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Riot reported at Apple partner manufacturer Foxconn's iPhone 5 plant [ux2] - Page 2

post #41 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

The pre-teens are probably not the actual rioters. The news gets out of some injustice and the hooligans converge to vent their anger for whatever cause de jure. There is a lot of sociological assertiveness emerging in many parts of the developing world recently and the majority of these disturbances are instigated by adolescent males. The examples are wide ranging but there have been recent news of riots in China about tiny disputed islands on which no one lives but nevertheless it has caused numerous burnings of Japanese businesses, flags and cars. Young people are immature in every society, but given an excuse for social disorder there is very little personal restraint and the confrontations escalate quickly. Occasionally we see the same type of crowd behavior in the the US and UK etc, but the emerging third world societies are particularly susceptible to this type of unrest as recent current events have confirmed especially in the Islamic world. 

 

Ahh... the dog days of summer when third-world countries all go a little batty and bristly. It will all settle down once it gets cold and abusing your immediate family becomes a far easier way to generate some warmth. 

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #42 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

 

So you'd rather Apple use robots to build their machines instead, Im sure all those Chinese workers would be better off eh? Maybe then they'd just go live off their investments or something. Or, more likely, go back to their villages and starve. But hey, at least we don't have "slave labor" then, right? What a humanitarian you are. And by humanitarian, I mean naive, idealistic, short-sighted hypocrite. 

Improvement in factory automation plus rapidly increasing labor costs abroad and higher transportation costs offer hope that manufacturing capability/capacity will return to the U.S.--closer to consumers (hopefully still).

In the mean time, drink your slurpy while you can.

post #43 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slurpy View Post

 

So you'd rather Apple use robots to build their machines instead, Im sure all those Chinese workers would be better off eh? Maybe then they'd just go live off their investments or something. Or, more likely, go back to their villages and starve. But hey, at least we don't have "slave labor" then, right? What a humanitarian you are. And by humanitarian, I mean naive, idealistic, short-sighted hypocrite. 

 

I'm sure if you lived in the mid 1800's you would be supporting slave plantations of the south because by your reasoning the slaves were better off having those jobs and you would have bashed abolitionists for your same stupid and selfish reasons. It's always those (like yourself) who sold out and lost their conscious who want to bring others down to their level. 


Edited by Commodification - 9/24/12 at 12:20am
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post #44 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

This story has nothing to do with Apple.
From Reuters:
He said the company will issue a statement later on Monday. The Taiyuan plant makes parts for automotive electronics as well as a variety of other electronic parts.

 

Ahh...so... this explains evely thing. These were Honda and Toyota parts for much hated Japanese companies! Evelyone liot!!!

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #45 of 77

A recent video clip of Tim Cook on why Apple doesn't have their own factory in China and if they will ever bring products back to the USA @http://youtu.be/DGUC8ekdPcE

I think it's rather obvious that Apple hides behind their Foxconn partner (gives them room from taking direct responsibility on worker abuses) even though there are many Apple-only facilities within Foxconn properties.


Edited by Commodification - 9/24/12 at 12:34am
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post #46 of 77

Riot reported at Apple partner manufacturer Foxconn's iPhone 5 plant

So...I'm assuming everybody's already crossed off the list the possibility that it was a riot to get in and buy iPhones?


Edited by GTR - 9/24/12 at 3:38am
Pot is legal in North Korea.
That explains a considerable amount.

"The United States will respond proportionally at a place and time we choose..."
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Pot is legal in North Korea.
That explains a considerable amount.

"The United States will respond proportionally at a place and time we choose..."
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post #47 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodification View Post

An insanely great video clip from 1990 of Steve Jobs talking highly about Next's American factory and it's use of automation @ http://youtu.be/2nMD6sjAe8I?t=11m42s

 

This is interesting since Apple went to China to build their products, not to use the latest high-tech automation but to take advantage of poor slave-like human workers.

 

Look how much better workers were treated in Next's California factory (from a 1990 edition of Fortune magazine):

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/1990/02/26/73121/index.htm

 

"The workers are not restricted to the assembly line, as their counterparts are in a traditional factory. They are just as likely to be at their own computers, doing a statistical analysis of defect rates to find the cause of a snag. Next's two-year-old 40,000-square-foot plant in Fremont, California, produces circuitboards for more than 60 machines a day, or approximately $100 million of hardware in a year. That's just a fraction of capacity, since Next sales are off to a slow start. If the machines are a hit, the plant could produce up to $1 billion worth of them a year with no more than 100 workers. Says Jobs: ''I'm as proud of the factory as I am of the computer.''

 

Manufacturing has changed radically in the 20 years since that video. One of the things that Jobs learned from that experiment in automation is that it is (1) very expensive to set up, and (2) very hard to modify for a different product. (3) extremely hard to balance the workload, so the process that takes the most time becomes the bottle neck. (4) By the time you get a fully automated line tuned, you (a) need to tear it down and produce a different product, or (b) constantly be starting up and stopping the line due to critical machine maintenance. 

 

What works better in today's manufacturing is a combination of automation and human labor. Now, any factory is a hungry machine and needs to be fed constantly. Foxxcon has hundreds of manufacturers they build for and so feeding the factory is easy. Apple cannot stay competitive if they had to feed their own factory. Jobs learned that as well with NeXT. It was the lessons that he learned with the NeXT factory that brought him to the current fabrication strategy... not any love for Chinese labor. If there were an equivalent to Foxxcon in the USA, it would need an infrastructure to support it. (1) Massive numbers of production workers that could be hired or let go as work built up or died down. The hiring needed to be done in a matter of hours, not weeks or months. (2) Massive numbers of professionals need to be available for surges in need. For example, "we need 25,000 mechanical engineers next week." Such a request is possible in China, but just wouldn't be thinkable in the USA. 

 

Then, outside of the factory, there will be needed roads and runways to move the finished goods quickly and bring in raw materials even as rapidly. Look how long it took for Apple to get the solar and fuel cells installed in NC. American workers, suppliers and local governmental bodies just cannot act as fast as their Asian counterparts. We generally think in terms of weeks or months instead of days or hours. It was once in our DNA, but no longer is there.  Read up on how rapidly the Pentagon was built, or auto factories converted to tank production during WWII. The USA was once a powerhouse of production, not just in volume but also in speed of ramping up. While the world is evolving faster today than in 1940, the USA infrastructure is acting as a damping effect on keeping up. 

 

Even if we were to try to ramp up our automation, we encounter strange problems. For example, it was an American mathematician that developed fuzzy logic, the basis of smooth robotic control. No American factory was interested in that form of machine control, however the Asians were. Now, the Asians manufacture nearly all the robotic systems in the world. The USA would need to buy boatloads of Asian robotic machines and control systems just to get back into automation production. When you watch an American car commercial and they are showing the welding robots hard at work... you are watching Asians (in proxy) building American auto in American factories.

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #48 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodification View Post

A recent video clip of Tim Cook on why Apple doesn't have their own factory in China and if they will ever bring products back to the USA @http://youtu.be/DGUC8ekdPcE
I think it's rather obvious that Apple hides behind their Foxconn partner (gives them room from taking direct responsibility on worker abuses) even though there are many Apple-only facilities within Foxconn properties.

 

Your leap of logic is equivalent to blaming auto manufactures for abuses in iron mines. 

 

Even then, Apple has shown a deep interest in the health and welfare of the Foxxcon workers far beyond what may be required of them. In all fairness, this is in stark contrast to how Samsung concerns itself in the compliance of its suppliers to fundamental human treatment of their workers.

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #49 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodification View Post

 

I'm sure if you lived in the mid 1800's you would be supporting slave plantations of the south because by your reasoning the slaves were better off having those jobs and you would have bashed abolitionists for your same stupid and selfish reasons. It's always those (like yourself) who sold out and lost their conscious who want to bring others down to their level. 

 

I'm afraid your analogy fails due to the negro slaves not being here willingly. They were totally at home in Africa, even though they may have starved in Africa due to local conditions, by bringing them to America we imposed a do or die condition upon them with no hope of financial betterment or returning home.

 

The Chinese worker has a choice to stay home and eke by, or go work for Foxxcon and create comparative wealth in a short period of time. This is more akin to how the gold rush worked in American society in the 1800s. In both situations, the idea was to return back home in a much improved financial condition than when one left. 

 

Your final sentence is so idiotic I won't even address it.

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #50 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleInsider View Post

Update 2: Foxconn has reportedly shut down the Taiyuan factory due to the disturbance which reportedly injured 40 people.

 

40 people... that's less the number of people that scrub the toilets on the night shift.

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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post #51 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

Products made at Foxconn.

Microsoft (United States)[39] [Windows phone, X Box]
 

 

Didn't know Microsoft made Windows Phone hardware.....

post #52 of 77
these things happen all the time.


Gary.
post #53 of 77

No insurance and break your iphone. Cost to replace = £119. Break your Samsung Galaxy III. Cost to replace = £500.

Erm who the greedy one now.


I have owned Apple products since 1996 and have only spent a vert small amount on repairs. In that time I have owned 3 desktops, 3 laptops and 5 iPhones (this is between 2 adults and 2 children).

2 iphones that I broke £238. 1 power pack in my imac £50. so in 16 years of ownership my bill or repairs come to £288. I've had numerous things fixed/replaced free of charge.

All the above from the worlds greediest company !!!! I think not.


They are out to make money, thats what their business is, but they have one of the best customer services and that counts for a lot in my book.


Gary.

post #54 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Synced between Notes on my Macs and my iPad. Not done yet. lol.gif

 

Doesn't that score you a point? (Claiming ownership...) ;-)

post #55 of 77
Why did Steve change tactics? Mmm, could Next have lost their shirt trying to make these $13,000 computers and actually sell them?

I wish we really were in a world where it was just because we simply didnt want to do it. Sorry, but there are not enough trained American engineers available in the next 3 years to launch the iPhone 5. It took 60,000 trained engineers to launch the 3g version. Even if that number is unchanged with volume at 8 times higher, it still is just not possible here.
post #56 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

This is due to exploitation and Apple is contributing to it. What, only a couple of bucks or so go labor on iPhone?

 

Apple is turning out to be the most greediest company in history.

 

Apple customer since 1990...

 

I agree with most of the contributors that the first two statements are inaccurate and are opinions of the writer and the last is Irrelevant. Point 2 would be correct if the phrase "the most greedy" to "one of  the most greedy". The statement is based on corporate behaviour. When the previous CEO was alive, Apple didn't want to pay dividends to the shareholders or have charitable giving and now Apple have a huge sum of money offshore which they don't want to repatriate due to paying US tax.

 

Still, this has little to do with why the riot took place  it probably started like this

 

CheekMan  :  Do you mind?  I can't hear a word he's saying.
Wife:        Don't you "do you mind" me...I'm talking to my husband.
Cheeky Man:  Well go and talk to him somewhere else!  I can't hear a bloody
             thing!
Big-nose:    Don't you swear at my wife.
CheekyMan:   I was only asking her to shut up so we can hear what he's saying,
             Big-nose.
Wife:        Don't you call my husband "Big-nose."
Cheeky Man:  Well he has got a big nose.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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post #57 of 77

Morenci AZ

 

 

 

ZhengZhou China

 

 

 

 

Daly City CA

 

 

 

 

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post #58 of 77

 

 

Quote:

Greed is the inordinate desire to possess wealth, goods, or objects of abstract value with the intention to keep it for one's self, far beyond the dictates of basic survival and comfort. It is applied to a markedly high desire for and pursuit of wealth, status, and power.

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greed

 

 

 

 

Quote:

In economics, the term economic efficiency refers to the use of resources so as to maximize the production of goods and services.[1] An economic system is said to be more efficient than another (in relative terms) if it can provide more goods and servicesfor society without using more resources. In absolute terms, a situation can be called economically efficient if:

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_efficiency

 

 

 

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post #59 of 77

 

 

 

Was Andrew Carnegie a Robber Barron?

 

Leland Stanford?

 

Bill Gates?

 

Steve Jobs?

 

Tim Cook?

"Swift generally gets you to the right way much quicker." - auxio -

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post #60 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeRange View Post

As an expat living in China, I can tell you that their are in fact 10's of thousands of demonstrations in China every year. Yes, 10's of thousands.

 

It's finally time for the oppressed Chinese masses to rise up, unite, and fight for socialism!

 

Oh, wait...


Edited by Lebensmuede - 9/24/12 at 5:01am
post #61 of 77

Update: According to Reuters, a Foxconn official said the incident was in fact a fight between workers from different production lines.
"The fight is over now ... we're still investigating the cause of the fight and the number of people involved," said Foxconn spokesman Louis Woo. He went on to say the company will release a statement regarding the matter later on Monday.
Update 2: Foxconn has reportedly shut down the Taiyuan factory due to the disturbance which reportedly injured 40 people.

 

 

Terminate those responsible, set an example, and fill those positions. With iPhone demand being as high as it is, there's no room for this sort of nonsense. 

post #62 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


Update: According to Reuters, a Foxconn official said the incident was in fact a fight between workers from different production lines.
"The fight is over now ... we're still investigating the cause of the fight and the number of people involved," said Foxconn spokesman Louis Woo. He went on to say the company will release a statement regarding the matter later on Monday.
Update 2: Foxconn has reportedly shut down the Taiyuan factory due to the disturbance which reportedly injured 40 people.

 

 

Terminate those responsible, set an example, and fill those positions. With iPhone demand being as high as it is, there's no room for this sort of nonsense. 

 

Ahh... it all started when one worker said to another:  "Yo Mama makes Windows phones..."

 

Aside:  My riot-free iP5 just shipped from ZhengZhou China to Inchon, Korea -- first time Korea was on the flight path for anything I ordered from Apple...  I wonder if Sammy...  ...???  ...Nah?


Edited by Dick Applebaum - 9/24/12 at 6:03am
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post #63 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac-user View Post

First I thought it's about a concert of a Russian band at Foxconn... then I saw it's not the Pussy Riot... it's pissy riot (or PC riot?).

Does anyone know if it has affected Apple's production? if not, it's not a mac related news.

 

It's "expected" to--hence the rapid AAPL sell off this morning.  Anything that affects--or might affect--iPhone 5 production is news.  Hopefully, just a minor glitch.  Foxconn will just build new Chinese city and factory in a few days we'll we'll be back to normal.

post #64 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

This is due to exploitation and Apple is contributing to it. What, only a couple of bucks or so go labor on iPhone?

 

Apple is turning out to be the most greediest company in history.

 

Apple customer since 1990...

 

Genius.

post #65 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

This is due to exploitation and Apple is contributing to it. What, only a couple of bucks or so go labor on iPhone?

 

Apple is turning out to be the most greediest company in history.

 

Apple customer since 1990...

 

Fist fights in potato packing factories are due to greedy potato buyers and grocers.  True story.  Why can't the potato greed stop?  I heard someone got into a fist fight at Eddy's Quick Stop the other day.  Eddy is a greedy sumbich, and if it weren't for big oil it never would have happened.

 

I've been eating potatoes and gasoline since 1980, so I should know.

post #66 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sol77 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

This is due to exploitation and Apple is contributing to it. What, only a couple of bucks or so go labor on iPhone?

 

Apple is turning out to be the most greediest company in history.

 

Apple customer since 1990...

 

Fist fights in potato packing factories are due to greedy potato buyers and grocers.  True story.  Why can't the potato greed stop?  I heard someone got into a fist fight at Eddy's Quick Stop the other day.  Eddy is a greedy sumbich, and if it weren't for big oil it never would have happened.

 

I've been eating potatoes and gasoline since 1980, so I should know.

 

LOL... Eating potatoes and passing gas...

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post #67 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Was Andrew Carnegie a Robber Barron?

No, but he gave us Hagenaars a great Peace Palace!
Send from my iPhone. Excuse brevity and auto-corrupt.
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Send from my iPhone. Excuse brevity and auto-corrupt.
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post #68 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by malax View Post

It's "expected" to--hence the rapid AAPL sell off this morning.  Anything that affects--or might affect--iPhone 5 production is news.  Hopefully, just a minor glitch.  Foxconn will just build new Chinese city and factory in a few days we'll we'll be back to normal.

On stock prices, we all know there are never any external factors such as:

Stocks head lower on more gloom from Europe
http://www.usatoday.com/money/markets/story/2012/09/24/stocks-head-lower-on-more-gloom-from-europe/57836188/1

Story posted 45 minutes ago.

So it's not as if the entire market took a bit of a dive.

http://www.google.com/finance?q=INDEXDJX%3A.DJI%2CINDEXSP%3A.INX%2CINDEXNASDAQ%3A.IXIC&ei=7GtgUPC5JobslAOYLA

Apple took it worse than average, but still not bad on the rebound.

Anyway, I try to avoid reading anything into individual stocks without factoring in the broader picture first.
Edited by JeffDM - 9/24/12 at 7:32am
post #69 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerk36 View Post

Wow you make a good point.  We need to pay another country for our goods.  Screw making anything here any more.  The minimum wage jobs created are a waste of time.  People really dont need to get a job HERE do they?  We have enough of those at Mc Donald's  Your point was well made.  Your one of those people who like cheap labor in china.  Screw the future and screw the economy.  Tax paying jobs are a waste of time here.  And now the insert of sarcasm and creative ego type will be posted to make one think this Ikrupp is all that and more.  He must think highly of his god like status.

Not fond of thinking beyond the emotional spectrum, are you?

post #70 of 77
"Every age has its massive moral blind spots. We might not see them, but our children will." - Bono
We become what we behold. We shape our tools and then our tools shape us.- Marshall McLuhan

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post #71 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by pfisher View Post

This is due to exploitation and Apple is contributing to it. What, only a couple of bucks or so go labor on iPhone?

Zero proof that anything iPhone or Apple was involved in this. And yet every story will toss Apple in the headline for the hits

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #72 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffDM View Post

Where do you keep your list?

On his Galaxy Tab of course. They are sooooo much better than anything Apple has done. Cause ya know Android is all open and stuff. That makes it way better than iOS

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #73 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodification View Post


This is interesting since Apple went to China to build their products, not to use the latest high-tech automation but to take advantage of poor slave-like human workers.

It is also very important to point out that the electronics we are talking about still require a number of rare earth metals that are under China's control. They are able and have refused to allow export of these metals to plants. If you want the metals they will be processed in China.

A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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A non tech's thoughts on Apple stuff 

(She's family so I'm a little biased)

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post #74 of 77

Maybe they were looking for love but iMaps failed them.

post #75 of 77
Originally Posted by BestKeptSecret View Post
OT: Wasn't there some particular image you said you'd use as your signature if the new iPhone was called iPhone 5? I haven't seen that yet.

 

Ah, that. I was too busy being dumbstruck that my favorite company was beginning to make the mistakes that nearly bankrupted it fifteen years ago to remember. I'll post it if they make an iPad mini. Same theme, at least.


Originally Posted by Sol77 View Post
I've been eating potatoes and gasoline since 1980, so I should know.

 

I think you may have been eating gasoline for a little less time than that if you're alive.


Originally Posted by charlituna View Post
Zero proof that anything iPhone or Apple was involved in this. And yet every story will toss Apple in the headline for the hits

 

And ONLY Apple. NO other company ever uses Foxconn. Foxconn is actually just the name of the building; Apple directly owns everything over there.

post #76 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

Was Andrew Carnegie a Robber Barron?


No, but he gave us Hagenaars a great Peace Palace!

 

 

Actually, he was... take a look at this:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robber_baron_(industrialist)

 

 

including the revisionism:

 

 

Quote:

After the Depression, business historians, led by Allan Nevins, began revising this view of American big businessmen by advocating the "Industrial Statesman" thesis.
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post #77 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlituna View Post


Zero proof that anything iPhone or Apple was involved in this. And yet every story will toss Apple in the headline for the hits

 

I was heartened to read the New York Times this morning that Apple wasn't sucked into the story alone as you and I expected. In fact Apple was given sole credit for its efforts to better conditions and pay. This factory employes 79.000 people, of which about 40 were injured. Factory will re-open on Tuesday.

 

Quote: New Your Times
The disturbance is the latest to hit Foxconn, a key supplier of products to Apple and other global electronics companies, including Hewlett-Packard, Dell and Microsoft.
Foxconn, which is part of the Hon Hai Group of Taiwan, has been struggling to improve labor conditions at its China factories following reports about labor abuse and work safety violations.
Apple and Foxconn have worked together in the last year to improve conditions, raise pay and improve labor standards.
Disturbances at factories have become increasingly common in China, rights groups say, as laborers have begun to demand higher pay and better conditions.

 

"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
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"That (the) world is moving so quickly that iOS is already amongst the older mobile operating systems in active development today." — The Verge
Reply
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