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Microsoft says Apple's 'post-PC' view is wrong, claims it's a 'PC+' era - Page 5

post #161 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

are you joking? what do you call a tablet running multiple displays?

An iPad using AirPlay.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #162 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post

I think what they did with the keyboard cover is great and much better than Apple's keyboard dock, which you can't really take with you easily. 

 

Shouldn't you wait to test their fancy new keyboard in person before declaring it as great and much better than Apple's keyboard dock? While it certainly LOOKS cool, I am willing to bet that real world usage will fall short of expectations. I'm anticipating a keyboard that requires pressing down firmly on each individual key as opposed to lightly tapping a touchscreen or Apple's time-tested keyboard. If my assumption is right, this new keyboard will be anything but fast and will result in fatigue or even repetitive stress injuries after extended use.

 

But of course, all my predictions are worthless until the real product comes out and people can actually test it - just like everything Microsoft is claiming about this device, which no one at the event was allowed to use in person.

 

If we've learned anything about Microsoft over the last 20+ years it's that their products never live up to their hype.


Edited by freediverx - 7/14/12 at 11:54am
post #163 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by WizSquid View Post

He has traded his Windows Phone (stylus) for an iPhone, picked up an iPad, but still uses PC's for doing 3D animation. Dell gives him $5k laptops for free because he is that good, and now he hates Windows 8 passionately. Very, very bad sign for MS.

 

Dell makes a $5k laptop?? What kind of idiot would pay that kind of money for anything made by Dell?

post #164 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by NasserAE View Post

 

It is unfinished product and it will be until there is CTL+ALT+DEL buttons!! Every Windows machine needs CTL ALT DEL! lol.gif

 

Nah, I think Microsoft will provide a Metro tile for the frequently required reboots.

post #165 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

OK this is Lenovo's laptop/tablet hybrid. Honestly who would ever use this as a tablet? It looks heavy, bulky and uncomfortable to hold as the back is the keyboard.

flipping-the-screen-over-disables-the-keyboard-so-you-dont-accidentally-type-something.jpg

To me this has fail written all over it. I just can't imagine myself on a bus/plane or at the park/beach reading a book with one of these things.

 

It's telling that its most attractive feature is the keyboard design they copied from Apple. LOL.

post #166 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Oh and here's another Lenovo lt that the Apple haters swear up and down looks nothing like a Mac.
Why is it so hard for people to admit that a lot of PC laptops/Ultrabooks take their design cues from the MacBook Pro/Air these days? It's so obvious. And has nothing to do with whether Apple invented something or not (i.e. wedge shape, chicklit keyboard), it's about the finished product, all th design components put together.

KB_TP_3_1020_gallery_post.jpg


 

 

I can almost hear the discussions that led to this design at Lenovo...

 

     "It will look just like a MacBook!"

 

     "Yeah, consumers are so dumb. They'll happily overpay for products just based on pretty looks. Just look at Apple's success!"

 

     "Hold on there... what about patent infringement...?"

 

     "No worries, boss. We've moved our Apple-cloned power button from the right side to the left, added an unnecessary scalloped edge to the keyboard keys,
     moved the touchpad to an awkward left-of-center position, and of course, we're including our usual assortment of crapware and hard to remove Windows/Intel stickers!!"

 

     "Ha! We even moved the ventilation slots to the bottom of the device! Let's see Apple top that!"

 

     "Brilliant! Commence manufacturing immediately!"

post #167 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsd View Post

If putting Ballmer in charge and leaving him there for 10+ years isn't a real risk, I don't know what is.

 

I think Bill Gates did this on purpose when he retired to reinforce his own legacy as the real "genius" behind Microsoft's success.

post #168 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by jnjnjn View Post


MS Office is not even compatible with itself and not long ago a document with more than a few pages would get instable after a while.
And belief me I tried to use it, because it was required.
Good riddance I would say.
J.

 

 

Absolutely correct, lol. They not only have a totally different UI between their Mac and PC versions, but the file formats are not fully compatible. Also Microsoft and Adobe are probably the only two software makers that make installing and removing software on a Mac feel like the same crappy experience on the Windows PC, with their horrific installation software and retarded organization of application files.

 

But this doesn't address my point, though, that even for a huge Apple fan like myself, iWork is a tough proposition given I work in an MS Office-centered environment. This would only work if I created documents in isolation. The moment you have to share with and collaborate with others, the dual software approach becomes so unwieldily that it's no longer justifiable.

post #169 of 210
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post

 

 

and we'll actually see who was right/wrong, AGAIN.

 

 

Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

 

 

Are you saying that Microsoft is "right" and that Google is "right" with Windows and Android, respectively? And that Apple is "wrong" with OSX and iOS for phones, both?

 

Are you sure that market share and "right" are tightly correlated? 

 

 

I think you've misread my comment if you think I'm on Microsoft's or Google's side of the argument. Please read in context and you'll see its quite the opposite.

post #170 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerrySwitched26 View Post

 

Are you saying that Microsoft is "right" and that Google is "right" with Windows and Android, respectively? And that Apple is "wrong" with OSX and iOS for phones, both?

 

Are you sure that market share and "right" are tightly correlated? 

 

 

Shouldn't you wait to test their fancy new keyboard in person before declaring it as great and much better than Apple's keyboard dock?

 

While it certainly LOOKS cool, I am willing to bet that real world usability will fall short of expectations. I'm anticipating a keyboard that requires pressing down firmly on each individual key as opposed to lightly tapping a touchscreen or Apple's time-tested keyboard. If my assumption is right, this new keyboard will be anything but fast and will result in fatigue or even repetitive stress injuries after extended use.

 

But of course, all my predictions are worthless until the real product comes out and people can actually test it - just like everything Microsoft is claiming about this device, which no one at the event was allowed to use in person.

 

If we've learned anything about Microsoft over the last 20+ years it's that their products never live up to their hype, assuming the product is ever released at all.

post #171 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by freediverx View Post

 

 

Shouldn't you wait to test their fancy new keyboard in person before declaring it as great and much better than Apple's keyboard dock?

 

While it certainly LOOKS cool, I am willing to bet that real world usability will fall short of expectations. I'm anticipating a keyboard that requires pressing down firmly on each individual key as opposed to lightly tapping a touchscreen or Apple's time-tested keyboard. If my assumption is right, this new keyboard will be anything but fast and will result in fatigue or even repetitive stress injuries after extended use.

 

But of course, all my predictions are worthless until the real product comes out and people can actually test it - just like everything Microsoft is claiming about this device, which no one at the event was allowed to use in person.

 

If we've learned anything about Microsoft over the last 20+ years it's that their products never live up to their hype, assuming the product is ever released at all.

 Don't forget that there wil be 2 types of keyboard, one that is 3mm thicker and allows the key to be pressed down by 1.5mm (in common with laptop keyboards).

 

Microsoft do have a history of making decent keyboards.

post #172 of 210

Some thoughts on the iPad's file system:

 

Like others posting here, I believe that one of the major differences between a traditional pc and a post-pc iPad is the accessibility of the file system.

 

First, it is important to note that iOS has the same Unix file system as Mac OS with hierarchical folders, paths, symlinks, etc.   The difference is that iOS doesn't have a Finder equivalent -- so the file system is not visible or directly-accessable to the user.

 

There are both advantages and disadvantages, depending on your perspective -- simplicity vs flexibility...  To many, one of the biggest turn-offs of a traditional OS is the complexity of navigating the file system.

 

In an earlier post to this thread, I suggested "why should you care where a file is if you can easily access it?"

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

 

As to the FF (Fine Finder):  I believe that the basic constructs are in place to finally replace the Finder.  

 

Here's the big question -- why should you care where a file is stored -- as long as you can find it?  But being able to easily find a file should not require that you, the user remember the name, date, file type, application creator, etc.

 

...

 

A potential implementation exists using search, keywords, smart collections, metadata along with a database -- I illustrated how FCP X (Final Cut Pro X) uses this approach to manage files without the need for the user to understand and navigate the bowels of the OS X file system.

 

Like most here, I grew up with the file system and it is second nature to me -- to the extent that I often do unnecessary work... because I don't take full advantage of OS X capabilities such as searchlight and smart folders.

 

That same bad habit [the old tried and true method is better] has followed me to the iPad -- I don't take full advantage of what's available.

 

For example, on my iPad (and all our iDevices) we have access to over 16,000 songs stored on iCloud with iTunes Match.

 

iTunesScreenSnapz001.png

 

 

Now, if I want to find and play a song named "Lovey", the habitual way is to invoke the Music App, Select the "Songs" tab, type in the search field, select the song from the results displayed:

 

Lovey Music app.png

 

Typically, that would involve the following steps:

 

  1. press the home button to activate the home screen
  2. press the home button a second time to activate the Searchlight search
  3. type "music" into the search field to indicate the name of the app I want
  4. select the Music app from the displayed results to launch it
  5. select the "Songs" tab to denote that I want to find a song by title
  6. type "Lovey" into the search field to identify the song
  7. select the appropriate song from the results to play the song

 

Whew!

 

Now, breaking that old habit, instead I could:

 

Spotlight 3.png

 

  1. press the home button to activate the home screen
  2. press the home button a second time to activate the Searchlight search
  3. type "lovey" into the search field to indicate the file [song] I want to play
  4. tap the song I want from the results to launch the music app and play the song

 

Wow, I eliminated 3 steps out of 7!

 

 

But, Even better (on iOS 6) I can just press-hold the Home and tell Siri:

 

"Play Lovey by the Clovers"

 

Siri Lovey.PNG

 

Lovey, Where'd you get that crazy lookin' sweater?

Lovey, I never saw a sweater lookin' better!

Lovey, when you comin' off the shelf?

With your crazy way of walkin' 

You got me talkin' to myself!

 

Wow! One step instead of seven... and Siri misheard me but figured out what I meant...  

 

The only way I could do it in less steps...  If you could read my mind...

 

 

Edit: here's a little challenge for you 50s-60s music aficionados -- see if you can find the song, album or lyrics of the song "Lovey" by the clovers (or anyone)... It does exist as I have the album.  Hint: rhythm and blues.   The problem is there are songs with similar names: Lovey Dovey;  Love, Love, Love; Love Potion #9...

 

 

Let's delve a little deeper into the way you can find things on the iPad without access to the file systems:

 

 

Here, I've invoked a searchlight search for "Melwani" and I get the following results:

 

Sheena 1 spotlight.png

 

And

 

 

 

 

Sheena Spotlight 3.png

 

These are my friends Sheena and Dinesh Melwani.  Searchlight shows me every file*  that contains a reference to "Melwani".  This includes:

 

  • contacts
  • music songs
  • videos
  • calendar events
  • emails

 

If I tap on any selection it launches the app and displays (plays) the content.

 

* At this point in time, the metadata/content of every file type is not catalogued by iOS... Files from apps like Pages, text messages, etc.  But the basic structure is in place.

 

 

OK!

 

I experimented with Searchlight search for songs -- remember we have over 16,000 songs in iCloud...

 

I found that I could search for songs by: Title; Artist; Album; Genre...  even though I was not connected to the web.  I could find the songs, but could not play them -- that tells me that the index (database) exists on the iPad.

 

 

 If you explore what is already available on iOS devices and think ahead what is possible with some relatively minor enhancements...

 

It just may be that the RTFF (Replacement For The Fine Finder) is at hand for iOS devices...

 

It is interesting that Searchlight does a better job on the iPad -- maybe that's another iOS capability that will be migrated back to OS X.   Then, for many users, the current Fine Finder will be hidden and a tool of last resort.

 

Finally I asked Siri:

 

"Play a Polka"

 

Siri Polka.PNG

 

And, Siri got the pronunciation right:

 

"Lauterbach Medley Waltz" (Oh Where, Oh Where Has My Little Dog Gone) by:

 

"Whoopee John Wilfahrt"

 

Aw, c'mon. Whoopee John... it just doesn't get any better than this!

 

http://itunes.apple.com/us/album/the-whoopee-john-story/id278056318


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 4:08pm
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #173 of 210
Great post Mr. Applebaum.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #174 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

 


dos -- see if you can find the song, album or lyrics of the song "Lovey" by the clovers (or anyone)... It does exist as I have the album.  Hint: Rythym & Blues.   The problem is there I love somebody named Lovey are songs with similar names: Lovey Dovey;  Love, Love, Love; Love Potion #9...

courtesy of musiXmatch:

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/musixmatch-lyrics-+-player/id448278467?mt=8

 

I love somebody named Lovey

please don't tell anybody

Lovey has no money

or hope of a job

yeah, take a look at the room

that pearl is a slob

why oh why do I love Lovey?...

 

but by the Roches not the Clovers. Same song?


Edited by Gatorguy - 7/14/12 at 2:01pm
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post #175 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Great post Mr. Applebaum.

 

 

Of course!   This is my blog :)

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #176 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post


Of course!   This is my blog 1smile.gif

They need to get you a special section: Applebaum's Hour on AppleInsider.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #177 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

They need to get you a special section: Applebaum's Hour on AppleInsider.

The Last Bite

A special feature where our own Dick Applebaum clears up misconceptions and speaks his mind.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #178 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


The Last Bite
A special feature where our own Dick Applebaum clears up misconceptions and speaks his mind.

I've only recently become more cognizant of how deep Mr. Applebaum's industry roots go. I'm more impressed and amazed with each story he brings to the forum. He's one of the very few here that can add nuance to Apple news. 

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post #179 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


The Last Bite
A special feature where our own Dick Applebaum clears up misconceptions and speaks his mind.

 

A special feature where our own Dick Applebaum speaks misconceptions and clears up his mind  Emoji.png

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
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"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #180 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


They need to get you a special section: Applebaum's Hour on AppleInsider.

 

 

Or maybe just AppleBaumInsider...

 

I worked on a joint project with Apple some years back, and Pete Kavanaugh, the project leader insisted on writing my name as: AppleBaum

 

...keep those cards and letters coming... especially the ones with checks enclosed!

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #181 of 210

MS has finally published the specs for the Surface Pro... And it is PC+++

 

Here ya' go:

 

Surface←{↑1 ⍵∨.∧3 4=+/,¯1 0 1∘.⊖¯1 0 1∘.⌽⊂⍵}

 

 

And here's a closeup of the Surface kb layout:

 

union.png

 

 

...Sorry, I couldn't find an image of the Cyrillic version!

 

 

And a screen capture of the Surface Pro running Word:

 

WordToolbars.jpg


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 3:55pm
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #182 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post


An iPad using AirPlay.

... And what uses does a fairly low powered device have streaming images to multiple monitors?

 

it is less practical than using a desktop + streaming or a desktop + cables.

 

...

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply
post #183 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

... And what uses does a fairly low powered device have streaming images to multiple monitors?

 

it is less practical than using a desktop + streaming or a desktop + cables.

 

...

 

Oh, I can't thing of a single thing... Except:

 

  • giving a preso in the board room, classroom, etc.
  • several persons taking turns showing their solution to a class problem
  • people sharing their component of a collaborative effort
  • the convenience of showing results without going to another location/computer
  • a doctor showing a patient detail information/images on the large screen
  • a video editor  reviewing cuts/dailies with a group of director, AD, cast, crew
  • sharing home movies and slide shows with family and friends
  • giving a Keynote preso
  • demonstrating how to use an app on the tablet
  • display your or the client's stock portfolio and show live interaction
  • display this AI forum thread to the family -- we all had a good laugh at the Word display from post 184 -- and yes you can pinch zoom to see "Not much room down here"
  • display anything on this site, the web or any VNC computer for all to see

 

...Nah, I got nothing!


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 8:24pm
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post #184 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

...keep those cards and letters coming... especially the ones with checks enclosed!
✔✔
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

... And what uses does a fairly low powered device have streaming images to multiple monitors?

If you're unable to imagine a use for such a thing, I would imagine the feature is meaningless to you and should be of no concern, yes?

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #185 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Oh, I can't thing of a single thing... Except:
  • giving a preso in the board room, classroom, etc.
  • several persons taking turns showing their solution to a class problem
  • people sharing their component of a collaborative effort
  • the convenience of showing results without going to another location/computer
  • a doctor showing a patient detail information/images on the large screen
  • a video editor  reviewing cuts/dailies with a group of director, AD, cast, crew
  • sharing home movies and slide shows with family and friends
  • giving a Keynote preso
  • demonstrating how to use an app on the tablet
  • display your or the client's stock portfolio and show live interaction
  • display this AI forum thread to the family -- we all had a good laugh at the Word display from post 184 -- and yes you can pinch zoom to see "Not much room down here"
  • display anything on this site, the web or any VNC computer for all to see

...Nah, I got nothing!

I think I'm pretty awesome but sometimes you remind me why you're my hero.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #186 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

 

Oh, I can't thing of a single thing... Except:

 

  • giving a preso in the board room, classroom, etc.
  • several persons taking turns showing their solution to a class problem
  • people sharing their component of a collaborative effort
  • the convenience of showing results without going to another location/computer
  • a doctor showing a patient detail information/images on the large screen
  • a video editor  reviewing cuts/dailies with a group of director, AD, cast, crew
  • sharing home movies and slide shows with family and friends
  • giving a Keynote preso
  • demonstrating how to use an app on the tablet
  • display your or the client's stock portfolio and show live interaction
  • display this AI forum thread to the family -- we all had a good laugh at the Word display from post 184 -- and yes you can pinch zoom to see "Not much room down here"
  • display anything on this site, the web or any VNC computer for all to see

 

...Nah, I got nothing!

-the presentation which would be cheaper and more easily made on a notebook or desktop?

-yes, this makes sense, but that is multiple devices streaming to one screen, not what we are talking about

-um.... people do this via notebooks and pc's

-yes

-doctors do this.... with mounted computers.

-done via desktop just fine  currently.

-um, also done with desktops and notebooks just fine currently

-sure, but also doable with desktops and notebooks

-yeah.

-um.... done with notebooks and desktops

-i would say that is not a common reason

-um, the last part is that desktops and notebooks do that.

 

 

Oh, and you have to buy monitors that support airplay....

 

The ability may have its uses, but the vast majority are done by notebooks and desktops with the same efficiency (or more), less data flowing through the air and cheaper.

 

So yes, they could replace and do a worse job than desktops.... i guess i should restate my point:

 

What kind the low powered device streaming to MULTIPLE MONITORS (that means two or more you realize!!) do more effectively than a notebook or desktop can do?  

the answer is very few things.

 

 

 

As my sig now reads, i do have troubles getting my ideas all out of my head, so these kinds of things help me! thanks whether you meant to or not :)!! :D 

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply
post #187 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

-the presentation which would be cheaper and more easily made on a notebook or desktop?

Doubtfully.
Quote:
-um…. people do this via notebooks and pc's

Welcome to last century.
Quote:
-doctors do this.... with mounted computers.

They prefer iPads.
Quote:
-done via desktop just fine  currently.
-um, also done with desktops and notebooks just fine currently
-sure, but also doable with desktops and notebooks

And I'm certain the use of mercury thermometers and asbestos blankets was 'just fine', as well. And not as easily.
Quote:
Oh, and you have to buy monitors that support airplay....

So as long as you don't buy one that doesn't have a VGA, DVI, or HDMI port, nor a port that can be reached via an adapter for the three aforementioned, you're fine.

I'm saying that any monitor on Earth save pre-RBY televisions will do it.
Quote:
… done by notebooks and desktops with the same efficiency (or more), less data flowing through the air and cheaper.

How? And how is a mobile device supposed to be "less practical" than a desktop with… cables… lol.gif

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already fucked.

 

Reply
post #188 of 210

Dear Mr. Ballmer,

 

Just by shorting MSFT whenever it has traded consistently above $30 for a few sessions (using a channeling strategy), I have been able to pay for the iMac that I bought last November. Thanks. I haven't quite covered the cost of the matching Thunderbolt display yet though. So please keep up the "good work." Why not plan another iPhone funeral? Or better yet, guarantee the market that you're going to sell more of those Surfboard tablets in 1 month than Apple sold iPads in 12 months.

 

Steve, u da man! Don't let anybody tell you any different. Microsoft is lucky to have you. Now go out there and say something. Anything!

If two people always agree, then one of them is redundant.
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If two people always agree, then one of them is redundant.
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post #189 of 210
Removed... duplicate duplicate... Apparently AI needs a file system!

Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 10:45pm
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #190 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag_Warrior View Post

Dear Mr. Ballmer,

 

Just by shorting MSFT whenever it has traded consistently above $30 for a few sessions (using a channeling strategy), I have been able to pay for the iMac that I bought last November. Thanks. I haven't quite covered the cost of the matching Thunderbolt display yet though. So please keep up the "good work." Why not plan another iPhone funeral? Or better yet, guarantee the market that you're going to sell more of those Surfboard tablets in 1 month than Apple sold iPads in 12 months.

 

Steve, u da man! Don't let anybody tell you any different. Microsoft is lucky to have you. Now go out there and say something. Anything!

 

Ballmer and MS management are so out of touch that they think that "grape nuts" is an STD.

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #191 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

-the presentation which would be cheaper and more easily made on a notebook or desktop?

-yes, this makes sense, but that is multiple devices streaming to one screen, not what we are talking about

-um.... people do this via notebooks and pc's

-yes

-doctors do this.... with mounted computers.

-done via desktop just fine  currently.

-um, also done with desktops and notebooks just fine currently

-sure, but also doable with desktops and notebooks

-yeah.

-um.... done with notebooks and desktops

-i would say that is not a common reason

-um, the last part is that desktops and notebooks do that.

 

 

Oh, and you have to buy monitors that support airplay....

 

The ability may have its uses, but the vast majority are done by notebooks and desktops with the same efficiency (or more), less data flowing through the air and cheaper.

 

So yes, they could replace and do a worse job than desktops.... i guess i should restate my point:

 

What kind the low powered device streaming to MULTIPLE MONITORS (that means two or more you realize!!) do more effectively than a notebook or desktop can do?  

the answer is very few things.

 

 

 

As my sig now reads, i do have troubles getting my ideas all out of my head, so these kinds of things help me! thanks whether you meant to or not :)!! :D 

 

First, I understand the implications of your sig... believe me I've been there & go back to visit quite often.

 

But I don't quite know how to understand and respond to your post...

 

Second, I have sold/installed computer networks in corporate boardrooms as far back as 1982...

 

Third, you seem to think that the way we did it yesterday (and the way many do it now) is the best way... because "That's how it is done".

 

 

Instead of responding point by point -- let me give you a scenario:

 

There is a corporate board meeting where the 5 Senior VPs will each give a short preso on how their groups are progressing on the new product under development...

 

The boardroom has an HDTV, a $280 Airport Extreme WiFi router, a $100 Apple TV and a $50 HDMI cable.

 

The CEO and 5 SVPs enter the room and are seated...  after some small talk each SVP, in turn makes his preso:

 

  1. he picks up his iPad
  2. he swipes to unlock
  3. he double clicks the Home button to activate the task bar
  4. he swipes right to access AirPlay
  5. he taps the icon to invoke AirPlay
  6. he taps the Boardroom AppleTV list item to select it
  7. he turns on Screen Mirroring (if desired) -- his iPad screen is mirrored on the HDTV
  8. he swipes left to reveal the task bar showing his suspended app (he is prepared)
  9. he taps the app to launch it
  10. he gives his preso

 

This all takes less time (about 5 seconds) than it takes to describe

 

 

Each SVP, in turn repeats the process... there us no waiting for boot, switching batteries, pugging in accessories/dongles/thumb drives, attaching chargers or power buses...

 

It is Wham, Bam... Thank you Sam!

 

During any of the presos, the SVP can surf the web, invoke a SS with charts, show the current stock prices, access corporate data via VNC, play a promotional video -- he can even [demo how to] edit a movie....

 

But, most of the time, they'll just give their prepared presos.

 

 

So you are telling us you can do a better/cheaper job with traditional PCs, cables, power busses, ad hoc connections, and all the baggage that goes with it.

 

 

Let's say the 5 SVPs each have $700 (top of the line WiFi iPads).  With another $700 iPad for the CEO, our total one-time cost is under $5,000... Hell, any first-level manager can authorize a $5,000 expenditure without any [upper] management approval!

 

 

Show us how you can do it cheaper, better and easier -- using any hardware/software you choose!

 

 

This example was a boardroom, it could just as as easily have been:  a classroom, training room, cafeteria, auditorium pre-op room...


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 10:49pm
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
post #192 of 210
Removed, duplicate... AI's magical forum autoposter...

Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/14/12 at 10:47pm
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #193 of 210

I think its simple, microsoft are scared, they have a high market share for computer OS installs, if they admit that there is a post pc era, then their days are numbered (because they might think everyone will ditch PCs for phones & tablets), in their simple minds, they think that post pc means its us or them, you either have a pc or a tablet, not both.
thats what i think microsoft is so stubborn about this.
 

As far as i can see, for a while yet, im still going to need a computer, i have an iPad but my iPad cant take over for all the dutes my computers have.

post #194 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Fix View Post

I do like Microsoft's incorporation of a PC based processor into their Surface which will run PC software and have usable USB ports.  In my business, this is a better and more useful direction for a tablet, showing that the iPad is really just for games and internet access and not work.  I see a place for both.

The market for a desktop OS on a tablet is called a niche. Don't take my word for it, examine the history of Microsoft TabletPCs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GadgetCanada View Post

If Apple got serious and produced a real Office Suite comparable to MS Office (iWork doesn't count) but lean, mean and full of features, Microsoft would be screwed.
If I was a Microsoft investor, I would be seriously concerned. Don't let MS turn into RIM.

I don't think it makes sense for Apple to try to compete with Microsoft on Office suites. They usually don't try to compete head-on like that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfiejr View Post

the best thing about this debate is that the answer will be decided in the marektplace over the next year. and we'll actually see who was right/wrong.

There is already a track record in the market. To discount the track record, the Surface Pro proponents need to explain what's different this time over the previous incarnations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post


i think the real way you can cut it would be "all purpose PC's" and "entertainment PC's" 1smile.gif   This gives you two distinct graphs, "older" versions of PC's and "newer" versions of PC's.

That's going to be a fuzzy distinction, and too prone to biases. The definitions need to be clearer than that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

Oh and here's another Lenovo lt that the Apple haters swear up and down looks nothing like a Mac.

Why is it so hard for people to admit that a lot of PC laptops/Ultrabooks take their design cues from the MacBook Pro/Air these days? It's so obvious. And has nothing to do with whether Apple invented something or not (i.e. wedge shape, chicklit keyboard), it's about the finished product, all th design components put together.

I don't think they want to admit that Apple is shaping the future of technology and design, and that their favorite companies are but followers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maestro64 View Post

oh course they see it that way, so did IBM when the PC come onto the stage, they though the PC would be an extension to the Mainframe and they would never disappeared, I know many of you have no clue what a Mainframe is, and you kids in 20 years will no idea what a PC is either.

Did the public really understand what a mainframe was? At best, the popular understanding was just a big computer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendergast View Post

As mentioned, Jobs' analogy of cars and trucks makes the most sense. 

Traditional PCs = pickups
Tablets/Smartphones = sedans

I suppose laptops, who although predate tablets actually seem like a tweener category between PCs and Tablets, are analogous to crossover vehicles, SUVs, etc.

I dislike vehicular analogies, they're cliché and I don't think they communicate the point very well. Also, it invites comparisons to when people mocked a certain politician for saying the "Internet isn't a dump truck". Why shouldn't the same amount of derision be used on individuals that suggest a laptop is a truck?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fyngyrz View Post

Microsoft has it right: As tablets power up, they're destined to become more powerful, support more interfaces, like IR, radio, USB, optical, memory, etc. They'll move towards PCs. The closer they get, the more they can do, the better I'll like them.

Just as a reminder that you did mention optical as a must-have feature.

I'll point down that technically, tablets are "powered" down. I think you're forgetting the multiple TabletPC flops. They provided all the features you requested and that couldn't save them.

How many times have you used IR on a computer?

What kind of radio are you talking about there? AM/FM? Cellular? iPads have, Bluetooth, WiFi and optional cellular radios. Radio stations stream on the internet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

so, I am and was talking with my friend, i have a summary of what we were saying.

-it was a brutal in beginning, made himself use ipad 2 as main device to consume device
-when he did it they lacked some tech like online (aka remote simulation screened to tablet)
-cumbersome to do any word/excel/etc related work
-many websites were still not optimized for tablet
-he could survive on it for 4-5 months, didn't miss anything apart from intensive gaming.
-but believes that any tablet device is a very good compliment to desktop or laptop, but it will never replace a primary device no matter how good apps (things that replicate desktop experience)
-because restraints on screen size AND ways of impute (swype would have made it better, it is on android)
-had to use portable keyboard which worked as a stand
-can do 60% of his work on ipad vs. tablet, but could not replace completely
-streaming speeds slow compared to desktop + buffer less
-cannot not do multiple things at once (Seeing multiple programs at once)
-works as: investment background, was being mentored by men from two different multinational companies which both were financial firms

I think he's in the 10% that other people mention. I am as well. I don't think it makes sense to complain that a device doesn't fit your needs when it wasn't designed to fit your needs.

The point remains that iPads fill the needs of most people, and will continue to fill the needs a wider variety of people as apps and peripherals are available. The IBM PC didn't meet a lot of needs either, an ecosystem developed around it, and it took a decade to be accepted by consumers.
post #195 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


The market for a desktop OS on a tablet is called a niche. Don't take my word for it, examine the history of Microsoft TabletPCs.
 

The earlier tablet devices were hampered by the hardware available at the time. They tended to be cumbersome, expensive and under promoted. In the main they were aimed at those that wanted the ability to use a stylus for annotations. The fact that windows was not optimized for fingers didn't help.

 

Perhaps one of the biggest obstacles was the limited, or painfully slow internet access. Had the iPad been released in 2005 it may well have flopped.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post


I don't think they want to admit that Apple is shaping the future of technology and design, and that their favorite companies are but followers.
 

So who did Amtek copy in 2007 with their capacitive touch screen iTablet?

 

2007itablet.jpg

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

The point remains that iPads fill the needs of most people, and will continue to fill the needs a wider variety of people as apps and peripherals are available.  

Perhaps, but as time passes the consumer will demand more. Look how many iPhone owners honestly believe that the 2007 iphone was the first smart phone. For those people the move from a feature phone to the iphone was liberating and they had no need to want more because they knew no better. I for one miss some of the features that I had years ago; IR TV remote control, OBEX BT, a file structure, BT DUN, pixel perfect drawing, the ability to use my PC to control my phone and so on. I may well be one of the 10%ers that you refer to but to suggest that the iPad fufills the needs of the 90% is flawed. Those people might not know what their needs are just yet.

 

Personally I see the whole "post PC" "PC plus" thing as little more than marketing hype.

post #196 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by hungover View Post

Perhaps one of the biggest obstacles was the limited, or painfully slow internet access. Had the iPad been released in 2005 it may well have flopped.
Which is why a smart company will choose when and how to launch a product so it makes the proper impact on the market nstead of just bringing to market something with the lowest level of completion just so they can claim "First!"

Quote:
So who did Amtek copy in 2007 with their capacitive touch screen iTablet?

LL

1) That had a resistive touchscreen. It wasn't until mid-2010, after the iPad was launched did they have a capacitive touchscreen version... to demo.

2) It cost $2,200 which means it was likely doomed from the start.

3) It was low-end PC hardware running Windows. This was nothing new. Don't think because its name is iTablet that Apple copied a damn thing from this 2 decade old, failed tablet model.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #197 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

First, I understand the implications of your sig... believe me I've been there & go back to visit quite often.

 

But I don't quite know how to understand and respond to your post...

 

Second, I have sold/installed computer networks in corporate boardrooms as far back as 1982...

 

Third, you seem to think that the way we did it yesterday (and the way many do it now) is the best way... because "That's how it is done".

 

 

Instead of responding point by point -- let me give you a scenario:

 

There is a corporate board meeting where the 5 Senior VPs will each give a short preso on how their groups are progressing on the new product under development...

 

The boardroom has an HDTV, a $280 Airport Extreme WiFi router, a $100 Apple TV and a $50 HDMI cable.

 

The CEO and 5 SVPs enter the room and are seated...  after some small talk each SVP, in turn makes his preso:

 

  1. he picks up his iPad
  2. he swipes to unlock
  3. he double clicks the Home button to activate the task bar
  4. he swipes right to access AirPlay
  5. he taps the icon to invoke AirPlay
  6. he taps the Boardroom AppleTV list item to select it
  7. he turns on Screen Mirroring (if desired) -- his iPad screen is mirrored on the HDTV
  8. he swipes left to reveal the task bar showing his suspended app (he is prepared)
  9. he taps the app to launch it
  10. he gives his preso

 

This all takes less time (about 5 seconds) than it takes to describe

 

 

Each SVP, in turn repeats the process... there us no waiting for boot, switching batteries, pugging in accessories/dongles/thumb drives, attaching chargers or power buses...

 

It is Wham, Bam... Thank you Sam!

 

During any of the presos, the SVP can surf the web, invoke a SS with charts, show the current stock prices, access corporate data via VNC, play a promotional video -- he can even [demo how to] edit a movie....

 

But, most of the time, they'll just give their prepared presos.

 

 

So you are telling us you can do a better/cheaper job with traditional PCs, cables, power busses, ad hoc connections, and all the baggage that goes with it.

 

 

Let's say the 5 SVPs each have $700 (top of the line WiFi iPads).  With another $700 iPad for the CEO, our total one-time cost is under $5,000... Hell, any first-level manager can authorize a $5,000 expenditure without any [upper] management approval!

 

 

Show us how you can do it cheaper, better and easier -- using any hardware/software you choose!

 

 

This example was a boardroom, it could just as as easily have been:  a classroom, training room, cafeteria, auditorium pre-op room...

all right.  you get 100 dollar PC with 6 monitors (estimated 200 each) so 2200.

you get a projector + cloth.... estimated price 1-1.5k

you have all (up to 6) sign into virtual machines and just switch the monitor input.

you open documents whatever you need.  you turn on projector and have it display VM 1, than VM 2, etc.

 

 

OR

instead of having that projector,one everyone is ready you have VM1 duplicate what it sees onto all screen, once that is done have VM 2 do it, etc, etc.]

not sure what the software would cost to do it super fast, but if you can wait a minute or two inbetween each persons presintation than it can be done for under $50 a person.

 

so yes, i believe i can do it cheaper. As long as you have 6 or less people that is, but you can add another computer + moniters for each other set of people.. which does start taking dramatically more space.

however, depending on what kind of biz the people worked at iPad's could be much better for everyday use, or completely worthless for doing work.  So i think which solution wins depends on that.

 

also, depending on what other work they want to do in that meeting each solution can have varying degrees of usefulness.

 

also sorry for spelling, i usually look up correct spellings if words say they are spelled incorrectly, just Apple insider doesn't let me do it via right click...

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply

PC means personal computer.  

i have processing issues, mostly trying to get my ideas into speech and text.

if i say something confusing please tell me!

Reply
post #198 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


1) That had a resistive touchscreen. It wasn't until mid-2010, after the iPad was launched did they have a capacitive touchscreen version... to demo.
2) It cost $2,200 which means it was likely doomed from the start.
3) It was low-end PC hardware running Windows. This was nothing new. Don't think because its name is iTablet that Apple copied a damn thing from this 2 decade old, failed tablet model.

1. According to Engadget it was available as capacitive or digitizer. (in 2007 and not 2010)

 

http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/10/hands-on-with-amteks-itablet-t221/

 

2. yes it was expensive, so...

 

3. Low end hardware? Intel Core 2 Duo and 2GB ram- erm... what were the specs for the MBPs in 2007. I don't understand the end of your post, "2 decade old"???  I was merely trying to point out that the overall shape/look of the iPad is not as revolutionary as many would suggest. I am not saying that Apple copied anyone, just pointing out that two different developers can come up with similar looking items without prior knowledge of the other.

post #199 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

...

The point remains that iPads fill the needs of most people, and will continue to fill the needs a wider variety of people as apps and peripherals are available. The IBM PC didn't meet a lot of needs either, an ecosystem developed around it, and it took a decade to be accepted by consumers.

 

Excellent post, @JeffDM... I want to expand on your last point...

 

The IBM/PC and Windows pretty-much defined the pc era.  One way to look at the pc era is the attributes, or style of the supporting ecosystem:

 

The pc era started as one of (stay with me now):

 

  • a [relatively] expensive computer
  • using a [relatively] expensive OS
  • using [relatively] expensive peripherals (printers, scanners, mass storage HDDs, etc)
  • running [relatively] expensive applications

 

Each computer had it's own copy of stuff (hardware, OS, peripherals, applications).  Due to competition and technology the costs of some of these things became much less expensive.  Networking (even sneaker net) reduced the overall cost of the more expensive components because it allowed them to be shared, concurrently,  among several users.

 

Technology breakthroughs happened frequently and this usually involved replacement or upgrading the various components of the user's ecosystem.  One of the key incentives [offered by the manufacturers] to upgrading/replacing hardware and software was to support backward compatibility -- your investment in [relatively] expensive OS, Peripherals, and applications was protected.

 

But, "Sharing" and "Backward Compatibility" were antithetical to the business plans of the manufacturers -- the users could share their components and could continue to run older versions.

 

 

"Backward compatibility" was a problem for the software manufacturers (OS and Applications, alike).   The manufacturers needed to entice the users to buy the latest version, rather than continuing to run "last year's" version.  The main way the manufacturers addressed this was to increase speed, power, usability and features... The easiest way to entice the user to buy/upgrade was to add new features while maintaining backward compatibility...  This has resulted in the Feature Bloat and Legacy Baggage!  As an example of this, consider that Word and Excel ran quite nicely (thank you) on a 128 KB RAM Mac with 2 400 KB MicroFloppy drives.

 

"Sharing"  is especially significant for software manufacturers (OS and Applications, alike).  In its pure form, software, like money, is fungible -- it can run anywhere... On Bill's computer, or on Sarah's computer, or on Sam's computer... The big problem (for the manufacturers) came when one copy software was running On Bill's computer, and on Sarah's computer, and on Sam's computer...  The way the software manufacturers addressed this was with dongles, activation codes, authorization disks, call home authorization...   Or, in the case of MS, they sold the basic Windows OS directly to the computer manufacturers -- so it was factory installed on each computer.  To flesh out its business plan, MS arbitrarily divided its OS into several "versions" (home, office, pro, misogynist... whatever) and charged individuals for the upgrade to get the features they really needed...  To protect this lucrative "version upgrade" business MS had to address the copy protection devices mentioned above.

 

That's pretty much the way the pc era has evolved to where we are today.

 

 

So, enter the post-pc era:

 

  • relatively inexpensive hardware
  • very inexpensive software
  • instant gratification in use (instant on) and software -- just download and go
  • mobility -- take your stuff along with you
  • lean and mean -- just grab your device and go (no cables, accessories, DVDs, dongles...)

 

One problem for hardware manufacturers (and for MS) is that they can no longer afford to pay MS for a lobotomized OS to preinstall on their hardware -- and for MS to charge users to upgrade... That business model is broken, especially when Apple, who defines post-pc, offers its OS free, with free upgrades to all.

 

Then there's the issues of "backward compatibility" and "legacy baggage" -- these are are in direct opposition to the "instant gratification" and "lean and mean" attributes of post-pc devices...

 

Even if you could run Full PhotoShop, Full AutoCad, Full Office on a [post-pc] tablet like an iPad... Would you want to?  Are you willing to pay the price?

 

Next, is the issue of price... how do you repackage an app like Office so it works acceptably on a tablet and competes:  features, compatibility price... especially price. Apple has defined the threshold here, with a set of features, compatibility and a price of $10 for each component of their office suite.  If MS wants to compete, they can offer more features, more compatibility and charge a premium price (say, $10-$20 per component).

 

Finally, "Sharing" is the real killer (on the consumer side).  If you buy all the iWork components (Pages, Numbers, Keynote) you pay $30 for a single copy that, by design, is meant to be shared on all your devices.  MS has no real answer for this other than to charge/require the manufacturers to pre-install Office on every device -- or to make the devices themself.

 

 

These issues also affect other software manufacturers like Adobe, Avid, Autodesk -- and they are beginning to offer subset, sharable apps for the tablets (at least for the iPad).

 

 

Now, here's the dagger direct to the heart of MS (and, to a lesser extent. other major software manufactures)...

 

The low-price and unlimited sharing attributes are filtering back into the pc era devices.  For consumers, OS X Mountain Lion will cost $19 (no home, pro, etc. deviants)... and a single copy is sharable on all the computers you own.  The same is true of iWork... and even Apple's top of the line Pro and ProSumer OS X application, FCP X -- Final Cut Pro X.

 

Earlier versions of Final cut were priced in the thousands of dollars and were non-sharable.  A copy of FCP X costs $300 and is sharable on every Mac you own.

 

 

To my mind this is one of the major characteristics of the post-pc era... like it or not, Apple has redefined how software will be built, priced, marketed, distributed and used.

 

 

Like those two innocents in the Garden of Eden -- having tasted the Apple, we can't go back!

 

 

It is for the likes of MS to adapt or die!

 

 

I'm done!

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
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"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
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post #200 of 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolbolas View Post

all right.  you get 100 dollar PC with 6 monitors (estimated 200 each) so 2200.

you get a projector + cloth.... estimated price 1-1.5k

you have all (up to 6) sign into virtual machines and just switch the monitor input.

you open documents whatever you need.  you turn on projector and have it display VM 1, than VM 2, etc.

 

 

OR

instead of having that projector,one everyone is ready you have VM1 duplicate what it sees onto all screen, once that is done have VM 2 do it, etc, etc.]

not sure what the software would cost to do it super fast, but if you can wait a minute or two inbetween each persons presintation than it can be done for under $50 a person.

 

so yes, i believe i can do it cheaper. As long as you have 6 or less people that is, but you can add another computer + moniters for each other set of people.. which does start taking dramatically more space.

however, depending on what kind of biz the people worked at iPad's could be much better for everyday use, or completely worthless for doing work.  So i think which solution wins depends on that.

 

also, depending on what other work they want to do in that meeting each solution can have varying degrees of usefulness.

 

also sorry for spelling, i usually look up correct spellings if words say they are spelled incorrectly, just Apple insider doesn't let me do it via right click...

 

Is that what you are talking about?  Not to demean, but we did that in the 1980s with Apple ][s on a Corvus LAN sharing networked HDDs, printers, etc.

 

I am serious... we installed our first LAN in June of 1980 at Saratoga HS, Saratoga, CA.  My daughter attended Saratoga HS -- as did Gene Carter's daughter... Gene was the VP of Marketing at Apple.  Marion Kenworthy was the no-nonsense SHS Vice Principal who spearheaded and managed the project... and she was quite familiar with Gene's and my daughters.

 

Seven Apple ][s with monitors (no other peripherals) connected in a star network.  The Teacher's Apple ][ had 2 floppies.  The network contained a shared HDD (5 MB) and a shared Centronics printer.  The teacher could display the content of his computer on every screen (for demonstrations and instruction) -- or allow the sharing of any students computer on any on all the screens (for problem or solution presentation).  

 

 

Again, not to demean, but for your solution, you have to have:

 

  • a room that is already setup with dedicated hardware (that is likely not cost effective because it is infrequently used)
  • or bring the the hardware, cables, peripherals, etc. and setup the room each time it is used (removing computer capability from the original source)
  • bring your content to the meeting and install it on the installed hardware/peripherals
  • do a dry run-through to make sure [see if] anything works

 

 

In my solution, the room has a $249 AirPort Extreme, a $100 Apple TV, a $50 HDMI cable and an HDTV (large enough for all to see).

 

Each person brings his iPad containing his content (no wires, cables, peripherals, cross-loading content, dry runs, etc.).

 

Each person, in turn, connects (via WiFi/AirPlay) to the HDTV -- it takes about 5 seconds to switch among presenters.

 

 

There is no need to display the same content on each iPad -- though there are ways of doing that too.

 

 

I have attended and made presentations in the environment you describe -- generally the time was spent:

 

  • 20% getting initially setup
  • 10% delays, work-arounds reacting to problems
  • 50% actual presentation
  • 20% teardown and afterglow -- discussing what they should have done

 

(that was on a good day)

 

If I was attending, I was the guy in the back of the room taking my watch apart!

 

 

Edit: If circumstances require that you use "regular computers" instead of iPads, you can do that too (Officially, later this month):

 

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/12/07/14/inside_os_x_108_mountain_lion_gm_airplay_mirroring.html

 

Inside OS X 10.8 Mountain Lion GM: AirPlay Mirroring

Mac airplay-120216-1.jpg

 

Quote:
"also sorry for spelling, i usually look up correct spellings if words say they are spelled incorrectly, just Apple insider doesn't let me do it via right click..."

 

We are in wholehearted agreement!


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 7/15/12 at 9:49am
"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

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"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

"The perfect [birth]day -- A little playtime, a good poop, and a long nap." - Tomato Greeting Cards -
Reply
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