New pics of Apple's 'iPhone 5' mystery part reaffirm no NFC chip - Page 2

Re-read what I wrote. I wrote "much larger". I readily concede that the RAZR M is larger--7mm taller and 2mm wider. I would GLADLY add the extra size to get 20mm in screen size.

 

I'm not nearly as concerned with 200,000 pixels (over a 7,441 sq/mm surface) as I am the _actual size_ of the display. The extra pixels don't do any good, if they're not displaying additional information. An extra row of icons or extra width of a web page when viewed in landscape mode doesn't really buy much, IMO. A screen larger on both axes would allow for a bigger keyboard and less scrolling when viewing web pages in landscape mode. Or possibly even a bigger font for those who don't see as well.

 

I'm not seeing it either.

You are totally right. However, I understand that magnetic resonance could allow a reasonable energy loss, and I'm sure that trough chip communication it could be possible to secure the energy supply by pairing the device with base station. Respect to your comment, I would say that the guy who let his wifi network unprotected, is as guilty as the one who steel the connection. If I leave a gas tank wide open in my garden, and you walk near it with a cigarette in a warm day, generating fire ignition, will you be the responsible of the fire, or will it be me for having my tank unsecure ?

Well, it might be not for that device generation, but you should agree that in the wifi / bluetooth / RFID century, travelling everywhere with a wired energy charger (and a lot of adapters in my case) is something of the past yet, and wireless electricity should be the correct technology for next years, much before getting batteries that last 1 month instead of 1 day.

Absolutely! Apple seems poised to utilize Bluetooth 4.0 as their mobile payment solution rather than NFC:

1. Apple generates revenue from sales of hardware, in fact, hardware sales comprise approximately 92% of Apple net sales. Apple will almost certainly use their mobile payment solution as a means to generate more hardware sales rather than compete against competitors and merchants who want a percentage of sales. Thus, Bluetooth would integrate immediately with existing Apple products (many used by merchants using Apple products as a point-of-sale presence) while competitors scramble to compete.
   
2. Apple filed several patents apparently related to the new Passbook feature (the so-called "iTravel" and "iWallet" patents) beginning in 2008 which demonstrates that Apple has been considering this problem for an extended period of time and likely has a mature solution.
   
3. Apple joined the board of directors of Bluetooth Special Interest Group in 2011.
   
4. Apple included Bluetooth 4.0 in both the new iPad and iPhone 4S. Apple is known to test new features in small volumes or ship products with features deactivated until they are confident with the feature.
   
5. Despite comments to the contrary, Bluetooth 4.0 has more than sufficient features to a support mobile payment solution, including: Elliptic Curve Diffie Hellman (ECDH) public key exchange (protects against passive eavesdropping) with numerical comparison (with 95 bits of entropy using the P192 elliptic curve using 16 decimal digit numbers (2(53) providing low probability of success) or passkey entry (with 6 digits) (protects against Man-in-the-Middle attacks). Furthermore, Bluetooth may use AES-CCM encryption. Fingerprint sensor authentication would provide strong two-factor authentication for Bluetooth Short Range Financial Transactions.
   
6. Another consideration is the rollout of new security measures for iTunes earlier this year.
   
7. Interestingly, Apple made a bid for mobile and network security provider AuthenTec. Apple previously paid $20 million for the "right to acquire non-exclusive licenses and certain other rights with respect to hardware technology, software technology and patents of the Company" including "commercialization of 2D fingerprint sensors for use in or with Apple products," with an option to extend the licensing agreement perpetually for $115 million. Apple also spent $7.5 million for AuthenTec to "perform certain non-recurring engineering services."
   
8. Notably, no NFC component manufacturer has announced or speculated (in quarterly reports) about a large, new contract this year.
   
9. Despite numerous rumors regarding the iPhone 5, no mention of a marquee feature for the iPhone 5 has been made. A functional mobile payment solution would certainly be a marquee feature.

I have never seen anyone in the United States pay using NFC on their smartphone despite formerly living in Silicon Valley. A late-to-the-party but functional version of a mobile payment solution is much more likely from Apple. I have a considerable number of family and friends who reside near Tokyo, Japan and not one of them has ever used NFC on their phones (except for some train terminals). The rumors of NFC ubiquity in Japan are vastly overstated.

1.5 GHz dual-core Qualcomm Scorpion with 1 GB RAM
Qualcomm Adreno 220
8 MP rear camera
216 ppi display

1.5 GHz dual-core Krait with 2 GB RAM
Qualcomm Adreno 225
8 MP rear camera
306 ppi display

The preceding specifications are for the Samsung Galaxy S II and Samsung Galaxy S 3. The difference in specifications is barely noticeable other than the display which wasn't improved until nearly one year after Apple released the iPhone 4. This is the state of technology. There won't be any massive upgrades until manufacturers are ready to deploy ARM Cortex A-15 processors, PowerVR SEries 6 (Rogue) graphics processors, 802.11ac and LTE Advanced baseband processors.

Apple is almost certain to be one of the first to sell smartphones designed with the ARM Cortex A9 architecture using a 28nm or 32 nm process which will dramatically improve efficiency and performance.
Apple is almost certain to be one of the first to sell smartphones with the third generation Qualcomm MDM9615 baseband processor built using a 28 nm process which improves efficiency and performance.
Apple uses mature technologies once Apple has considered the actual real-world use of technologies and can leverage technology to provide an advantage not only for Apple but for Apple consumers.

NFC offers few, if any, real advantages to consumers at this time.

AuthenTec AES 2750 "Smart Sensor"?

 I could argue your point backwards. A larger display with the same resolution isn't displaying ANY additional information. The information displayed is just larger! You get no additional webpage/photo/video real estate on screen.

 

Higher resolution, on the other hand, does display more information. Yes it's smaller in size, but it's more information on the screen: more of a photo, more of a webpage, more of a video. But it's smaller, which makes pixelation less prominent and the image and text sharper.

 

And why are you even arguing about which axis to lengthen? The RAZR M, along with most other large-screened smart phones are 16:9, in other words TALLER than the current iPhone 4S with it's 3:2 ratio. The next gen iPhone is simply going to the same aspect ratio as the phone you're touting as better because it's "wider".

 

Your real issue is Apple isn't making the screen .3 inches larger with a worse resolution.

 

"Spring Surprise" like in the Monty Python crunchy frog skit?

This is erroneous. A larger screen doesn't display more information, a larger screen simply displays the same elements in a larger format.

There is a reason that digital mammograms are required to be diagnosed using 5 megapixel displays rather than 3 megapixel displays. A higher quality display simply demonstrates more anatomy (and potentially) pathology. I absolutely, positively don't want a physician reviewing my medical images (CT, MR, "x-rays" (radiographs) on a POS "PenTile" display.

Exactly. A larger display doesn't necessarily equate to improved quality. In fact, in this instance a larger display specifically equates to a lower quality display. I can't imagine why anyone would complain. Apple appears to be poised to offer a larger screen for which many have expressed a desire with the best consumer display technology available today.
Edited by MacBook Pro - 9/6/12 at 11:12am

Some of the wealthy chinese guys at school had freaky pimp pinky fingernails like that.  It seriously grossed me out and I would try and bring it up in conversation with them and they would refuse to talk about it.

Gagging on lulz.

The horror of having inferior hardware in your pocket!

 

They do, check the Apple Store App.

 

You can walk into an Apple store, buy anything you want, all from your phone.

 

No RFID, no need to buy a new phone for this..

 

If RFID was hacked there would be a new generation of pickpockets walking through crowds, tapping into the chips.

 

There, fixed that for you.

Mystery iPhone 5 chip Is AuthenTec sensor

Comparing the pictures of the AuthenTec sensors and the mystery iPhone 5 chip, we have an exact match. Not only do we find the two square chips matching, but also we have matching rectangular silver sensor parts with black printed scan code.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/12/08/16/authentec_smart_sensor_appears_key_to_apples_urgent_acquisition.html

Scroll down half-way to see the picture of the Fujitsu Regza. In the center, you can see the AuthenTec sensor. It is the same shape and size of the square iPhone 5 mystery chip. To the right, you can see a related silver rectangular part. Compare this silver part with the silver part with the black print scanner code on it and you have an exact match. Zoom in on the silver part shown in the Regza picture and you can even make out that the same black ink scanner code of the silver part shown in the leaked iPhone 5 part is clearly printed.

The timing of Apple's acquisition of AuthenTec is no coincidence, if my theory holds true.

My opinion, though I admit it might be a long shot, is that the display will be 3D in some way. There are quite a few clues leading to this:

 

The invitation seems like a bento-box. The shadow may imply depth (an Apple patent does make reference to finger shadows in 3D displays). The caption "It's almost here" is kinda like saying "It's almost real".

 

The new maps app has 3D maps.

 

For a proper 3D display, the front-camera and proximity and light sensors are integral, thus the new component at the top.

Don't forget that much of the A5 real estate is still secret and unaccounted for. The use of these still-secret circuits could be anything, including NFC. The iPhone 5 may be centered on the next-gen A6 chip, which is likely to have even more real estate filled with mysterious secret unaccounted for circuitry. So, if the A5 doesn't already have NFC hardware secretly included (waiting for a future iOS version to unlock it), the A6 could very well have it.

Very good theory, I like your thinking.

 

Is this new kind of trolling? People came to AI to make first posts claiming non-existing features (NFC, 3D) to raise our expectation and make us pissed off after release?

 

There will be no NFC! Period. This has been confirmed by the source that was not mistaken once (http://www.loopinsight.com/2012/08/28/nfc-on-the-new-iphone/ ) so stop BSing here.

I think your theory is a bit reaching. Apple *will* have 3D some day, but it won't have it in the iPhone 5. Since 3D is the eventual evolution, it is not out of the question to make small design changes steering in that direction. To have 3D, there must be two cameras side by side. The leaked parts do not show this.

Apple has filed some interesting patents in recent years for a 3D smartphone display, 3D camera technology that adds a new sensor to accurately record depth metadata, a 3D UI for iOS, and many others. In addition to 3D, Apple also filed patents relating to new technologies to be incorporated into the display, including transparent solar cells to make the screen less dependent on the unit's batteries for power and something called eInk Hybrid that optionally mimicks the Kindle screen on part or all of the iPhone screen. Both these technologies requires integration into the display as part of the design process. While the part for the display is likely being designed for the iPhone 5, I don't think these two technologies have been incorporated into it this time around. However, the mere fact that the display part will be introduced in totally redesigned and reengineered form, is telling by itself that Apple can make major design changes for major component parts on a whim whenever it wants to. Therefore, it is not a stretch that they will do this again and include more of its patented new features, including 3D.

I won't believe it will or will not happen until I hear it from Apple officially. The above is just mere speculation on my part, explaining why you shouldn't rule it out. I just find it odd that Apple would include a wallet-like feature in iOS 6 and not NFC. Also, they've been investing in NFC technologies and related companies over recent years, so NFC *is* coming... some day. Possibily not so soon, but why introduce a wallet-like app so soon ahead of NFC?

This is a forum. What on earth would trolling accomplish? Valid and substantiated suggestions should be welcomed. It broadens the discussion.

I think the new iPhone will sell well and Apple will add features available to Android phones or similar features over time with iOS 7. Till then you'll have to wait for the jailbreak community to do things for it, and surely Apple listens to their jailbreak community now because the Pull to refresh feature found in today's mail app was available in iOS 3.1.3 with a jailbreak. So as long as you jailbreak it, you'll have a phone that's ahead of every other phone based on what you learn to make it do. 

Well thank God!  Keep NFC/RFID SpyChips OUT OF MY DEVICES!

 

see the documentary movie free:

http://freedomtofascism.com

 

read the book:

http://spychips.com

 

But you're fine with GPS.

In which NFC technologies and related companies has Apple invested?

It's just a matter of one-handed use.

 

It's secure one-handed use. I can keep a solid grip on my iPhone while performing all the main tasks I need.

 

When I had a GSII it required more grip shifting to access all points of the screen, and perform regular tasks, which made the phone less secure to hold, which affects my day to day use.
 

 

You forgot the 'oh, so important' replaceable battery.

 

...and how to steal stuff, the Android way, like so:-

 

 

 

It makes you wonder why they bother with the copying.

 

 

LOL

Edited by hill60 - 9/7/12 at 4:38am

Apple iPhone is the most popular smartphone.

Apple iPhone has the highest customer retention rate.

Apple iPhone has the highest customer satisfaction.

Apple has the highest product reliability (including the iPhone product line).

Apple has the best smartphone reliability.

Apple iPhone offers much less expensive prices for apps than Android.

Apple products are highly secure as evidenced by only two significantly successful malware threats in the last ten years (MacDefender and Flashback) across their entire product line.

Apple has the market leading ecosystem with:

* 28 million (mostly) DRM-free songs worldwide (many encoded as 256 kbit/s AAC)
* 1,000,000+ podcasts (USA)
* 40,000+ music videos (USA)
* 3,000+ TV shows (USA)
* 20,000+ audiobooks (USA)
* 2,500+ movies (USA)
* 725,700 App Store Apps with more than 25 billion downloads
* Apple has more than 70% of the digital music downloads


Apple iPhone (iPhone 4 and iPhone 4S) has historically offered the best overall performance of any smartphone for following six months upon release.

Apple provides software updates for the iPhone for two software generations.

 

Lack of a point?

 

 

You realize this image is making fun of Samsung, right?

 

 

Real shame that "most of the smartphone users worldwide" hate their phones.

Maybe I was wrong about NFC. I didn't realize Bluetooth 4 could substitute it.

Believe me, I love my Apple iPhone 4, iPad 3, iPod Touch 4, and Apple TV 2 too much to be a troll.

My sister, btw, has a Samsung Galaxy S3, a Mac Book Pro, an iPad 3, and and an Apple TV 3 and we get into Apple vs Samsung arguments all the time. I keep telling her that Samsung outright stole Apple's designs and tried to improve it. In many cases, they used their insider knowledge as a manufacturer contractor for Apple to gain the upper hand and compete against it unfairly. I guess values and morality counts little for Samsung fans.

I could be mistaken but I believe there are significant advantages for Apple to use Bluetooth rather than NFC.

You are asking the correct questions though:

Why was the FaceTime camera moved?
Why was the headphone jack moved?
Why is a only a portion of the rear metal (NFC antenna)?
Conversely, why is only a portion of the rear glass (fingerprint sensor)?
Why does Apple feel the AuthenTec purchase is worthwhile?
Why did the iTravel and iWallet patents only recently surface?
Why does Apple feel that Passbook is so important?

 

The back panel and two side panels are one piece. That's not going to be a very good antenna, I don't think.

I don't believe so either but I also question whether the design is real.

 

Oh, at the very least it's real. If nothing else, it's an actual Apple prototype; that machining, that refinement of the iPhone 4 design is too sophisticated for anyone else, and do you know how expensive making one-shots of all the parts we've seen are? Even if they're literally just laminated paper to make them look shiny like ribbon cables and cardboard for the pieces, it's a feat. 

I remember last year when virtually everyone was sure that the iPhone 5 would be curved based on images.

At any rate, that isn't the point. My point is that based on the imagery, Apple has made some significant changes apparently unnecessarily. Unnecessary changes are an anathema to Apple.

Why the back panel?
Why not a one piece back?
Why was the headphone jack moved?
Why was the FaceTime camera moved?

 

They wanted metal for the back, but you can't do that and expect radio reception (and unless this back IS LiquidMetal and they just chose an alloy that was transparent to the wrong frequencies, LiquidMetal isn't ready yet). 

 

Headphone jack, who knows, but I have a sinking suspicion it has to do with compatibility with the Dock Connector 2 to Dock Connector accessories. 

 

FaceTime probably because Apple likes symmetry. There were two screws on the bottom of the white MacBook that did absolutely nothing, but were there because the two screws in the same place on the other side did.

The partial metal back seems an odd design choice; therefore, I believe there must be a reason. (cognitive bias)

There is also the question of how Apple is using the (likely) massive amounts of additional space in the new iPhone:

Apple A6 SOC will likely use a 28 nm or 32 nm process indicating a smaller processor (unless Apple decides to use a quad-core processor)
Qualcomm MDM9615 is manufactured using a 28 nm process, again, possibly indicating potential additional space.
Additionally, most of the thinner profile seems to be attributable to the in-cell technology of the display.
Edited by MacBook Pro - 9/7/12 at 9:09pm

 

It's thinner though, so I read somewhere the volume is about the same… 

You must have responded before I finished.

Apparently the thinner profile is attributable to the in-cell technology.
The additional space; therefore, is attributable to the use of 28 nm or 32 nm process technology.

I presume some of the space will be used for Hynix or Toshiba NAND flash
NFC components aren't very large
AuthenTec's AES2750 fingerprint sensor isn't very large

 

In any case, I want it to go to the battery. Anything would probably be better than the drop off from 4 to 4S… 

 

… I just noticed you're in my basement.

The battery doesn't seem significantly larger based on rumored data. I hope the change to 28 nm and 32 nm process technology will benefit users.

Like Steve Jobs, I am second to no one.