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Romney picks Ryan

post #1 of 103
Thread Starter 

1000

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(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #2 of 103

You would post something like that.  Ryan is the best any conservative or libertarian could hope for.  The problem is that you're totally out of the mainstream, and anything short of Ron Paul is unacceptable.  He's an excellent choice...arguably the best available.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #3 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

You would post something like that.

 

Yes, I would.

 

 

Quote:
Ryan is the best any conservative or libertarian could hope for.

 

He has been rubber stamped by the establishment. That alone is reason to doubt him.

 

 

Quote:
  The problem is that you're totally out of the mainstream, and anything short of Ron Paul is unacceptable.

 

The problem is the mainstream doesn't see the false dilemma before them.

 

 

Quote:
 He's an excellent choice...arguably the best available.  

 

He's an excellent choice if you prefer the status quo.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #4 of 103

Nice intro-  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yke1QDm968 

 

Pretty scary that a Denialist can be so close to the presidency. How did America become so radical?

"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #5 of 103

Well it's pretty much a done deal now. Thanks Mitt! Go Paul! They'll love you in Florida ( and everywhere else also ).lol.gif

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #6 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Nice intro-  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yke1QDm968 

 

Pretty scary that a Denialist can be so close to the presidency. How did America become so radical?

 

Quote:

How did America become so radical?

A previously well organized GOP.  There's some seriously scary people in there ( not all of them however the party seems to be dominated by Tea Party types these days ). However they just don't get that most of the voting public see through their smoke and mirrors. I guess they just don't understand ( or can't imagine ) there's a very different way of thinking about this country and it's problems. Democrats love this country also. They just don't want to see it turn into a country where there is no middle class. That get's eroded every time a Republican gets in there.  They don't want a country where there's only the very needy and the very greedy.

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/22-statistics-that-prove-the-middle-class-is-being-systematically-wiped-out-of-existence-in-america-2010-7


Edited by jimmac - 8/11/12 at 8:17pm
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post #7 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Pretty scary that a Denialist can be so close to the presidency.

 

What the **** is a "denialist?"

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

How did America become so radical?

 

If you think Romney and Ryan are radical you need a serious re-calibration.

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post #8 of 103

Two people who will decimate the middle class and seniors and also the poor.That is your favorite?
 

post #9 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Two people who will decimate the middle class and seniors and also the poor.That is your favorite?
 

 

Because things have improved for the middle class, seniors, and poor under Obama?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #10 of 103

Introducing Ryan, Romney insulted Japan.  While at a US navy base.  Naval Station Norfolk, if I'm correct.

 

It just came on the news tonight.  The room I was in gasped when they heard the translation.

 

 

 

And the conservatives and GOP will defend this one, too.

 

 

The story was introduced on the news with the comment that Romney as a non-stop-gaffe-machine who is dropping in the polls as a result.  


Edited by Bergermeister - 8/12/12 at 8:21am

 

Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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Your = the possessive of you, as in, "Your name is Tom, right?" or "What is your name?"

 

You're = a contraction of YOU + ARE as in, "You are right" --> "You're right."

 

 

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post #11 of 103
Thread Starter 

True or False: Obama and Biden never, EVER make gaffes.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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post #12 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Two people who will decimate the middle class and seniors and also the poor.That is your favorite?
 

 

Because things have improved for the middle class, seniors, and poor under Obama?

They haven't gotten worse like they would under a Republican rule. They've made it quite clear who their favorites are.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #13 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Pretty scary that a Denialist can be so close to the presidency.

 

What the **** is a "denialist?"

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

How did America become so radical?

 

If you think Romney and Ryan are radical you need a serious re-calibration.

Well everything has a perspective. What you're saying for example is coming from someone who believes that there should be no government. I'd call that pretty radical so Romney and Ryan's views may not seem that radical to you. They do to others.

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post #14 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

True or False: Obama and Biden never, EVER make gaffes.

Like this caliber of a gaffe? Where are we at now? So far he's insulted the British, the Palestinians, and the Japanese. Who's next?


Edited by jimmac - 8/12/12 at 10:57am
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post #15 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well everything has a perspective. What you're saying for example is coming from someone who believes that there should be no government. I'd call that pretty radical so Romney and Ryan's views may not seem that radical to you. They do to others.

 

You're right, perspective matters. And when it is far leftists speaking (such as you and Hands), then I could see how these guys seem radical to you.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #16 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergermeister View Post

Introducing Ryan, Romney insulted Japan.  While at a US navy base.  Naval Station Norfolk, if I'm correct.

 

It just came on the news tonight.  The room I was in gasped when they heard the translation.

 

 

 

And the conservatives and GOP will defend this one, too.

 

 

The story was introduced on the news with the comment that Romney as a non-stop-gaffe-machine who is dropping in the polls as a result.  

 

Perhaps you should explain the gaffe since it appears I've read no reporting on it.

"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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"During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

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post #17 of 103
Apparently this isn't made up-

"WASHINGTON -- He's been in Congress for nearly 13 years, but Rep. Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) has only seen two of his bills pass into law during that time.
Ryan, who Mitt Romney has tapped as his running mate, passed a bill into law in July 2000 that renames a post office in his district. Thanks to Ryan, the post office on 1818 Milton Ave. in Janesville, Wis., is now known as "Les Aspin Post Office Building."
The other time Ryan saw one of his bills become law was in December 2008, with legislation to change the way arrows (as in bows and arrows) are hit with an excise tax. Specifically, his bill amended the Internal Revenue Code to impose a 39-cent tax per arrow shaft, instead of a 12.4 percent tax on the sales price. The bill also "includes points suitable for use with arrows in the 11 percent excise tax on arrow parts and accessories."
Kevin Seifert, Ryan's congressional spokesman, did not respond to a request for comment.
"
"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

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post #18 of 103

It's rather amusing that Obama/BIDEN supporters want to pick up the stick of "who's qualified to be Vice President."

 

Now that's irony in its purest form.

 

lol.gif

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post #19 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

It's rather amusing that Obama/BIDEN supporters want to pick up the stick of "who's qualified to be Vice President."

 

Now that's irony in its purest form.

 

lol.gif

Well Paul Ryan as president is a possible future I never want to see.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #20 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well Paul Ryan as president is a possible future I never want to see.

 

Thanks for making my point!

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post #21 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well Paul Ryan as president is a possible future I never want to see.

 

Thanks for making my point!

Well it's true the guy is seriously scary.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #22 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well it's true the guy is seriously scary.

 

And you continue! Brilliant!

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post #23 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well it's true the guy is seriously scary.

 

And you continue! Brilliant!

I suppose you love the guy that would make the lives of Seniors everywhere a lot harder? He doesn't have to worry. He's young and he's got lots of money.

 

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2018906137_ryanwealth13.html

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post #24 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I suppose you love the guy that would make the lives of Seniors everywhere a lot harder?

 

Not at all. But back to begging the question I see. You're a riot.

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post #25 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

I suppose you love the guy that would make the lives of Seniors everywhere a lot harder?

 

Not at all. But back to begging the question I see. You're a riot.

That's odd. I don't See the plight of Seniors who can't afford health care funny at all.

Without the need for difference or a need to always follow the herd breeds complacency, mediocrity, and a lack of imagination
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post #26 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

Yes, I would.

 

 

 

He has been rubber stamped by the establishment. That alone is reason to doubt him.

 

The establishment?  Ryan is a Tea Party favorite.  He's become the leading conservative voice on fiscal issues.  He's the only one that has actually produced a plan to balance our books.  

 

 

 

 

 

Quote:

The problem is the mainstream doesn't see the false dilemma before them.

 

 

You're telling me that Romney/Ryan equals Obama/Biden.  That is simply and completely false, no matter how many times you repeat it. 

 

 

 

 

Quote:

 

He's an excellent choice if you prefer the status quo.

 

 

 

He's most qualified person, both from an ideological standpoint, and from an experience standpoint.  The fact is--again--that no one other than Ron Paul is acceptable to you.  No one.  Meanwhile, back in Reality Land, the rest of us realize that we have to make a choice.  Either Obama or Romney will be the next President.  And yes, it damn sure matters which one wins.  

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well it's pretty much a done deal now. Thanks Mitt! Go Paul! They'll love you in Florida ( and everywhere else also ).lol.gif

 

See you're back to your old ways.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

 

A previously well organized GOP.  There's some seriously scary people in there ( not all of them however the party seems to be dominated by Tea Party types these days ). However they just don't get that most of the voting public see through their smoke and mirrors. I guess they just don't understand ( or can't imagine ) there's a very different way of thinking about this country and it's problems. Democrats love this country also. They just don't want to see it turn into a country where there is no middle class. That get's eroded every time a Republican gets in there.  They don't want a country where there's only the very needy and the very greedy.

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/22-statistics-that-prove-the-middle-class-is-being-systematically-wiped-out-of-existence-in-america-2010-7

 

Scary people?  And who are those people?  And what policies has Obama enacted that benefit the middle class?  What are the results of his policies so far?  

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by marvfox View Post

Two people who will decimate the middle class and seniors and also the poor.That is your favorite?
 

 

How will they do that?  And how has Obama NOT hurt the middle class?  

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Like this caliber of a gaffe? Where are we at now? So far he's insulted the British, the Palestinians, and the Japanese. Who's next?

 

The only place he's done that is in Obama-Bizzaro world.  

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

Well Paul Ryan as president is a possible future I never want to see.

 

I wonder if you actually believe that.  And if so, I wonder why.  He's put forth the only serious fiscal proposals in the last four years.  By the way how are things going under Obama?  What has he done to earn your vote for reelection?  

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post #27 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmac View Post

That's odd. I don't See the plight of Seniors who can't afford health care funny at all.

 

Nor do I. But, as I say, you're begging the question.

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post #28 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

The establishment?  Ryan is a Tea Party favorite.  He's become the leading conservative voice on fiscal issues.  He's the only one that has actually produced a plan to balance our books.

 

 

Your so-called "Tea Party favorite" supported TARP, the auto bailouts, medicare expansion, and growing our overseas military empire. And he's the "leading conservative voice on fiscal issues?" How absolutely pathetic.

 

Quote:
You're telling me that Romney/Ryan equals Obama/Biden.  That is simply and completely false, no matter how many times you repeat it.

 

You're telling me there's a meaningful, substantial difference between Romney/Ryan and Obama/Biden. That is simply and completely false, no matter how many times you repeat it.

 

 

Quote:
He's most qualified person, both from an ideological standpoint, and from an experience standpoint.  The fact is--again--that no one other than Ron Paul is acceptable to you.  No one.  Meanwhile, back in Reality Land, the rest of us realize that we have to make a choice.  Either Obama or Romney will be the next President.  And yes, it damn sure matters which one wins.

 

You haven't paid attention to a thing I've said, have you?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

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post #29 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

 

Your so-called "Tea Party favorite" supported TARP, the auto bailouts, medicare expansion, and growing our overseas military empire. And he's the "leading conservative voice on fiscal issues?" How absolutely pathetic.

 

 

You're telling me there's a meaningful, substantial difference between Romney/Ryan and Obama/Biden. That is simply and completely false, no matter how many times you repeat it.

 

 

 

You haven't paid attention to a thing I've said, have you?

 

Many people supported TARP.  TARP was the right thing to do.  It was necessary.  As for the auto bailouts, that's a legit disagreement I have...though he did not support the GM takeover.  As for the medicare expansion, that was something I wasn't thrilled with--but not totally opposed to, either.  The military comment is just silly.  From your perspective, Dennis Kucinich probably is guilty of "expanding our empire."  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #30 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

Many people supported TARP.  TARP was the right thing to do.  It was necessary.  As for the auto bailouts, that's a legit disagreement I have...though he did not support the GM takeover.  As for the medicare expansion, that was something I wasn't thrilled with--but not totally opposed to, either.  The military comment is just silly.  From your perspective, Dennis Kucinich probably is guilty of "expanding our empire."  

 

And from my perspective TARP, the auto bailouts, medicare expansion, and policing the world were the wrong thing to do and I refuse to support anyone who believes they were the right thing to do.

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #31 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

Many people supported TARP.  TARP was the right thing to do.  It was necessary.  As for the auto bailouts, that's a legit disagreement I have...though he did not support the GM takeover.  As for the medicare expansion, that was something I wasn't thrilled with--but not totally opposed to, either.  The military comment is just silly.  From your perspective, Dennis Kucinich probably is guilty of "expanding our empire."  

 

What is your argument/justification for supporting the TARP program? These banks and institutions failed on account of having to exist in the (so-called) free market, and they were rescued by "applied socialism". Furthermore, many of those who were most responsible for the crash - and the complex financial shenanigans and mega-crimes that characterized the meltdown, were never held accountable and still hold senior positions in that same industry which failed so ignominiously, across the board. 

 

Does law enforcement, (re. financial crimes) only exist to rein in those of lesser means? Do the rigors of the free market only apply to those with lesser privileges, influence and connections? Are government welfare payouts only "acceptable" when rescuing high profile institutions and individuals who fail at the hands of the free market, while "unacceptable" when used to help the poorest in society? 

"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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"We've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming". VP Cheney, 3/29/2006. Interview by Tony Snow
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post #32 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

 

What is your argument/justification for supporting the TARP program? These banks and institutions failed on account of having to exist in the (so-called) free market, and they were rescued by "applied socialism". Furthermore, many of those who were most responsible for the crash - and the complex financial shenanigans and mega-crimes that characterized the meltdown, were never held accountable and still hold senior positions in that same industry which failed so ignominiously, across the board. 

 

Does law enforcement, (re. financial crimes) only exist to rein in those of lesser means? Do the rigors of the free market only apply to those with lesser privileges, influence and connections? Are government welfare payouts only "acceptable" when rescuing high profile institutions and individuals who fail at the hands of the free market, while "unacceptable" when used to help the poorest in society? 

 

This. Well stated sammi.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #33 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammi jo View Post

 

What is your argument/justification for supporting the TARP program? These banks and institutions failed on account of having to exist in the (so-called) free market, and they were rescued by "applied socialism". Furthermore, many of those who were most responsible for the crash - and the complex financial shenanigans and mega-crimes that characterized the meltdown, were never held accountable and still hold senior positions in that same industry which failed so ignominiously, across the board. 

 

Does law enforcement, (re. financial crimes) only exist to rein in those of lesser means? Do the rigors of the free market only apply to those with lesser privileges, influence and connections? Are government welfare payouts only "acceptable" when rescuing high profile institutions and individuals who fail at the hands of the free market, while "unacceptable" when used to help the poorest in society? 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

This. Well stated sammi.

 

TARP was necessary to stop the bleeding.  I didn't like it, but it was necessary at the time.  Your statement concerning the cause of the problem is truly misguided.  The meltdown did not happen because we had too little regulation.  The meltdown happened because of extremely cheap money and the government meddling in the mortgage business.  The sub prime crisis and the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac debacle caused the bubble and its subsequent bursting, which nearly brought down the entire system.  And tell me...what "financial crimes" do you speak of?  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #34 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

TARP was necessary to stop the bleeding. I didn't like it, but it was necessary at the time.

 

You keep repeating this as if it is a fact, and as if the more often you repeat it, the more true it will be.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

The meltdown happened because of extremely cheap money and the government meddling in the mortgage business.

 

So, naturally, the solution is yet for cheap money and government meddling in the economy.

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post #35 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

 

 

TARP was necessary to stop the bleeding.  I didn't like it, but it was necessary at the time.  Your statement concerning the cause of the problem is truly misguided.  The meltdown did not happen because we had too little regulation.  The meltdown happened because of extremely cheap money and the government meddling in the mortgage business.  The sub prime crisis and the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac debacle caused the bubble and its subsequent bursting, which nearly brought down the entire system.

 

So the housing bubble was created by the government...and the solution is to let the government print more money and bail out the corporatist elites that helped create the bubble?

Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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Malo periculosam, libertatem quam quietam servitutem.

(I prefer the tumult of liberty to the quiet of servitude.)

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post #36 of 103

Looks like O'Romney made a bad choice in A'Ryan, the worst choice in decades in fact-

 

2012-08-13-gallupvpreaction.png

"I have been made victorious by terror~ Muhammad

"The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam," ~ Barack Obama

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post #37 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

 

You keep repeating this as if it is a fact, and as if the more often you repeat it, the more true it will be.

 

 

 

So, naturally, the solution is yet for cheap money and government meddling in the economy.

 

It's not a fact.  It's my opinion.  We've been through this before.  So far, the only support for your opinion has been "they didn't prove it was necessary!"  

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzguru View Post

 

So the housing bubble was created by the government...and the solution is to let the government print more money and bail out the corporatist elites that helped create the bubble?

 

I never claimed TARP was "the solution."  I claimed it was needed at the time.  Once again, it stopped the bleeding by restoring some confidence.  The "solution" is less government, less spending, and less taxes.  As usual.   

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Sandon View Post

Looks like O'Romney made a bad choice in A'Ryan, the worst choice in decades in fact-

 

2012-08-13-gallupvpreaction.png

 

I saw that poll and don't think it means much at all.  I'm not saying it's flawed (though Harris does tend to be somewhat biased towards the Left).  I mean, look at Kerry-Edwards.  That turned out well, didn't it?  Surveying people on this issue means nothing for the election.   On the flip side, the Ryan pick is helpful to Republicans.  He comes off as authentic and affable.  He's extremely popular in a Democratic district in WI and it puts that state in play.  It energizes the fiscal conservatives and certain religious groups (he's Catholic).  Even people that disagree with him respect his character and integrity.  He's a man of ideas and substances, and he knows how to communicate them.  

I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow doesn't look good either.  
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post #38 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

It's not a fact.  It's my opinion.  We've been through this before.

 

Yes we have, and when you repeatedly say things like: "TARP was necessary to stop the bleeding.  I didn't like it, but it was necessary at the time." you are making a statement as if your opinion was a fact. More correctly it would be: "I think/believe TARP was necessary to stop the bleeding."

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDW2001 View Post

So far, the only support for your opinion has been "they didn't prove it was necessary!" 

 

Well, yeah, that, and logic and reason and facts. But we won't let those cloud the discussion.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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post #39 of 103
Could you let those cloud your discussions about religion?

 

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” 
-Sagan
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post #40 of 103

I'm not sure I understand your question (or its relevance to the thread). But please feel free to clarify what you're asking.

The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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The state is nothing more than a criminal gang writ large.

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