HTC has no intention to settle with Apple in wake of Samsung loss - Page 3

Quote:

Originally Posted by SockRolid 

 

And did Google, in their infinite wisdom, patent its precursor to Notification Shade?

 

Or did Google just push out an update ASAP, cross their fingers, close their eyes, and say "Here goes nothing!"

Because that's what they seem to be doing most of the time.  "Legal shmegal.  Ship now, ask questions later."

More likely Google isn't interested stifling competition via patent hording and trolling.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

 

What's the difference? It's a huge, glaring point stamped right on Apple: They took the Notification Bar from Android.

 

If you're going to make the arguments of "don't steal, don't copy, invent your own tech, etc." then you're being hypocritical because of that single instance. Any more would only further the point.
 

That's why you continue to hear it, and you'll continue to hear it--because it's a perfect example of hypocrisy.

 If i can recall correctly, the apple newton had that function a long, long time ago and the patent on it has long expired. so google or apple can use them freely.

patents are there in place to give the inventor a "temporary monopoly" on their invention and to publicly disclose the method for implementing the invention

once the patent expires anyone is free to use it. thats why you don't see google publicly going after apple. 

but in the end google got it from the apple newton..

Here's my take. Apple did what would be considered a LOGICAL progression FOR APPLE in taking their OS X interface and removing the top menu bar and organizing the most used apps on a dock at the bottom of the screen and then putting the various icons of apps, folders, etc. in columns and rows.  That IS THE APPLE IOS INTERFACE.  WIth Windows phones/tablets, they are using TILES, which is DIFFERENT.  With the original RIMM, they have a keypad.  I personally feel that Android, wether it is Google, Samsung, HTC, etc. are in violation of this as it is Apple's interface for a touchscreen phone/tablet.  IT IS APPLE'S LOGICAL PROGRESSION, BUT NOT ANDROIDS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 

 

HTC isn't copying Apple.

HTC isn't copying their computers.

HTC isn't copying their mail clients.

HTC isn't copying their Dock.

HTC isn't copying their background images.

HTC isn't copying Apple.

Here's what just happened to me. 

FIRST REACTION:  "Why the hell is Tallest posting pictures of an iMac being held like that? What is this insanity? Why would someone hold an iMac like that? And why is the iMac so much smaller?"

*Looked closer, wondered why HTC is in the post*

*Looked back at images, sees subtle differences in the Mail application*   "How come there's no Apple logo on that iM . . .  ooooohhhhh . . . . yeah. I see it now.*

*shakes head*

*Googles terms: HTC (and) iMac, together*

Top hit:

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/47129/htc-10-inch-tablet-imac-design

THIS is the problem with the industry outside Cupertino: unimaginative, lazy, and unfortunately, totally unaware of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

Death to HTC! Death to Samsung! Death to Microsoft! Death to RIM!

 

/Fitting right in here.

no, you aren't

Originally Posted by Quadra 610 
FIRST REACTION:  "Why the hell is Tallest posting pictures of an iMac being held like that? What is this insanity? Why would someone hold an iMac like that? And why is the iMac so much smaller?"

*Looked closer, wondered why HTC is in the post*

*Looked back at images, sees subtle differences in the Mail application*   "How come there's no Apple logo on that iM . . .  ooooohhhhh . . . . yeah. I see it now.*

*shakes head*

No, we're both wrong, see. Apple stole everything they have from Android, so it's okay to steal back.

I was going to say "unquestionably conscious of it", but yours is the one that will partially work for them in court.

Originally Posted by dasanman69 
How can a tablet look like a laptop? They're very different…

Almost as different as a laptop and a desktop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

Death to HTC! Death to Samsung! Death to Microsoft! Death to RIM!

 

/Fitting right in here.

All too well for my tastes, alas......

Quadra, weren't you known as LTD on MacRumors?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

 

What's the difference? It's a huge, glaring point stamped right on Apple: They took the Notification Bar from Android.

 

If you're going to make the arguments of "don't steal, don't copy, invent your own tech, etc." then you're being hypocritical because of that single instance. Any more would only further the point.
 

That's why you continue to hear it, and you'll continue to hear it--because it's a perfect example of hypocrisy.

My 2008 iPhone 3G had a bright green "notification bar" across the top of the screen, when accessing other menus during multitasking while on a call, a zero length swipe would cause the in call menu to drop back down.

The same thing happens when tethering except the "notification bar" is blue.

So if  Android is "open", why can't Apple use whatever they want, just like Google uses Apple's open WebKit?

Is it because Android's "openness" is nothing more than bullshit marketing spin?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Amhran 

Quadra, weren't you known as LTD on MacRumors?

Yes indeed. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

 

What kind of an argument is this? Is your argument not that Android doesn't invent, and takes everything from Apple? Does that mean that it is OK for Apple to take something from Android, just because it's open? Design cues, UI and all?

 

You don't think that's hypocritical?

 

The Notification Shade is an integral part of Android, and it was present in 1.0. There was no such thing in a jailbroken iPhone before that, it was added as a feature when someone said, "You know, that makes a lot of sense" and implemented a solution mimicking it.

How come iPhone's don't have tiny little icons across the top bar of the screen, indicating the presence of notifications?

Oh, yeah because they didn't copy Android or use their "open" source code.

So what's it to be, Android is "open" like WebKit or Android is not "open" like WebKit?

If it is not "open" like webkit, why has Google been lying?

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaHarder 

Probably a smart move on HTC's part given that the Jury Forman in the Samsung trail has now disclosed that he had litte-to-no idea what 'Prior Art' meant or how to instruct fellow jurers how to assest such a claim.
http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20120828225612963
"The foreman in the Apple v. Samsung trial has now done an interview with Bloomberg News, giving him an opportunity to answer some of the criticisms of the verdict. It's a video on YouTube, titled "Apple Jury Foreman: Here's How We Reached a Verdict", and while he answers the criticisms, he describes how the jury, under his instructions, decided that the Samsung prior art didn't invalidate an Apple patent. In doing so, I think he has revealed the biggest mistake of all made by the jury, one so large I don't believe it can be ignored. At a minimum, Apple shouldn't want to win like this. His aha moment, as he calls it, and assuming what he says on the video is accurate, was based on a misunderstanding of what constitutes prior art. "
Apple's going to press their luck with all this nonsense and end up getting half of their patents invalidated.

You make the strangest prognostications, in that they never come true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJ Web 

A lil' off topic but CNET is pimping Samsung's Gallery Note 2 today. 

 

http://asia.cnet.com/product/samsung-galaxy-note-2-46728194.htm

 

When I voted "Not for me" in the poll CNET presented a dialogue box offering "Change your Vote?" When I clicked "No Thanks" the vote didn't register.

:/

They fixed, I saw the same thing you saw.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 

 

 

HTC isn't copying Apple.

HTC isn't copying their computers.

HTC isn't copying their mail clients.

HTC isn't copying their Dock.

HTC isn't copying their background images.

HTC isn't copying Apple.

It's a bit hard to see if they are copying the reflection below the icons in the semi transparent dock, like Samsung is with their S-menu in Windows 8:-

This definitely needs to be posted:

http://www.google.com/patents/US20090249247

In case you don't want to follow the link, the patent description is

I don't think the patent has been granted yet, but there is no disputing the fact that were this granted, Apple would be in clear violation.  Can we move along now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo42 

 

zOmg that looks JUST LIKE AN iMAC!  Everyone in your lawsuit gear ASAP.  

 

Can't wait to see what the evangelicals say when Apple finally gets around to adding some sort of widget functionality to iOS.

Why wait when you can root your iPhone, install a custom ROM and add widgets from Cydia.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo42 

 

More likely Google isn't interested stifling competition via patent hording and trolling.

Why did they buy Motorola and continue trolling lawsuits then, particularly those involving standards essential patents?

Then there were the failed attempts to "loan" patents to HTC solely for the purpose of litigation against Apple.

Looks like a patent troll, sounds like a patent troll, IS a patent troll.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 

 

Nothing can be stolen from 'open source'. My answer is that jailbroken iPhones had it first, and from them Apple got its implementation and code, but if you cared whatsoever about the actual argument, you'd know that.

 

Guess who wasn't doing it and making it look like that. Wild guess.

I've actually tried to trace the lineage of the notification shade and so far what I've been able to surmise is that apple got it from jail breakers...who got it from android...whose developers at Google, while coding on their macbooks, were surely using growl at the time. and growl is open source.

and that's as far back as I went but it's a very interesting brain pool and talent that led to the ubiquitous notification shade we all use today

that said, I don't think that the case against HTC is a sliver as strong as it was against samsung and most certainly not willful infringement

Quote:

Originally Posted by hill60 

 

Why did they buy Motorola and continue trolling lawsuits then, particularly those involving standards essential patents?

 

Then there were the failed attempts to "loan" patents to HTC solely for the purpose of litigation against Apple.

 

Looks like a patent troll, sounds like a patent troll, IS a patent troll.

Clearly you don't properly understand what a 'patent troll' is, so let me help you out.

Originally Posted by Wikipedia 

 

Patent troll is a pejorative term used for a person or company who enforces patents against one or more alleged infringers in a manner considered aggressive or opportunistic with no intention to manufacture or market the patented invention.

Please pay careful attention to the last part of this definition, as the last time I checked, Google was very much in the business of bringing mobile patents into the marketplace. They do after all develop the world's most popular smartphone OS.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakefinance 

This definitely needs to be posted:

 

http://www.google.com/patents/US20090249247

 

In case you don't want to follow the link, the patent description is

 

A computer-implemented user notification method includes displaying, in a status area near a perimeter of a graphical interface, a notification of a recent alert event for a mobile device, receiving a user selection in the status area, and in response to the receipt of the user selection, displaying, in a central zone of the graphical interface, detail regarding a plurality of recent messaging events for the mobile device.

 

I don't think the patent has been granted yet, but there is no disputing the fact that were this granted, Apple would be in clear violation.  Can we move along now?

Except Apple doesn't use this bit "includes displaying, in a status area near a perimeter of a graphical interface, a notification of a recent alert event for a mobile device", NOW we can move along.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hill60 

 

Except Apple doesn't use this bit "includes displaying, in a status area near a perimeter of a graphical interface, a notification of a recent alert event for a mobile device", NOW we can move along.

Really??? What exactly do you call it then when recent events are displayed at the top of your iPhone screen?

I HOPE Apple took Notification shade from Google. Google and their Android pimps have been using Apple as their R&D dept. since the original iPhone. There is no telling how much *more* the industry owes Apple in damages, never mind Samsung. Who's next? Who's next to follow down the Samsung legal path?

Notification Shade is very, very small compensation for the violations that are still out there, that Apple has *yet* to address. Samsung is probably not the end of it. What a great turn of events, to have made an example out of the biggest player, so the potential smaller infringers can be picked off more easily. Expect to see at the very least, some radical device redesigns from these Android OEMs based on the fallout of the Apple-Samsung ruling. 

Fair play to Apple. Fair damn play. The industry at large owes them plenty. And Google knows better than to pursue Apple on it. The last thing they want is to be put under a legal microscope. Better to rely on OEMs (while leaving them out to dry) to fight the battles, while Google files a few half-hearted briefs as a consolation. But what else can you expect from some bottom-feeding ad-company that has as much respect for their OS and OEMs as they do for the user's privacy? 

Quote:

Originally Posted by e_veritas 

Really??? What exactly do you call it then when recent events are displayed at the top of your iPhone screen?

Such as?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quadra 610 

 

Google knows better than to pursue Apple on it. The last thing they want is to be put under a legal microscope. Better to rely on OEMs (while leaving them out to dry) to fight the battles, while Google files a few half-hearted briefs as a consolation.

Apparently you have been living in a cave the last week...

http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/152042/motorolas-seven-patent-itc-complaint-against-apple-detailed

Quote:

Originally Posted by hill60 

 

Such as?

I honestly can't tell if you're being serious or not. Are you asking what type of recent events are displayed at the top of the screen? Text, emails, etc...

Quote:

Originally Posted by SockRolid 

And did Google, in their infinite wisdom, patent its precursor to Notification Shade?

Or did Google just push out an update ASAP, cross their fingers, close their eyes, and say "Here goes nothing!"
Because that's what they seem to be doing most of the time.  "Legal shmegal.  Ship now, ask questions later."

Quote:

Originally Posted by dasanman69 

Patent pending

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slurpy 

I love how almost every pro-Android and anti-Apple innovation always come back to the 'notification bar. Fucking amazing. As if this ONE gesture, compared to the very concept of the modern smartphone and the millions of details, large and small, that have been 'inspired' by Apple's iPhone, makes it a wash or something. 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

What's the difference? It's a huge, glaring point stamped right on Apple: They took the Notification Bar from Android.

If you're going to make the arguments of "don't steal, don't copy, invent your own tech, etc." then you're being hypocritical because of that single instance. Any more would only further the point.
 
That's why you continue to hear it, and you'll continue to hear it--because it's a perfect example of hypocrisy.

1. If Apple is found guilty of stealing the notification bar from Google... they will pay.
2. Samsung was found guilty of infringing Apple's patents and violating trade dress... so they will pay too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shidell 

 

What kind of an argument is this? Is your argument not that Android doesn't invent, and takes everything from Apple? Does that mean that it is OK for Apple to take something from Android, just because it's open? Design cues, UI and all?

 

You don't think that's hypocritical?

 

The Notification Shade is an integral part of Android, and it was present in 1.0. There was no such thing in a jailbroken iPhone before that, it was added as a feature when someone said, "You know, that makes a lot of sense" and implemented a solution mimicking it.

I need some clarification.  You keep saying "notification bar" and "notification shade."  Are you referring to the bar in the top menu bar that displays a notification or the actual notification center?

Quote:

Originally Posted by e_veritas 

 They do after all develop the world's most popular smartphone OS.

popular.... not by a long shot, cheapest and most widely used, sure ill give you that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by xRCx 

popular.... not by a long shot, cheapest and most widely used, sure ill give you that.

Considering that 2 out of every 3 people in the world with a smartphone uses Android, how is this not 'popular'??

pop·u·lar (adj) - 3)frequently encountered or widely accepted

Quote:

Originally Posted by e_veritas 

 

Considering that 2 out of every 3 people in the world with a smartphone uses Android, how is this not 'popular'??

 

pop·u·lar (adj) - 3)frequently encountered or widely accepted

again you are assuming people are buying android phones because they prefer them over IOS and not because they are cheaper or in many cases free, hmm $400 ipone which would suck my entire months paycheck away or a free android POS, well I guess ill settle with the android POS until I get promoted to drive through.