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Disagreements over turn-by-turn directions prompted Apple to ditch Google Maps

post #1 of 89
Thread Starter 
Apple's decision to abandon Google Maps with iOS 6 and implement its own mapping solution was reportedly driven by a disagreement between Apple and Google over turn-by-turn navigation.

Citing multiple sources familiar with the talks held between the two companies, John Paczkowski of All Things D reported on Wednesday that Apple wanted Google to bring spoken turn-by-turn navigation to iOS, but could not broker a deal. As a result, Apple decided to ditch Google Maps so that it could provide users with turn-by-turn directions—a free feature that has been integrated into Google's competing Android platform for years now.

"Requiring iPhone users to look directly at handsets for directions and manually move through each step—while Android users enjoyed native voice-guided instructions—put Apple at a clear disadvantage in the mobile space," Paczkowski wrote. "And having chosen Google as its original mapping partner, the iPhone maker was now in a position where an arch-rival was calling the shots on functionality important to the iOS maps feature set."

Sources reportedly said that Apple "pushed Google hard" to bring turn-by-turn navigations to iOS. However, Google viewed the capability as a "key feature" of its own Android platform, and decided to keep the functionality exclusive to Android handsets.

While Apple wanted voice-guided navigation in its iOS Maps application, Google wanted in-app branding and the addition of its Google Latitude service to the built-in iOS mapping service. Apple reportedly refused to concede either of those to the search company.

This week it was revealed that Apple waived one year of its remaining contract for Google Maps to roll out is own iOS mapping solution. Google is said to be working on its own standalone Google Maps application for iOS, but it is not expected to debut for months at the earliest.

Turn


Paczkowski added on Wednesday that Google is currently "scrambling" to build a dedicated Google Maps application for iOS to be released on the App Store. That's partially driven by the large number of Google Maps users that the company just lost when 100 million iPhone, iPad and iPod touch owners upgraded to iOS 6 in its first few days of availability.

For more, see, AppleInsider's detailed look at the problems with the feature Inside iOS 6: What's wrong with Apple's new maps.
post #2 of 89
I'm sure it could have been brokered if the price were right- not that Apple is hurting for cash. And I'm sure that Apple saves tons of cash by using their own Map App.
Too bad for us purchasers of high end hardware now have to deal with a lower end Map software. Should have been extended a year as its clearly barely a beta.
post #3 of 89
Creepy Google Latitude is creepy.

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post #4 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post

I'm sure it could have been brokered if the price were right- 

 

 

Apple doesn't license most of their key technologies/patents to competitors, for any amount of money. In fact, they'll defend them to the death first. 

 

Google can't be expected to act any differently. 

post #5 of 89

Yesterday I criticized Apple, but today I'm going to criticize Google, based on this new information.

 

Google basically told all Apple users to go and F*ck themselves. No, we will not provide voice guided navigation for Apple users, we want it exclusively for Fandroids. Apple users have to look at their screens while driving, and if they crash their cars and die, then too bad.

 

And remember, Google Maps app on iOS was also not vector based.

 

So then Apple told Google to go F*ck themselves, because Apple realized that they had no choice but to release their own Maps app.

 

The Apple Maps app has a very strong foundation, it's fast, it's smooth and it's vector based. As the Apple map app improves, with more and better data, then it will be quite good. Soon, 99% of all normal people, besides a few moronic Fandroids, will have forgotten all about Map-Gate, just as people have forgotten about all of the other "Gates" that came before that.

post #6 of 89
I hope Apple ensures Google go through intense review for the proposed Google Maps standalone app and in the mean time improve their Maps App and say a big FU to Google. 100 Million customers no longer using your app,is not a small number.

Google can not longer hold Apple to ransom and thats what Page and the gang were trying to do.
post #7 of 89
The overlay that Apple used for Google Maps was nice, it was a bummer not to have Turn-by-Turn as I did when I had an Android device but now that iOS 6 has it integrated I'm ready to really use it.

It's always interesting to learn more about the situation but I'm glad we're pressing on. The Maps app does need improvement but, wow, the first iteration is already fantastic and I'm sure that Apple is going to do good things now that they have full control over it.
post #8 of 89

Turn by turn on an iOS device is not that useful. Unless you have dedicated mounting brackets in your auto so that the device is more at eye level, using turn by turn and looking down at the device sitting on the passenger seat or holding your phone while driving is a dangerous habit to get into. Personally, I have built in navigation in all my autos so I don't need it at all. I can see a case for all vehicles having built in navigation within the next 5 years or so. Perhaps this new Apple Maps service is the precursor to striking a deal with auto makers to provide built in iOS devices in the cars..

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post #9 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by John.B View Post

Creepy Google Latitude is creepy.

Certainly nothing I'd use. It's similar to Find my Friends on iOS isn't it?

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post #10 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Certainly nothing I'd use. It's similar to Find my Friends on iOS isn't it?

 

Except that Google Latitude entrusts your 24/7 location history to Eric Schimdt's minions.

 

Quote:
Originally posted by Eric Schmidt
 
"We don't need you to type at all. We know where you are. We know where you've been. We can more or less know what you're thinking about."

 

Quote:

Originally posted by Eric Schmidt
 
"It's a future where you don't forget anything. In this new future you're never lost...We will know your position down to the foot and down to the inch over time..."

 

Quote:
Originally posted by Eric Schmidt
 
"I actually think most people don't want Google to answer their questions ... They want Google to tell them what they should be doing next."

 

Quote:

Originally posted by Eric Schmidt
 
"If you have something that you don't want anyone to know, maybe you shouldn't be doing it in the first place."

 

This is the man that was demanding real-time location data from iOS users, in exchange for turn-by-turn directions on the iPhone.


Edited by John.B - 9/26/12 at 1:43pm

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post #11 of 89
This makes sense. As I have thought, the biggest complaints of iOS maps was in comparison to google maps on android. Frankly, I like being able to use siri to say "give me directions to fair oaks mall", and have the turn by turn directions spoken to me.
post #12 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by souliisoul View Post

I hope Apple ensures Google go through intense review for the proposed Google Maps standalone app and in the mean time improve their Maps App and say a big FU to Google. 100 Million customers no longer using your app,is not a small number.
Google can not longer hold Apple to ransom and thats what Page and the gang were trying to do.

 

Dear Google,

 

We are sorry to inform you that Google Maps was rejected from the App Store because it duplicates core functionality, uses undocumented APIs, and violates user privacy in the following ways...

 

 

Sincerely,

Tim

post #13 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Yesterday I criticized Apple, but today I'm going to criticize Google, based on this new information.

 

Google basically told all Apple users to go and F*ck themselves. No, we will not provide voice guided navigation for Apple users, we want it exclusively for Fandroids. Apple users have to look at their screens while driving, and if they crash their cars and die, then too bad.

 

And remember, Google Maps app on iOS was also not vector based.

 

So then Apple told Google to go F*ck themselves, because Apple realized that they had no choice but to release their own Maps app.

 

The Apple Maps app has a very strong foundation, it's fast, it's smooth and it's vector based. As the Apple map app improves, with more and better data, then it will be quite good. Soon, 99% of all normal people, besides a few moronic Fandroids, will have forgotten all about Map-Gate, just as people have forgotten about all of the other "Gates" that came before that.

If you link back to the source article and read it there's not a claim that Google wouldn't offer Turn-by-Turn navigation to iOS users under any circumstances according to their sources. Instead it's says that if they did Google wanted certain things from Apple in return and Apple wasn't biting.

 

 

"But according to people familiar with Google’s thinking, the search giant, which had invested massive sums in creating that data and views it as a key feature of Android, wasn’t willing to simply hand it over to a competing platform.

And if there were terms under which it might have agreed to do so, Apple wasn’t offering them. Sources tell AllThingsD that Google, for example, wanted more say in the iOS maps feature set. It wasn’t happy simply providing back-end data. It asked for in-app branding. Apple declined. It suggested adding Google Latitude. Again, Apple declined."

http://allthingsd.com/20120926/apple-google-maps-talks-crashed-over-voice-guided-directions/

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post #14 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Turn by turn on an iOS device is not that useful. Unless you have dedicated mounting brackets in your auto so that the device is more at eye level, using turn by turn and looking down at the device sitting on the passenger seat or holding your phone while driving is a dangerous habit to get into. Personally, I have built in navigation in all my autos so I don't need it at all. I can see a case for all vehicles having built in navigation within the next 5 years or so. Perhaps this new Apple Maps service is the precursor to striking a deal with auto makers to provide built in iOS devices in the cars..


That's the whole point. You just listen to what it tells you "Turn left at 300 meters". No need to look down at it. I've used it on Apple Maps and it's pretty darn good.

 

Personally, I'm glad they just ripped the band-aid off. Google had no intentions of providing us Apple users with the technology, at least not until they had the "next big thing" to give to android keeping iOS one step behind. And I highly doubt that they'll push out a maps app. They are hoping to get many people to switch over to Android.

post #15 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

If you link back to the source article and read it there's not a claim that Google wouldn't offer Turn-by-Turn navigation to iOS users under any circumstances according to their sources. Instead it's says that if they did Google wanted certain things from Apple in return and Apple wasn't biting.

 

 

"But according to people familiar with Google’s thinking, the search giant, which had invested massive sums in creating that data and views it as a key feature of Android, wasn’t willing to simply hand it over to a competing platform.

And if there were terms under which it might have agreed to do so, Apple wasn’t offering them. Sources tell AllThingsD that Google, for example, wanted more say in the iOS maps feature set. It wasn’t happy simply providing back-end data. It asked for in-app branding. Apple declined. It suggested adding Google Latitude. Again, Apple declined."

http://allthingsd.com/20120926/apple-google-maps-talks-crashed-over-voice-guided-directions/

 

Sounds like Apple did the right thing to protect its users.

post #16 of 89

I do not believe this. I mean, look, if Google ever make a Maps App for iOS, there will be turn-by-turn navigation. So, what's the point for google to hold it back? No point.

 

It's more believable that Apple axed the old Maps App because Google wants the data wired to them in a certain way and Apple thinks that'd give Google too much advantage. It's ok to axe it because of competitive reasons, I don't blame Apple. But I don't buy this turn-by-turn thing, and the facts will confirm what I said once Google finally releases a Maps App for iOS with turn-by-turn navigation.

post #17 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


Apple doesn't license most of their key technologies/patents to competitors, for any amount of money. In fact, they'll defend them to the death first. 

Google can't be expected to act any differently. 

Fine, them keep paying as is until you get it right. iPhone users don't care about the voice we care about street view. Siri can't hear us on a street anyway to give us directions at least not in Manhattan.
post #18 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

I do not believe this. I mean, look, if Google ever make a Maps App for iOS, there will be turn-by-turn navigation. So, what's the point for google to hold it back? No point.

 

It's more believable that Apple axed the old Maps App because Google wants the data wired to them in a certain way and Apple thinks that'd give Google too much advantage. It's ok to axe it because of competitive reasons, I don't blame Apple. But I don't buy this turn-by-turn thing, and the facts will confirm what I said once Google finally releases a Maps App for iOS with turn-by-turn navigation.

Well yeah, now that they will have to compete against Apple's app which has it.

post #19 of 89

I think it says Apple learned their lesson of the 90s...play your own game, don't trust your business to another company.  I'll say what I've said all along: I love the new Maps, love the turn by turn, and I love that Google doesn't get more of my information than they already get.  

post #20 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post


Fine, them keep paying as is until you get it right. iPhone users don't care about the voice we care about street view. Siri can't hear us on a street anyway to give us directions at least not in Manhattan.

Speak for yourself. I didn't use street view, I love my turn by turn.

post #21 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post

iPhone users don't care about street view.

 

Fixed.

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post #22 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post


Fine, them keep paying as us until you get it right. iPhone users don't care about the voice we care about street view.

 

I personally prefer the Voice and the Flyover to StreetView. Never was a fan of the SV. Only time I used it was when I was house hunting and wanted to get a feel of the outside of the house. I never use it for directions.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post

I do not believe this. I mean, look, if Google ever make a Maps App for iOS, there will be turn-by-turn navigation. So, what's the point for google to hold it back? No point.

 

It's more believable that Apple axed the old Maps App because Google wants the data wired to them in a certain way and Apple thinks that'd give Google too much advantage. It's ok to axe it because of competitive reasons, I don't blame Apple. But I don't buy this turn-by-turn thing, and the facts will confirm what I said once Google finally releases a Maps App for iOS with turn-by-turn navigation.

 

 

Well they hold it back to tout an Android feature that iOS doesn't have. IMO Google will release their own app when Apple gets theirs right. They probably figure that all the bad press, and pissed off users (with "no option" so they believe) will get some people to switch over to Android.

 

Google's not that quiet nice guy at the corner of the party. They are just as ruthless as Apple and MS and any other successful corporation. They want to win, and at the same time eliminate competition.

post #23 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by "Apple 
[" url="/t/152914/disagreements-over-turn-by-turn-directions-prompted-apple-to-ditch-google-maps#post_2199035"]Yesterday I criticized Apple, but today I'm going to criticize Google, based on this new information.

Google basically told all Apple users to go and F*ck themselves. No, we will not provide voice guided navigation for Apple users, we want it exclusively for Fandroids. Apple users have to look at their screens while driving, and if they crash their cars and die, then too bad.

And remember, Google Maps app on iOS was also not vector based.

So then Apple told Google to go F*ck themselves, because Apple realized that they had no choice but to release their own Maps app.

The Apple Maps app has a very strong foundation, it's fast, it's smooth and it's vector based. As the Apple map app improves, with more and better data, then it will be quite good. Soon, 99% of all normal people, besides a few moronic Fandroids, will have forgotten all about Map-Gate, just as people have forgotten about all of the other "Gates" that came before that.
.

I don't believe it was that at all and agree with Quadra 610. Google was protecting a key feature of their platform.
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post #24 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apple ][ View Post

Yesterday I criticized Apple, but today I'm going to criticize Google, based on this new information.

 

Same here. If this story is true, Google can go **** itself.

 

I am willing to wait for an improvement in Apple's map app over time.

 

That said, Apple could do a far better job of explaining this to users.

post #25 of 89
Originally Posted by drobforever View Post
I do not believe this. I mean, look, if Google ever make a Maps App for iOS, there will be turn-by-turn navigation. So, what's the point for google to hold it back? No point.

 

Apple never gives Mac software more features than their Windows equivalents… 

 

The purpose of holding it back is to get Android converts.

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post #26 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Turn by turn on an iOS device is not that useful. Unless you have dedicated mounting brackets in your auto so that the device is more at eye level, using turn by turn and looking down at the device sitting on the passenger seat or holding your phone while driving is a dangerous habit to get into. Personally, I have built in navigation in all my autos so I don't need it at all. I can see a case for all vehicles having built in navigation within the next 5 years or so. Perhaps this new Apple Maps service is the precursor to striking a deal with auto makers to provide built in iOS devices in the cars..

Some cars already have this integration. I believe Ford's Sync feature can use a smartphone's navigation capabilities, and GM's MyLink is likely to incorporate the capability soon. I'm not familiar with at what level these work, but the concept is clearly out there. The navigation option is a pretty big revenue generator, though, so there's competing interests. My car has downloadable turn-by-turn but I skipped the in-dash navigation. With my iPhone, I haven't missed it at all.

post #27 of 89
First of all i%u2019m a 61 year old male and i don%u2019t see as well as i used to. last spring i was surprised to find that i had not got the memo and they changed the Triborough bridge to the rfk bridge. this caused me to get a bit lost at night in the bronx.%u201D Perfect, flawless%u201D google maps on my i phone apparently thought that it was more important for me to see an unbroken blue line than the street name under it . in this cell challenged neighborhood my blue position dot was lets say slow in updating and the drivers in this neighborhood did not lets say appreciate me slowing down trying to read (some missing) street signs to determine where i was . google maps almost cost me my life and were terribly frustrating. i tried apple maps today and the search is a bit rough but once it was established where i wanted to go the huge direction balloons were a great help especially easy to read at a glance while driving . I am a 3-d cad designer and i could see the problems with the bridges were that the program that renders the flyover was having problems interpreting where the bridge ended and the shadow begins as the shadows were shifting around on moving water! I hardly think this is apples fault and a reasonable person would understand that the bridge and the Eiffel tower are still ok. I am glad to have apple mapping and i know apple is working as fast as they can to improve it and i do not think they should have delayed its inclusion .
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post #28 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by souliisoul View Post

I hope Apple ensures Google go through intense review for the proposed Google Maps standalone app and in the mean time improve their Maps App and say a big FU to Google. 100 Million customers no longer using your app,is not a small number.
Google can not longer hold Apple to ransom and thats what Page and the gang were trying to do.

Not just '100 million,' but likely the highest income segment customers of anyone/anywhere on the globe. It's suicidal to give that up, especially when monetizing mobile is where the future is for companies like GOOG and FB. (As an aside, I don't know anyone who's halfway well-off -- who also is not an Apple-hater -- that's an Android user).

post #29 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by dasanman69 View Post

Google was protecting a key feature of their platform.

 

Yes, a feature that they didn't want Apple to have. That's their choice of course, but no matter how you cut it or slice it, we now know why Apple had to dump Google and go with their own version.

post #30 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post


Fine, them keep paying as is until you get it right. iPhone users don't care about the voice we care about street view. Siri can't hear us on a street anyway to give us directions at least not in Manhattan.


Please don't speak for all iPhone users.  Personally, I didn't realize that street view was an option on iOS until I read stories about the Google maps app being removed from iOS.  Using the Google maps app on an iPhone 4S with Verizon was an exercise in frustration as the maps loaded extremely slowly.  Apple's maps app is much faster on the same hardware in the same locations.

post #31 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quadra 610 View Post


Apple doesn't license most of their key technologies/patents to competitors, for any amount of money. In fact, they'll defend them to the death first. 

Google can't be expected to act any differently. 

In general, there's some truth to that.

HOWEVER, when Apple refuses to license its core technologies, they're not screwing their own users. They're keeping the competition from getting Apple technologies. Google, OTOH, by refusing to release a good Maps app for iOS or license the technology to Apple is screwing their own users.

Besides which, Google didn't have to be Apple's competitor. Apple was apparently quite happy with partnering with Google until Google copied all of their technologies and set themselves up as a competitor (even though Google is apparently making less money than they would have if they had never gotten into the Android thing at all).

Essentially, Google invited a good friend over for dinner, stabbed him in the back and then said "I'm not going to help you because you're bleeding all over my living room".
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post #32 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by twosee View Post

That's the whole point. You just listen to what it tells you "Turn left at 300 meters". No need to look down at it. I've used it on Apple Maps and it's pretty darn good.

Sure my vehicles all have turn by turn voice but they also have visual cues on screen as well, just like the iOS app. The problem is unless you put the iOS device in the back seat you are going to be tempted to look at the screen. If the screen is not at the eye level position, it is dangerous, because you take your eyes too far from the road, for too long, and too often. The Apple app even gives you a big warning before you start using it.

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post #33 of 89
So, essentially, Apple wasn't willing to negotiate anything, which proves me right, this was done for political reasons alone, not concern for the customers.
post #34 of 89
First of all i%u2019m a 61 year old male and i don%u2019t see as well as i used to. last spring i was surprised to find that i had not got the memo and they changed the Triborough bridge to the rfk bridge. this caused me to get a bit lost at night in the bronx.%u201D Perfect, flawless%u201D google maps on my i phone apparently thought that it was more important for me to see an unbroken blue line than the street name under it . in this cell challenged neighborhood my blue position dot was lets say slow in updating and the drivers in this neighborhood did not lets say appreciate me slowing down trying to read (some missing) street signs to determine where i was . google maps almost cost me my life and were terribly frustrating. i tried apple maps today and the search is a bit rough but once it was established where i wanted to go the huge direction balloons were a great help especially easy to read at a glance while driving . I am a 3-d cad designer and i could see the problems with the bridges were that the program that renders the flyover was having problems interpreting where the bridge ended and the shadow begins as the shadows were shifting around on moving waterI hardly think this is apples fault and a reasonable person would understand that the bridge and the Eiffel tower are still ok. I am glad to have apple mapping and i know apple is working as fast as they can to improve it and i do not think they should have delayed its inclusion .
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post #35 of 89

Wait so google wanted something in return for providing Apple with more data?

Apple turned them down, well their demands must of been outlandish, right?

So what did google want?
-For the app to be called google maps and for the inclusion of Latitude, and location check in service.

What else? 
-According to reports nothing else.

Did they ask to build the app themselves, and have complete control over it?
-No apple would still make the app, and improve it how they see fit.

I see
.

 

post #36 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

If you link back to the source article and read it there's not a claim that Google wouldn't offer Turn-by-Turn navigation to iOS users under any circumstances according to their sources. Instead it's says that if they did Google wanted certain things from Apple in return and Apple wasn't biting.


"But according to people familiar with Google’s thinking, the search giant, which had invested massive sums in creating that data and views it as a key feature of Android, wasn’t willing to simply hand it over to a competing platform.



And if there were terms under which it might have agreed to do so, Apple wasn’t offering them. Sources tell AllThingsD
 that Google, for example, wanted more say in the iOS maps feature set. It wasn’t happy simply providing back-end data. It asked for in-app branding. Apple declined. It suggested adding Google Latitude. Again, Apple declined."



http://allthingsd.com/20120926/apple-google-maps-talks-crashed-over-voice-guided-directions/



We'll use your data and your turn by turn directions but the user will never know it.
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post #37 of 89

Google will be the one losing out most.

 

Google makes revenue from Apple users. Less Apple users using Google's services = less money for Google.

post #38 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Sure my vehicles all have turn by turn voice but they also have visual cues on screen as well, just like the iOS app. The problem is unless you put the iOS device in the back seat you are going to be tempted to look at the screen. If the screen is not at the eye level position, it is dangerous, because you take your eyes too far from the road, for too long, and too often. The Apple app even gives you a big warning before you start using it.

There actually is a solution for this: buy velcro stickers and an iPad case; glue the stickers to your dashboard and case, and drop the iPad case on them. When you park, just remove the iPad and store it in the glovebox. You can use the lighter adapter to power the iPad, so it can stay always on displaying Google Maps, and you don't need to tap a button on the screen since you can center the screen in your current position and follow the blue line (or find your way back to it, or reset directions, if for some reason you miss an exit).
post #39 of 89
Apple should have implemented its own MAP solution years ago when they heard that Google was going to encroach on their turf and build a mobile phone which is similar in design.

With so much cash in hand, Apple should have invested in building its own services and don't let Google snap up all the great app developers one by one.
post #40 of 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstone View Post

Sure my vehicles all have turn by turn voice but they also have visual cues on screen as well, just like the iOS app. The problem is unless you put the iOS device in the back seat you are going to be tempted to look at the screen. If the screen is not at the eye level position, it is dangerous, because you take your eyes too far from the road, for too long, and too often. The Apple app even gives you a big warning before you start using it.

Well, I suppose if you use it that often you can get a windshield or dashboard mount. There are many on the market.

 

Or you can just use one of these haha!

 

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  • Disagreements over turn-by-turn directions prompted Apple to ditch Google Maps
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