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NYT: iOS Maps another internet services blunder for Apple - Page 11

post #401 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Wait a second. In post #384, you said:
"As a frequent traveller to Washington DC with all its circles and crossed diagonal streets, StreetView was indispensable. There is no substitute."
So it is indispensable or do you not need it? Please make up your mind.
We really need smarter trolls around here......

I believe you're misreading his post. I think he's saying that for him Streetview replaced the need for an actual map of the location.

 

I'm not picking sides, just posting my understanding of what he tried to say so that you guys can get on with throwing insults at each other over an overblown issue. 

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post #402 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

I believe you're misreading his post. I think he's saying that for him Streetview replaced the need for an actual map of the location.

Then maybe he should say that instead of saying something entirely different.
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post #403 of 444
The "Don't Do Anything Evi"l company promote jailbreaking? Next thing you'll try to tell me is that a high executive will get on Apple's board and steal ideas about a new product.
post #404 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post

I'm not responsible for Apple's Maps- Apple is!
Geesh!

Life is like a mirror: you'll receive what you give to others first.

So, yes, you are responsible. And have been; Google Maps got better over time. You said you've used it. So for that, I thank you sir.
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post #405 of 444

Google promotes jailbreaking iOS devices? 

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post #406 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

WOT...

Anyone here have experience with a mixed OS X Windows 7 WiFi network?

Should I be concerned about a Windows virus contaminating the network and possibly destroying data on Macs or external Mac HDDs -- Thunderbolt, USB and FireWire?

Or can I be assured that any exposure is limited to the Windows boxes?

I have absolutely no time or desire to admin Windows boxes!

TIA

I have. WiFi and wired, and you can indeed rest assure there is nothing to worry about. You have shown your computers skills over and over which leads me to believe you already know the do's and don'ts. Just don't have the OSX users run as root and click ok to every popup. I don't know however if a Windows virus could change the WiFi settings on the device itself - that obviously would effect Mac users as well. But nothing a simple reset couldn't fix.
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post #407 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Perhaps he doesn't understand the correlation between these words.

 

 

Isn't that an oxymoron? I'd prefer no trolls. 

 

Can we at least have no tekstud?

post #408 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Then maybe he should say that instead of saying something entirely different.

 

It was just a reflex post. GG can't help himself trying to spin everything.

post #409 of 444
In f[act, from MobileMe to iTunes, to iCloud, apple seems to "get" Internet services like few companies do.

Right on!
post #410 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

 

I agree!

 

However, I liked the @TBell letter too!   It went a little farther (blaming Google, explaining the goals and problems, etc.).  I think it displays a "personalty" more like Steve's than Tim's.  I don't, necessarily, think that one letter is better than the other -- rather more a difference in style (and that Steve could get away with more, while not continuously being compared to his predecessor).

 

 

Thanks. I was more trying to capture Jobs' spirit than Cook's. I think Jobs was effective because when explaining things he got to the heart of the matter and explained Apple's position, which at the end of the day was usually common sense.

 

In my view Tim's letter didn't really explain Apple's position and why it released the new App. Many people are wondering why Apple ditched Google maps. Cook had an opportunity to paint Google as the villain that was preventing iOS users from having voice search, turn by turn, and vector graphics. Further, Google was using customer's location data. Apple's noble goal was to give iOS users these features, and not use customers data in a scrupulous fashion,  and to do so had to build the app from the ground up to do so. When Jobs released his open letter on Flash, he rightfully called Adobe out and answered questions about why Apple was shunning Flash. At the end of the day, Apple looked in the right. 

 

Cook also could have lead with the good. Namely, there are plenty of people using Apple Maps, like myself, that are happy with it. He should have pointed that out while acknowledging the app does have some issues that will be addressed quickly and that Apple, like all map companies, need user impute to correct such errors. 

post #411 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


Then maybe he should say that instead of saying something entirely different.

Again not picking sides (FWIW Shelton's complaints seem a bit too much to me), but if you read this as I have it makes sense. To go by the way you want, it does not:

 

Excuse me, I didn't need a map with (if I have) StreetView- that's its whole point!

http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/152979/nyt-ios-maps-another-internet-services-blunder-for-apple/360#post_2202361

 

Anyway, as I posted earlier I think many of the posters to this thread are being way too nit-picky. Sure Streetview may be missed by some small percentage of users, but there's other sources for it like Garmin's nav app. As for mistakes, the most egregious ones will probably be taken care of in short order while some of the minor ones may hang around awhile. In any event I think most users of Apple new maps will prefer the built-in TBT navigation over the features and functions of the previous Apple app.

 

If Apple Maps was available as a standalone application for multiple platforms I don't personally think it would get a lot of uptake yet, particularly by users of Google Maps for Android, but as an improvement over what Apple themselves offered in previous iOS versions I think it's a good start myself and will only get better.


Edited by Gatorguy - 10/1/12 at 8:08am
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post #412 of 444
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post
I think he's saying that for him Streetview replaced the need for an actual map of the location.

 

… So he doesn't need to figure out how to get there as long as he can see what it looks like? lol.gif

Now I'm picturing him driving thousands of miles aimlessly, holding his 5.1.1 iPad in his lap, looking between it and the scenery around him. 

"Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* … 


Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post
Can we at least have no tekstud?

 

If you can make a strong enough case of it, I'll definitely consider banning whoever you think Techstud is this time. Heaven knows he's a bit of a loony to keep coming back.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #413 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Wait a second. In post #384, you said:
"As a frequent traveller to Washington DC .....

We really need smarter trolls around here......

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

Then maybe he should say that instead of saying something entirely different.

I did say that as he and everyone else obviously understood. You obviously need a reading App. And thank for calling me a dumb troll. What does that make you?
I love this- Apple's Map defenders are vitriolic in defense of a lousy Map App. How low can you go?
post #414 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

… So he doesn't need to figure out how to get there as long as he can see what it looks like? lol.gif


Now I'm picturing him driving thousands of miles aimlessly, holding his 5.1.1 iPad in his lap, looking between it and the scenery around him. 


"Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* "Nope." *looks down, looks up* … 

Except I was walking not driving.
And what do you think people used StreetView for and why are they so adamant about missing it? Never once did I mention driving.
post #415 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Life is like a mirror: you'll receive what you give to others first.
So, yes, you are responsible. And have been; Google Maps got better over time. You said you've used it. So for that, I thank you sir.

I never had a problem w Google Maps, never had to file a report
It just worked.
post #416 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post

I did say that as he and everyone else obviously understood. You obviously need a reading App. And thank for calling me a dumb troll. What does that make you?
I love this- Apple's Map defenders are vitriolic in defense of a lousy Map App. How low can you go?

No, 'everyone else' didn't understand - as is clear from the comments.

In the end, though, you still haven't presented any case why Street View is essential as you claimed. Anyone with even the most basic map-reading skills can find their location more easily with a map than with Streetview. Using Streetview to find your location is just plain insane. Using it to VERIFY the location you found on the map is slightly less insane, but still doesn't make any sense. If you can read a map, you don't need to look at streetview to know that you're in the right place.
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post #417 of 444
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post
Except I was walking not driving.

 

Fine, you're walking aimlessly, looking between your iPad and your surroundings, trying to find parity.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #418 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by iSheldon View Post

I never had a problem w Google Maps, never had to file a report
It just worked.

And I never had a problem with Apple's Maps, never had to file a report. It just worked.

So what's your point?

As you Apple-haters have been told repeatedly: Data is not the plural for anecdote.
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post #419 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFHJr View Post

In f[act, from MobileMe to iTunes, to iCloud, apple seems to "get" Internet services like few companies do.
Right on!

Right, and not to overlook Apple.com, their own online store, and their massively competent software update systems.

I haven't been able to read through 400 + posts here, but a search under "nocera" tells me that no one mentioned this gem from Joe "slimebucket" Nocera, about Apple's imminent doom—in the New York Times!

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/22/opinion/nocera-has-apple-peaked.html

(via Gruber and the Macalope)

It seems a certain kind of "tech jounalist" is falling all over himself to be the first to give reasons for Apple's demise. Dan Lyons is another one, now reduced to writing for Gizmodo.

There's something weird about these guys. It's like they can't stand to see competence and polish succeed. They want to return to the good old days of American mediocrity. They jump on Apples's every blunder, as if to say, "See, this drive for perfection will not work out in the end, it was all Steve Jobs to begin with, it will all come crashing down, no (American) company can maintain this trajectory of success for long."

One problem they have is that their powers to imagine an evolving and expanding future for Apple is blocked by their envious hope for Apple's downfall. They have no clue that Jobs and Ive and who knows how many others at the company have plotted revolutionary products far into the future.
post #420 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilBoogie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Applebaum View Post

WOT...

Anyone here have experience with a mixed OS X Windows 7 WiFi network?

Should I be concerned about a Windows virus contaminating the network and possibly destroying data on Macs or external Mac HDDs -- Thunderbolt, USB and FireWire?

Or can I be assured that any exposure is limited to the Windows boxes?

I have absolutely no time or desire to admin Windows boxes!

TIA

I have. WiFi and wired, and you can indeed rest assure there is nothing to worry about. You have shown your computers skills over and over which leads me to believe you already know the do's and don'ts. Just don't have the OSX users run as root and click ok to every popup. I don't know however if a Windows virus could change the WiFi settings on the device itself - that obviously would effect Mac users as well. But nothing a simple reset couldn't fix.

Thank you much appreciated!

My grandkids thank you too… Sigh!
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post #421 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

In the end, though, you still haven't presented any case why Street View is essential as you claimed. Anyone with even the most basic map-reading skills can find their location more easily with a map than with Streetview. Using Streetview to find your location is just plain insane. Using it to VERIFY the location you found on the map is slightly less insane, but still doesn't make any sense. If you can read a map, you don't need to look at streetview to know that you're in the right place.

In my opinion that's not true. Sometimes street numbers may not be readily evident, especially while driving, making a preview of what your're looking for via Streetview fairly helpful and time-saving.

 

I realize too that it's a bit of a specialty use but I often pull up Streetview when talking with a client on the phone about site signs or business identification including competing signage or obstructions around them. In that usage I don't need it in conjunction with navigation, but it sure saves me a lot of on-site visits.

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post #422 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

In my opinion that's not true. Sometimes street numbers may not be readily evident, especially while driving, making a preview of what your're looking for via Streetview fairly helpful and time-saving.

You shouldn't be using Streetview while you're driving.

That aside, there's a little marker that shows your location on the map. When your marker gets to your destination, you're there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

I realize too that it's a bit of a specialty use but I often pull up Streetview when talking with a client on the phone about site signs or business identification including competing signage or obstructions around them. In that usage I don't need it in conjunction with navigation, but it sure saves me a lot of on-site visits.

Then you can use street view on your PC.

In the end, though, that has nothing to do with finding an address and is therefore not essential as iSheldon claimed that it was. Nice of you to admit that he's wrong about it being essential.
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post #423 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


You shouldn't be using Streetview while you're driving.
That aside, there's a little marker that shows your location on the map. When your marker gets to your destination, you're there.
Then you can use street view on your PC.
In the end, though, that has nothing to do with finding an address and is therefore not essential as iSheldon claimed that it was. Nice of you to admit that he's wrong about it being essential.

I'd agree that it's not essential. I completely disagree with you that it's useless or makes no sense. FWIW, why is driving and looking at a map on screen to see when you get to your "marker" less dangerous than glancing at Streetview on screen to verify you're "there"? Your suggestion is what makes no sense.


Edited by Gatorguy - 10/1/12 at 8:50am
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post #424 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorguy View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post

In the end, though, you still haven't presented any case why Street View is essential as you claimed. Anyone with even the most basic map-reading skills can find their location more easily with a map than with Streetview. Using Streetview to find your location is just plain insane. Using it to VERIFY the location you found on the map is slightly less insane, but still doesn't make any sense. If you can read a map, you don't need to look at streetview to know that you're in the right place.

In my opinion that's not true. Sometimes street numbers may not be readily evident, especially while driving, making a preview of what your're looking for via Streetview fairly helpful and time-saving.

 

I realize too that it's a bit of a specialty use but I often pull up Streetview when talking with a client on the phone about site signs or business identification including competing signage or obstructions around them. In that usage I don't need it in conjunction with navigation, but it sure saves me a lot of on-site visits.

 

I have to admit that I have used streetview quite a lot. Figuring out where I might be able to park, which entrance or driveway I want, confirming that a business is where the map says it is etc.. Especially in busy traffic areas it is useful to have seen that stuff in advance, and it is not always clear from above. On the other hand, I still wonder about the long-term viability of streetview with all the related privacy fuss. If it doesn't get shut down and Google manage to keep it moderately up to date, then I would expect it to stay popular, and eventually, other companies will likely want to have their own version. It clearly isn't essential, but neither is a cell phone.

post #425 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


You shouldn't be using Streetview while you're driving.
 

No kidding!

 

One shouldn't be using the phone at all!

post #426 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetry View Post

I have to admit that I have used streetview quite a lot. Figuring out where I might be able to park, which entrance or driveway I want, confirming that a business is where the map says it is etc.. Especially in busy traffic areas it is useful to have seen that stuff in advance, and it is not always clear from above. On the other hand, I still wonder about the long-term viability of streetview with all the related privacy fuss. If it doesn't get shut down and Google manage to keep it moderately up to date, then I would expect it to stay popular, and eventually, other companies will likely want to have their own version. It clearly isn't essential, but neither is a cell phone.

Oh a few people might find something interesting to do with it. That does not make it indispensable as was claimed.
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post #427 of 444
post #428 of 444

 

Come off it. Cook knows how to run a frigging company. 

 

But I'll say that if he has the same input into most of the creative and UX decisions as Steve, that needs to stop posthaste.


Edited by Tallest Skil - 10/1/12 at 10:50am

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #429 of 444

Apple definitely showed potential for Maps, but the data is what seems really to be dragging it down. I think that the Apple maps team is probably trying to figure out why it sucks so badly, and they're going to find that it's the data. The software itself isn't horrible so much as the framework behind it which causes all the inaccuracies. Still, I do think they have a solid base, and under Tim's guidance we will see a fix at Apple's next media event. I'm still a doubter of the ipad mini, but if that happens, we will surely see a fix then.

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post #430 of 444

What's your point? That the author doesn't understand the difference between correlation and causation? If that's your point, you're absolutely correct.
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post #431 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse View Post

 

Even if they did release a web version, it would probably be an iCloud feature, which means iOS & OS X users only. Apple only seems interested in ads as a way for developers to release ad supported software, so it's hard to see them offering a free to everyone, ad supported, web version. Still that's a large and growing number of users.

The iCloud is completely available to Windows machines.Apple wisely set this up so families or organizations with iPhones or iPads with all Windows computers or mixed Win/OSX computers would have no problem syncing all their data. It's bween that way from day one.

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post #432 of 444

Navteq is owned by Nokia.. they'll never give that to Apple

post #433 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by kheba View Post

Navteq is owned by Nokia.. they'll never give that to Apple

 

Nokia uses C3 Technologies for its 3D mapping... Apple will never let them use that

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post #434 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by jragosta View Post


What's your point? That the author doesn't understand the difference between correlation and causation? If that's your point, you're absolutely correct.

 

I'm not an expert on shares and stuff, so I'm probably speaking out of turn.

 

But if you had clumsily wiped  $30 billion from the value of your company, then wouldn't now be a good time to start a buyback programme?

 

http://wallstcheatsheet.com/stocks/share-buybacks-apple-kicks-off-10b-repurchase-plan-news-corp-sells-to-bskyb.html/

 

Is Apple buying at the current price, or the price at which they made the announcement in March?


Edited by Rayz - 10/2/12 at 12:05am
post #435 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by hill60 View Post

 

The NYT article explicitly stated that the new maps App was indicative of a general failure of Apple to manage Internet services.  

 

The fact is they set up and run iTunes the most successful ONLINE music and other digital content store ever seen, they have been running it day in, day out 24/7, 365 days a year for almost ten years, serving hundreds of millions of customers billions of purchases and the NYT  shows it's inherent bias by overlooking this "Internet service". 

 

It's there in black and white in the title of this thread,

 

 

NYT: iOS Maps another internet services blunder for Apple

Again pointing out a success does not having anything to do with the recent blunders that the NYT article is talking about.  A company that rests on pasts successes is doomed to fail, I can remember one in the late 70's early 80's that had a great product but failed to capitalize on it and continue to innovate instead of copy.....  what was its name again....  oh yes I remember APPLE!   There is no doubt that IPhone 5 is well behind the pack and didn't do a great job in innovation.  All it did was catch up but it didn't pass any of the competitors, there are plenty of phones out there, or about to come out, that on a feature for feature basis are going to kill IPHONE, including of all brands Sony with the xpedia V....  13 megapixal camera and waterproof.....  anyway I said I'm finishing with this forum, and should, as clearly the bias shown here is well beyond any reasoning.  As for mapping features Garmin/Asus put out two phones 3 years ago that are still unmatched in mapping and turn by turn instruction, being GPS based means you don't even need a internet connection for them work fine.

post #436 of 444
Originally Posted by ernysp76 View Post
There is no doubt that IPhone 5 is well behind the pack and didn't do a great job in innovation.

 

Any sane thoughts that led you to this conclusion?

 

All it did was catch up but it didn't pass any of the competitors…

 

YEAH, you're having a bad time being here, YEAH, you "want to leave" (despite returning), it's because people are calling out your BLATANT, DISGUSTING LIES, and you don't like it.

 

there are plenty of phones out there or about to come out that on a feature for feature basis are going to kill IPHONE, including of all brands Sony with the xpedia V….  13 megapixal camera and waterproof…

 

Which means what to anyone if the software is trash? Why haven't any of these phones that "surpass" the iPhone outsold it in the five years it has been on the market?

 

…anyway I said I'm finishing with this forum…

 

You're quite a masochist to have returned for more "punishment" after that tirade.

 

…and should as clearly the bias shown here is well beyond and reasoning.

 

No, that's your inaccuracy.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #437 of 444

No, no. I'm not "going the guy". You have made the current subject your desire to leave this place by trumpeting that in every post. A desire which, strangely, as it's a desire, you haven't fulfilled. "I'm going to leave. No, really, I am" and then not leaving? Calling that out isn't unwarranted.

 

And never mind that your original rebuttal to hill60's comment remains irrelevant and wrong, now you're just outright lying about the iPhone for whatever reason.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
post #438 of 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallest Skil View Post

 

Any sane thoughts that led you to this conclusion?   

 

The suggestion that I might be "insane" is both insulting and unnecessary and again proves the point I made that people here can not hold a civil discussion without attacking the man instead of the ball as for the reason for my conclusion?  This is logical based on a simple search on your "favorite" search engines I guess the article by Investopedia is one of the better ones.

 

YEAH, you're having a bad time being here, YEAH, you "want to leave" (despite returning), it's because people are calling out your BLATANT, DISGUSTING LIES, and you don't like it.

 

Lies which ones in particular??  Please explain?  I can back my statements with facts one of which was quickly repeated by non other than the Apple CEO!  Now we have moderators calling poster liars is this allowed? Is this within the forum rules?

 

Which means what to anyone if the software is trash? Why haven't any of these phones that "surpass" the iPhone outsold it in the five years it has been on the market?

 

Software Trash?  Which software might that be? Google Maps maybe or any of the mapping software that the Apple CEO is now recommending above the Apple product perhaps?  BETA video was a better system than VHS the fact that VHS became the standard format didn't make BETA a lesser system.  As for outselling we are talking more than a single product with iPhone, in fact we are talking at least 15+ different variations of the iPhone in five years and it still won't let you put a SD card in it probably because to get extra memory you have to buy a different phone thereby artificially inflating the sales figures.  

 

You're quite a masochist to have returned for more "punishment" after that tirade.

 

So now I am "a liar", "insane" and to top it of "masochistic" and you say I let out a tirade!  Maybe you need to look up the meaning of the word.  But non the less why should anyone be "punished" for having a different point of view?  What happen to civil discourse without stooping to calling people liars and questioning their integrity?

 

No, that's your inaccuracy.

 

Please explain where I have been inaccurate?

post #439 of 444

Oh in fact you'll find that the collective sales of all Android devices outsold the 15 + variations of the iPhones/iPads on a ratio of 2:1 (source Forbes.com 22 Aug 2012), similarly Android based open source music providers are collectively much larger than iTunes by a great deal but that is not to say that Apple has not been a great innovator, the point is it is no longer a class leader but instead a follower trying to imitate others including in this case Google Maps and largely stuffing it up (Apple CEO admits as much).  Once you could say "XXX" phone has all the features of a iPhone, and people would say well why don't I just buy an iPhone instead?  This is not the case anymore and in spite unprecedented sales of the 4 new variations of the iPhone 5 the collective sales of Android based phones is still well ahead and the gap will continue to grow until Apple pull another rabbit out of the hat.  The good news for Apple is it makes money out of every device sold whereas Google give the Android OS away for free! 


Edited by ernysp76 - 10/3/12 at 6:23am
post #440 of 444
Originally Posted by ernysp76 View Post
Oh in fact you'll find that the collective sales of all Android devices outsold the 15 + variations of the iPhones/iPads on a ratio of 2:1…

 

Your point being what?

 

…Android based music servers are collectively much larger than iTunes by a great deal…

 

Uh, source? Name? What in the world is an "Android-"based" music server"?

 

The good news for Apple is it makes money out of every device sold whereas Google give the Android OS away for free! 
 

Just cannot stop lying, can you? I ignored most of the others because if you're still repeating them after they've been proven wrong hundreds of times, there's no hope or help for you.

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply

Originally Posted by Slurpy

There's just a TINY chance that Apple will also be able to figure out payments. Oh wait, they did already… …and you’re already f*ed.

 

Reply
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