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Nokia halves price of Lumia 900 as Windows Phone struggles persist

post #1 of 112
Thread Starter 
Nokia has cut in half the price of its flagship Lumia 900 smartphone, a device won't run Microsoft's forthcoming Windows Phone 8 platform refresh.

The Finnish handset maker is attempting to spur sales of the Lumia 900 in the wake of Microsoft's announcement that Windows Phone 8, set to launch this fall, will not run on legacy devices. With a new two-year contract, the Lumia 900 can now be bought for just $49.99, down from its original $99.99 price tag.

Shares in Nokia fell over 3 percent on Monday, as noted by Reuters, as investors are concerned that the price cut on the Lumia 900 is a "sign of desperation" as Nokia struggles to compete with Apple's iPhone and Samsung's Android-based handsets.

Nokia's flagship phone took a major blow last month, when it was revealed that the Lumia 900 won't be upgradeable to Microsoft's Windows Phone 8 platform. Instead, Microsoft plans to offer an update in the form of Windows Phone 7.8 that will add some of the Windows Phone 8 features to the legacy platform, such as an updated Start screen with customizable tile sizes.

Nokia has bet heavily on the Windows Phone platform in transition away from its own Symbian operating system. The company was once dominant in the smartphone market, but failed to respond as the iPhone and Google's Android took over.

Lumia 900


Last month, Nokia also announced plans to ax 10,000 jobs by the end of 2013 in an effort to cut costs and turn the company around. The company's credit rating is also labeled junk by all three major credit rating agencies.
post #2 of 112
Well, that's better than some Android phones.

Lumia 900 is half price three months after launch while I've seen Android phones for $1 on contract three months after launch.

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post #3 of 112

paddles! clear!

post #4 of 112

Death.  Spiral.

 

It'll be interesting to see who goes tits up first - Nokia or RIM...

 

I'm betting on Nokia.  RIM at least has their service business to bring in some revenue - their message network.  Nokia's got nothing much apart from their now-worthless phones.

post #5 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Well, that's better than some Android phones.
Lumia 900 is half price three months after launch while I've seen Android phones for $1 on contract three months after launch.
Galaxy S3 is already buy one get one free!
post #6 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

Galaxy S3 is already buy one get one free!

Is it? Oh dear, that's a problem.

And they say that Android phones are MORE expensive than iPhones, and "people still want them more". lol.gif

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post #7 of 112

Another one bites the dust

Another one bites the dust

And another one gone, and another one gone....

 

Somehow, a song popped into my head. Sorry.lol.gif

post #8 of 112

But it's not half price is it as far as Nokia is concerned. It was $400 before subsidy and now it's $350.

This is the kind of price reduction you would expect from any manufacturer except Apple (who just takes increased profit rather than try to generate more sales from lower prices). It is hardly a comparably bad sign for Nokia as most of the other harbingers of poor sales and being Osborned by Ballmer.

post #9 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capnbob View Post

But it's not half price is it as far as Nokia is concerned. It was $400 before subsidy and now it's $350.
This is the kind of price reduction you would expect from any manufacturer except Apple (who just takes increased profit rather than try to generate more sales from lower prices). It is hardly a comparably bad sign for Nokia as most of the other harbingers of poor sales and being Osborned by Ballmer.

Exactly. It's probably closer to a 10-15% price cut from Nokia. Hardly a disaster.

For comparison, Apple released the iPhone at $600 without subsidies. It was only later that they introduced a $199 phone without subsidies. Would it have been accurate at the time to say that Apple's iPhone was doomed because they had to cut the price by 2/3? Obviously not.

Besides, Nokia has a challenge. The current Nokia will not be upgradeable. While that's OK in Android-ville, most people prefer the ability to upgrade their phones - which means this phone has a disadvantage and a price cut is not unreasonable.
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post #10 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunspot42 View Post

Death.  Spiral.

 

It'll be interesting to see who goes tits up first - Nokia or RIM...

 

I'm betting on Nokia.  RIM at least has their service business to bring in some revenue - their message network.  Nokia's got nothing much apart from their now-worthless phones.

 

You me both, shorting NOK:ADR pretty hard, smiling like its christmas :D

At least RIM has their own platform, revenue stream as you said, etc. Licensing out the BB platform is something I'm really hopping for, its too much iOS vs Android now days, it would be nice to have someone else in there fighting... (No, MS is to pathetic to count as fighting, they are like a turtle laying on its back)

post #11 of 112

Microsoft never answered the question of why anyone should buy a Windows phone instead of an iPhone or Android.  They're in for similar struggles when their tablets come out regardless of whose name is on the hardware.  The tablet situation could be worse once people try running actual Windows apps on a Surface only to realize their Windows apps were never designed for a touchscreen.  It's better to have someone think "It's great...  if only it had more apps" rather than "It sucks at what it's supposed to be able to do."

post #12 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunspot42 View Post

Death.  Spiral.

 

It'll be interesting to see who goes tits up first - Nokia or RIM...

 

I'm betting on Nokia.  RIM at least has their service business to bring in some revenue - their message network.  Nokia's got nothing much apart from their now-worthless phones.

 

If that device ran iOS, you'd be singing a different tune. That phone is gorgeous. Microsoft just sucks at marketing and partnering. It's like they can't figure out how NOT to stab the competition to death, even when it's the guys on their own team. 

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post #13 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Exactly. It's probably closer to a 10-15% price cut from Nokia. Hardly a disaster.
For comparison, Apple released the iPhone at $600 without subsidies. It was only later that they introduced a $199 phone without subsidies. Would it have been accurate at the time to say that Apple's iPhone was doomed because they had to cut the price by 2/3? Obviously not.
Besides, Nokia has a challenge. The current Nokia will not be upgradeable. While that's OK in Android-ville, most people prefer the ability to upgrade their phones - which means this phone has a disadvantage and a price cut is not unreasonable.

 

That analogy doesn't work because Apple didn't have competition from other modern smartphones when the iPhone was launched.  They introduced a whole new category of device.

post #14 of 112

Nokia: sleep with dogs, wake up with fleas. 

 

Good thing Win8 will save them. (rolls eyes)

post #15 of 112

Really guys?

Hop in the wayback machine to 2007 when the iPhone came out. It hardly made a dent in the mobile sphere and it wasn't until the 3G that it took off. Here we are 5 years later. And Success! Agreed!

 

But if I put an iPhone in your hands in 2006 what would your reaction be?   :\
Back then Motorola ruled the world, and it's phones sever pretty awesome. Remember the RAZR?

 

My point is, the Nokia Lumia 900 isn't even 6 months old... and fighting it's way up into the market.

 

Simply dimissing it as stupid, as dying, as Microsoft sucks - is moronic. There's A LOT of ex-iPhone users using the Nokia Lumia - including me... because it's literally a better OS. No crashes, buttery smooth. And per Steve Wozniak - it's like Steve Job got reincarnated at Microsoft.

 

And why the hell would Steve Wozniak say that? Because it's that good of a phone/OS.

 

Step away from the punch gentlemen. Apple NEEDS competition. Apple only makes a great iPad/iPhone NOW because 10 years ago, APPLE was the underdog.

 

Why is Apple making a 4" phone? Why is Apple making a 7" tablet? Why is Apple making an HDTV?

Because COMPETITION is making them offer it. Sure Amazon maybe sold 6 Million Kindles, but that's 6 million less iPads. Sure Samsung may suck with their 4" phones, but they sell as many phones as Apple does.

 

Don't root for companies who are innovating and hungry to die gentlemen.
If they succeed and compete, it allows Apple to give you better products.

 

Or are you guys really that much into mediocrity with your 5 year-old OS?

 

 

 
 
post #16 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Exactly. It's probably closer to a 10-15% price cut from Nokia. Hardly a disaster.
For comparison, Apple released the iPhone at $600 without subsidies. It was only later that they introduced a $199 phone without subsidies. Would it have been accurate at the time to say that Apple's iPhone was doomed because they had to cut the price by 2/3? Obviously not.
Besides, Nokia has a challenge. The current Nokia will not be upgradeable. While that's OK in Android-ville, most people prefer the ability to upgrade their phones - which means this phone has a disadvantage and a price cut is not unreasonable.

 

Most people prefer to upgrade their phones? What makes you say that. Very few people outside the iPhone base seem to. Very few in Android-ville as you term it. But Android-ville is most people!

 

But agree with your first point. Very misleading headlining "halves price".

post #17 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffreytgilbert View Post

 

If that device ran iOS, you'd be singing a different tune.

 

 

And if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon.  Sadly, it doesn't, so I'm not.

post #18 of 112

Can you install iOS6 on iPhone 1 or 2? Can you install Icecream on G1 etc? The answer is NO! There is always a limit on upgrading, and that is true for every device or laptop etc. WTF?

post #19 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

Why is Apple making a 4" phone? Why is Apple making a 7" tablet? Why is Apple making an HDTV?

{citation needed}

Why would you think they're actually making an HDTV? People have been saying that for almost ten years.

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post #20 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by quinney View Post

paddles! clear!

LOL. No one ever got fired recommending Microsoft. Not yet. Stephen Elop still has a job.
Windows CE (later renamed Windows Mobile) was supposed to be a clean, portable (and already ported to ARM) version of Windows without the legacy DOS crap. Now Microsoft has dumped this supposedly clean and legacy-free version of Windows with some new version of legacy Windows that's ditched the legacy stuff (like DOS, x86, and desktop) and ported to ARM. It's like they re-created Windows CE/Windows Mobile with Windows Phone 8 and RT. Only without compatibility with any of those operating systems or legacy Windows. Nokia signed up for Microsoft chaos.

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post #21 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffreytgilbert View Post

If that device ran iOS, you'd be singing a different tune. That phone is gorgeous. Microsoft just sucks at marketing and partnering. It's like they can't figure out how NOT to stab the competition to death, even when it's the guys on their own team. 
I don't think it was a marketing issue. The Lumina was HEAVILY marketed by Microsoft, Nokia, and Carriers. Even registered as "best phone" on Siri/Wolfram Alpha if I'm not mistaken.
post #22 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

Galaxy S3 is already buy one get one free!

 

Really? Details? Whereabouts?

post #23 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffreytgilbert View Post

 

If that device ran iOS, you'd be singing a different tune. That phone is gorgeous. Microsoft just sucks at marketing and partnering. It's like they can't figure out how NOT to stab the competition to death, even when it's the guys on their own team. 

 

So if the phone was an iPhone people would like it?  Imagine that?  Microsoft just sucks at making OS'es.  Windows Phone is horribly fugly.  "Metro" is a complete failure and joke.

post #24 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

I don't think it was a marketing issue. The Lumina was HEAVILY marketed by Microsoft, Nokia, and Carriers. Even registered as "best phone" on Siri/Wolfram Alpha if I'm not mistaken.

 

Exactly. this is the main Microsoft drone talking point...the marketing was not good.  It is never that the OS is complete crap or there are no apps, or the phones a cheap crap.

post #25 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunspot42 View Post

Death.  Spiral.

 

It'll be interesting to see who goes tits up first - Nokia or RIM...

 

I'm betting on Nokia.  RIM at least has their service business to bring in some revenue - their message network.  Nokia's got nothing much apart from their now-worthless phones.

 

They have their manufacturing capabilities and a lot of patents too.  Nokia is a better buyout target than RIM in my opinion. 

post #26 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackbook View Post

Galaxy S3 is already buy one get one free!

Where can I get this?  I have an upgraded available and can sell two phones and save of the next iphone

post #27 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sijun Jia View Post

Can you install iOS6 on iPhone 1 or 2? Can you install Icecream on G1 etc? The answer is NO! There is always a limit on upgrading, and that is true for every device or laptop etc. WTF?

The difference, of course, is that you can upgrade any iPhone for several years after its release.

For Android, OTOH, the majority of phones NEVER have an upgrade available. Not to mention, of course, that even today, a large percentage of Android phones on the market are still using an obsolete version of the OS.
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post #28 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunspot42 View Post

 

And if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon.  Sadly, it doesn't, so I'm not.

 

Thank you, Mr. Scott. :)

post #29 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Me View Post

Where can I get this?  I have an upgraded available and can sell two phones and save of the next iphone

BOGO - sort of

 

"T-Mobile has already rolled out its back-to-school promotion and you’ll be happy to hear there are plenty of smartphones included in its buy-one-get-one (BOGO) sale. Even the recently launched Galaxy S3 is part of the promo, but unfortunately, you won’t be able to receive a free Galaxy S3 when buying a Galaxy S3 handset bundled with a new contract.

 

Instead, you’ll be able to pick from a variety of other Galaxy-branded handsets including the Galaxy S2, the Galaxy S Blaze 4G or the Galaxy Exhibit 4G when buying the new Galaxy S3. These three devices will be available free of charge part of the BOGO offer, but only after a mail-in rebate and when purchased with new two-year contracts with the carrier – so they won’t be entirely free of charge."

 

http://www.androidauthority.com/t-mobile-galaxy-s3-back-school-bogo-promo-unveiled-100571/

post #30 of 112
The entire platform is redundant, offers no real advantages compared to Apple on one end and Google/Android on the other, is ridiculously late to the market, with an underdeveloped ecosystem.

It is merely "different." Which in this market, is woefully inadequate in terms of what it takes to really compete. Nokia/MS needs a total game-changer. Some interface changes and hardware upgrades
with an attempt at platform-duplication (own App store, etc.) just won't cut it. And it isn't, as we're seeing.

"Live Tiles" is not a big enough reason for anyone to invest in Windows Phone, unless they are already committed Windows/MS fans, and that too, is not enough to sustain this platform amid the
kind of of competition that Apple and Google bring to the table. This is not 15 years ago. It's not even 5 years ago.

As the average consumer, if you're not going to go with Android, your best option is iOS, not something that is underdeveloped and
barely adequate after nearly two years on the market. There's just no real incentive to go with Windows Phone. Consumer interest still isn't there, and if it's not there already, it won't be there
in the future. Every new iPhone model, every new wave of Android devices flooding the market . . . both of these factors serve to lock up the market for the two big players and make things even
more difficult for Nokia/MS. And by the looks of it, both iOS and Android have both ends of the market covered very well in terms of features and value, and in Apple's case, image and cachet.
Something which MS has never had and can't hope to have anytime soon.

Why care about Windows Phone when there's iOS? And if the iOS model doesn't suit the consumer, they'll go with Android.

This market isn't like the "computer" segment, where Mac sales can persist at lower volumes, where Apple can make a huge profit, and which offers a different value-proposition
(such as a far greater shelf-life) from what you get with mobile devices. Apple has carved out their "computer" piece of the pie. If the consumer has $1000 spend on a computer,
chances are, it's going to be a Mac.

Windows Phone has no such user base to speak of, and Nokia/MS have no such ability to make that kind of profit. In the mobile segment, market share matters as an indicator
of platform health. And Apple, with just 3 devices or so, commands well over 30% in the biggest, most important market outside of Asia: the US. That's pretty impressive.
Edited by Quadra 610 - 7/16/12 at 1:26pm
post #31 of 112

I would have to get paid to be stuck on a contract with this phone.

 

This phone has 2 year old hardware and won't even get a single major update.

 

In months Windows 8 will be out and this "flagship" phone won't run a single app due to new APIs

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post #32 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerMach View Post

BOGO - sort of

 

"T-Mobile has already rolled out its back-to-school promotion and you’ll be happy to hear there are plenty of smartphones included in its buy-one-get-one (BOGO) sale. Even the recently launched Galaxy S3 is part of the promo, but unfortunately, you won’t be able to receive a free Galaxy S3 when buying a Galaxy S3 handset bundled with a new contract.

 

Instead, you’ll be able to pick from a variety of other Galaxy-branded handsets including the Galaxy S2, the Galaxy S Blaze 4G or the Galaxy Exhibit 4G when buying the new Galaxy S3. These three devices will be available free of charge part of the BOGO offer, but only after a mail-in rebate and when purchased with new two-year contracts with the carrier – so they won’t be entirely free of charge."

 

http://www.androidauthority.com/t-mobile-galaxy-s3-back-school-bogo-promo-unveiled-100571/

Thats crappy bogo.  Can sell a new sg3 for around 500 and the other one only worth while is the sg2 but would have to renew two lines. 

post #33 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2oh1 View Post

Microsoft never answered the question of why anyone should buy a Windows phone instead of an iPhone or Android.  

They can't. Because for the bulk of the market, there's no real advantage over iOS on one end and Android on the other.
post #34 of 112

MS sucks at marketing? LOL!

post #35 of 112

Dead Phone Walking.

post #36 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

The entire platform is redundant, offers no real advantages compared to Apple on one end and Google/Android on the other, is ridiculously late to the market, with an underdeveloped ecosystem.
It is merely "different." Which in this market, is woefully inadequate in terms of what it takes to really compete. Nokia/MS needs a total game-changer. Some interface changes and hardware upgrades
with an attempt at platform-duplication (own App store, etc.) just won't cut it. And it isn't, as we're seeing.
"Live Tiles" is not a big enough reason for anyone to invest in Windows Phone, unless they are already committed Windows/MS fans, and that too, is not enough to sustain this platform amid the
kind of of competition that Apple and Google bring to the table. This is not 15 years ago. It's not even 5 years ago.
As the average consumer, if you're not going to go with Android, your best option is iOS, not something that is underdeveloped and
barely adequate after nearly two years on the market. There's just no real incentive to go with Windows Phone. Consumer interest still isn't there, and if it's not there already, it won't be there
in the future. Every new iPhone model, every new wave of Android devices flooding the market . . . both of these factors serve to lock up the market for the two big players and make things even
more difficult for Nokia/MS. And by the looks of it, both iOS and Android have both ends of the market covered very well in terms of features and value, and in Apple's case, image and cachet.
Something which MS has never had and can't hope to have anytime soon.
Why care about Windows Phone when there's iOS? And if the iOS model doesn't suit the consumer, they'll go with Android.
This market isn't like the "computer" segment, where Mac sales can persist at lower volumes, where Apple can make a huge profit, and which offers a different value-proposition
(such as a far greater shelf-life) from what you get with mobile devices. Apple has carved out their "computer" piece of the pie. If the consumer has $1000 spend on a computer,
chances are, it's going to be a Mac.
Windows Phone has no such user base to speak of, and Nokia/MS have no such ability to make that kind of profit. In the mobile segment, market share matters as an indicator
of platform health. And Apple, with just 3 devices or so, commands well over 30% in the biggest, most important market outside of Asia: the US. That's pretty impressive.
That's precisely why Microsoft will have to develop their own hardware for Windows 8.
post #37 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by bullhead View Post

 

So if the phone was an iPhone people would like it?  Imagine that?  Microsoft just sucks at making OS'es.  Windows Phone is horribly fugly.  "Metro" is a complete failure and joke.

Actually Metro is pretty nice.

 

Microsoft just sucks at roadmaps and partnerships.   Name me one partnership (outside of Intel) that has 'thrived.'  Nokia is just the most recent of many that have been burned by Microsoft's inability to deliver.   I would never buy a device with a MS OS on it until it's confirmed it will be upgradable to the next OS.  

 

As for iOS... that argument went in reverse for a long time (people would love Apple HW if it only ran windows).   People love their interface... new ones are roadblocks for people to adapt...

post #38 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxoM3 View Post

Hop in the wayback machine to 2007 when the iPhone came out. It hardly made a dent in the mobile sphere and it wasn't until the 3G that it took off. Here we are 5 years later. And Success! Agreed!

 

But if I put an iPhone in your hands in 2006 what would your reaction be?   :\
Back then Motorola ruled the world, and it's phones sever pretty awesome. Remember the RAZR?

 

My point is, the Nokia Lumia 900 isn't even 6 months old... and fighting it's way up into the market.

 

Simply dimissing it as stupid, as dying, as Microsoft sucks - is moronic. There's A LOT of ex-iPhone users using the Nokia Lumia - including me... because it's literally a better OS. No crashes, buttery smooth. And per Steve Wozniak - it's like Steve Job got reincarnated at Microsoft.

 

And why the hell would Steve Wozniak say that? Because it's that good of a phone/OS.

 

Step away from the punch gentlemen. Apple NEEDS competition. Apple only makes a great iPad/iPhone NOW because 10 years ago, APPLE was the underdog.

 

Why is Apple making a 4" phone? Why is Apple making a 7" tablet? Why is Apple making an HDTV?

Because COMPETITION is making them offer it. Sure Amazon maybe sold 6 Million Kindles, but that's 6 million less iPads. Sure Samsung may suck with their 4" phones, but they sell as many phones as Apple does.

 

Don't root for companies who are innovating and hungry to die gentlemen.
If they succeed and compete, it allows Apple to give you better products.

 

Or are you guys really that much into mediocrity with your 5 year-old OS?

 

 

 
 

 

The first iPhone made a dent into smartphone sphere, look at any Pre and Post-iPhone design, like you said, does anyone still remember the RAZR? Look at the smartphone sphere before the iPhone where Palm, Motorola, Nokia was the kings of the hill back then. The iPhone 3G was a much bigger success than the first iPhone because it was the first iPhone sold internationally. 

 

Nokia is now facing a difficult situation, Microsoft have clearly state no current WP7 won't be upgradable to WP8, what a bummer for Nokia where their flagship phone and first generation of a new platform will be stuck at their first implementation for ever. 

 

Which OS are you calling a 5 years-old OS? Roots of OSX date much longer than that. Windows kernel is coming from VaxVMS way back in the 70s, Android Linux kernel is the youngest will being birth in mid-90.  I wonder how the age of an OS have anything with how good it is, only noobs use this logic, and Microsoft is notorious for bringing really bad 1.0 product to market. 

post #39 of 112

I for one am hoping that Microsoft is successful. It would thin the herd. A lot of Apple fans have the knee jerk reaction of wanting Apple to do well at all costs. This is from years of being the underdog and if you were a devote back in '97, there was serious worry that Apple was going to go belly up (they were very much like how RIM is now). Now with Apple's success, there is a developing problem of the company focusing too much on consumer products and gadgets, and ignoring the customers that have supported the company for years. With the death of the Xserve and Raid servers, the FinalCut Pro debacle, the Mac Pro languishing, and the possibility the MacBook Pro 17" is dead, it is looking like Apple is abandoning the professional user to concentrate on the more profitable consumer market. This worries me because I refuse to go back to Windows and Linux doesn't have support from Adobe for it's programs (yet). So I've abandoned the defense mechanism of Apple at all costs. I'd like for the competition to get some market share and keep Apple honest. But, unfortunately, the salad days of 2005 to 2010 for Apple power users may just be a memory. 

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post #40 of 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevt View Post

 

Really? Details? Whereabouts?


T-Mobile is "Buy any of these Samsung 4G devices and receive a Galaxy S™ II 4G, Galaxy S® Blaze™ 4G, or Galaxy Exhibit® 4G for FREE! This limited time offer is available exclusively at your local T-Mobile® store." The photo on website includes the S III.

 

This is NOT a buy an S III and get an S III free as original poster would lead us to believe.

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