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post #81 of 171

I'm a graphic designer and this sort of blows my mind. There are a lot of logos and identities out there that blow my mind. For example, http://www.firstalliancecu.com here in my own city of Rochester, MN. Three rounded rectangles layered over each other. This took what...3 minutes of the president's son playing around in Illustrator? Some of the stuff I see here in Rochester is real garbage that doesn't take much thought, effort or any creativity, but I'm sure was well paid for. Or maybe it's an indication that more companies are doing the logo on their own in Microsoft Publisher to save money than actually paying someone who can build something visually engaging and represents an actual concept and brand strategy.

 

Microsoft's old logo wasn't that exciting either, but it sort of does that FedEx implied arrow thing with the O and S and is sort of more visually engaging...not by much, but more visually engaging. This new logo is just the name without any tweaking of the typeface and then 4 squares. Big deal. The old logo is boring but it's more iconic than this. This is too simple. I love simple, but this isn't that amazing. It probably did cost Microsoft a pretty penny to have this developed and built...but I don't think it's going to do them much good. Its like they've been developing this new UI (Metro) and then decided that they should build an identity that follows that new UI which is going to be prevalent throughout it's products. It makes sense, but it's too simple. Like someone here said earlier...they could have designed this in a span of 20 minutes. I could have done the same. There's no real thought involved. "Make it look like Metro" was probably in the creative brief. Some creative professional somewhere just made bank cause they did the one job on earth that required no thought and no effort yet yielded a massive check. 

 

Now if they staggered the tiles and changed the sizes and shapes it would be more like the Metro UI since not all tiles in the UI are the same size and shape and are staggered. This would indicate motion better than 4 squares of the same dimensions sitting static next to boring unaltered text.

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post #82 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddawson100 View Post

 

There's no successor name to Metro. Any recent reviews that mentions that UI is still referring to Metro. The-UI-formerly-known-as-Metro hasn't caught on and I hope doesn't.

 

From Daring Fireball:

 

Quote:
From now on, the new terminology that Microsoft is using is “Windows 8-style UI”...
 

 

"Windows 8-style UI" definitely rolls right off the tongue.

post #83 of 171

"We're really excited about the new logo"

 

This simple statement demonstrates everything that's gone wrong in Redmond.

post #84 of 171

In a cubicle.

 

post #85 of 171

Here's a rejected version of Microsoft's new logo:

 

(click for full size)

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post #86 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpsx View Post

i think it's nice. simple and modern.

No. It's nice, simple and modern in a boring way. Period. Once again, they're taking their cues from Apple and not moving forward.

I'll give ya a hint: MS is looking for "iconic", and "minimalist chic" as in luxury brands. No. They haven't reached this level, with this new design.
Quote:
honestly, i think apple has lost it's way in terms of graphic design. paul rand would not impressed with what the OS he originally branded has become. 

Your opinion counts as "one" (1)... considering that the Apple logo.... even without a word mark, is near the top of the most recognized and valuable image brands in the world.
Quote:
that steve jobs clip is old. the cut of helvetica that iOS/macs use is crap. the built in kerning between the 1 and any other number is so off, and it's never been improved. i saw an early microsoft design presentation where they were zooming in text in windows phone 7 about 2000% to show micro-fine perfect kerning for all letters. that's the detail jobs was talking about, that apple UI designers no longer get. 

I'm going to agree with you here regarding kerning, but it is not "only" an Apple problem. The vast majority of Adobe's OTF font library has horrible metrics. Old Dog's see and know, that Postscript 1 fonts were far superior, even if they were somewhat flaky and seriously prone to corruption. Although, font corruption is STILL a huge problem for any system Win or Mac, and most software by Adobe (check their Forums!).
Quote:
sorry, this skewmorphic craptasticism has got to stop, apple. i never in 20 years thought i would say that microsoft could out-design apple, but they seem to be moving in that direction. hardware? no. but, at least for software graphic design, they are far more on the right track that faux wood or leather-wrapped apple. gross. 

No. As a whole, Microsoft is NOT out-designing Apple and I doubt will any time soon.

However.... you get serious bonus points for your opinion of the faux-wood and leather look, which I absolutely agree, with the same reaction.

I can't imagine the pain and suffering that Jony Ive deals with, when using those apps on his devices. Completely and diametrically apposed design philosophies!
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post #87 of 171

And they probably paid $2 million to ad agency's and focus groups to create 4 squares and use a font similar to Apple.

post #88 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post

However.... you get serious bonus points for your opinion of the faux-wood and leather look, which I absolutely agree, with the same reaction.
I can't imagine the pain and suffering that Jony Ive deals with, when using those apps on his devices. Completely and diametrically apposed design philosophies!

 

True. Apple needs a Jony Ive for the UI. Someone that has the whole vision of now and the future.

 

I actually wonder if Steve was ever that in any substantial way to be honest.

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post #89 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View PostCompletely and diametrically opposed design philosophies!

 

They're truly not.

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post #90 of 171

I guess MSFT will get to an agreement with the Metro Inc. in Germany. They are a big holding for malls and such - but they only have professional/reseller outlets under their name. (The rest are like Media Markt / Saturn, Real,- , Praktiker). What I mean, they are important, but they do not have a lot of mindshare on "Metro". I think, when you asked Germans about "Metro" they would answer "it's the Paris' Subway". And, their Media Markt and Saturn stores are quite big sellers of....brand PCs.

 

I like the new Logo. But I dislike Windows 8 and even more the new flat but still crowded interface of Office 2013.

post #91 of 171

In reaction to my statement: "It's been estimated that 7.42% of the success of the iPad has been directly linked to the eye-catching use of "skeuomorphic" elements in some of the core pre-installed apps..."

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post
 

Really? Fascinating. You have link to back up this claim or have you made shit up?

 

 

You can link back to my original post.  The estimation, or perhaps more accurately 'guestimation' was done by yours truly as I was typing it.  So the statement is completely truly.  The estimate may be off however.

 

But seriously my point was that I am certain that more people purchased iPads because of a positive "wow, that's really beautiful and intuitive" reaction to the apps like Notes and Calendar that were turned away by it.

 

Also, I find the (mis)use/overuse of the term skeuomorphic to be very tiring.  So much of software is skeuomorphic that it's silly to use that term only to complain about some innocuous visual textures.  It's not like Apple is making us simulate dialing a rotary phone to place a call for example. 

post #92 of 171

Microsoft Windows Minecraft Edition?

post #93 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

They're truly not.


That's your opinion, not a statement of fact.

post #94 of 171

That should solve all MS problems.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by thataveragejoe View Post

AI, It's not called Metro anymore...

It has more catchy name.. Windows 8 User Interface!

post #95 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post

Is this a last minute decision or a tightly kept secret they thought would shatter the tech media sites for a day?

It clearly worked. We are all talking about it on Apple Insider. 

post #96 of 171

Windows Metro Sexual.  The new sensual windows.

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post #97 of 171
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post

That's your opinion, not a statement of fact.

 

The design of the hardware steps out of the way so that the design of the software is what the user experiences. The minimalistic nature of the former serves to promote the richness of the latter. You want cold, clinical, and impersonal, Windows 8 tablets. You want something that anyone can pick up because it mimics its physical analog counterpart, Apple's applications.

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post #98 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by EWTHeckman View Post

A bunch of squares. What a great way to represent a technology company! As if computer guys aren't already thought of as squares.
[/sarc off]

 

Sigh. You beat me to it. Apple = cool. Microsoft = squares. How 1960s.

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post #99 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

The estimation, or perhaps more accurately 'guestimation' was done by yours truly as I was typing it.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

But seriously my point was that I am certain that more people purchased iPads because of a positive "wow, that's really beautiful and intuitive" reaction to the apps like Notes and Calendar that were turned away by it.

 

Or...more people were attracted to what Apple is offering despite these UIs.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

Also, I find the (mis)use/overuse of the term skeuomorphic to be very tiring.

 

OK.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

So much of software is skeuomorphic that it's silly to use that term only to complain about some innocuous visual textures.

 

So there you go. You've got your opinion and others (including me) have a different one. Of course yours reeks of Apple fanboi-ism.

 

Fact is though, on some things, they've used this approach to, in my experience, the detriment of usability. iCal is a prime example. Apple might have gone a different route (forward) here that would have created true innovation using the medium at their disposal (software interfaces) to create an even more effective calendar app. But instead they went backwards!

 

Don't get me wrong. I think Apple's done some great UI stuff. I think their trending on things like iTunes and Finder have been positive (though sometimes incomplete and with different kinds of mistakes.) Mail is evolving. Safari is so-so with the recent one taking some steps backward.

 

They are imperfect and sometimes get so convinced of what they're doing that they don't see the better way.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

It's not like Apple is making us simulate dialing a rotary phone to place a call for example. 

 

No...but they're terribly close on other things:

 


Edited by MJ1970 - 8/23/12 at 11:32am

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post #100 of 171

I find many of the criticisms of MS in the logo issue interesting and deeply ironic given how closely it draws from the bauhaus design ethos...as Apple has for decades both directly and indirectly.

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post #101 of 171

If Microsoft likes squares, how about arranging them into a cube? That's slightly more of a catch-up on Steve:

 

Philip Machanick creator of Opinionations and Green Grahamstown
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post #102 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

"The symbol is important in a world of digital motion," Hansen explained. "The symbol's squares of color are intended to express the company's diverse portfolio of products."

I can think of a few other symbols which better represent Microsoft's product portfolio.
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post #103 of 171
Originally Posted by knightlie View Post
I can think of a few other symbols which better represent Microsoft's product portfolio.

 

💩👎💤🔁💸

Originally posted by Relic

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post #104 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by philipm View Post

If Microsoft likes squares, how about arranging them into a cube? That's slightly more of a catch-up on Steve:

 

 

And you sir, should be flogged for soiling Paul Rand's beautifully elegant creation.

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post #105 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euphonious View Post

Well, for a start, Windows 7 has been released - an acclaimed and highly successful operating system whose sales dwarf those of OS X.

Call that 'nothing' if you want to.

Great, the Windows Apologists have arrived. Sorry buddy, you're in the wrong place for crowing about Microsoft products.
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post #106 of 171
Originally Posted by knightlie View Post
Great, the Windows Apologists have arrived. Sorry buddy, you're in the wrong place for crowing about Microsoft products.


We let people spew outright lies about Android products, may as well let the Microsoft crowd do the same. lol.gif

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post #107 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

Fact is though, on some things, they've used this approach to, in my experience, the detriment of usability. iCal is a prime example. Apple might have gone a different route (forward) here that would have created true innovation using the medium at their disposal (software interfaces) to create an even more effective calendar app. But instead they went backwards!

Please explain how the skeuomorphic design of iCal interferes with usability. I can understand how you might not like it. I can understand how someone might think that it detracts from the appearance. But how does the fake leather detract from usability?

Some of the complaints around here are just too silly for words.
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post #108 of 171

I like the new logo, font and choice of colors.  I think it is very fitting and clean.  Call it 'square' if you want it has a very clean look to it which is just fine by me.  I think it was about time MS started updating themselves.  

post #109 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Please explain how the skeuomorphic design of iCal interferes with usability.

 

The issue is that their insistence on applying the desk calendar metaphor appears to have hemmed them in and prevented them from applying true, productive innovation to the calendar application and calender content that would be possible if they simply avoided that silliness.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

But how does the fake leather detract from usability?

 

It isn't just about the fake leather. You're starting to show that perhaps you don't really know what's meant by "skeuomorphic design".

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Some of the complaints around here are just too silly for words.

 

Sometimes the Apple fanboi-ism around here is just too defensive.

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post #110 of 171
Microsoft
Well, that nails it down!  Now the Surface is sure to be perfect!!!
 
(oops, should have caught and corrected "Slate" way quicker...well, I knew what I meant anyway!)

Edited by boredumb - 8/25/12 at 7:56am
post #111 of 171

New lego - same old Microsoft.  

post #112 of 171
Originally Posted by markbyrn View Post
New lego - same old Microsoft.  

 

L'eggo my logo!

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post #113 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay1985 View Post

looks  like I am the only one who thinks the new logo is nicer, I never really liked the old one with the wavy fluttering flag type logo.... but then i've never even liked msft.

probably not, but this is Appleinsider...if it aint Apple you're not allowed to like it...unless it has no chance against Apple then it can be cool...
post #114 of 171

Wow, I can see the creative talents up in Redmond have really been burning the midnight oil on this....Genius...

 

Although with Windows 8, all Metro apps run full screen no matter what maybe it should just be one big square?

post #115 of 171

Actually, I really like the logo. It's simple. And scales very well from 16x16 pixels (think fav icons) to inifinite size of pixels. 

 

Kudos to MS. 

post #116 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpsx View Post

are you really a designer? because, you, like everyone else here, don't seem to understand the context of the brandmark. 

*clearing of throat" --- as a matter of fact, yes I am. For over 30 years now. In that time working with an assortment of leading ad agencies, conglomerates, and printers in the world, creating packaging for food and luxury brands.
 
Quote:
as previously mentioned, though without a gaudy useless comparison to myriad (no graphic designer would even imagine doing this) - this is simply "Microsoft" written with their brand font Sagoe. if you are a designer, you gotta get what they are doing. 

Yes, I get what they are "trying to do". No. I don't think it's working now... or will in the future.
 
Quote:
unlike 1950s design, where the logo/logotype was the brand, they actually are living in the current century. they chose to let the OS experience define the brand. unlike apple, where their print/tv material have nothing to do with the OS elements, microsoft have decided to be consistent everywhere. 

I would seriously reconsider your statement, whether it's wise or not for MS to define everything with an OS experience.... that at the moment seems to be rather disliked. Dangerous stuff!

Whereas Apple can produce an ad campaign any way they choose to... and even pull it as they recently did... but the brand and that iconic Apple logo... didn't suffer a smidgen. Not in the least.

It's called having a logo that eclipses trends, is flexible, and is timeless. The newest retro-rage fonts, such as that used by Pinterest... sit's perfectly well next to the Apple logo. Not so much next to either the logo or the word mark from Microsoft. Just as an example.
 
Quote:
everyone, including you said designer, seem to be judging the logo presented here totally out of context. only in this article will you likely every see just the microsoft logo by itself. any consumer will be seeing it sitting comfortable amongst the whole world of the microsoft experience - UI, print, tv - all of it. 

Yeah. And that's exactly why I consider the design shortsighted. You really MUST put it into it's comfortable surroundings, BEFORE you know who it is, and what it is supposed to be representing. Just 4-squares is NEVER going to be as iconic and easily recognizable as the Apple logo. Ever.

Also, what happens when the "squares" become stale? When the "Microsoft" wordmark doesn't fit, or is not wanted? For instance an embossed "4-square logo" in glass. What if those 4 squares visually translate into a "Suisse" product... without also going to the trouble and expense of adding "Microsoft".
 
Quote:
also, side note - my guess is this was all done in house. probably no external agency was involved, or given their large budgets, maybe for field research and minor stuff. 

Yes... I think so as well. Over 15 years ago!
 
Segoe is a close descendant** of Frutiger, a font I've used maybe once in my career, and certainly only because I had to at the request of a client. Due to the flaring of the curves, ascenders, etc... it appears to me like having "sharp" claws... or knives. Not nearly as "clean" and "pure" as Helvetica or most of the Humanist category of fonts.

On the other hand, it is both fitting for our violent times and entertainment choices (trendy!)... as well as rather metaphoric for Microsoft, with their hopes and dreams to "claw their way back to the top".

** It appears that Segoe has been contested as "an original" font.

From Wikipedia:
In 2004, Microsoft registered certain Segoe and Segoe Italic fonts (designed by Steve Matteson during his employment at Agfa Monotype) as original font designs with the European Union trademark and design office. The German font foundry Linotype protested, citing Segoe UI's similarity to its licensed Frutiger family of typefaces. In its submission to the EU, Microsoft claimed that Linotype had failed to properly prove that it had been selling Frutiger and Frutiger Next prior to 2004.

I don't know what they're teaching you in school (I'm assuming you've went to design school)... but either you skipped too many classes, or it's as bad as some of us ol' Xacto/Rapidograph guys think it's become. Because I hate to break the news to ya, but the 50's and 60's were... and still are... easily the most influential decades of image branding, creative design and advertising EVER.
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post #117 of 171
I always used to like the old logo. Something about one of the worlds largest companies just having there name in italics as a logo was kinda cool.

But I like this one to. It's still simple and is essentially a square version of the windows flag and I tend to find there's something about things being really really really simple that makes them nice.
post #118 of 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by rpsx View Post

i think it's nice. simple and modern. honestly, i think apple has lost it's way in terms of graphic design. paul rand would not impressed with what the OS he originally branded has become. 

 

that steve jobs clip is old. the cut of helvetica that iOS/macs use is crap. the built in kerning between the 1 and any other number is so off, and it's never been improved. i saw an early microsoft design presentation where they were zooming in text in windows phone 7 about 2000% to show micro-fine perfect kerning for all letters. that's the detail jobs was talking about, that apple UI designers no longer get. 

 

sorry, this skewmorphic craptasticism has got to stop, apple. i never in 20 years thought i would say that microsoft could out-design apple, but they seem to be moving in that direction. hardware? no. but, at least for software graphic design, they are far more on the right track that faux wood or leather-wrapped apple. gross. 

 

 

The alleged "modernity" of their revised logo will look even more stale and unexciting in a year or two. It's boring and it's now closely tied to Windows. That doesn't make sense. Did Apple change their logo to jam a giant X on top of the apple?... or a picture of a mountain lion? As usual, Microsoft has the dumbest people in charge making the decisions on their corporate image.

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GOA

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post #119 of 171
Originally Posted by MJ1970 View Post

I find many of the criticisms of MS in the logo issue interesting and deeply ironic given how closely it draws from the bauhaus design ethos...as Apple has for decades both directly and indirectly.

But that's the thing; Microsoft is following Apple's design cues once again, instead of finding their own identity.

 

For everyone chiming in about consistency: It would be more consistent to use Zune/Metro style typography. Giant thin lowercase type, cutting off the right side.

"microsc"

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post #120 of 171
Is it just me or is this a creepy combination of music that sounds like the Mac OS X welcome video and graphics with floating squares flying around like the Apple TV startup videos? Maybe I'm just looking for similarity... I like the logos better than the old ones, but that isn't saying much.
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