's notebook sales have continued increasing while Windows-based notebook sales have declined. 

 

This is not correct.  Therefore, any conclusions drawn are unreliable.

post #51 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galley View Post

I got a new work PC last week with Windows 7. It seems to actually have less functionality than XP.

 

 

Can you give a few examples of the lost functionality?  

post #52 of 152

amazing how few tech blabbers can grasp it is all about using the right tool for the job/situation.

 

unlike the tech blabbers who mainly hang out, do "social" on the web, and then BS on their websites, i do "real work" - spreadsheets, contracts, detailed memos, review designs, etc. so my work setup now is very simple: on the desk are wireless mouse/keyboard and a thunderbolt display to go with my basic Macbook (just two wires to plug in, total). on the road, i just take the same Macbook of course, which is brain dead simple to do. not a Macbook Air because the optical drive is still important because, despite all the hype about the cloud and such, the easiest and most dependable way to swap/leave behind lots of files with people from other companies, attorneys, designers, etc. on the spot is still to burn CD's and receive/give it to them (no fiddling needed with their IT or ID's or anything, can do it anywhere, and they can then be shared with others in those offices very easily too).

 

no tablet can ever be adequate for that, period. the screens are just too small (try looking at a complicated multilayer spreadsheet on one). and being a clumsy typer anyway, the bigger keyboard is better for me. this is why the Surface Pro is DOA. despite all the kitchen sink hardware, it's still the wrong tool for "real work." almost every business person is going to reach the same conclusion.

 

but when i am on my own time/vacation yet need to be able to do "light work" - mainly stay in touch and maybe review/sign off some pdf's - i don't take the Macbook any more. my iPad 2 is very adequate for this. and of course i can use it for all the "consumer" purposes too. the Surface Pro would be total overkill for this situation.

 

the iPad is also very adequate for quick work trips - around town or day trips out of town - when i'm not going to be working on "content," but just need to stay in touch and look at whatever. same is true for doing limited business "homework" at home after hours.

 

about 1/3 of our staff need a portable computer sometimes like this. the rest are desk-bound and so will always have a standard PC of some kind.

 

my company is small, so we don't have custom software or a massive D-base. if we ever needed to, we'd look at contracting for a custom iPad program if being portable and D-base interface was necessary. the proprietary professional software we do use is Windows-based - and it is very complex. there is no way on earth that program (which has a few dozen "modules") is ever going to be ported to a tablet/touch UI. ditto the accounting software.

 

so bottom line: for businesses, consumer tablets will augment but not replace computers - but laptops/notebooks ARE replacing desktop PC's for the part of the workforce that travels. not the cheap ones (i'd bet most of those are bought for students), but the better quality models, which is why Apple's sales keep growing.

 

for consumers tho, tablets definitely can and will replace laptops/notebooks. i won't ever buy another laptop just for personal use - that's overkill now for a portable device. (but i'll always have one big iMac at home as the base unit for everything - i got a lot of media.)

post #53 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You are dreaming ..go to any information system department of any company and see if Windows is over..no one in the right mind will use Mac in the corporate world. Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

 

@ DAYLOVE 22

 

Ok Trolly Polly, not sure if you are serious or SIRIus or just iLLinformed...

 

First off- the couple of issues that were related to the MAC OSX were NOT VIRUSES but MALWARE (there is a difference and I'm sure your very well aware of that since you are posting here on a tech site, or maybe not) so get your facts straight dude. and second check the statistics out there online, in trade mags and anywhere you can dig up some info your a PC troll so since your are already in the trenches you should be able to "DIGG" and get up on it... WINDoze is slowing dying a slow death as it should be for trying to STEAL from APPLE from way back when and copying them for EVER and failing at it miserably- and now MICRO$LOTH is coming out with a WINDOZE 8 TABLOTH and will fail at that too-but if you can hold your breath just a little bit longer before the end of the this year 2012 Micro$hit will released the much anticipated MS OFFICE for iPad suite and when this does happen it will be the DEATH of WINDoze PC and their iPad Killers as well.. because EVERYONE who thought the needed a WINDoze PC to do what they needed to do at work will be HISTORY!!! and aren't you aware of the PC emulators out there VMware Fusion and Parallels Desktop now run well in OS X Lion, and work even faster than a regular PC???

 

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-20106060-263/vmware-and-parallels-now-updated-for-os-x-lion/

 

H8 to say it but CYA LATER ALLIGATOR!!!

post #54 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

This is not correct.  Therefore, any conclusions drawn are unreliable.

It's pretty close actually. This year is the first time in which Microsoft's revenues for Windows has declined.
post #55 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You are dreaming ..go to any information system department of any company and see if Windows is over..no one in the right mind will use Mac in the corporate world. Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

 

@ DAYLOVE 22

 

Ok Trolly Polly, not sure if you are serious or SIRIus or just iLLinformed...

 

First off- the couple of issues that were related to the MAC OSX were NOT VIRUSES but MALWARE (there is a difference and I'm sure your very well aware of that since you are posting here on a tech site, or maybe not) so get your facts straight dude. and second check the statistics out there online, in trade mags and anywhere you can dig up some info your a PC troll so since your are already in the trenches you should be able to "DIGG" and get up on it... WINDoze is slowing dying a slow death as it should be for trying to STEAL from APPLE from way back when and copying them for EVER and failing at it miserably- and now MICRO$LOTH is coming out with a WINDOZE 8 TABLOTH and will fail at that too-but if you can hold your breath just a little bit longer before the end of the this year 2012 Micro$hit will released the much anticipated MS OFFICE for iPad suite and when this does happen it will be the DEATH of WINDoze PC and their iPad Killers as well.. because EVERYONE who thought the needed a WINDoze PC to do what they needed to do at work will be HISTORY!!! and aren't you aware of the PC emulators out there VMware Fusion and Parallels Desktop now run well in OS X Lion, and work even faster than a regular PC???

 

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-20106060-263/vmware-and-parallels-now-updated-for-os-x-lion/

 

H8 to say it but CYA LATER ALLIGATOR!!!

post #56 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You are dreaming ..go to any information system department of any company and see if Windows is over..no one in the right mind will use Mac in the corporate world. Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

What has been happening in all kinds of companies is that the executives and upper management bought iPads and brought them to work. They then told IT "make it so I can use this here." IT didn't want them, but the execs did. And once IT is supporting Apple, the flood gates opened. People who have clout started demanding that the company buy them Macs, and even people without clout asked it they could bring their own machines to work. There is a huge trend in BYOC (bring your own computer to work) that is pushing macs on reluctant IT departments. It has always been the IT departments that kept macs out of the enterprise and now they can't resist the pressure. Believe me, it's only going to get worse (if your an IT guy) or better (if your a computer user) as time goes on.

post #57 of 152

Absolutely true -- sort of.  I've found the iPad to have limitations butI don't want to pack around a full size laptop.  BuAfter using the iPad though  I'm more likely to buy a Macbook Air than a windows netbook.  I imagine a lot of other people will make a similar choice.

post #58 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

 

This is not correct.  Therefore, any conclusions drawn are unreliable.

Jerry, I don't think it is sufficient to refute an argument (that MacBooks have increased in sales while netbooks have decreased in sales) but just saying "you're wrong" You can either ask for proof, or provide counter proof, but your response is insufficient. So, if you want to be proactive, refute this if not ask the OP to support.

post #59 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You are dreaming ..go to any information system department of any company and see if Windows is over..no one in the right mind will use Mac in the corporate world. Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

 

I guess I should tell my colleagues that all of us on Macs don't exist. We'll have to uninstall MS Office, Neatbeans, our personal build scripts and shell scripts that automate our code testing and smash our wonderful Mac Book Airs into pieces. God what were we thinking?!?  This software is too complex for OS X!! I mean how can a 20+ year old BSD-based kernel possibly figure out how to manage "complex" programs. Let me just open a terminal on OS X right now 

 

rm -rf /*

 

Whew! Now I'm safe. Thank you for showing your unbelievable ignorance about what OS X is and how it works. Oh wait, those linux scripts we used to use on that crapmaster 5000 platform known at Redhat "Do it yourself and make all your own drivers because that's what's cool about linux" Edition. Well surprisingly they WORK on OS X. If you cannot realize that OS X is unix-based stable platform for which software rests in a standardized and reasonable implementation, well you are simply another McMicrosoft Certified....oh it pains me to say it.....Engineer.  Go learn something new today, start with a wikipedia search for FreeBSD.

post #60 of 152

Appleinsider where is the DELETE DUPLICATE POST BUTTON??? i mistakenly posted twice not seeing my first attempt now i have 2, so where is the delete post button or trash post icon??

 

Thank you... BITZANDBITEZ

post #61 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

amazing how few tech blabbers can grasp it is all about using the right tool for the job/situation.

unlike the tech blabbers who mainly hang out, do "social" on the web, and then BS on their websites, i do "real work" - spreadsheets, contracts, detailed memos, review designs, etc. so my work setup now is very simple: on the desk are wireless mouse/keyboard and a thunderbolt display to go with my basic Macbook (just two wires to plug in, total). on the road, i just take the same Macbook of course, which is brain dead simple to do. not a Macbook Air because the optical drive is still important because, despite all the hype about the cloud and such, the easiest and most dependable way to swap/leave behind lots of files with people from other companies, attorneys, designers, etc. on the spot is still to burn CD's and receive/give it to them (no fiddling needed with their IT or ID's or anything, can do it anywhere, and they can then be shared with others in those offices very easily too).

no tablet can ever be adequate for that, period. the screens are just too small (try looking at a complicated multilayer spreadsheet on one). and being a clumsy typer anyway, the bigger keyboard is better for me. this is why the Surface Pro is DOA. despite all the kitchen sink hardware, it's still the wrong tool for "real work." almost every business person is going to reach the same conclusion.

but when i am on my own time/vacation yet need to be able to do "light work" - mainly stay in touch and maybe review/sign off some pdf's - i don't take the Macbook any more. my iPad 2 is very adequate for this. and of course i can use it for all the "consumer" purposes too. the Surface Pro would be total overkill for this situation.

the iPad is also very adequate for quick work trips - around town or day trips out of town - when i'm not going to be working on "content," but just need to stay in touch and look at whatever. same is true for doing limited business "homework" at home after hours.

about 1/3 of our staff need a portable computer sometimes like this. the rest are desk-bound and so will always have a standard PC of some kind.

my company is small, so we don't have custom software or a massive D-base. if we ever needed to, we'd look at contracting for a custom iPad program if being portable and D-base interface was necessary. the proprietary professional software we do use is Windows-based - and it is very complex. there is no way on earth that program (which has a few dozen "modules") is ever going to be ported to a tablet/touch UI. ditto the accounting software.

so bottom line: for businesses, consumer tablets will augment but not replace computers - but laptops/notebooks ARE replacing desktop PC's for the part of the workforce that travels. not the cheap ones (i'd bet most of those are bought for students), but the better quality models, which is why Apple's sales keep growing.

for consumers tho, tablets definitely can and will replace laptops/notebooks. i won't ever buy another laptop just for personal use - that's overkill now for a portable device. (but i'll always have one big iMac at home as the base unit for everything - i got a lot of media.)

Your experience is just a small subset of what business people do with their portable devices. SAP, for example has purchased more than 20,000 iPads, and has replaced people's notebooks with them. They have reported an increase in productivity, and that their staff is happier using them.

SAP isn't alone here. Few people need to work on a full blown spreadsheet or database whole on the road. For the few that do, a tablet, at least for now, isn't the thing to use. But for most other uses, it's just as good, or better.

You're going to have to get used to that idea, like it or not. Forrester Research recently reported that in 2011, businesses (not BYOD) bought $6 billion of iPads. That in 2012" business will buy $9 billion of iPads, and that in 2013" businesses will buy $16 billion of iPads.

If that doesn't validate the iPad for business use, I don't know what else might.
post #62 of 152

They’re right—very often iPads are only delaying people’s next computer purchase. You can let your old PC “make do” longer if you no longer use it as much. But someday, you’re likely to get another PC to replace the dying one. Not everyone needs/wants something beyond an iPad, but right now most people still do.

 

But delayed sales = fewer sales. One laptop every 5 years instead of every 2, or whatever. So delayed sales = LOST sales. There’s no hoping that isn’t so.

 

(Plus iPads make people want a Mac when they do upgrade to a new computer.)

post #63 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitzandbitez View Post

Appleinsider where is the DELETE DUPLICATE POST BUTTON??? i mistakenly posted twice not seeing my first attempt now i have 2, so where is the delete post button or trash post icon??

Thank you... BITZANDBITEZ

Sorry. This is still new software.
post #64 of 152

 

 

Quote:

@ DAYLOVE 22

 

Ok Trolly Polly, not sure if you are serious or SIRIus or just iLLinformed...

 

First off- the couple of issues that were related to the MAC OSX were NOT VIRUSES but MALWARE (there is a difference and I'm sure your very well aware of that since you are posting here on a tech site, or maybe not) so get your facts straight dude. and second check the statistics out there online, in trade mags and anywhere you can dig up some info your a PC troll so since your are already in the trenches you should be able to "DIGG" and get up on it... WINDoze is slowing dying a slow death as it should be for trying to STEAL from APPLE from way back when and copying them for EVER and failing at it miserably- and now MICRO$LOTH is coming out with a WINDOZE 8 TABLOTH and will fail at that too-but if you can hold your breath just a little bit longer before the end of the this year 2012 Micro$hit will released the much anticipated MS OFFICE for iPad suite and when this does happen it will be the DEATH of WINDoze PC and their iPad Killers as well.. because EVERYONE who thought the needed a WINDoze PC to do what they needed to do at work will be HISTORY!!! and aren't you aware of the PC emulators out there VMware Fusion and Parallels Desktop now run well in OS X Lion, and work even faster than a regular PC???

 

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-20106060-263/vmware-and-parallels-now-updated-for-os-x-lion/

 

H8 to say it but CYA LATER ALLIGATOR!!!

 

Wow.  It's hard to take any of this seriously.  It just sounds so juvenile.   WinDoze?  Micro$Sloth?  Micro$shit?  What are you, 13 years old?    Grow up.

post #65 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrail View Post

Ironically, the iPad might sell more laptops in the long run.

 

Consumers keep their gear longer than enthusiasts (just think about any computer you've been asked to look at because it's "acting funny").  If they still need* a "real" computer, the iPad's convenience and portability will probably push their once-a-decade computer purchase into the laptop column.

 

*as with all needs, it's a perceived need, not an actual need

 

In the long-run, I think the iPad will end up selling more Desktops. Very few people, including those who typically do more than email/web, really need a laptop, because most of them don't need the additional capabilities that a laptop provides when they are away from their "desk". Most of these people are buying laptops for (the perception of) the "coolness" factor associated with a laptop, not because they actually need them. But, I think as more and more begin to use iPads for their mobile needs (i.e., where other people will see them), they'll start to want to be free from the constraints that the compromises of a laptop impose and decide to switch to a more compromise free, larger screen, more powerful system like a desktop.

post #66 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newera View Post

The MS era is over. PCs are not over but anyone with any sense will buy a Mac. MS Windows always has problems, works inconsistently, utilizes unrest upgrades that wreck your system, and throws all kinds of other misfortune to us users.
We want something that works and is reliable. We want software that we don't have to troubleshoot. The company meeting this need is Apple. After decades of windows headaches I'm using iPad and headed to a MacBook next.
No it's not PCs that are dead, it's MS Windows

 

That's not going to happen. Windows still has something like 90% market share around the world. Even Steve Jobs admitted that Windows won that battle and Apple had to forget about it and move on.

 

Apple are not interested in replacing Microsoft as the dominant desktop OS. Apple target the high end of the market as that's where the profits are. Apple could always make a range of cheap PCs and laptops to gain market share if they wanted to but I don't think they ever will.

 

Apple has moved on. The new battle is iOS versus Android versus all the others.

post #67 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newera View Post

The MS era is over. PCs are not over but anyone with any sense will buy a Mac. MS Windows always has problems, works inconsistently, utilizes unrest upgrades that wreck your system, and throws all kinds of other misfortune to us users.
We want something that works and is reliable. We want software that we don't have to troubleshoot. The company meeting this need is Apple. After decades of windows headaches I'm using iPad and headed to a MacBook next.
No it's not PCs that are dead, it's MS Windows

 

i've been a mac convert for almost 12 months now, i took the plunge and bought a macbook pro last summer. i can most definitely state that os x lion is no more reliable than what windows 7 is. my mac has crashed more times on me in the last 12 months than what windows 7 has in the last 2 years. os x is full of bugs and apple software certainly does not "just work". tell that to everybody who recently downloaded the latest thunderbolt update for their macs to then find out that they wouldn't boot up. microsoft is not alone in making serious screw up's, or having the monopoly on buggy software. os x has loads of bugs, take the volume keys not working when you boot up, you have to plug in headphones and unplug them again before the volume keys work. this is a bug that's been in os x since around 2007 and it still isn't fixed.

 

don't get me wrong, i don't regret ditching windows for a mac, but apple and os x is not the holy grail of companies and software that the apple fanboys always seem to defend. it seems apple can do what they like and people still defend them. the thunderbolt update i mentioned above, even 24 hours later after people worldwide were complaining their macs wouldn't boot, apple was still pushing out the update to everybody. they were very slow to respond to the situation, likewise with the virus outbreak the other month. pc's were patched against that vulnerability weeks before but apple dragged its heels over it and still they get defended by the fanboys.

apple sure isn't perfect, they've had two major screw ups within 2 months but because they're apple they get away with it.

had that have been microsoft, it would have made headline news around the world.

post #68 of 152

Bill Gates retired from MSFT 6 years ago this week.

Look what Steve Bummer accomplished single-handedly in only a half decade!

Win 8 looks as if Mondiran went blind and crazy. 

Windows will be a memory by 2020. 

post #69 of 152

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post #70 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

 

That's not going to happen. Windows still has something like 90% market share around the world. Even Steve Jobs admitted that Windows won that battle and Apple had to forget about it and move on.

 

Apple are not interested in replacing Microsoft as the dominant desktop OS. Apple target the high end of the market as that's where the profits are. Apple could always make a range of cheap PCs and laptops to gain market share if they wanted to but I don't think they ever will.

 

Apple has moved on. The new battle is iOS versus Android versus all the others.

 

Your remark was true 10 years ago, but things a change a lot since Steves has concede win to Windows 95 (more than 15 years ago). Ever since Microsoft has failed to innovate their platform and since Vista, the whole Windows eco-system is on a slow downhill slope, PC hardware is declining and Windows software really have a hard time to innovate and give customer reasons to upgrade to another version of Windows who beside a new UI have pretty little to offert and many lost functionnality over the previous version.  

post #71 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun, UK View Post

That's not going to happen. Windows still has something like 90% market share around the world. Even Steve Jobs admitted that Windows won that battle and Apple had to forget about it and move on.

Apple are not interested in replacing Microsoft as the dominant desktop OS. Apple target the high end of the market as that's where the profits are. Apple could always make a range of cheap PCs and laptops to gain market share if they wanted to but I don't think they ever will.

Apple has moved on. The new battle is iOS versus Android versus all the others.

It's not that simple anymore though. When he said that in 1997 or 1998, it seemed to be true. But what is "the desktop"? That definition is changing.

I have a Mac Pro, with a 27" monitor. If you asked me in late 2009 whether that would remain my main desktop, I would have replied; Hell. Yeah! But no longer. Most of my daily computer use has been with an iPad. My friends who have bought one, an increasing number, have been finding that it does indeed grow on you, and that you spend more hours with it over time.

Most of those people own Windows machines. Though, that's changing as well.

It's very possible that we'll find iOS as the next major "desktop". In fact, I believe that it's already happening.

With estimates that tablet sales will exceed 375 million in 2016, the desktop will no longer be considered to be a Windows world. If the Surface doesn't have rapid and broad adoption, it will be out of the picture.
post #72 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne2612 View Post

i've been a mac convert for almost 12 months now, i took the plunge and bought a macbook pro last summer. i can most definitely state that os x lion is no more reliable than what windows 7 is. my mac has crashed more times on me in the last 12 months than what windows 7 has in the last 2 years. os x is full of bugs and apple software certainly does not "just work". tell that to everybody who recently downloaded the latest thunderbolt update for their macs to then find out that they wouldn't boot up. microsoft is not alone in making serious screw up's, or having the monopoly on buggy software. os x has loads of bugs, take the volume keys not working when you boot up, you have to plug in headphones and unplug them again before the volume keys work. this is a bug that's been in os x since around 2007 and it still isn't fixed.

don't get me wrong, i don't regret ditching windows for a mac, but apple and os x is not the holy grail of companies and software that the apple fanboys always seem to defend. it seems apple can do what they like and people still defend them. the thunderbolt update i mentioned above, even 24 hours later after people worldwide were complaining their macs wouldn't boot, apple was still pushing out the update to everybody. they were very slow to respond to the situation, likewise with the virus outbreak the other month. pc's were patched against that vulnerability weeks before but apple dragged its heels over it and still they get defended by the fanboys.
apple sure isn't perfect, they've had two major screw ups within 2 months but because they're apple they get away with it.
had that have been microsoft, it would have made headline news around the world.

Nothing is perfect. But your problems are not the average, to be sure. And there are plenty of Microsoft apologists as well, they just don't see themselves that way.
post #73 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ Web View Post

Bill Gates retired from MSFT 6 years ago this week.
Look what Steve Bummer accomplished single-handedly in only a half decade!
Win 8 looks as if Mondiran went blind and crazy. 
Windows will be a memory by 2020. 

Actually, Bill didn't retire at all. He just gave up the CEO position. He remains Executive Chairman, and heads a major committee on innovation. His is still the major power at Microsoft, and you can be sure that nothing Ballmer does isn't approved by him. He just removed himself from the limelight after the debacle of the Federal case against Microsoft where he was caught lying on the stand several times.
post #74 of 152

god I hope so... it would be a sign that a great deal of people are not only untalented but do little with their free time if they can just survive with an iPad.

 

seeing how every book, web site, App, game, magazine -- you read, visit, use, play, and keep on an iPad are made on an REAL computer - it is far from dead. Again, unless you are untalented or a very simple person even at home - but hey more people drink Cocacola, over a good wine with a meal.

 

I have more respect for someone who actually thinks they needs a Windows PC over an iPad - they a bit confused fort not using OSX but at a minimum their lives do not fit in a Toy.

post #75 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne2612 View Post

 

i've been a mac convert for almost 12 months now, i took the plunge and bought a macbook pro last summer. i can most definitely state that os x lion is no more reliable than what windows 7 is. my mac has crashed more times on me in the last 12 months than what windows 7 has in the last 2 years. os x is full of bugs and apple software certainly does not "just work". tell that to everybody who recently downloaded the latest thunderbolt update for their macs to then find out that they wouldn't boot up. microsoft is not alone in making serious screw up's, or having the monopoly on buggy software. os x has loads of bugs, take the volume keys not working when you boot up, you have to plug in headphones and unplug them again before the volume keys work. this is a bug that's been in os x since around 2007 and it still isn't fixed.

 

don't get me wrong, i don't regret ditching windows for a mac, but apple and os x is not the holy grail of companies and software that the apple fanboys always seem to defend. it seems apple can do what they like and people still defend them. the thunderbolt update i mentioned above, even 24 hours later after people worldwide were complaining their macs wouldn't boot, apple was still pushing out the update to everybody. they were very slow to respond to the situation, likewise with the virus outbreak the other month. pc's were patched against that vulnerability weeks before but apple dragged its heels over it and still they get defended by the fanboys.

apple sure isn't perfect, they've had two major screw ups within 2 months but because they're apple they get away with it.

had that have been microsoft, it would have made headline news around the world.

I don't want to dismiss your experience, but something is very atypical with what you describe. A "crash" for a Mac is called a Kernal Panic, and they are extremely rare. I know I have had one or two in all the years of owning macs (I won't count my Hackintosh, which will KP occasionally when I am making serious edits to the system, but even that machine is incredibly stable). The application crashes that I have had have almost exclusively been either MS apps like Word, or caused by other third parties like Flash or Java.

 

As far as your alleged volume issue, I cannot recreate this on a 2008 MBP nor on a 2011 MBA. And for the record there is still no recorded incident of a VIRUS on a Mac. You give an example of Malware which again BTW was the result of a third party (Java). So, no one reading this site is going to fall for the "Macs aren't any more secure than PC" argument, because the OS is inherently more secure, regardless of how big a target Macs are.

 

So, what do you suppose is the reason that people didn't get all up in arms because there was a few day lag before the TB update was delivered? You seem to suppose that it is some powerful mind control (Anytime I see Fanboy in a post I know I can immediately discount most of what is said). Maybe it is because these things are very infrequent and usually handled well. I'm sorry you're not having the same great experience with OS X that most of us are, but as I said, what you describe is not the experience most of us have. And that experience is what makes us defend Apple from the FUD that gets posted.

post #76 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

You are dreaming ..go to any information system department of any company and see if Windows is over..no one in the right mind will use Mac in the corporate world. Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

 

What are "complex applications"?

post #77 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne2612 View Post

 

i've been a mac convert for almost 12 months now, i took the plunge and bought a macbook pro last summer. i can most definitely state that os x lion is no more reliable than what windows 7 is. my mac has crashed more times on me in the last 12 months than what windows 7 has in the last 2 years. os x is full of bugs and apple software certainly does not "just work". tell that to everybody who recently downloaded the latest thunderbolt update for their macs to then find out that they wouldn't boot up. microsoft is not alone in making serious screw up's, or having the monopoly on buggy software. os x has loads of bugs, take the volume keys not working when you boot up, you have to plug in headphones and unplug them again before the volume keys work. this is a bug that's been in os x since around 2007 and it still isn't fixed.

 

don't get me wrong, i don't regret ditching windows for a mac, but apple and os x is not the holy grail of companies and software that the apple fanboys always seem to defend. it seems apple can do what they like and people still defend them. the thunderbolt update i mentioned above, even 24 hours later after people worldwide were complaining their macs wouldn't boot, apple was still pushing out the update to everybody. they were very slow to respond to the situation, likewise with the virus outbreak the other month. pc's were patched against that vulnerability weeks before but apple dragged its heels over it and still they get defended by the fanboys.

apple sure isn't perfect, they've had two major screw ups within 2 months but because they're apple they get away with it.

had that have been microsoft, it would have made headline news around the world.

 

Wow you seams very angry, beside the 2 issues you mention (the Flash malware and Thunderbolt) was not wide spread like you tend to pretend, a very very small minority has actually experiment issues here.  As for your own crash and bugs issue, you don't have any clue on what happening, could be a third party hardware and software problem. One thing for sure some of my servers are runnings for more than 4 years uninterrupted, so the OS is not in cause here.  Beside, you can't honestly compare OSX malware issue with Windows where new malwares and malicious code appear on a daily basis. I fail to see any treat on OSX that can be compare with Nimda and Stuxnet virus


Edited by BigMac2 - 6/22/12 at 11:31am
post #78 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMac2 View Post

 

Your remark was true 10 years ago, but things a change a lot since Steves has concede win to Windows 95 (more than 15 years ago). Ever since Microsoft has failed to innovate their platform and since Vista, the whole Windows eco-system is on a slow downhill slope, PC hardware is declining and Windows software really have a hard time to innovate and give customer reasons to upgrade to another version of Windows who beside a new UI have pretty little to offert and many lost functionnality over the previous version.  

 

And 15 years later Windows still has 90% market share on the desktop. Not exactly a rapid decline. Apple are happy with their very profitable 10% market share. They're not going to introduce cheaper Macs simply to gain a bigger market share. Linux has maybe 1%. Chrome OS has who knows. I'm sorry but this situation is simply not going to change anytime soon.

post #79 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

If we're only talking about consumers and not office workers, I agree. Most consumers only want to check their email, surf the web and update their facebook and twitter. If an iPad is doing all this with great portability, the PC makers may have to get down on their knees and pray.

I think Steve Jobs was prescient when he called PCs "trucks" and post-PC devices "cars". There are people who need trucks, once you give people a choice, the car will win marketshare for its advantages.

I can think of several advantages of an iPad over a PC. It's easy & intuitive, instant on, long battery life, super portable, no moving parts, 4G LTE option, and $499 for a retina display.

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply

"Apple should pull the plug on the iPhone."

John C. Dvorak, 2007
Reply
post #80 of 152
Quote:
Originally Posted by daylove22 View Post

Moreover, Mac os x is as buggy as Windows and gets viruses too btw. I love Apple but for complex applications you simply cannot use their software.

I won't discuss the bugginess of Mac OS X, since it became more buggy since Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger, though Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard is quite okay in my eyes. Mac OS X 10.7 Lion and OS X 10.8 Mountain Lion are just so-so.

But please show us ONE, only ONE, actual virus, that affects Mac OS X. I am not talking about viruses for the classic Mac OS, for which there have been some, but since Mac OS X' arrival, there have been no viruses. And yes, a trojan is not a virus, even if you would like to think so.
Look for the "Mac Virus / Malware Guide" on MacRumors to learn more about Mac OS X and available malware and the differences and ways to protect yourself. Or don't. You are probably not here to learn anything, just to stir up some shit (ui, no censorship, how refreshing).
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