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Apple reportedly waived one year of Google Maps contract in switch to iOS Maps [u] - Page 5

post #161 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by ipen View Post

Ok, someone @ Apple made a bad decision (probably with TC's approval).  So what.  iphone5 still sells more than 4s in the first weekend.  people still upgrading to iOS6.  There was no effect as having a bad map app.  Yes, people whine about it.  But that doesn't affect anything.  Come on, people will buy any phone Apple puts out regardless of what's on there.  This proves the case.

 

I agree with most of what you say.  Apple did certainly screw up the quality of the 1.0 iOS 6 maps release.

 

I am not so sure, though, that Apple made a bad decision... given the alternatives!  The implementation and the decision are two different things.

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post #162 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by ecs View Post

 

It's not the media. It's us, Apple users. I'll be very happy to switch to IOS Maps, because Apple products are always higher quality than the competitors, but I'll do it when it's ready. In the meantime, don't force us to travel back in time losing the features we were used to, specially when you could very easily keep Google Maps while you were polishing IOS Maps. On every forums I visit, I don't see the media over-dramatizing, I just see Apple users who disagree with recent Apple policies.

Just to clarify, I'm not saying the maps app is free of issues. Now, I haven't read the other posts you've made, but this post of yours here is NOT over-dramatizing. You seem to be a sensible user who is opting to wait until the maps are to your liking to upgrade. What I was referring to were the rants and posts I've seen from various media outlets and users who are calling a product a disaster and threatening to dump everything Apple because a 3D image of a bridge in their town is drawn poorly, or an icon is missing. from a "known" local coffee shop. These items will undoubtedly get fixed, but I truly wonder what percentage of people are honestly affected by the maps' problems. It's like the Malware issue on Android. Media gets a hold of it, next thing you know there's a perception out there that if you use Android and you download apps, you will get a rogue app installed and all your personal data will be stolen.

post #163 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by ipen View Post

Ok, someone @ Apple made a bad decision (probably with TC's approval).  So what.  iphone5 still sells more than 4s in the first weekend.  people still upgrading to iOS6.  There was no effect as having a bad map app.  Yes, people whine about it.  But that doesn't affect anything.  Come on, people will buy any phone Apple puts out regardless of what's on there.  This proves the case.


I disagree. People will buy ANY phone if it best suits their needs (even if the need is simply a vain one). I am sure if someone needs a rock solid reliable map app on their phone and cannot wait till the Apple maps catches up, they wont buy an iPhone, they'll go Android or Windows. You know, It IS possible that for many of the the 100+ million people who bought the 5 or upgraded to iOS6, all these maps issues are not a deal breaker.

post #164 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post


You get what? That I don't care whether you believe me or not? That's true, I don't, because it's not relevant to the debate. Don't try kindergarten psychology on an emotionally detached person, I'm not motivated by the same things normal people are.
And to think I was being called irrational earlier...

 

I know, you were just getting warmed up then.

post #165 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by twosee View Post

I disagree. People will buy ANY phone if it best suits their needs (even if the need is simply a vain one).

Except, apparently, Vaelian. He says that maps were the only reason he uses a smartphone - yet he intentionally bought an iPhone even though Google Maps on Android is better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post

Except the latter wouldn't have happened without the former, and if I am rendered unable to use GPS on my phone, I will lose interest in developing for it, too. Is it that hard to comprehend?

It would be easier to comprehend if your story made any sense.

For example:

1. Apple released a new mapping program on iOS 6. You are still using iOS 5.1.1, so it doesn't affect you. So why are you whining so much?

2. Google's Maps app is known to be better on Android than on iOS (for intentional reasons on Google's part, obviously). You stated that maps are the only reason you use a smart phone - yet you chose an iPhone. That doesn't make sense.

3. You stated that maps are the only reason you use a smart phone and then later admitted that you're a developer. Either you're an iOS developer who never tests his apps or you're lying. Which is it?
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post #166 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post


For starters, I asked for a citation (you're replying with speculation, which I can do, too), and secondly Apple isn't gathering or processing that data, they're displaying it to users in a convenient way, just like Google does through the browser. There is absolutely no reason to believe that Google would charge Apple for a service that they provide for free, quite the opposite actually, as Google regards users as assets to their advertisement core business, rather than clients.
 
Citation?

 

 

I am providing you something better than a citation or speculation.  It is experience.  

 

I've noticed you said you became a developer when you got an iPhone.  Interesting seeing as I had been a developer for 5 years in 2007 and had worked on GIS software for 4 of those 5 years.

 

You pay a fee to Apple of about $100 a year, and that is because Apple gives you access to third-party services and data that Apple is paying others for.  Very little is free in the software development world beyond compilers and the IDE (Xcode, Eclipse, etc).  That is because many people are selling what they produce and everyone wants a piece of the pie.  That isn't speculation, that is reality. Sure, you made find a free component or block of code here and there, but iOS was not copy and pasted together from free code found on the Internet.

 

The company I work for has to pay several companies for GIS data, demographic data, and third-party API tools.  We have to pay Microsoft for Bing Maps, and based on the way we use that, we'd have to pay Google too.  And we pay A LOT.  We also pay Google for Google Apps for Business so we can using Gmail and Google Docs as a company.  So Google charges for plenty, believe it or not.

 

You can believe Apple wasn't paying Google, but you are wrong.

post #167 of 183

Sick of iOS 6 maps?  Give our 2012 maps a shot!

 

 - Up to date data from around the country

 - Thousands of points of interests

 - Detailed maps or cities and parks!

 - No internet access required!

 - No batteries or power source required!

 - Real paper look and feel!

 - Turn by turn navigation with realistic human voice! *

 

 

*Feature requires actual human being that can read a map in passenger seat. 

 

 

post #168 of 183
Originally Posted by rednival View Post
 - Up to date data from around the country

 - Thousands of points of interests

 - Detailed maps or cities and parks!

 - No internet access required!

 - No batteries or power source required!

 - Real paper look and feel!

 - Turn by turn navigation with realistic human voice! *

 

 

*Feature requires actual human being that can read a map in passenger seat. 

 

- Out of date before printing

- Limited by the DPI capabilities of the printer

- Watch out for snakes (who said that?!)

- No updates available

- Ruined when wet (so… just like a digital source)

- Just look and feel, though? lol.gif

 

Thing about a paper map is that roads will be under construction for centuries to come.

 

But you make an interesting point; I think that paper map suppliers would have been better served to advertise against any perceived failure of digital ones than Apple's actual competitors. 

post #169 of 183

Ya' know...

 

It'd be great PR if Apple gave an iPhone 5 with iOS 6 Maps to every NFL Referee... 

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post #170 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

- Out of date before printing
- Limited by the DPI capabilities of the printer
- Watch out for snakes (who said that?!)
- No updates available
- Ruined when wet (so… just like a digital source)
- Just look and feel, though? lol.gif

Thing about a paper map is that roads will be under construction for centuries to come.

But you make an interesting point; I think that paper map suppliers would have been better served to advertise against any perceived failure of digital ones than Apple's actual competitors. 

I used to buy it yearly. It really only shows major roads, so whenever I drove I would use it to get to whatever city/town I was visiting then I'd buy a local more detailed map at a 7 11 or Walmart.
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post #171 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyzlmt View Post

I really don't understand why this gets so much attention.
Its one stinking application. To me its like meeting the most amazing, intelligent, beautiful woman in the world, but constantly complaining about some minor thing "but dude, she doesn't understand football.. I don't think this is gonna last"
Get over it. Give it time, it will fix itself.
How incredibly sexist of you. Next time try cars.

But OK, using your analogy, perhaps it's more like, every time she opens her mouth she says something factually incorrect. "Black is white", etc. So she's either lying or ignorant. And while incredibly intelligent, she's arrogant about it. Never mind she doesn't understand football. The idea that she doesn't care to learn is enough to sour any relationship. Apple could have offered a choice of downloading Google Maps while on the remaining year of their license, while placing their incomplete version on the Home screen for all the users to use who have no problem with Apple Maps ... And according to you and numerous others on this forum, that's the majority of the users -- the only people complaining are the smallest of vocal minorities.

If you and others really believe that, then why did Apple make a public apology? They didn't capitulate so quickly over "antennagate". And the solution there ... to keep using your analogy, was to dress the beauty up inside a thick wool trench coat. And if you truly believe this is no big deal, then why doesn't Apple just offer the choice now? If Apple's Maps is so much better than Google's then only a small percentage of users will want to download it after being forced to try Apple's, right? And it's not like Apple terminated their license, they just didn't take advantage of it, so they are seemingly in a position to do just that.

But too late now. It's now a pissing contest and (using your analogy) Apple is saying, our girlfriend is better than yours, so no way we're taking her back after what she did to us.
post #172 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by sflocal View Post


I did have better things to do, and I went and did them.  I didn't go around having a hissy-fit that a man-made product wasn't perfect.  I accepted it's shortcomings as a first-release and moved on knowing in time it will get better.  Surely, my tune would change if I were paying for a service or a product and it was faulty.  This is not the case.  With Apple's resources and design-mantra, I see Maps rivaling GoogleMaps, if not surpassing it, sooner than later.  I look at the big picture, so should you.  But no, you focus on the "now, now, now" and "I want my 5-minute fix" nonsense.
 


You beat me to it Charli.  Everyone I know that upgraded to iOS6 only had a smattering of curiosities about Apple's maps.  They didn't care.  They too exhibited the same philosophy that it will get better over time and went on with their lives.

Unlike souliisoul which seems to be exhibiting the typical iHating, trolling mentality.  He'd rather mouth-off than actually have a rational, grown-up discussion.  I find a lot of that mentality infesting AI now.

If you are that stupid or naive to think that the cost of Maps development has not been included in setting the iPhone price, i.e., every year Apple provide certain 'free apps', which they have determined will cost this much to develop and included that in their overall R&D costs, then you more stupid, then I think. Apple will revise the price, if they thought that R&D costs had increased,  but you still pay for apps as part of iPhone R&D costs.

Even Apple agrees that customer feedback helps them stay strong. If everyone did not give feedback, Apple would assume the product is acceptable and there would not be this intense drive to improve the next version so quickly.  You keep the holy than thou approach and I live in real world and provide my customer feedback. Since you have better things to do, a reply from me will be ignored, lets see.

 

Edit:http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/09/26/visually-impaired-users-say-ios-6-app-store-redesign-is-a-downgrade, this article shows why Apple listen to customers and reason why your comments are complete rubbish in nature, without customer feedback, Apple would not improve, since their products are being used in real-life situations across millions of people and not just couple of hundred in a closed testing environment.


Edited by souliisoul - 9/26/12 at 1:15pm
post #173 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post

You get what? That I don't care whether you believe me or not? That's true, I don't, because it's not relevant to the debate. Don't try kindergarten psychology on an emotionally detached person, I'm not motivated by the same things normal people are.
And to think I was being called irrational earlier...
Just out of curiosity, what color is the sky in your world? And are pharmaceuticals involved?

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post #174 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

[Except, apparently, Vaelian. He says that maps were the only reason he uses a smartphone - yet he intentionally bought an iPhone even though Google Maps on Android is better.

I also recall explaining that iPhones were the only thing I had available for testing at the time; why did you ignore that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post

Except the latter wouldn't have happened without the former, and if I am rendered unable to use GPS on my phone, I will lose interest in developing for it, too. Is it that hard to comprehend?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

It would be easier to comprehend if your story made any sense.

It doesn't make sense to you because you're confusing cause and effect, which a fallacy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

1. Apple released a new mapping program on iOS 6. You are still using iOS 5.1.1, so it doesn't affect you. So why are you whining so much?

Explained before: Both iOS 5.1.1 and 6 have pretty bad security holes that won't get fixed in 5.1.1, so eventually I will be forced to upgrade.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

2. Google's Maps app is known to be better on Android than on iOS (for intentional reasons on Google's part, obviously). You stated that maps are the only reason you use a smart phone - yet you chose an iPhone. That doesn't make sense.

Explained before: What's better for others is not necessarily better for me. I'm not gullible, I make decisions based on my own observations, not on other people's preferences. I had access to iPhones, but not to Android devices, so I was sure that if I bought an iPhone I would be happy with the Maps experience on it, but unsure that I would be happy with the Maps experience on Android.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

3. You stated that maps are the only reason you use a smart phone and then later admitted that you're a developer. Either you're an iOS developer who never tests his apps or you're lying. Which is it?

You're confusing cause and effect: I became a developer because I had an iPhone and am a geek who likes to tinker with things. If I stop using an iPhone, I'll stop caring about developing for it. The ability to develop for the platform doesn't make it any more useful to me than it would on, say, a Nokia N9, which by the way is a lot more open. I do not buy hardware to develop for it, I develop for the hardware that I buy.

You are confusing cause and effect, which is an informal logic fallacy, in order to subvert the debate, unfortunately for you it does not work with me (nor does calling me a liar). If you want to have a chance at winning an argument against me, you must resort to logic, not ad hominem.
post #175 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

I am providing you something better than a citation or speculation.  It is experience.

No, you're providing me with baseless speculation, because there is nowhere I can go to validate your logic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

I've noticed you said you became a developer when you got an iPhone.  Interesting seeing as I had been a developer for 5 years in 2007 and had worked on GIS software for 4 of those 5 years.

That's impossible, there was no iOS developer program in 2007...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

You pay a fee to Apple of about $100 a year, and that is because Apple gives you access to third-party services and data that Apple is paying others for.  Very little is free in the software development world beyond compilers and the IDE (Xcode, Eclipse, etc).  That is because many people are selling what they produce and everyone wants a piece of the pie.  That isn't speculation, that is reality. Sure, you made find a free component or block of code here and there, but iOS was not copy and pasted together from free code found on the Internet.

Source? Because paying for code-signing digital certificates is nothing new, and they don't involve access to third-party data, either. This includes the Mac Developer Program, which doesn't have Google Maps.

Oops, there goes your logic down the drain... Try harder...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

The company I work for has to pay several companies for GIS data, demographic data, and third-party API tools.  We have to pay Microsoft for Bing Maps, and based on the way we use that, we'd have to pay Google too.  And we pay A LOT.  We also pay Google for Google Apps for Business so we can using Gmail and Google Docs as a company.  So Google charges for plenty, believe it or not.

You pay for the ability to process that data, not for the ability to directly display it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

You can believe Apple wasn't paying Google, but you are wrong.

Citation?
post #176 of 183
This article puts it remarkably fairly in light of the recent depressed stock price following the release and numerous issues it inspired.

http://techpinions.com/relax-everyone-the-iphone-is-just-a-phone-apple-is-just-a-company/10615
post #177 of 183

Oh for god sake, it's a cloud based service, in order for Apple to improve it Apple first need to release it. Why can't you lot understand this?

post #178 of 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaelian View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

I am providing you something better than a citation or speculation.  It is experience.

No, you're providing me with baseless speculation, because there is nowhere I can go to validate your logic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

I've noticed you said you became a developer when you got an iPhone.  Interesting seeing as I had been a developer for 5 years in 2007 and had worked on GIS software for 4 of those 5 years.

That's impossible, there was no iOS developer program in 2007...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

You pay a fee to Apple of about $100 a year, and that is because Apple gives you access to third-party services and data that Apple is paying others for.  Very little is free in the software development world beyond compilers and the IDE (Xcode, Eclipse, etc).  That is because many people are selling what they produce and everyone wants a piece of the pie.  That isn't speculation, that is reality. Sure, you made find a free component or block of code here and there, but iOS was not copy and pasted together from free code found on the Internet.

Source? Because paying for code-signing digital certificates is nothing new, and they don't involve access to third-party data, either. This includes the Mac Developer Program, which doesn't have Google Maps.

Oops, there goes your logic down the drain... Try harder...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

The company I work for has to pay several companies for GIS data, demographic data, and third-party API tools.  We have to pay Microsoft for Bing Maps, and based on the way we use that, we'd have to pay Google too.  And we pay A LOT.  We also pay Google for Google Apps for Business so we can using Gmail and Google Docs as a company.  So Google charges for plenty, believe it or not.

You pay for the ability to process that data, not for the ability to directly display it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rednival View Post

You can believe Apple wasn't paying Google, but you are wrong.

Citation?

 

Man Of War?

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post #179 of 183

I just got mine...

 

Maps, Shmaps... in the overall importance of things it rates somewhere below your preferred brand of toilet paper... IOW, Who the Fu ck cares?

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post #180 of 183

I'm sorry, but how the **** was Google 'caught off guard'? it's a lie. It's been confirmed since JUNE that this was the case, and rumored strongly for several months before that. How long does it take to make a maps app? It's been 4 months since it's confirmed, but suddenly they're "scrambling"? Google has enough smart people working there for anyone to believe this. Bullshit. It's just more FUD to further the narrative that Apple is the bad guy. They should have been working on an app fulltime since the WWDC keynote at LEAST, if not before that. 

post #181 of 183
Losing Google's YouTube App on iOS:
No biggie...we don't have to watch Gangnam Style

Losing Google Maps on iOS:
Millions of users in the Apple community disoriented...Apple, this is a monumental and fundamental part of what makes the iPhone or any smartphone a fledging Internet communications device. We have become so dependant on this in our daily lives and we take google maps as a feature that we pay for on iPhone having paid 1000's of dollars on products.

When the first iPhone came out, google maps was a primary feature and since then it always has been for millions of us. Now... Suddenly this smartphone is not so smart after all is it?

All we as customers want is some official statement regarding the situation so we can make calculated decisions in our own lives. The majority of users don't care about your beef with Google... We just want to know what's going to be done about this fiasco of epic proportions.
post #182 of 183
Originally Posted by simtub View Post
Apple, this is a monumental and fundamental part of what makes the iPhone or any smartphone a fledging Internet communications device.

 

That's hilarious. Because until Apple told you that maps would be great on a phone and showed you how to do it right, no one gave a crap, remember? Now their back end has given up on them, so they're relying entirely on themselves to give you what you want.


We have become so dependent on this in our daily lives…

 

Isn't that your fault?


…and we take google maps as a feature that we pay for on iPhone having paid 1000's of dollars on products.

 

If you're buying an iPhone just for Google Maps, you REALLY ought to consider not doing that and going for a cheaper solution.


When the first iPhone came out, google maps was a primary feature and since then it always has been for millions of us. Now... Suddenly this smartphone is not so smart after all is it?

 

Suddenly people aren't so smart, are they? 

 

All we as customers want is some official statement regarding the situation…
 

Already did.


…so we can make calculated decisions in our own lives.

 

Here's a decision: Don't become wholly dependent on a single website.


We just want to know what's going to be done about this fiasco of epic proportions.

 

The fiasco that is in no way a fiasco, you mean? The "problem" can solve by going to maps.google.com? The problem that, in a year's time, will have many of the people complaining about Maps today saying that they can't remember a time before Apple Maps? That one? 

post #183 of 183

Tim Cook is making me sick... more interested in stock prices than product innovation and performance.

I can't stand watching him try to imitate Steve Jobs in his presentations and mannerisms... when really he's the black pope.

 

While this MAP issue is the most blatant expression of disrespect for apple's clients - there have been several other releases in the last year with apple's (products and software) that prove that Tim is a money man.

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