Inside Apple's new vector-based Maps in iOS 6 - Page 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gazoobee 

 

Wuh? 

 

What is "Formula 1"?  For that matter, what is "Speed Channel"?  

It came before Formula Jr.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rennaisance 

 

 

I think the main reason we won't see this soon is engineering resources. Apple will want to be focusing their energies on the iOS implementation, not worrying about a web variant.

 

That said, if Apple Maps is ever truly going to be competitive with Google, expanding the scope beyond iOS may be necessary. For one thing, more and more maps data is crowd sourced these days. Check out Google's MapMaker: it's hard to imagine Apple keeping their maps up-to-date without something like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SolipsismX 


You're probably right but I will certainly don't want to hear that.

The resource issue may not be as restrictive as you think -- I believe Apple still uses Web Objects internally for its online store and developer sites.  If so, the new maps app could be developed with Web Objects in mind and modularized so that much of the source code (UI excepted) could be used on the web.  It appears that the maps app is pretty much complete -- and they are awaiting, more, more robust and more up-to-date data.

Here's a partial link to the login at the developer site:

https://daw.apple.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/DSAuthWeb.woa/wa/login?appIdKey=zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

the woa suffix stands for Web Objects App -- this indicates that DSAuthWeb.woa is an Web Objects app written to authorize a user login.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebObjects

Originally Posted by Crowley 

Since Maps.app is developed and maintained by Apple, this is really a case of Apple surpassing Apple.  Google doesn't make the app, and their back end certainly hasn't been surpassed, as has been said many times over - they do vectors, and they have better data

The article is very disingenuous as painting the lack of vector graphics in Maps.app as a Google problem.

I normally read a DED article with a lot of skepticism --- he tends to quote himself, presents opinion as fact, omit challenging or contrary opinions and facts -- and tella Apple fans what he thinks they want to hear...

He tricked me with this article -- the way it was presented lead me to believe that the Google-written maps apps were bitmapped-based the way the Apple-written [current] maps app is bitmapped-based.   And that with iOS 6 the Apple-written, vector-based maps app was superior to anything that Google had... and Google was struggling to catch up!

...shame on me!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum 

 

I normally read a DED article with a lot of skepticism --- he tends to quote himself, presents opinion as fact, omit challenging or contrary opinions and facts -- and tella Apple fans what he thinks they want to hear...

 

He tricked me with this article -- the way it was presented lead me to believe that the Google-written maps apps were bitmapped-based the way the Apple-written [current] maps app is bitmapped-based.   And that with iOS 6 the Apple-written, vector-based maps app was superior to anything that Google had... and Google was struggling to catch up!

 

...shame on me!

Lol, nice post. Be careful though, he lives in San Francisco and seems to have quite the temper so be on the lookout. If he attacked my post as mild as my criticism was, I can only imagine what he wants to do to you after that post. 

As longs as the iOS 6 Apple maps can give me good voice navigation while driving I will be thrilled. The current free choices like Waze and mapquest are subpar. I suspect most people are primarily concerned about good voice navigation since you are likely to use it while driving more than any other time. For that reason, I am not really concerned about vector, raster, 3D mapping or anything else and expect Apple will do a decent job on that front eventually. But I do like articles to provide a bit more balance and I think he needs to try a lot harder in that area. Google may be the enemy to DED but you have to give them props for what they get right, and their maps is pretty darned good. No one expects Apple to beat them right off the bat with their their very first try so no need to oversell it.  

Originally Posted by Adam Foosaner 
I literally come to this site for laughs.

Please don't. That's just a personal request.

Originally Posted by majjo 
Traffic is traffic.

And trolling is trolling. Would you prefer I stop banning the spambots and let them overrun the site, too?

One thing I can't stand on the Apple/Google maps app is using the compass. If you're using it and then touch the map to zoom out/in or check out another area the map it does this rotating adjusting thing then the compass shuts off. You totally lose your orientation. So you click to enable the compass again but the app automatically takes you out of the previous zoom level you were in (takes you to the default zoom level). That default zoom level is quite far out so then you touch the map to try to zoom in again but because you've touched the map the compass shuts off again. It's completely bonkers. It has worked like this since the beginning. I sure hope it's fixed with the new Apple Maps.

Originally Posted by majjo 
Don't delude yourself into thinking AI doesn't want as much traffic as it can get tho.

They don't have to be able to post to be able to read and up pageviews… 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 

 

They don't have to be able to post to be able to read and up pageviews… 

Oooohhhhh....

That means we could have a posting elite and a trolling elite...

Edit:  And "Up your Pageviews, too!"

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagamer34 


Google has had vector maps on the web for several months now, just turn on WebGL. And this article makes it sound as if Google just discovered vector maps when Google has had them for almost 3 years.
And Google is struggling with voice dictation? Really? Please show me offline voice dictation in iOS 6. Oy, this article sounds like a fan piece. I like Apple, Google, and Microsoft, but dislike when someone is playing fast and loose with facts.
Lastly, one does not simply remove Street View or public transit directions. I don't see that going well when iOS is released to the public.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4TheLoveOfTech 

How can the writers on this blog continue to "LIE" day after day?  90% of the article written or copy and pasted from another site and then edited with an Apple Bias are full of lies and missing data that would completely change the story.

 

Google maps have vector

http://googlemapsmania.blogspot.com/2010/12/google-maps-now-with-vector-graphics.html

 

Google the 100K other article written on the subject.

 

APPLEINSIDER.  QUIT WRITING LIES FOR HITS AND HEADLINES.  

I guess anyone who can write ABC can now write an article for Appleinsider.

You can keep drinking the kool-aid.

I've had a test iPhone 4 with iOS 6 on it since it was released to developers.

They have a LOT of work to do.  It's slow and the search is horrible.  They will need to improve before it even gets close to the speed and ease of Google.  They will need to be able to match the results accuracy that Google has.

Bing Maps already did it. Glad to see Apple catch up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rennaisance 

There's no doubt that 3D, Vector-based maps are the future.

 

However - cool new 3D and navigation features aside - in terms of basic 2D maps, Apple's current implementation in iOS 6 is pretty poor compared to the Google Maps it is replacing.

 

Compared to Google Maps: 

• Apple's maps are often out of date (more than 10 years out of date in the case of London, UK!)
• colours are garish (parks & water features too bright and over-emphasised)
• many non-road features are missing (random unknown businesses names appear while significant tourist attractions and points of interest are missing)
• building outlines are only shown in a few select cities
• many transit features are missing. No bus stops shown, and train stations often missing or in the wrong place.
• satellite images are poor quality (not just lacking detail but also dark washed out colours, lacking in contrast)
• hybrid mode is sluggish on slower devices (iPad 2)

 

All in all, Apple maps shows promise, and could eventually be great, but is disappointing in the current iteration. In my opinion they are releasing it too early.

Google has had 10 years or so to get their maps into what they are today, with an entire team dedicated to it. No, Apple maps will not be feature-parity with Google maps on day 1. Like all their other products, they're focus 1st on the fundamentals/experience/useability, and then quickly fill in the feature gaps. However, I'd guess APple will be constantly improving their maps very, very quickly. They know how important it is, and it is indeed a massive undertaking to do it from scratch. Google has a massive headstart but I think the gap will close quickly. Apple clearly isnt playing around, and they know comparisons will be made.  

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


If I understand correctly the problem you are describing, then all you have to do is touch the location icon bottom left to re-enable the compass - it keeps the new zoom level.

Not always. If you click the map to zoom far out (i.e. province/country level) then enable the compass, the app will take you all the way down to the default zoom level (city level).

If you click the map the compass turns off then the map rotates so you lose your orientation. The compass should never turn off unless I tell it to. Then when you enable the compass again the map rotates again to reflect the correct compass direction. The map should not move at all when clicking the map to zoom in or out. 2 problems right there. 3 including the zoom issue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zorinlynx 

>Apple isn't serving up a public web version of its own maps as Google does, so it isn't constrained by the limits of web-based technologies.

 

This is actually something that annoys me. Right now, I can use Google Maps on my phone, iPad or computer and always get the same data, directions, street view, etc.

 

With iOS 6 I'm going to have a different mapping system on my iPad/phone than on my desktop. This is going to lead to different directions and data. This is ALREADY annoying because of the differences between TomTom on my iPhone and Google Maps; now we're going to have a third source of different information.

 

It'd be nice if Apple would release a web version of their maps, or even an app for the Mac to access them. An app would likely be easier to implement due to the use of vector data.

Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.

Think Different.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveN 

Kudos on a well researched and written article!

Ditto, Dan.

An article to be proud of.

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Originally Posted by Crowley 

I don't mind a little bit of Apple spin ladled on, but this one has a bucket poured over it.

DED is such a tool.

I don't mind reading a little constructive criticism, but you sound like you have some kind of vendetta.

. . . 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziteke 

I did my research and I agree that Google did indeed have vector based maps on Android devices back in Dec 2010, so the writer is biased. I think the writer should have focused more on the free seamless transition to Apple's maps and the HUGE loss to revenue to Google. For example, for you to experience the vector based maps on Android you need to have the right hardware/software combo, this is less of an issue when it comes to Apple. Also most mobile based traffic (web included) comes from Apple devices

I'll take your word for it, but what use are vector maps if they don't perform well?

Agree with you that there is a deeper and more interesting story here that needs to be explored.

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


I see. At least on my IP4 and iPad, you can pinch to zoom in or out without leaving compass mode. If you do leave compass mode, you have to tap the location button twice to get back, and the first tap puts you into location mode, which is why it takes you back down to city level. However, I agree that it would be nice to enable location+compass without changing zoom level.

Zooming in while in compass mode seems fine (if you're careful with the correct pinching technique). Zooming out is another story. I can do it if I'm REALLY careful with making sure it's a pinch and not touch (this is also annoying) but when you try zooming out to say state/province level watch what happens. Maps will eventually read it as a touch not pinch and boom you've lost your compass orientation. It definitely needs work. 

Example: I'm heading east in compass mode. I zoom out because I want to see my direction in relation to the state/province. Eventually with enough zoom out pinches you'll lose the compass and since you have now disabled the compass, the map arbitrarily rotates about 45 degrees. Then you click back to get the compass. Now you have lost your zoom level and have to start all over again only to encounter the same problem. This is not a very good compass / maps combo.

If you mostly use the compass in your home town you might never notice since you wouldn't need to zoom out so often. However, I'm living in Japan and zoom out all the time to get my bearings. It's a very sloppy implementation IMHO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


No - I agree - you have to be careful zooming and this could be improved. I guess the problem is that compass mode requires location mode and the software intentionally disengages location mode if it thinks you are trying to recenter the map.

What do you think the location confirmation window? I turn it off which already requires quite a precise click. Not like you can hit it by mistake. You still get a confirmation window to turn it off. I feel like chewing my phone whenever this pops up. 

Of course I want it off. I clicked the settings icon and the location service menu to get there in the first place!  lol

Seriously, they just could have renamed this article "Yet another boring reason why we find Apple superior".

They dismiss the lack of Streetview and only mention in briefly, but write a (way too long!) article about these vector graphics.

Come on! It's time they start writing a neutral post, or bash Apple on a specific subject. That would be so refreshing.

Nice that they have 3D model support in their backyard, but what about the rest of the world?

It seems to kinda suck not having streetview and no alternative. 

And shit... look here! I just enabled the 'vector layer' in Google Maps!
This article is a piece of shit!

While vector graphics are an advantage over bitmaps, however, most users use the satellite image view, because it lets you identify areas more clearly. So, I'm sorry to say this, but if you want to sell a maps tool, make your marketing over satellite images, not maps, because you won't convince anybody with maps no matter if they're vector or bitmaps.

Also, streetview is no longer a "cool" feature, but a must-have one. Many architects, engineers, and artists, use streetview for their work, letting them add quick previews of an area before visiting it. So, any professional who is currently using streetview, needs it as a must-have feature.

I'm not sure how Apple could add streetview, considering the legal issues Google had when doing it (some countries didn't allow Google to do streetview on their territory).

ecs

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


Not sure what you are referring to there. Which window is that?

You know, you go to settings - > location settings - > off and you're presented with a confirmation window to turn off location settings. "iPhone Search needs Location Settings. If you turn it off you won't be able to use this service. Are you sure you want to turn it off blah blah blah". Very annoying. I think it's obvious you want to turn location settings off if you have already entered the settings app and then the location settings menu. OSX usually gives you the ability to turn on/off confirmation dialogues, but I guess iOS doesn't. 

It's interesting that Apple partnered with TomTom for turn-by-turn directions.  With the cash in their war chest, and since their last mapping partnership didn't quite work out, they could just bought them outright.

Nice, what a comprehensive article!

Apple's new vector maps look absolutely amazing. The ability to cache large areas of the map for offline use are a great innovation too. Wonder how long it will take for Google and Android to catch up and ditch their old, busted bitmapped maps. This next generation of maps is going to be fantastic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


You obviously didn't read any of the other comments.

I think I detect a hint of sarcasm in purpledorm's post ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwmac 

I guess you missed the part where I said I am a former Android user and now happily own an iPhone 4S. I am not a fandroid by any stretch of the imagination. So calm down DED, take a deep breath and relax. You really don't handle constructive criticism very well. And why even pick my post to assault? There were a dozen more posts far more detailed and critical.

Stick to the issues, like DED does; personalities don't tend to contribute anything but (negative) emotion to the discussion and are not helpful. This is key to enjoying blog sites like AI.

By way of comparison, and to explain the point being made here, count the number of uses of the word "I", "you", "my" in all posts by the author and by others responding critically to the article.

A lot of "contributors" here purporting to "portray the facts" and "uncover lies" are simply trolling professionally with a few half-truths and plenty of insults; others are trying to set the record straight and stick to the science, pushing the envelope of readers' knowledge with cool facts. The latter educate and enlighten, the former simply muddy the waters and reduce everything to a pi**ing contest of schoolboys, provoking flame wars.

A lot has been revealed here about mapping technology, both by this article and many of the constructive rejoinders written by people who are knowledgeable about and/or involved in Mapping - that's what the topic is about, not whether one is a returning Android, iOS or Windows Phone user, facts that are totally unhelpful to the issue under discussion. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by muppetry 


You obviously didn't read any of the other comments.

Nope, I didn't! There were so many words and pictures in the article, and reading all the comments is just too much work. What did I say that was wrong?

The article argues that vector maps are far superior to bitmaps, which I find hard to disagree with. Just look at the screenshots comparing the ugly zoomed in pixels from the current iOS maps against the vector app. It goes on to say that Apple is working on maps using this brand new technology and that Google is also working on it too but will struggle to catch up.