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Samsung designer says smartphone inspired by 'bowl of water,' not the iPhone - Page 2

post #41 of 74
Originally Posted by lvri View Post
I think this is not fair to use pictures of Galaxy S vs Iphone 3G which were modified (like for tabs !)

Here is a real picture of the 2 devices on the main screen (and not in App Drawer for the Galaxy S) :

700

 

Aside from your point being without one and incorrect on its face, look at that screen. You can do exactly what the "app drawer" does on any of the home screens, which exist in the exact same manner as the iOS Springboard. You can't look at that and not notice that your argument holds no water.

 

Ooh. We now have a new meaning for the bolded above. lol.gif I hope to see that get used more.

 

Samsung deserve to be punished (not in billion of dollars in my opinion), but that could be great, first of all, to see rules in terms of patent modified ! This system is broken since a long time now !

 

Blah blah, something about pretending that Samsung is in the wrong, blah blah, trying to use that to distract us and soften the blow of the real point of the sentence where we whine about how the patent system is broken, blah blah… 

 

I guess that's the logical conclusion, though. Every single argument that every Samsung astroturfer on here has ever said is completely broken, so all they have left is to attack the very idea of being able to protect intellectual property at all. 

post #42 of 74

I don't know how they can say with a straight face they didn't copy-cat. 

 

Pause this at :40. Check out the background on the Galaxy. Is that phone running Snow Leopard or something? haha 

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501465_162-57330279-501465/samsung-galaxy-s-ii-ad-mocks-apple-fans/

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post #43 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcallows View Post

she got her inspiration after hitting her head on a toilet bowl

Yeah, after a bit too much saki. lol

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If you want to call me names, tell me to shut up and f off...you will be ignored. I WILL NOT BE BULLIED!!
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post #44 of 74

Samsung is quite clearly getting desperate. It doesn't matter what "inspired" your design, if you are infringing on someone else's patent then your inspiration is irrelevant. A single infringing design could easily have been inspired by a thousand different things, but the end result still infringes on Apple's patents. Inspiration has nothing to do with it. Samsung is losing this one.

post #45 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvri View Post

This system is broken since a long time now !

 

Why? Because someone in the industry is standing up to infringers?

 

Patent system: ok. 

 

Apple using it to defend their patents: patent system is broken. 

 

????

 

NOTHING IS BROKEN HERE. The "patent system" is working just as it was intended. And the courts are doing the job they are there to do: adjudicate disputes. Exactly as intended.

 

The only thing broken is the industry outside of Cupertino. Take Apple out of the mix, and soon enough we'll find ourselves in the Dark Ages of mobile again, today's version of the industry pre-June 2007. 

 

Am I saying there is a monumental lack of innovation outside of Apple? If there *is* any innovation outside of Apple, then something has gone terribly wrong: the also-rans don't know how to make their towering genius and stupendous ideas appeal to consumers. In this market, innovation unseen, wasted, and mishandled, is no innovation at all. In which case, there is no reason for me, or you, or anyone else to bother acknowledging it. 

 

The Apple logo actually has something behind it. It actually delivers great things to consumers who end up wanting more of it. No one else can manage to pull that off without at the best of times, aping Apple (what we saw at CES, for example), and at the worst of times, copying them blatantly, right down to connectors and packaging (Samsung.)

post #46 of 74
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

The only thing broken is the industry outside of Cupertino. Take Apple out of the mix, and soon enough we'll find ourselves in the Dark Ages of mobile again, today's version of the industry pre-June 2007. 

 

The only thing that has been made worse in the entire tech industry, going so far as to encompass all digital media entirely, in the last five years as a result of Apple is data plans are no longer unlimited.

post #47 of 74

FAIL

post #48 of 74

Apple brought in a icon designer who only claimed that "should couldnt tell the difference" between icons. 

 

Yet, they are going app sh!t when Samsung wanted to bring in the ACTUAL designer of the F700 phone, which was submitted for a design "patent" in December 2006. 

 

This device is a significant smoking gun that undermines Apple's entire accusations that Samsung "slavishly copied" Apple. 

 

Whats even funniers is that Apple, on purpose, left out the F700 for it would hurt their statement. 

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post #49 of 74
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post
Apple brought in a icon designer who only claimed that "should couldnt tell the difference" between icons. 

 

Yet, they are going app sh!t when Samsung wanted to bring in the ACTUAL designer of the F700 phone, which was submitted for a design "patent" in December 2006. 

 

This device is a significant smoking gun that undermines Apple's entire accusations that Samsung "slavishly copied" Apple. 

 

Whats even funniers is that Apple, on purpose, left out the F700 for it would hurt their statement. 

 

Is there any doubt left that you have absolutely no argument whatsoever?

post #50 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Is there any doubt left that you have absolutely no argument whatsoever?

I would say there is plenty of doubt.

Are there elements of the iPhone 3gs' design in the Galaxy S, yes, absolutely, unequivocally.

Is it designed from the ground up to be an absolute clone of the iPhone? I would say no, and that is what the F700 represents. It shows that they may have come a little too close to Apple's design, but its not as if that general shape and form was unprecedented for Samsung.

 

Samsung is definitely in the wrong here, but the F700 is certainly a strong piece of evidence on Samsung's side.

post #51 of 74

I "CAN" ?

post #52 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbi View Post

Apple brought in a icon designer who only claimed that "should couldnt tell the difference" between icons. 

 

Yet, they are going app sh!t when Samsung wanted to bring in the ACTUAL designer of the F700 phone, which was submitted for a design "patent" in December 2006. 

 

This device is a significant smoking gun that undermines Apple's entire accusations that Samsung "slavishly copied" Apple. 

 

Whats even funniers is that Apple, on purpose, left out the F700 for it would hurt their statement. 

 

If you gave a shit about truth, objectivity, honesty, etc you would aknowledge that the F700 absolutely bears no resemblance to the iPhone, either conceptually or in terms of design. But you clearly care little about those things. 

 

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2012/08/02/heres-the-phone-samsung-insists-the-apple-jury-must-see/

 

700

 

How is that in any way, shape, or phone similar to an iPhone? It's black? They're worlds apart. It proves Samsung was NOT going in the same direction before the iPhone was revealed, and if anything strengthens Apple's case. Looks like Samsung's FUD worked on you, because you wanted it to. 

post #53 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

 

If you gave a shit about truth, objectivity, honesty, etc you would aknowledge that the F700 absolutely bears no resemblance to the iPhone, either conceptually or in terms of design. But you clearly care little about those things. 

 

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2012/08/02/heres-the-phone-samsung-insists-the-apple-jury-must-see/

 

700

 

How is that in any way, shape, or phone similar to an iPhone? It's black? They're worlds apart. It proves Samsung was NOT going in the same direction before the iPhone was revealed, and if anything strengthens Apple's case. Looks like Samsung's FUD worked on you, because you wanted it to. 

 

... not sure if sarcastic or not.....

 

.... the front is dominated by the screen, faux metal outlines the edge, a single rounded button is the only physical thing that adorns the front, the front is dominated by the screen, and the ear piece grill is remarkably similar. It has its differences to be sure, but no one is saying its the SAME phone, just has enough similarities to show that the Galaxy S was a natural progression.  Furthermore, finding one article of someone sharing your point of view doesn't constitute an objective analysis; especially when that person claims that because it came out a month after the original iPhone it means that its horrible proof for Samsung. From design to release, a phone's development takes far more time than a month, I question this article's author's credibility.


Edited by ChuckVader - 8/11/12 at 6:06pm
post #54 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckVader View Post

... not sure if sarcastic or not.....

post #55 of 74

How could it have been anything but?  Touch was new!

 

Samsung want to show this was the beginning of their design principals and inspired their touch phones.

post #56 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckVader View Post

... not sure if sarcastic or not.....

.... the front is dominated by the screen, faux metal outlines the edge, a single rounded button is the only physical thing that adorns the front, the front is dominated by the screen, and the ear piece grill is remarkably similar. It has its differences to be sure, but no one is saying its the SAME phone, just has enough similarities to show that the Galaxy S was a natural progression.  Furthermore, finding one article of someone sharing your point of view doesn't constitute an objective analysis; especially when that person claims that because it came out a month after the original iPhone it means that its horrible proof for Samsung. From design to release, a phone's development takes far more time than a month, I question this article's author's credibility.

You make some very clever, totally believable, and not-in-any-way-silly, points.

And don't forget that the F700 was constructed from materials that were various colours, which the iPhone also was, not to mention both being made out of atoms.

You've really thrown some light on this whole issue for me...
Edited by GTR - 8/12/12 at 5:28am
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post #57 of 74

I had an F700. Trust me - there's no chance of confusing it with an iPhone. Not in terms of hardware, and most definitely not in terms of software. Awful phone.

post #58 of 74

Actually, I think that the F700 does show some innovation, which is what Apple is asking for.  Now, the innovation was in the wrong direction, as in the phone was ugly, but innovation none the less.

post #59 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by drblank View Post

Uh oh, the half empty, half filled water.  Hack psychologists use that.

 

I think that an engineer is going to use a bowl that is filled with water because water is cheap enough.

 

But I am still trying to figure out why they simply just say that from the back of the phone it looks very much like the back of an iPhone 1st gen,  only a lot thicker.

 

One thing about Apple product designs that become big sellers is that they are usually iconic, just like the early Motorola handsets that first came out were iconic during the 70's.  Boy did everyone that had one seem cool and important.  

 

What I laugh about are the people that use cell phones to look like they are doing some important business deal, when in fact, all they are really doing is find out if they can hear someone through the bad cell connection.

The joke is "The optimist sees the glass half full.  The pessimist sees the glass half empty.  The engineer sees the glass designed and built twice as large as needed."

- or -

"Dear Optimist and Pessimist.  While you were arguing over the glass, I drank the water.  Signed, The Pragmatist."

post #60 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Amhran View Post

A bowl of water? Can Samsung get any more desperate to show it's not copying & ripping off Apple designs?

What this case needs is Susan and Grover, a board with four things on it: a bowl of water, a Samsung 700, an iPhone and an iPhone3.  Cue the music:  "One of These Things Is Not Like The Other..."

post #61 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

If you gave a shit about truth, objectivity, honesty, etc you would aknowledge that the F700 absolutely bears no resemblance to the iPhone, either conceptually or in terms of design. But you clearly care little about those things. 

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2012/08/02/heres-the-phone-samsung-insists-the-apple-jury-must-see/



How is that in any way, shape, or phone similar to an iPhone? It's black? They're worlds apart. It proves Samsung was NOT going in the same direction before the iPhone was revealed, and if anything strengthens Apple's case. Looks like Samsung's FUD worked on you, because you wanted it to. 

Close the phone and you'll see a rectangle with rounded corners, centered screen and all the rest of the blah
post #62 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitz1 View Post

…the blah

You've summed up Samsung's argument in this regard fairly nicely, at least.
post #63 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post


You make some very clever, totally believable, and not-in-any-way-silly, points.
And don't forget that the F700 was constructed from materials that were various colours, which the iPhone also was, not to mention both being made out of atoms.
You've really thrown some light on this whole issue for me...

Why belittle my argument with nothing but sarcasm? Apple's argument is that Samsung outright copied key characteristics, yet this phone is proof that at least some of those characteristics existed in Samsung products prior to the iPhone. The characteristics I named were ones that Apple claims Samsung blatantly ripped off in order to confuse customers. You'll hear no argument from me that software wise they followed Apple's design cues far too closely, but in the hardware aspect they have a case that their design was constructed in house. Just because they copied on aspect does not mean that they should be charged for the full monty.

 

In the case you weren't being fecetious,  the exterior materials were not various colors, on either phone, and I fail to see how being constructed of atoms is relevant. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphonious View Post

I had an F700. Trust me - there's no chance of confusing it with an iPhone. Not in terms of hardware, and most definitely not in terms of software. Awful phone.

 

The argument here is not whether you would ever confuse the two phones, the argument is that physical design cues used in Galaxy S existed in Samsung products prior to the iPhone. If this argument is accepted, than it would mean that Apple's case against Samsung can only be fought on a software level.

post #64 of 74

Before Apple announced Iphone in early 2007, most cellphone manufacturers had released "rectangle with rounded corners" as early as 2003. Nokia released 6030 and 6708 in Q1 2005. Motorola had several models released in 2002 and 2003 [c331/333, e380]. Sony Ericsson had also released many of models with "rectangle with rounded corners" characteristics since 2005. LG produced C2600 in 2006. And many other manufacturers had released phones prior to 2007 with similar characteristics as well.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckVader View Post

 

The argument here is not whether you would ever confuse the two phones, the argument is that physical design cues used in Galaxy S existed in Samsung products prior to the iPhone. If this argument is accepted, than it would mean that Apple's case against Samsung can only be fought on a software level.

 

To put it bluntly, if Apple put too much emphasis on Samsung's infringement of the patented "rectangle with rounded corners" thingy, Doubts will simmer on jurors' mind that Apple will lose the case outright. However, if Apple stresses so much more on the IOS side of Samsung's infringement, Samsung will have a hard time to rebut it- a blowout for Apple.

post #65 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR View Post

So, just for the record.

 

According to Samsung these AREN'T the same:

 

 

700

 

 

But these ARE:

 

 

700700

 

Did I get that correct?

 

Yes you did. What Samsung implied was that they saw a reflection of another phone in the bowl of water.

post #66 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by LizSandford View Post

Typically awful AI story.

Typically useless troll...

post #67 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Amhran View Post

A bowl of water? Can Samsung get any more desperate to show it's not copying & ripping off Apple designs?

I think Apple should use this in their closing arguments. Place an iPhone, an F700, and a bowl of water on a table and tell the jury "one of these things is not like the other" - and ask the jury which one it is.

darn - jpellino beat me to it.
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post #68 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckVader View Post

I would say there is plenty of doubt.
Are there elements of the iPhone 3gs' design in the Galaxy S, yes, absolutely, unequivocally.
Is it designed from the ground up to be an absolute clone of the iPhone? I would say no, and that is what the F700 represents. It shows that they may have come a little too close to Apple's design, but its not as if that general shape and form was unprecedented for Samsung.

Samsung is definitely in the wrong here, but the F700 is certainly a strong piece of evidence on Samsung's side.

Not at all.

The iPhone came out just before the F700. One can argue that the F700 design was largely complete before the iPhone came out - and that might even be a factual argument.

However, after the F700 came out, Samsung spent a lot of time comparing their phones to the iPhone and then making their phones consistently look more like the iPhone. In virtually every comparison where they found their phones to be deficient, they copied the iPhone - so the NEXT generation of Samsung phones were near exact copies.

In fact, the evidence makes Samsung look even worse. They showed early on that there were other ways to design a phone, yet they threw out all the innovative designs and chose a design that was nearly indistinguishable from the iPhone.
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post #69 of 74

How about:

 

Inspired by a bowl of water? With all the crap samsung is pulling, it's more likely a toilet bowl.

post #70 of 74
Yo ho ho he ho
post #71 of 74
So the F700 looks like rubbish, and the iPhone 1 looks like, an iPhone 1. Where's the beef?
post #72 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by inhalexhale View Post

I don't know how they can say with a straight face they didn't copy-cat. 

Pause this at :40. Check out the background on the Galaxy. Is that phone running Snow Leopard or something? haha 

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501465_162-57330279-501465/samsung-galaxy-s-ii-ad-mocks-apple-fans/

Yes. Snow Galaxy ~ not copied from Apple OK!!! /s
Quote:
Originally Posted by VisualZone View Post

Yeah, after a bit too much saki. lol

Wrong race dude.
post #73 of 74
Quote:

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by VisualZone View Post

Yeah, after a bit too much saki. lol

 

Originally Posted by sr2012 View Post

Wrong race dude.

 

The well-learned man meant "soju" ;)

post #74 of 74
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

Yes, I definitely see the resemblance to a bowl of water..

 

Wait- what!??

 

Seriously Samsung needs to lay off with this F700 thing. It's embarrassing, especially since they seem to believe it's their strongest card. Quite the opposite, it utterly proves Apple's argument that Samsung was NOT working on anything like the iPhone before the iPhone, since this phone has nothing in common with the concept of the iPhone. It's black? Is that their argument? I don't get it. It has a damn slideout keyboard and the UI couldnt have looked more different than iOS. Nobody gives a shit what it was inspired by, because it's utterly irrelevant to their defence. 

 

I agree that the F700 isn't the same look since its a slider etc. What I think Samsung is going for is to say that future phone generations took the shape of the F700. If you remove the slider part away, the phone is half as think and starts to resemble the iPhone somewhat. My guess is that they then will say this was natural design progression when moving to a larger touch screen/keyboard interface.  Grasping at straws but trying.  

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