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HOPE - Page 2

post #41 of 97
Thread Starter 

That was Mitch M aim to make Obama a one term president  he said this several times already. That is the Republican party today NO NO NO!
 

post #42 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Millions of morons, jackasses, and the hoodwinked.

 

And here we have the sum total of BR's perspective: Those who oppose what and who he supports or disagree with his perspective of issues, people, policies and circumstances are "morons, jackasses" and "hoodwinked."

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #43 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

And here we have the sum total of BR's perspective: Those who oppose what and who he supports or disagree with his perspective of issues, people, policies and circumstances are "morons, jackasses" and "hoodwinked."

Way to misinterpret.  Only those who feel that making Obama a 1 term president is the highest priority are the morons, jackasses, and/or the hoodwinked.  The conservatives who didn't vote for Obama but still wished for some bipartisanship and supported the president are not counted among those.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #44 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Way to misinterpret.  Only those who feel that making Obama a 1 term president is the highest priority are the morons, jackasses, and/or the hoodwinked.

 

Certainly not if he and his policies are creating more problems than they are solving.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #45 of 97

I didn't realize those evil obstructionist Republicans had 100% majorities in the House and Senate:

 

House Votes 414-0 to Reject Obama's Budget Plan

 

Senate rejects Obama budget in 99-0 vote

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #46 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post
 
Millions of morons, jackasses, and the hoodwinked.  

 

Oh look, indicting your opposition as stupid or gullible.  Surprise, surprise.  

 

 

Quote:
Those who would compromise their own ideals to do so--vote against their own policies--don't have the health and welfare of the nation at heart.

 

Right...back to pretending Obamacare and tax increases on the rich are Republican policies.  And now they don't care about the country.  This just keeps getting better. 

 

 

Quote:
Fact is, Obama is center-right.  

 

There is nothing about Obama that is center-right.  He was influenced by radical leftists as a young man, and shows no signs of having changed.  He was the most liberal member of the U.S. Senate.  Think again.  

 

 

Quote:
His opponents are racists. 

 

TFTFY.

 

 

 

 

Quote:
 Finally, although he is pretty corporate friendly (just look at the lack of prosecutions against those who put us in this mess),

 

A lack of corporate prosecutions (for which there are no real grounds) means he's "corporate friendly?"  LOL.  

 

he's also not willing to sign over America's deed to the multinational entities with no allegiance to the American people.  Strike 3.

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #47 of 97
Thread Starter 

Why are you a Republican ?
 

post #48 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Why are you a Republican ?
 

 

Assuming that's for me...

 

1.  Between the two major political parties, it is closest to my values of limited government, strong national defense and creating an opportunity society.   I agree with most of the platform, and disagree with most of the Democratic platform.  

 

2.  I was, at one time, a registered Independent.  However, we have a closed primary system in PA.  That means to vote in the Republican primary, I need to be registered as a Republican.  Voting in the primaries in important to me, ergo I'm registered as a Republican.  In reality, I'm fiscally very conservative and socially moderate...even somewhat liberal on some issues (drugs, for example).  

 

 

By the way, marv, why are you a Democrat (I assume as much...perhaps I'm wrong)?  The Democratic Party is no longer about John F. Kennedy and FDR.  It's not even about Lyndon Johnson.  It's not the party of the "little guy" any more.  Today's party is controlled by the extreme Left wing, with moderates (such as Joe Libermann, for example) left aside.  It's the party of Geroge Soros and Moveon.org.  This has been happening since at least 2000, though even that party was conservative by today's Democratic standards.  Today's leaders...Reid, Pelosi, Obama, Wasserman-Schultz, etc...are both Leftist and documented liars.  I'd love to read why you feel the need to defend them. 

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #49 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

The Democratic Party is no longer about John F. Kennedy and FDR.  It's not even about Lyndon Johnson.  It's not the party of the "little guy" any more.  Today's party is controlled by the extreme Left wing, with moderates (such as Joe Libermann, for example) left aside.  It's the party of Geroge Soros and Moveon.org.  This has been happening since at least 2000, though even that party was conservative by today's Democratic standards.  Today's leaders...Reid, Pelosi, Obama, Wasserman-Schultz, etc...are both Leftist and documented liars.

 

It's somewhat amusing that you claim the Democratic party is no longer the party of FDR and JFK (as if were it still that would be a good thing) and make the distinction that it is not the party of the little guy anymore (as if it ever was) and that it is a party of Leftists and documented liars (as if people like FDR and JFK weren't.)

 

I don't think there's as much of a disconnect from those previous times as you suggest.

 

FDR, for example, was part socialist, part fascist, all power-hungry.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #50 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

It's somewhat amusing that you claim the Democratic party is no longer the party of FDR and JFK (as if were it still that would be a good thing) and make the distinction that it is not the party of the little guy anymore (as if it ever was) and that it is a party of Leftists and documented liars (as if people like FDR and JFK weren't.)

 

I don't think there's as much of a disconnect from those previous times as you suggest.

 

FDR, for example, was part socialist, part fascist, all power-hungry.

 

That's a reasonable point.  FDR may not be the best example.  But the Democratic Party of the 1940s-60s was wholly different than the one we have today.  That Democratic Party certainly had Leftist elements, but it was not controlled by them.  It was a far more moderate party.  Even LBJ was far more moderate than today's Democratic Party.  The Democratic Party of old's power base was union, blue collar workers, the South, etc.  Today it is Hollywood, Radical Environmentalists, Progressive-Socialists and radical Leftists and the Dependency Class.  It's a different party.  I'm not saying it was "good" then, but it was certainly different.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #51 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

That's a reasonable point.  FDR may not be the best example.  But the Democratic Party of the 1940s-60s was wholly different than the one we have today.  That Democratic Party certainly had Leftist elements, but it was not controlled by them.  It was a far more moderate party.  Even LBJ was far more moderate than today's Democratic Party.  The Democratic Party of old's power base was union, blue collar workers, the South, etc.  Today it is Hollywood, Radical Environmentalists, Progressive-Socialists and radical Leftists and the Dependency Class.  It's a different party.  I'm not saying it was "good" then, but it was certainly different.  

 

Fair point. Probably right.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #52 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

That's a reasonable point.  FDR may not be the best example.  But the Democratic Party of the 1940s-60s was wholly different than the one we have today.  That Democratic Party certainly had Leftist elements, but it was not controlled by them.  It was a far more moderate party.  Even LBJ was far more moderate than today's Democratic Party.  The Democratic Party of old's power base was union, blue collar workers, the South, etc.  Today it is Hollywood, Radical Environmentalists, Progressive-Socialists and radical Leftists and the Dependency Class.  It's a different party.  I'm not saying it was "good" then, but it was certainly different.  

You are having a perspective issue.  A person on a stationary train observes a stationary car as unmoving.  However, when that train begins to move rapidly to the right, the car appears to move to the left, despite that it actually has also begun to move at a medium pace to the right.  If the train's passenger lacks the cognitive ability to recognize that it is he who is in fact in a rapidly rightward moving train, the passenger will mistake the car's slower right movement as a rapid leftward one.  Regardless of how passionately the passenger makes these assertions, the passenger still remains incorrect with respect to a stationary, outside observer.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #53 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

You are having a perspective issue.  A person on a stationary train observes a stationary car as unmoving.  However, when that train begins to move rapidly to the right, the car appears to move to the left, despite that it actually has also begun to move at a medium pace to the right.  If the train's passenger lacks the cognitive ability to recognize that it is he who is in fact in a rapidly rightward moving train, the passenger will mistake the car's slower right movement as a rapid leftward one.  Regardless of how passionately the passenger makes these assertions, the passenger still remains incorrect with respect to a stationary, outside observer.

 

Got it...the notion that our political spectrum has shifted dramatically to the right.  That's a laughable notion, but I understand.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #54 of 97

I present to you folks SDW, the unwitting train passenger.  It's not a laughable notion whatsoever.  The fact that you would just dismiss it as laughable is telling.

 

http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2012/04/10/150349438/gops-rightward-shift-higher-polarization-fills-political-scientist-with-dread

 

 

 

Quote:

When President Obama recently complained to news media executives about their ostensibly even-handed "pox on both of your houses" coverage of the partisan battles in Washington, it might have seemed like, well, a partisan shot from a Democratic president.

After all, his complaint was that the GOP had moved so far right, and intransigently so, that it was wrong to create a false "equivalence" by blaming both parties equally for the Washington gridlock. To a skeptic that comment, coming from a Democrat, sounded suspiciously partisan itself.

But while the president was making the kind of argument you would expect of the nation's top Democrat, he actually had the support of science — well at least political science research that maps that rightward GOP shift.

Keith Poole of the University of Georgia, with his collaboratorHoward Rosenthal of New York University, has spent decades charting the ideological shifts and polarization of the political parties in Congress from the 18th century until now to get the view of how the political landscape has changed from 30,000 feet up. What they have found is that the Republican Party is the most conservative it has been a century.

This graph shows the ideological movement for both parties in the House. Note the steady shift towards conservatism among Republicans.
Enlargevoteview.com

This graph shows the ideological movement for both parties in the House. Note the steady shift towards conservatism among Republicans.

In a recent conversation Poole, who's viewed by other political scientists as the go-to expert on this issue, explained that the data are very clear:

"This is an entirely objective statistical procedure. The graphs just reflect what comes out of the computer. Howard Rosenthal and I, we've been working on something called Nominate. This does all the Congresses simultaneously, which allows you to study change over time.

 

"The short version would be since the late 1970s starting with the 1976 election in the House the Republican caucus has steadily moved to the right ever since. It's been a little more uneven in the Senate. The Senate caucuses have also moved to the right. Republicans are now furtherest to the right that they've been in 100 years.

Of course some, and not just conservative activists, will be quick to point out that Democrats also have their take-no-prisoner liberals who aren't prone to compromise on their core issues, either.

Karlyn Bowman, a senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institution who studies public opinion, is definitely of the pox-on-both-house camp:

"Clearly, I think both parties have moved to the extremes since I've been watching politics. I don't think there's any doubt about that. The Democratic Party has been pulled to the left and the Republican Party has been pulled to the right. Part of that is redistricting."

Poole acknowledges that Democrats have contributed their share to the polarization of the political process, especially, he says, through their use of identity politics, appeals to race, ethnicity and gender.

Democrats have also contributed by losing House and Senate seats in the South where moderate Democrats have been replaced by Republicans. Meanwhile, moderate Republicans have continued to depart the scene, with Sen. Olympia Snowe of Maine being just the latest.

Buttressing a point that Obama has sometimes made, this loss of moderates and further rightward movement by congressional Republicans would have been a challenge to navigate for even the biggest conservative hero of modern times, President Ronald Reagan. Poole said:

"Ronald Reagan was so successful because he made all these deals with these huge blocks of moderate legislators. That's why he had overwhelming majorities for the 81 tax cut, the 82 tax increase, where they had to go back and adjust the tax bill in 82 and the Social Security fix in 83. Then in 86 you had Simpson Mazzoli, which included amnesty and tax simplification. All that stuff passed with very large majorities. You cannot imagine anything like that happening now. Which is why the country is really in the tank.

"There's a lot of blame to go around. It doesn't look like there's any resolution of this anytime soon."

That said, Poole says the data are hard to deny; the polarization is largely due to how far and relatively quickly Republicans have shifted to the right end of the ideological spectrum. And he faults leaders of both parties for allowing the nation to get into a fiscal morass in which government spending on health care is unsustainable:

"It is true that the Republicans have moved further to the right than the Democrats have moved to the left. That's absolutely true.

"On the other hand, there doesn't seem to be much impetus on the part of the leadership of either political party to really do something serious about our budget crisis. I doubt very seriously we'll see much improvement.

"People forget how utterly irresponsible our political leadership has been for the last 30 years. ... The current political class of the U.S. just isn't in the same league as Truman and Eisenhower and Adlai Stevenson. You just don't have that kind of leadership now, just when we need it.

This isn't meant as a knock on Obama, Poole said. But he's not very optimistic about what an Obama second term would bring:

"The likely outcome of the election is that it's a very close victory by President Obama, the Republicans hold the House and may come within an eyelash of taking the Senate. I could see a 50-50 Senate. So good luck. After $2 billion gets spent on federal elections at all levels, how bitter will the atmosphere will be in January 2013? We're really up the creek."

 

And here's a more detailed historical perspective showing point by point how, when, and why this rightward shift has occurred.  So, no, SDW, not fucking laughable at all.  

 

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/2011/0731/America-s-big-shift-right

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #55 of 97
@BR:

Ha ha ha ha ha ROTFL!! This is PRICELESS!!!

You must have precognition or something... how did you know "cognitive ability" was key?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

...... If [he] lacks the cognitive ability to recognize ......

Got it...the notion that our political spectrum has shifted dramatically to the right.  That's a laughable notion, but I understand.  


You have to admit, the response to your earlier post was amusing (but sad to see).

Though your statement was apropos, some in the audience didn't understand your relativist argument. One made it a point to tell you they DID understand you..... AND THEN they told you that you're the one saying "laughable" (wrong) things.

Not your fault at all that relativity is too complex for some -- you tried to explain using a concept that's intelligible to high-school graduates in many countries -- but sadly not to many in the US. This reminded me of the "this is your brain on drugs" commercial from years ago. Our national collective brain has been "dumbed down" for years -- to a point where, now, we can't even see how fried our brain has gotten.
The Truth is difficult to see, and more difficult to say — My God
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The Truth is difficult to see, and more difficult to say — My God
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post #56 of 97
Thread Starter 

Truthfully speaking today i am disappointed by the Democratic party with them buying politicians with this Super PAC of theirs.I know politics is a dirty game and it is getting more dirtier every day.Lies upon more lies from each party. The Liberals are in the throes of Wall Street and the big banks and this is pretty sad indeed.Liberman is an ass kisser from way back.I do not like his politics at all.He is connected to the oil companies exclusively.Years ago there was a true Democratic Party for the people which helped them in every way not now any longer.That was true politicians like FDR,JFK, and others.The GOP Party on the other hand is just like the Liberals in bed with the Banks, Oil Companies, and Corporations.They both have no answers to our current problems except blaming each other. This will not get it done. There is a saying "WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE" which they both should do.
 

post #57 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Truthfully speaking today i am disappointed by the Democratic party with them buying politicians with this Super PAC of theirs.I know politics is a dirty game and it is getting more dirtier every day.Lies upon more lies from each party. The Liberals are in the throes of Wall Street and the big banks and this is pretty sad indeed.Liberman is an ass kisser from way back.I do not like his politics at all.He is connected to the oil companies exclusively.Years ago there was a true Democratic Party for the people which helped them in every way not now any longer.That was true politicians like FDR,JFK, and others.The GOP Party on the other hand is just like the Liberals in bed with the Banks, Oil Companies, and Corporations.They both have no answers to our current problems except blaming each other. This will not get it done. There is a saying "WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE" which they both should do.
 

 

Wow.  Just...wow.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #58 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Truthfully speaking today i am disappointed by the Democratic party with them buying politicians with this Super PAC of theirs.I know politics is a dirty game and it is getting more dirtier every day.Lies upon more lies from each party. The Liberals are in the throes of Wall Street and the big banks and this is pretty sad indeed.Liberman is an ass kisser from way back.I do not like his politics at all.He is connected to the oil companies exclusively.Years ago there was a true Democratic Party for the people which helped them in every way not now any longer.That was true politicians like FDR,JFK, and others.The GOP Party on the other hand is just like the Liberals in bed with the Banks, Oil Companies, and Corporations.They both have no answers to our current problems except blaming each other. This will not get it done. There is a saying "WAKE UP AND SMELL THE COFFEE" which they both should do.

 

When I read your original post about "HOPE", and how little it is mentioned today by politicians, I have to say I agree.

Maybe they all know something we "regular folks" haven't yet figured out -- that there's no hope left for us (anyone) to get decent honest reliable leadership.

Maybe they know the system is rife with money (now billions) that almost solely determines who gets power and a political future.

Maybe they know that they can only win if they have billions to spend on advertising (subliminal convincing), on the average Joe's. Maybe they know they can only get billions in their campaign funds if they please Big Business and Mr. Billionaire. I'm sure they know that without those funds, they will not win.

I believe politics is now a simple "money game". It doesn't matter what you say, what you believe in, who you are, or what you've done in the past. For the vast majority of voters, they make their final decisions late in a campaign season -- some in the last few weeks. So their vote usually is determined by which ads they see and how frequently.

The old adage: "A lie told a thousand times, becomes avtruth." so, if you can throw/advertise your message (whether it is true or not) a thousand times (on nationwide TV), enough people will believe you -- and likely vote for your message.

Elections are no longer won based on the person. They are bought based on the funds available.

Given this as the situation, I don't think it matters who is really running, or how good/bad they are. Since anyone capable of getting to the real campaign (past the primaries) has already made countless promises to their big-money contributors -- to whom they're beholden. Candidates are slowly becoming "figureheads" -- straw-men -- who represent mostly the interests of the big-money donors funding them.


I won't be surprised if, in twenty years, we have only top CEOs of multinational corporations (e,g., China Inc.) running against other CEOs -- and the one with the most flashy/frequent adverts gets to sit in the fancy presidential chair.

Yes, this view leaves no "Hope" for us, but it's become the way I see it today. Not sure if "campaign reform" efforts are sufficient to change this -- such reform efforts will only be obscured by thousands of silly advertisements that effectively hide the reform message.

Pandora's box is very difficult to close once we've let out the "pestilence" inside it.
The Truth is difficult to see, and more difficult to say — My God
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The Truth is difficult to see, and more difficult to say — My God
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post #59 of 97
Thread Starter 

What you are saying is the truth it is sad that all this money backing these ads and we are financially strapped according to the government which for one moment i do not believe.I am losing more each day the hope in this country's future with the lies and power our ordinary citizens are facing from the parasites called politicians.
 

post #60 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

What you are saying is the truth it is sad that all this money backing these ads and we are financially strapped according to the government which for one moment i do not believe.I am losing more each day the hope in this country's future with the lies and power our ordinary citizens are facing from the parasites called politicians.
 

 

1.  You'll never get the money out of politics.  

2.  Spending limits have proven to be a nightmare.  

3. You don't believe what?

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #61 of 97
Thread Starter 

Politics is a dirty filthy and corrupt career which politicians enter for the money, power and fame. It is disgusting to see what is going on in PA and Ohio with this voting ID crap the Republicans came up with now so that they have more of a guarantee to beat Obama in 2012.Dirty politics prevail again!
 

post #62 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Politics is a dirty filthy and corrupt career which politicians enter for the money, power and fame. It is disgusting to see what is going on in PA and Ohio with this voting ID crap the Republicans came up with now so that they have more of a guarantee to beat Obama in 2012.Dirty politics prevail again!
 

 

As if you have any clue about voter ID laws and issues in my state.  PA is rife with voter fraud, particularly in Philadelphia.  The fact that one can vote without a photo ID (available for free, by the way), while one needs an ID to buy alcohol, tobacco, board a plane, get a loan or get into a bar is absurd.  In fact, people without ID CAN vote under the new law.  They have 8 days to provide documentation after they cast a provisional ballot.  And if they cannot provide documentation for cost or ability reasons (such as a birth cert), all they have to do is attest to that fact...and their ballot is counted.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #63 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Politics is a dirty filthy and corrupt career which politicians enter for the money, power and fame. It is disgusting to see what is going on in PA and Ohio with this voting ID crap the Republicans came up with now so that they have more of a guarantee to beat Obama in 2012.Dirty politics prevail again!
 

 

As if you have any clue about voter ID laws and issues in my state.  PA is rife with voter fraud, particularly in Philadelphia.  The fact that one can vote without a photo ID (available for free, by the way), while one needs an ID to buy alcohol, tobacco, board a plane, get a loan or get into a bar is absurd.  In fact, people without ID CAN vote under the new law.  They have 8 days to provide documentation after they cast a provisional ballot.  And if they cannot provide documentation for cost or ability reasons (such as a birth cert), all they have to do is attest to that fact...and their ballot is counted.  

Whether or not he does have intimate knowledge about that or not he's still right.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #64 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Whether or not he does have intimate knowledge about that or not he's still right.

 

No, he's not.  He's not even close to right.  Voter fraud is a massive problem.  The notion that requiring a photo ID is racist is absolutely absurd.  In fact, I'm sick of it being framed this way.  It's time to tell the truth:  Democrats oppose voter ID laws because they know it will cost them millions of fraudulent votes nationwide.  The Democrats have been better at voter fraud for a long time.  But hey, there's a new season of Boardwalk Empire starting soon, so perhaps you could be nostalgic about the GOP holding a candle to the Democratic Fraud Machine.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #65 of 97

Repeating that it's a massive problem over and over again while the evidence says otherwise does not make it true.  Systematic disenfranchisement by Republicans of those who are more likely to vote Democrat is a far greater issue--and don't forget the election fraud that is easily perpetrated through the use of closed-source voting machines.  There's more security in a Las Vegas slot machine than there is in a voting machine.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply
post #66 of 97
Thread Starter 

In plain words what the hell are we voting for if you say it is a fraud and the vote is not secure at all.
 

post #67 of 97
Thread Starter 

Why do you name Philadelphia because there might be racism going on there against the African Americans so perhaps there vote won't count. This never happened when Bush was running for president and his dad also.

post #68 of 97

Seriously, marv, drop the charade.  You can't be real.  Vuvuzela, that you?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
Reply

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #69 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Repeating that it's a massive problem over and over again while the evidence says otherwise does not make it true.  Systematic disenfranchisement by Republicans of those who are more likely to vote Democrat is a far greater issue--and don't forget the election fraud that is easily perpetrated through the use of closed-source voting machines.  There's more security in a Las Vegas slot machine than there is in a voting machine.

 

No, it's not.   You should really take the time to look into the Philly situation.  More than 100 percent turnout, tens of thousands of last minute registrations, non-citzens voting, dead people voting, voting in the wrong party's primary, etc.  The evidence is all there if you'll take the time to look.  

 

And none of that has anything to do with basic argument about voter ID laws:  Voting is too important to not have some sort of ID requirement.  We require ID for almost everything, from buying a six pack to boarding a plane, to buying a pack of cigarettes.  But not voting for our leaders?  And really, BR..what is your objection?  The IDs can be had for free.  Even without one, a citizen can vote provisionally.  And if he/she cannot get documentation to support that ballot (e.g. he cannot afford to buy a birth cert), all he has to do is attest to that and his ballot will be counted.  

 

What this is really about is protecting Democrats' power base---part of which is built on exploiting ignorance and outright fraud.

 

 

 


 

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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #70 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

You are one narrow minded person who never stops with these insults. I pity your students!
 

 

Reported for personal attacks.  Incidentally, none of what I posted above was an "insult" in any sense.  You seem to label opposing opinions "insults" regardless of what this opinions actually are.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #71 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Whether or not he does have intimate knowledge about that or not he's still right.

 

No, he's not.  He's not even close to right.  Voter fraud is a massive problem.  The notion that requiring a photo ID is racist is absolutely absurd.  In fact, I'm sick of it being framed this way.  It's time to tell the truth:  Democrats oppose voter ID laws because they know it will cost them millions of fraudulent votes nationwide.  The Democrats have been better at voter fraud for a long time.  But hey, there's a new season of Boardwalk Empire starting soon, so perhaps you could be nostalgic about the GOP holding a candle to the Democratic Fraud Machine.  

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

You are one narrow minded person who never stops with these insults. I pity your students!
 

 

Reported for personal attacks.  Incidentally, none of what I posted above was an "insult" in any sense.  You seem to label opposing opinions "insults" regardless of what this opinions actually are.  Oh please SDW I remmeebr 

Oh please SDW I remember several times when you got worked up and called me names. That was you getting worked up over the difference of opinion. And by the way I never reported you.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #72 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Whether or not he does have intimate knowledge about that or not he's still right.

 

No, he's not.  He's not even close to right.  Voter fraud is a massive problem.  The notion that requiring a photo ID is racist is absolutely absurd.  In fact, I'm sick of it being framed this way.  It's time to tell the truth:  Democrats oppose voter ID laws because they know it will cost them millions of fraudulent votes nationwide.  The Democrats have been better at voter fraud for a long time.  But hey, there's a new season of Boardwalk Empire starting soon, so perhaps you could be nostalgic about the GOP holding a candle to the Democratic Fraud Machine.  

 

Quote:

 The Democrats have been better at voter fraud for a long time. 

You have proof of this of course?

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #73 of 97
Thread Starter 

It is time to face the truth and what I post has my opinion and what i mean. This is immature on your part with this reporting all the time. We are adults not children here.
 

post #74 of 97
Thread Starter 

This Voting Id in Pa. is a way for the Republicans to gain more votes which they claim is voter fraud and which there never has been voter fraud in PA.Not one case.Pick out the poor and seniors and screw them with this crap of getting ID's which a lot of elderly people cannot get. This is injustice completely.
 

post #75 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

 

 

Oh please SDW I remember several times when you got worked up and called me names. That was you getting worked up over the difference of opinion. And by the way I never reported you.

 

Well since my post wasn't directed at you, you really needn't concern yourself.  :)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

 

You have proof of this of course?

 

Yes.

 

As a matter of fact, 

 

I do.  

 

From the last article:  

 

 

 

Quote:
The state law requires an ID not just for in-person voting, but for absentee ballots. Pennsylvania has experienced numerous instances of absentee ballot fraud that could have been deterred by this requirement. Consider, for example, the 1998 conviction of former U.S. Rep. Austin Murphy or the 1984 conviction of Bob A. Clapps, then the Democratic chairman of Luzerne County. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

It is time to face the truth and what I post has my opinion and what i mean. This is immature on your part with this reporting all the time. We are adults not children here.
 

 

The forum rules specifically prohibit ad hominem arguments (i.e. "you are narrow minded" and "you Republicans like dirty tricks") and personal attacks (i.e. such and such person is a real a-hole).  I happen to disagree that calling someone an a-hole or expressing an opinion like "you're freaking looney" should be against the rules, but it is.   So if it's going to get me infractions, you can be damn well sure it's going to get you some.  

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

This Voting Id in Pa. is a way for the Republicans to gain more votes which they claim is voter fraud and which there never has been voter fraud in PA.Not one case.Pick out the poor and seniors and screw them with this crap of getting ID's which a lot of elderly people cannot get. This is injustice completely.
 

 

 

1.  Voter fraud definitely exists.  And it is more Democratic than Republican.  

 

2.  There has never been a case of voter fraud in PA?  ROTFL! lol.gif

 

3.  The IDs can be had for low or even no cost.  Why can elderly people not get them?  

 

Let me repeat what the PA law actually does:  Voters much show a photo ID.  This can be a DL, or other types.  Voters without appropriate ID can cast provisional ballots and provide proof of ID later (this can be documents like birth certs, passports, etc).  If they do not have the resources to get that verification, all they need to do is provide a written statement attesting to that fact.   

 U.S. v. Clappstrial testified that "they never saw, marked, or mailed the ballots."

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #76 of 97
Thread Starter 

I guess what I read and heard about never having voter fraud in PA. was made up by the Governor of your state Rendell when he was Governor. No case in PA ever cited voter fraud at all.This is another ploy to get more votes for the GOP Party.
 

post #77 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by BR View Post

Seriously, marv, drop the charade.  You can't be real.  Vuvuzela, that you?

 

lol.gif

The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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The evil that we fight is but the shadow of the evil that we do.
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post #78 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

I guess what I read and heard about never having voter fraud in PA. was made up by the Governor of your state Rendell when he was Governor. No case in PA ever cited voter fraud at all.This is another ploy to get more votes for the GOP Party.
 

 

I really do wonder if you're real.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #79 of 97
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

I really do wonder if you're real.  

 

I've wonder for a long time. The posts seem strange. Almost robotic with the patina of humanness.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #80 of 97
My money is on Vuvuzela-man. Remember when he lied about his wife and fucked with everyone's emotions? He has the track record for this.

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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