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Apple's website reveals iPhone 5 name, plus new iPod touch, nano & iTunes - Page 4

post #121 of 145
Doctor David, please refer to your post above where you said:

"5 comes after 4"

Yes, you're correct. As my nephew in pre-school can confirm, 5 DOES come after 4.

Except in the case of the iPhone....... where it didn't. Hence the irritation of several members here at Apple Insider.

Refer again to your post above:

"You're making it too complicated"

There is exactly ZERO good reasons to call it the iPhone 5, except that sheeple are stupid.
post #122 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

The number of people that buy a product does not make a product good or even correct. Not by a long shot. That seems to be the prevailing argument in favor of (rather, in indifference toward) the "iPhone 5" name, and frankly that's sort of disturbing to see.

awwww.....so what did they end up calling the next iphone? :-)

Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

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Tallest Skil:


"Eventually Google will have their Afghanistan with Oracle and collapse"

"The future is Apple, Google, and a third company that hasn't yet been created."


 


 

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post #123 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by one9deuce View Post

Not having the iOS number and the chip number match up with the number of the iPhone just seems ludicrous. It's like running iOS 5 on the iPhone 4. You had the latest and greatest operating system on hardware that's a year old. Why have the newest operating system called iOS 6, the newest chip called the A6, and have the sixth phone called the 5?
Because Apple is now pandering to the masses. Which is what every company in the world BUT Apple does. Steve Jobs truly was a visionary, and that will slowly fade from Apple over the years. The executives running the show now are great, but they don't have what made Steve Jobs special. Which is what made Apple special.
History repeats itself always:
In a strange twist of fate, we've already seen what Apple is without Steve Jobs.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

I'm truly not alone. How wonderful. 

 

Because marketing it properly is more important than pleasing a couple geeks with OCD who insist that the phone be named after an internal chip that none of the customers will ever see, probably? Call me crazy. 

 

What is so frigging difficult for you guys to understand? Form factor update = new number. Updated internals keeping the same form factor = "S" suffix. Rocket science, isn't it? 

post #124 of 145
Originally Posted by FiveIronFrenzy View Post
Because marketing it properly…

 

6th iPhone. iOS 6. A6 processor. "iPhone 5". YEP. "PROPERLY". I think it's interesting that "properly" can be read as admitting to all the lies, FUD, and worthless drivel that all the trolls said last year. And by interesting, I mean absolutely disgusting.


Form factor update = new number.

 

Fine. Whatever. You want to pretend that, pretend that. At least let it be the RIGHT number. It ain't the fifth iPhone.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #125 of 145

FiveIronFrenzy,

 

You are just reinforcing what we're saying. Yes, it is named iPhone 5 because of marketing. Absolutely correct, you get a platinum star.

 

 

Except when marketing starts to be the most important thing you end up with mediocrity. That is a stone cold fact that you couldn't refute with a thousand links and posts. It might not be the next phone or the next ten, but when you pander to the masses you end up with something ordinary. Because no company spends a ton of money and effort to sell 10 million units when they can spend a small amount of money and expend little effort and sell........

 

10 million units. 

 

We don't want marketing to become more important than the product itself. YOU don't want marketing to become more important than the product itself.

post #126 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemon Bon Bon. View Post

5 comes after 4.  It seems Soli here doesn't understand it.

You can spin it any way you like...but Apple's calling it iPhone 5.

How do nitpickers like you get out of bed.  Lol.

Lemon Bon Bon. 

What's amazing is someone talking a name derived for marketing reasons because they think it will sell the most units and shoehorning some rationale they contorted to fit the most perplexing and irrational logic that could be conceived. If you think 5 comes after 4 then why was the next one 4S. If you think 1 is, well, one, and 2 comes after 1 then you can't say that the 2nd gen is the 3G. Of course, you say nothing on that because the BS you've devised won't allow you to actually look at anything but a small part of this this Flat Earth theory you've constructed. Now I see people have taken it even further to say that the it's called the iPhone 5 because the internal numbering of the ASIC is 5,1 and yet you've not saying that the 2nd gen iPhone is the iPhone S since it was 1,2, as previously noted. Again, as I've been saying for well over 6 months now, iPhone 5 was on the table because you have to market to your customers and if most of them are irrational then you need to cater to that, but to say that we now use letters in sequential numbering as standard and that it's the iPhone 5 because it's the 6th gen iPhone running an A6 chip with iOS 6 with the 4th distinct case is just legitimate rape of lucid thought.



one9deuce: "There is exactly ZERO good reasons to call it the iPhone 5, except that [people] are stupid."

QFT

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

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post #127 of 145
No matter how long you guys want to keep informing everyone of how stupid they are not to buy into your assumption that the marketing name has to match up to anything inside the phone, it's still called the iPhone 5 and it will still be called the iPhone 5 for many years to come. Rather than assume that the people making the phone are wrong and you are still right, how about accepting that your assumption that the marketing name had to match up to anything was wrong.

Or better yet, explain how Apple is going to suffer from this tragic naming folly and thereby justify your crusade.

If they had added LTE to the 4S and made a 4SL, the next one wouldn't have been the iPhone 7 because someone new to the product line would have seen 4S, 4SL and 7 next to each other in a store. Apple doesn't go out of its way to confuse people for the sake of matching numbers and this is what they've always done.

Quicktime X isn't the 10th version of Quicktime. They just picked a marketing label that let people know it was drastically different from what came before it. iMovie went 1,2,3,4,HD5,HD6,'08,'09,'11. They can pick and choose whatever name works whenever they want.

You don't have to be stupid or uninformed to think the name iPhone 5 was the right choice because it leads to "original, 3G, 3GS, 4, 4S, 5, 5S, 6, 6S..." instead of "original, 3G, 3GS, 4, 4S, 6, 6S, 8, 8S". The first sequence makes more sense to a lot of people.
post #128 of 145
Sol- your logic as to why you think it should be iPhone 6 is plenty sound but it doesn't seem right to call people irrational and stupid for not knowing details that don't matter to them, like how many iPhones came before. I think if they had called it iPhone 6 a great many people would have wondered "what happened to the 5, we had a 4 and even a 4s but they skipped right to 6". It's a distraction and apple appears to have wanted to avoid that. The distraction we are currently engaged in seems limited to the crazies like us that enjoy spending a fair bit of time talking and reading about apple.
I suspect there wasn't the same concern for confusion with the naming of the3g because iirc the original phone wasn't the iphone1. It was just the iPhone. The second one had the(new at the time)3G speed, a real selling point. I don't see that as potentially confusing to people. After the 3G they threw in an s. then they went to 4. Again they followed with throwing an s in there. Calling the next one the 5 seems a reasonable way to go. If I wasn't so damned lazy I'd go find a captain Kirk quote where he says something like "to hell with your logic Spock, embrace your humanity".
post #129 of 145
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
Or better yet, explain how Apple is going to suffer from this tragic naming folly and thereby justify your crusade.

 

I already have.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #130 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post

Sol- your logic as to why you think it should be iPhone 6 is plenty sound but it doesn't seem right to call people irrational and stupid for not knowing details that don't matter to them, like how many iPhones came before.

If one is basing a wider judgment on a very limited set of data, like not knowing about previous models, then one is ignorant. I'm sure it made perfect sense that the Sun revolved around the Earth at one point but that doesn't mean those people weren't ignorant.

It's being irrational when you have the facts and you choose to distort reality to fit a conclusion that you've already made. Racism does this in a brilliance way. I'll present no examples of that.
Quote:
I think if they had called it iPhone 6 a great many people would have wondered "what happened to the 5, we had a 4 and even a 4s but they skipped right to 6". It's a distraction and apple appears to have wanted to avoid that. The distraction we are currently engaged in seems limited to the crazies like us that enjoy spending a fair bit of time talking and reading about apple.

I agree wholeheartedly and have stated that a long, long time ago on this very forum and ever since. I also stated that I don't care what it's called (which I usually followed up with an attempt at some humorous name), I just don't like the irrational maneuvering to say that it has to be iPhone 5 because of this or that technical reason. Now we're seeing that it's iPhone 5 because the ASIC is 5,1!!!! <== I think that's literally insane.

I've also stated that I've never liked Apple's naming scheme. They are often corny and often inconsistent. Not a fan of the whole 'i' thing. Not a fan that Mac OS and iOS had very different names for the same items which made transitions more complex (but ML resolved that, mostly). Because of this I was pretty early on with this iPhone 5 talk saying that they'll call it whatever they think is best for sales. It's what they did with the iPhone 3G.
Quote:
Again they followed with throwing an s in there. Calling the next one the 5 seems a reasonable way to go. If I wasn't so damned lazy I'd go find a captain Kirk quote where he says something like "to hell with your logic Spock, embrace your humanity".
Yes, it was the most logical road for Apple to go. I don't recall anyone on this forum saying that Apple's choice wouldn't be logical and sound. My issue was saying that 5 comes after a 4 in the natural universe, not a marketing one.

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply

"The real haunted empire?  It's the New York Times." ~SockRolid

"There is no rule that says the best phones must have the largest screen." ~RoundaboutNow

Reply
post #131 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyb0731 View Post


What I really wish that they would do is put the alphabet near the scroll bar area like they have in iOS

Why?

Just type a letter to go to that letter in the list.

post #132 of 145
Sol- I agree that people trying to shoehorn a technical reason for it to be 5 instead of 6 are wrong. And upon re-reading your post that seems to have been your main point there. I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth sorry if I did.
Your Qft "there are exactly zero reasons to call it iphone5 except that people are stupid"-192. seems like far too broad a brush to be painting with. Even ignorant seems a bit much since its often used as a pejorative, but it is technically correct so I guess I can't complain too much really . Most people have no need to know how many iPhones have been released. Having the naming scheme understood by the majority of potential customers seems like a good reason without the need for them to be stupid.
post #133 of 145

as if this happened by accident...-.-

post #134 of 145
Originally Posted by applephil View Post
as if this happened by accident...-.-

 

… What possible purpose could revealing this an hour early have served?

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #135 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 
I already have.

No doubt the pre-order numbers will reveal how much of a negative impact the name has had. I'm guessing none at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX 
If one is basing a wider judgment on a very limited set of data, like not knowing about previous models, then one is ignorant.

So if you buy an iMac not knowing what iMacs that are no longer sold preceded it then you are making an uninformed choice? I don't think so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX 
It's being irrational when you have the facts and you choose to distort reality to fit a conclusion that you've already made.

The fact is it's called the iPhone 5. If you try to justify anything other than this, you are twisting things to fit your incorrect assumptions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX 
Now we're seeing that it's iPhone 5 because the ASIC is 5,1!!!! <== I think that's literally insane.

I don't see why that's insane. All along you guys have stated 'there is nothing 5 about the iPhone 5'. The model ID iphone5,1 is clearly something 5 about the iPhone 5. It doesn't matter if any phones before it didn't use it for the name.

The real problem comes with the iPhone 6 because it will most likely have an A7/8, run iOS 8, be the 8th phone and have id iphone7,1. But they can still call it the iPhone 6 if they feel like it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor David 
I agree that people trying to shoehorn a technical reason for it to be 5 instead of 6 are wrong.

What counts as a technical reason? Apple names pretty much everything about the phone. If any of the component names were required to align, Apple could have done something about it. They were not requirements.
post #136 of 145
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post
No doubt the pre-order numbers will reveal how much of a negative impact the name has had. I'm guessing none at all.

 

That's not the point at ALL… How many it sells doesn't matter!

 

It doesn't matter if any phones before it didn't use it for the name.
 

The only argument I've ever seen from the other side is "the name doesn't matter, they'll call it what they want to call it, and it will sell millions".

 

That's the opposite of Apple. Somehow people have chosen to forget the last thirty years.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #137 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 
That's not the point at ALL… How many it sells doesn't matter!

So what is the negative effect of the name? I don't see any at all. Has a single news source even mentioned it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil 
The only argument I've ever seen from the other side is "the name doesn't matter, they'll call it what they want to call it, and it will sell millions".

That's the opposite of Apple. Somehow people have chosen to forget the last thirty years.

That's not the only argument you've seen, you're doing the whole Samsung thing with their rounded rectangles. It's the only argument that matters though. The entire numbering convention is different from what Apple has done with other products. There is no iMac 6 or Macbook Pro 9S. If they've never done this kind of numbering on products, you can't dictate what conventions you think they should follow.
post #138 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvin View Post


What counts as a technical reason? Apple names pretty much everything about the phone. If any of the component names were required to align, Apple could have done something about it. They were not requirements.
I just meant that the ASIC(<--sporting goods, right?) component being designated a 5 as the reason seemed thin to me. I think the decision to use iphone 5 is a classic Apple decision. After the fact it seems obvious. The last time a person was in a store a 4 was on the box, the new one has a 5. Simple and understandable without having to think about it. Kind of like the os in general. It gets out of your way to let you get to what ever it is you want to do(unless you want to tinker with your os in which case...). Kind of like you know your at the end of a scrollable page by the rubber banding without having to be told, people will know this is the latest iphone. And while i'm clearly no tech guru my friends and family know i enjoy Apple gear and I'm sure I would have had to field a few questions as to why the last iphone was 4 and the new one is 6. I suspect the decision makers at Apple thought the same thing. Of course they could have made up a handy chart showing how this is actually the 6th iphone so they named it 6 despite the fact that only 2 previous model numbers matched the generation. Ya that seems like Apple. So, in all, I agree with your previous comment, they can name it what they want( I think that was you). I do think they made a good choice for all concerned though, well maybe not everyone to the last person but close enough.
post #139 of 145
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post
After the fact it seems obvious.

 

http://www.phonearena.com/news/Apples-Phil-Schiller-on-the-new-iPad-name-because-we-dont-want-to-be-predictable_id27823


Of course they could have made up a handy chart showing how this is actually the 6th iPhone so they named it 6…

 

No one is saying six.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #140 of 145
Something that is obvious after the fact and being predictable are two different things.And they aren't necessarily mutually exclusive by any means.
You mentioned several times in this thread that the problem with the name they chose is that it was a sign of them starting to design by committee, of giving people what they asked for not what they need. That's about as predictable as one could get. So, do you believe what Phil Schiller is saying is true or what you've been saying in this thread is true?
post #141 of 145
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post
So, do you believe what Phil Schiller is saying is true or what you've been saying in this thread is true?

 

I believe that in the six months since, something has changed, and not for the better.

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #142 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

I believe that in the six months since, something has changed, and not for the better.
So you posted that link to Phil saying they don't want to be predictable in response to me saying it was obvious after the fact because....?
Also, if its not too much trouble could you not edit when you quote me? I would prefer for my statements to be read in context.
post #143 of 145
Originally Posted by Doctor David View Post
So you posted that link to Phil saying they don't want to be predictable in response to me saying it was obvious after the fact because....?

 

Because it isn't obvious after the fact, and it wasn't obvious before the fact.


Also, if its not too much trouble could you not edit when you quote me? I would prefer for my statements to be read in context.

 

I trim for context's sake and split for clarity's sake. I've had to correct enough times when I don't split that I do it by reflex now. 

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply

Originally posted by Marvin

Even if [the 5.5” iPhone exists], it doesn’t deserve to.
Reply
post #144 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

Because it isn't obvious after the fact, and it wasn't obvious before the fact.

I trim for context's sake and split for clarity's sake. I've had to correct enough times when I don't split that I do it by reflex now. 
I do think its obvious after the fact. we'll have to agree to disagree since its subjective. I never said it was obvious before the fact, thats pretty clearly a red herring.
Could you just not edit my posts? If youre going to quote me i prefer my statements be in the context I put them, since they are my statements. I see the benefit of splitting posts since it allows a person to respond to something specific in a clear manner.
post #145 of 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

… What possible purpose could revealing this an hour early have served?


attention for example! i'm not saying it was a good move

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