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Google's Schmidt offers strong words regarding Apple Maps flap - Page 2

post #41 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Then go ahead and flip. No one cares.
Frankly, Street View looks like a total waste of time. I guess it's useful if you can't read a map or house numbers, but a normal person can look at a 2D map and see where they are.

Well, if that's the case then don't use directions or turn by turn. I use street view to see specifically where something is. When in a busy shopping strip not everything has a prominent premise number. Or when travelling its a good way to see specific landmarks. Or see what a hotel location looks like. It may look like a waste of time for you but it's not for others. How about you think how others interact with sometime rather than give your own biased opinion.
post #42 of 135
I am just happy to be a proud owner of iPhone 5. Maps...I have waited many years for turn-by-turn navigation, and now I have it. I don't even need the flyover feature: use too much data and takes too long. If other iPhone users still want Google Maps, you can create add the website to your home page. 2 things I want the most on a Android phone is a offline feature and the "My Places" which allows me to work on the same map across different devices and platforms (I plan my trip on my PC and use the same map on my iPhone). Google Map is still superior, but not essential. I'll wait for these features to come onto my iPhone.
post #43 of 135

How did Apple 1) ever let this guy on the Board, and 2) didn't sue him for using inside information to Google's advantage? The guy makes my skin crawl. 

 

With that said, Google's map service on IOS sucked. So much so I bought Navigon, which is great for turn by turn direction. For points of interest, I used Bing. Bing's Maps are based on Nokia's much superior mapping software (according to reviewers not just me). 

 

People are beating up on Apple for Maps, but the issues seem relatively small. I haven't found any issue with them that I haven't found with competing software. 

post #44 of 135

I know many people here hate Schmidt, but that doesn't mean Apple should put the hate above the needs of consumers. Apple used Google search in the 1st place not because they loved Google, but because they wanted consumers to have the best search experience. Maps should be the same. Consumers should be the ones to decide which Maps App is the best, lets approve the Google Maps App, and if everyone wants to download that and replace Apple's Maps App with it? So be it. Give consumers the best experience. 

 

I mean, today we replace Maps, next day search, next day Pandora, next day Netflix, .... there's a limit to this. 1 single company cannot manage all these and make all these the best of the world. The Apps model was/is a success because it's the collection of the best in the world. 

post #45 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bemmer View Post


Well, if that's the case then don't use directions or turn by turn. I use street view to see specifically where something is. When in a busy shopping strip not everything has a prominent premise number. Or when travelling its a good way to see specific landmarks. Or see what a hotel location looks like. It may look like a waste of time for you but it's not for others. How about you think how others interact with sometime rather than give your own biased opinion.

 

 

Aren't all opinions biased? Otherwise, they would be facts. For me, Street View was nothing more than a novelty. Something fun, but not used very much. Fly over might be the same. 

post #46 of 135
I guess I was the only one who didn't know that the old maps app had Google Streetview. Haha.

Anyways. I visited Madrid, Spain during this summer and couldn't use my smart phone and was able to get around the city for over three weeks without any problems/issues. I relied on their Metro subway the whole time I guess for being a tourist I was able to figure out a foreign city better than some locals of other cities or Madrid isn't a complex city to navigate.

Mark
post #47 of 135

Smart move by Apple. First Siri, then Youtube and Maps... Google search is next. I understand the strategy and fully agree. My only complaint is that Apple didn't do it sooner.

 

What appears to be a flop to the tech press, is really a strategic move by Apple - One that will guarantee its dominance for the next decade.

post #48 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBell View Post


Aren't all opinions biased? Otherwise, they would be facts. For me, Street View was nothing more than a novelty. Something fun, but not used very much. Fly over might be the same. 

I would even say that flyover IS the same. I can't imagine using it to figure out where I am or how to get where I'm going. It's a pure novelty.

But, then, I know how to read a map.
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

I know many people here hate Schmidt, but that doesn't mean Apple should put the hate above the needs of consumers. Apple used Google search in the 1st place not because they loved Google, but because they wanted consumers to have the best search experience. Maps should be the same. Consumers should be the ones to decide which Maps App is the best, lets approve the Google Maps App, and if everyone wants to download that and replace Apple's Maps App with it? So be it. Give consumers the best experience. 

I mean, today we replace Maps, next day search, next day Pandora, next day Netflix, .... there's a limit to this. 1 single company cannot manage all these and make all these the best of the world. The Apps model was/is a success because it's the collection of the best in the world. 

What was Apple supposed to do? Google would not let them have key features and wanted an extortionate amount of money. Serving their customers meant developing their own app and getting it up to date as quickly as possible (and many people have already reported that some of their complaints have been fixed). Apple would have been crazy to allow Google to control iOS the way Google was trying to do.
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post #49 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

I mean, today we replace Maps, next day search, next day Pandora, next day Netflix, .... there's a limit to this. 1 single company cannot manage all these and make all these the best of the world. The Apps model was/is a success because it's the collection of the best in the world. 

You're mistaking third-party apps for built-in apps. Apple replaced a built-in app. Google is free to release a third-party app on the App Store.

Don't believe me?

Look at the current built-in apps: Music, Video, Maps, Clock, Camera, Stocks, etc.

Now look at the App Store. Are there alternatives available?

Here's another example: Apple released iBooks, but still allows the offerings from a competitor in Kindle.

But no, Apple is an evil dictator who's going to take a way all your fun.
post #50 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitalclips View Post

...
Given Google ripped off iOS, most likely thanks the Schmidt abusing his position as a trusted member of the Apple Board of Directors (see Android prior to iOS it was to be a 'real keyboard' rip off of RIM's system, not a touch screen system at all) this is a very understandable move by Apple. If iOS is to have a built in mapping system let it be Apple's own. Why on earth would they allow the biggest back stabbing traitors in the software world a foot hold inside iOS?
...

 

Yep. The people out there complaining that Apple should go back to Google maps need to consider that it was Google that turned themselves into a direct competitor of Apple.

 

Had they kept doing their ads, maps, social networking, video, docs, etc., I don't think there would have been an issue. By copying iOS and making it the 'free' competitor of Apple's core products, they surely couldn't expect Apple to closely integrate their own product long-term.

 

The new maps look nicer than the Google solution already, the 3d is nice where available, the turn by turn is fairly good (would like an option to make it slightly more chatty like my Navigon, for example), map issues will surely be resolved fairly quickly, and hopefully the public transit piece is integrated by Apple (that's the one piece I think they probably took the wrong approach on).

 

Rolling out a new mapping system is no small piece of work, but it needed to be done, and staying on Google maps and paying them higher licensing while at the same time having them undercut your business makes no sense. Google is not as a partner anymore, and people will need to get over it.

post #51 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

I know many people here hate Schmidt, but that doesn't mean Apple should put the hate above the needs of consumers. Apple used Google search in the 1st place not because they loved Google, but because they wanted consumers to have the best search experience. Maps should be the same. Consumers should be the ones to decide which Maps App is the best, lets approve the Google Maps App, and if everyone wants to download that and replace Apple's Maps App with it? So be it. Give consumers the best experience. 

 

I mean, today we replace Maps, next day search, next day Pandora, next day Netflix, .... there's a limit to this. 1 single company cannot manage all these and make all these the best of the world. The Apps model was/is a success because it's the collection of the best in the world. 

I am not a fan of Google by any stretch, but I agree with you. Apple should let Google maps on the phone and let us decide what we want to use. Personally, I'm not losing any sleep that Google's maps are missing. I bought the Navigon app at it's "introductory price" a couple of years ago plus I have a Garmin 50lm in my car. Apple's flyover feature is really neat, but not overly useful. The one feature that I do miss from Google, is street view. That is often very useful.

post #52 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

Smart move by Apple. First Siri, then Youtube and Maps... Google search is next. I understand the strategy and fully agree. My only complaint is that Apple didn't do it sooner.

 

What appears to be a flop to the tech press, is really a strategic move by Apple - One that will guarantee its dominance for the next decade.

 

I agree that search can't be far behind. (A year or two?) And correctly so. Google decided to bite the hand that was feeding them and it doesn't look like that was a smart move. Apple cutting them out of core functions now that they are competitors, on the other hand, is the best move possible.  Nobody would expect them to integrate Samsung's voice solution or Bing + IE either. 

 

This was Google's call by trying to take over the platform.

post #53 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bemmer View Post

Really? Because I sure don't see any street view on that... I swear, if I hear one more fanboy just saying to go on the website I really am going to flip. It's a totally different experience and lacks the one feature that most people miss from Apple Maps

 

Then flip.

 

Who's fault is it that maps.google.com is "a totally different experience and lacks the one feature that most people miss from Apple Maps"?  If you have a problem with it, take it up with Eric Schmidt.

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post #54 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrstep View Post

 

I agree that search can't be far behind. (A year or two?) And correctly so. Google decided to bite the hand that was feeding them and it doesn't look like that was a smart move. Apple cutting them out of core functions now that they are competitors, on the other hand, is the best move possible.  Nobody would expect them to integrate Samsung's voice solution or Bing + IE either. 

 

This was Google's call by trying to take over the platform.

Apple just positioned itself to overtake Google in information-retrieval in less than a decade... And people are too blind to see it - People are still arguing that this is about hurting Google. Given the competitiveness of the landscape, you would think people would realize the value this brings to the iOS platform - This is about survival and the platform's future success.

 

Siri

Maps

Youtube

Up next, Google search

post #55 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Postulant View Post

Apple just positioned itself to overtake Google in information-retrieval in less than a decade... And people are too blind to see it - People are still arguing that this is about hurting Google. Given the competitiveness of the landscape, you would think people would realize the value this brings to the iOS platform - This is about survival and the platform's future success.

 

Agree.

 

If Google really derives more 4x more income from iOS than Android and Apple's maps take away location-based mobile ads while Siri takes away search-based mobile ads, then this really hurts Google far more than Eric Schmidt seems ready to admit.

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post #56 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

 

Agree.

 

If Google really derives more 4x more income from iOS than Android and Apple's maps take away location-based mobile ads while Siri takes away search-based mobile ads, then this really hurts Google far more than Eric Schmidt seems ready to admit.

Google is estimated to get just 2% of their revenue this year from iOS device ad searches/delivery.

 

As it currently stands the impact of even a total banning of all Google products across all iPhones and iPads would hardly be felt. Apple mobile users contribute little to their bottom line at the moment. The way forward is more important and Google better have plans in place on how to include Apple users even if Apple doesn't officially support them.

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post #57 of 135

Eric's a little pissed that Apple had the balls to sever ties with his bullshit ad company. 

 

That happens to do maps. 

 

If maps were all that consumers cared about, Apple wouldn't have sold over 5 million iPhone 5 units in the first weekend (with more to go toward that number, apparently.)

post #58 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcel655 View Post

Mobile google apps does not give me compass navigation or street view. Even SJ was touting howpeople prefer native apps over web apps, and he was corret. While I'm sure everything is rosy in major us cities, the maps are unusable overseas. The mapping data is of low quality sometime even just black and white, there is no fly over and entire city blocks are missing. While I understand the business reasons as a consumer I expect a first class "it just works" experience from a premium priced product.
I also got no sympathy when a company with a stock pile of cash exceeding that of many countries rams a steaming pile of shit down my throat instead of sucking it up and licensing some first class mapping data. For my personal usage Maps is the only reason I choose a smart phone over a small phone with 3 weeks battery life.
Sad state of affairs that one simple app tarnishes and stops me from upgrading to some sweet new heart ware and my devices to what is a otherwise great os. Also the first time in years that I left the apple store without buying a product I was hell bent on buying. I actually started checking out the android phones but found the hardware offerings to be of low quality. What to do?

First off I use an old chocolate with a new battery and I don't know where you were getting 3 weeks battery life but 1 hour on this pile of shit and the battery is dead. Second go to the Android apple does not need cry babies like you.

post #59 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lerxt View Post

Google's response is almost as bad as Apple's decision in the first place. Stop being smarmy, both of you, and get Google maps back on. For the sake of the consumer.


How is Google's response bad in anyway? They couldn't agree on how best to present/use Google's Maps API, and parted ways. It's a business decision. Google has teased Apple a bit in their Moto ads but that's business too.

post #60 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post

Eric's a little pissed that Apple had the balls to sever ties with his bullshit ad company. 

 

That happens to do maps. 

 

If maps were all that consumers cared about, Apple wouldn't have sold over 5 million iPhone 5 units in the first weekend (with more to go toward that number, apparently.)

 

He does not sound that pissed. Nor does he have a reason to. What did you expect him to say after all? "Oh, what a wonderful decision it was for Apple to forsake our services?" :)

post #61 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google is estimated to get just 2% of their revenue this year from iOS device ad searches/delivery.

As it currently stands the impact of even a total banning of all Google products across all iPhones and iPads would hardly be felt. Apple mobile users contribute little to their bottom line at the moment. The way forward is more important and Google better have plans in place on how to include Apple users even if Apple doesn't officially support them.

2% from just a single vendor's products that include the 50 trillion activates per day of Android and 95% marketshare and business world dominating Windows desktop that people typically spend 40 hours a week in front of? And you don't think that 2% from a single vendor's tablets (that are only 2 years old), their single smartphone and their personal media player isn't an impressive number?

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post #62 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bemmer View Post


Well, if that's the case then don't use directions or turn by turn. I use street view to see specifically where something is. When in a busy shopping strip not everything has a prominent premise number. Or when travelling its a good way to see specific landmarks. Or see what a hotel location looks like. It may look like a waste of time for you but it's not for others. How about you think how others interact with sometime rather than give your own biased opinion.

 

Most people I know thought it was cool when it came out but nothing more ... certainly not a deal breaker or a reason for them not to upgrade.

 

I don't miss street view at all. I used it every now and then out of curiosity, but when I really need to get somewhere I rely on good old 2d. I prefer Apple Maps over Google maps. I'm glad Apple made this move. They will work out the issues brought to light overseas but as a US resident I find the new app to be a better implementation for my daily needs and a solid experience overall. 

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post #63 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google is estimated to get just 2% of their revenue this year from iOS device ad searches/delivery.

As it currently stands the impact of even a total banning of all Google products across all iPhones and iPads would hardly be felt. Apple mobile users contribute little to their bottom line at the moment. The way forward is more important and Google better have plans in place on how to include Apple users even if Apple doesn't officially support them.

Can't you F**** read! This is from you BS link!

Munster estimates that Google will generate about $4.5 billion in gross mobile revenue in 2012, the lion's share ($4 billion) from search ads and the rest ($500 million) from display. He believes that iOS is likely to remain the biggest or close to the biggest source of that revenue, generating roughly 40% of the total (or $1.6 billion). Assuming Google keeps half (after subtracting so-called acquisition costs), iOS would generate about 2% of Google's total revenue in 2012.
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post #64 of 135
Just drove from Florida to North Carolina using the maps and had no issues. iHaters just blowing this out of proportion.
post #65 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Google is estimated to get just 2% of their revenue this year from iOS device ad searches/delivery.

 

As it currently stands the impact of even a total banning of all Google products across all iPhones and iPads would hardly be felt. Apple mobile users contribute little to their bottom line at the moment. The way forward is more important and Google better have plans in place on how to include Apple users even if Apple doesn't officially support them.

 

Sergey Brin?  Is that you?

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post #66 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

If Google really derives more 4x more income from iOS than Android and Apple's maps take away location-based mobile ads while Siri takes away search-based mobile ads, then this really hurts Google far more than Eric Schmidt seems ready to admit.

Google will spin it to show that Android is increasing its revenue gain over iOS but word it to make it seem like iOS just isn't as popular as it used to be.

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post #67 of 135

this graph  basically says it all about web surfing via mobile.  (% ad impressions via chitika)

 

If you're not aligned with the iOS model, you're missing the revenue.

 

This is growth in a 'dead quarter' for Apple.

 

 

 

 

 

an Unrefined Maps app (which seems to do fine in Metro Mpls/StP) will not invert this pie chart.

And if the stories in China are true, Apple seems to have a better mapping solution there (better to woe the new market).

 

Google's issue is that they feel an 'open internet' needs to point all roads to them.

My issue is that the 'internet' will be a dumb pipe.  Search will revert back to what search used to be, and all these value ads will become 'apps'

behind a paywall, that will be micropaymentized either by the user or the an advertiser.   Apple's model provides for both, Google's, not so much.

The key thing for Apple is that they they are purer in their HW deployments than the OEM vendors (who load crapware on because they need to to raise revenues), where as Apple is all about raising brand awareness.

 

Apple more than any organization is quite 'eastern' in it's view... this is not a 3 month race to profits, it's a 500 year marathon to impart a philosophy on technology.

post #68 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolipsismX View Post


2% from just a single vendor's products that include the 50 trillion activates per day of Android and 95% marketshare and business world dominating Windows desktop that people typically spend 40 hours a week in front of? And you don't think that 2% from a single vendor's tablets (that are only 2 years old), their single smartphone and their personal media player isn't an impressive number?

Impressive has nothing to do with it. The removal of Google Maps in the latest iOS6 release will have a negligible, nearly un-noticable affect on near-term Google revenues if the estimates are correct.. Much less than the 2% total flowing from all Google products on iOS devices, most of which are still in play.

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post #69 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by kozchris View Post

Just drove from Florida to North Carolina using the maps and had no issues. iHaters just blowing this out of proportion.


Your IP address says you're in France .... ;-)

post #70 of 135
Schmidt: What Apple should have done was steal our app completely instead of trying to design their own unique one. That's how we do things here at Google.
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post #71 of 135
I mentioned in an a thread a couple of days ago, that Apple is gearing up for the "real" tech lawsuit of the early millenium: Apple vs. Google.

They're divesting the need for Google and it's services on any and all of their devices. While many are assuming Bing or Yahoo, I'm betting Apple making a play for Wolfram Alpha, which powers a good portion of Siri.

The "computational knowledge engine" and future of getting straight answers without ads: Wolfram Alpha
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post #72 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


Can't you F**** read! This is from you BS link!
...Assuming Google keeps half (after subtracting so-called acquisition costs), iOS would generate about 2% of Google's total revenue in 2012.

Of course I can read. Didn't I say the same more than once, that roughly 2% of Google revenues can be traced back to iOS devices? The loss of maps alone on iOS won't even take that smallish 2% away. This is all about posturing for future revenue streams rather than current income.

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post #73 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePixelDoc View Post


Can't you F**** read! This is from you BS link!
Munster estimates that Google will generate about $4.5 billion in gross mobile revenue in 2012, the lion's share ($4 billion) from search ads and the rest ($500 million) from display. He believes that iOS is likely to remain the biggest or close to the biggest source of that revenue, generating roughly 40% of the total (or $1.6 billion). Assuming Google keeps half (after subtracting so-called acquisition costs), iOS would generate about 2% of Google's total revenue in 2012.

 

hold on... Google has a lot more than mobile in it's stable.  The 'rest of the internet' is generating a lot of business for it.  It's generating nearly 60Billion in revenue (so mobile is less than 10% of that), so  1.6 Billion is roughly 2.5% of the big Google $$ pie.

 

But Mobile will double if not triple in major markets now, and will likely fully disintermediate PCs in developing countries (in 3 years, when 8" iPad Minis are $100 , that will be the standard 'personal device', especially if 'tethering' to your $150 4G phone is a common 2nd/3rd world service).  

 

That's the win for Google and Apple and Samsung and Microsoft.   

 

Base (<10mbits/sec) Bandwidth and HW (phones and pads) will go to $0 in price.  In 3 years, it's all about the services and driving eyeballs into the 'cathedrals' and 'bazaars.'    Apple-i*/GoogleApps/AmazonPremium/MSOffice365.    All roads lead to those.

 

Maps... pfft. Ads.  meh. the end game is much much bigger.  

post #74 of 135

Traffic on google maps  - Apples graphical approach already superior 

 

post #75 of 135

Ef Google. I may switch to Bing now on my iPhone.

 

Market Share doesn't mean anything if you don't make money on your OS. How many of these Android devices can use 4.1 or even 4.0? All iphones sold in the last 3 years can use ios 6 in some way.

post #76 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

What was Apple supposed to do? Google would not let them have key features and wanted an extortionate amount of money. Serving their customers meant developing their own app and getting it up to date as quickly as possible (and many people have already reported that some of their complaints have been fixed). Apple would have been crazy to allow Google to control iOS the way Google was trying to do.

I don't think any of us know what Google was charging Apple for Maps. For all I know Google could have been paying Apple just like they do to have Google as default search in iOS.

 

I would have been happier with the new Maps had Apple really developed it entirely in house the way Google did (exception being the satellite imagery), but instead they are putting it together with a bunch of other third party data sets which they have no control over and have no quality control other than end users pointing out mistakes. It looks like an unmanageable mess that will need to be replaced again very soon. And speaking of messes, why did they license such crap for imagery? Oh, that's right Navteq is owned by Nokia which is a puppet of Microsoft. So now we have to have crap data.

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post #77 of 135
Why do people automatically assume Apple pays or paid anything to Google in order to use their maps? The service is free on the web, anybody can use it! If you want to believe that Apple customers are somehow an exception and Apple has to pay for our Google Maps use, then please cite some hard evidence, because otherwise that belief is pure nonsense.
post #78 of 135
Like many others I'm not very happy with the new Maps app, but it really annoys me when I hear people moaning and complaining to get Google Maps back! Stop whining and give it some time! Part of the reason Google Maps became so widely accepted in the first place was because of the iPhone. With millions of iPhone 5 sold and millions more upgrading to iOS6, it's only a matter of time before Apple's map become as good as Google's map.
post #79 of 135
Quote:
Originally Posted by caliminius View Post

 

You do realize that you've been able to get an iPhone for free for a while now too? So the argument about market share based on free phones seems kind of weak and pathetic now.

 

Free Android phones have been around much longer than free iPhones and likewise, Android phones are frequently part of buy-one-get-one-free deals, arguably better than a single free phone.

 

The argument is not weak and pathetic, but it is becoming increasingly irrelevant.

post #80 of 135

Google is an Android Ponzi scheme and Eric Schmidt is the Bernie Madoff of Silicon Valley.

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